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Aircraft Fuel Supply Line For Dublin Airport

  • 16-02-2018 11:30pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 249 ✭✭ FunkyDa2


    I came across this article, which suggests that many landowners along the planned route(all under public roads) may have land title out to the middle of the road, and would be in the way of causing disruption to the scheme. Could this be true?

    http://travelbiz.ie/DAILYNEWS/JETFUEL11FEB18.pdf


Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,341 D Trent


    FunkyDa2 wrote: »
    I came across this article, which suggests that many landowners along the planned route(all under public roads) may have land title out to the middle of the road, and would be in the way of causing disruption to the scheme. Could this be true?

    http://travelbiz.ie/DAILYNEWS/JETFUEL11FEB18.pdf
    I was 99% sure this had already been built ????


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,977 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L1011


    It hasn't been built yet

    Very old roads have landowners with title to the middle. Newer ones don't.


  • Registered Users Posts: 384 ✭✭ IsaacWunder


    L1011 wrote: »
    It hasn't been built yet

    Very old roads have landowners with title to the middle. Newer ones don't.

    Couldn't the state just cpo the roadway? Bizarre that this is even an issue.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,692 ✭✭✭ plodder


    Couldn't the state just cpo the roadway? Bizarre that this is even an issue.
    The state could build it without CPO'ing anything but it's a private company building it, and they aren't allowed to just take people's property, by CPO or otherwise. Maybe, it should be built/owned by the state.....


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 17,073 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sam Russell


    L1011 wrote: »
    It hasn't been built yet

    Very old roads have landowners with title to the middle. Newer ones don't.

    But is the pipe not under the road?

    I thought the state owned the below ground area. How did they fill in all the basements for the Luas?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,781 ✭✭✭ Carawaystick


    But is the pipe not under the road?

    I thought the state owned the below ground area. How did they fill in all the basements for the Luas?

    They compulsorily acquired the coal bunkers on Harcourt st after they discovered they existed


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 17,073 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sam Russell


    They compulsorily acquired the coal bunkers on Harcourt st after they discovered they existed

    How do the ESB Networks, Bord Gais Networks, and DCC work on the roads? Surely they dig it up, install their bits and fill in again. Why is there a problem?

    If the 'owner' of the bit of road claims ownership, they should bill them for maintaining the road.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,692 ✭✭✭ plodder


    How do the ESB Networks, Bord Gais Networks, and DCC work on the roads? Surely they dig it up, install their bits and fill in again. Why is there a problem?

    If the 'owner' of the bit of road claims ownership, they should bill them for maintaining the road.
    They all have statutory authority to dig up the roads. Private companies don't.

    Bord Gais has specific powers to build and maintain pipelines, but the promoters of this scheme don't. They are just a logistics company as far as I know.


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 9,198 Mod ✭✭✭✭ CatInABox


    plodder wrote: »
    They all have statutory authority to dig up the roads. Private companies don't.

    Bord Gais has specific powers to build and maintain pipelines, but the promoters of this scheme don't. They are just a logistics company as far as I know.

    So could the private company just subcontract the work out to Bord Gais then?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,692 ✭✭✭ plodder


    CatInABox wrote: »
    So could the private company just subcontract the work out to Bord Gais then?
    I doubt it. I'm not a lawyer, but it doesn't get around the issues to do with private property rights being infringed. The government would have to fix it with legislation, but it's not an area that any government will rush into changing, I'd guess.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,142 ✭✭✭ Middle Man


    plodder wrote: »
    I doubt it. I'm not a lawyer, but it doesn't get around the issues to do with private property rights being infringed. The government would have to fix it with legislation, but it's not an area that any government will rush into changing, I'd guess.
    Property rights in this country need to be cut back - it's IMO the main thing that's holding up progress here!


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,894 ✭✭✭ DaCor


    Middle Man wrote: »
    Property rights in this country need to be cut back - it's IMO the main thing that's holding up progress here!

    Absolutely, a chainsaw where a scalpel is needed!

    /sarcasm


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭ IE 222


    Would it not be cheaper and safer to run the pipeline under the sea and turn at Irelands Eye to follow the flight path into Dublin airport.

    The pipe will be longer but it saves on digging up streets and will reduce building costs and time.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,516 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    IE 222 wrote: »
    Would it not be cheaper and safer to run the pipeline under the sea and turn at Irelands Eye to follow the flight path into Dublin airport.

    The pipe will be longer but it saves on digging up streets and will reduce building costs and time.

    with this issue that has arisen, they may go for that option...


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,591 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    Why not just run it through the port tunnel ?


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 17,073 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sam Russell


    ted1 wrote: »
    Why not just run it through the port tunnel ?

    Fire risk? Safety risk? Burst pipe risk?


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,591 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    ted1 wrote: »
    Why not just run it through the port tunnel ?

    Fire risk? Safety risk? Burst pipe risk?
    I’m sure you could engineer out the risks. Double skin pipe etc


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,516 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    ted1 wrote: »
    I’m sure you could engineer out the risks. Double skin pipe etc
    Couldn’t it be run, in the pedestrian escIe tunnels? Not like anything is going to crash into that!


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,591 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    ted1 wrote: »
    I’m sure you could engineer out the risks. Double skin pipe etc
    Couldn’t it be run, in the pedestrian escIe tunnels? Not like anything is going to crash into that!
    I’m sure it could.( but s sudpended pipe in the ceiling highest point would suffice ) There’s a gas pipeline from Russia to Ireland that passes through many urban areas. As an engineer I’m sure what ever dangers that may occur could be engineered out.

    E.g. Auto closing valves every 50 m in the tunnel. Would limit any spill should a leak occur


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,756 ✭✭✭✭ Atlantic Dawn


    The talk of moving the docks to north county Dublin might make the whole project redundant.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 21,591 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    The talk of moving the docks to north county Dublin might make the whole project redundant.
    planes will probably be electric powered by the time that happens !!


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,977 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L1011


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Couldn’t it be run, in the pedestrian escIe tunnels? Not like anything is going to crash into that!

    There aren't any. Two tunnels with crossovers and isolation doors only.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 17,073 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sam Russell


    ted1 wrote: »
    I’m sure it could.( but s sudpended pipe in the ceiling highest point would suffice ) There’s a gas pipeline from Russia to Ireland that passes through many urban areas. As an engineer I’m sure what ever dangers that may occur could be engineered out.

    E.g. Auto closing valves every 50 m in the tunnel. Would limit any spill should a leak occur

    And if it leaked onto passing trucks, or pooled on the floor? I do not think so.

    It needs to be given statutory backing to overcome 'property rights' over the roads.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭ IE 222


    I really don't think anyone is going to install a fuel pipe in the port tunnel. It would be a massive disaster if it ever exploded regardless of what safety messaures were taken. We here of so many fail safe instruments failing in major disasters.


  • Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭ Dr_Bill


    Tunnel fires are about as bad as it gets - Mont Blanc fire below:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/1999/mar/27/6

    The tunnel lining was absolutely wrecked -> https://www.tunneltalk.com/images/Mont-Blanc/The-aftermath-of-the-1999-fire.jpg

    A pipe with aviation fuel which is highly combustible? Not on your nelly!


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