Restaurant Cancellation Fees

SusanC10

We want to book an Early Bird in a particular Restaurant in Dublin before going to a Performance for which we have Tickets. The Restaurant in question wants a pre-authorisation of €60 on my Credit Card which it will take in the event of a Cancellation less than 5 days ahead of the reservation.

I have never heard of this before and we have eaten at this Restaurant before though not for about 18 months. We don't live in Dublin and don't get out there very often as we have young children.

Is this a common thing now ?

TBH in the unforseen event that we do need to cancel we know that we will lose the money already paid for the performance but I don't want to lose another €60 as well.

rizzee

That's ridiculous. Don't give them a penny. Never heard of that.

Wheety

I agree with it 100%. I've seen so many restaurants turn away business while tables with 'Reserved' on them are sitting empty. After 30-40 mins of waiting I've seen staff remove the sign and rearrange the tables from a table of 10 or so, back to tables for 2.

It's apparently a huge problem.

Can you imagine ordering a taxi, asking him to wait outside for 30 mins and then telling him, 'nah you're alright'. Or as happens with restaurants, don't say anything and ignore his phone calls.

testicles

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Gravelly

Getting more common now. I can understand it from the restaurant's perspective as I've a friend in the business who has told me the effect non-showing bookings has on his bottom line. However, 5 days is a bit much - it it was, say 48 hours, I would think it a bit fairer.

SusanC10

I would understand if we simply did not show up for a Reservation but for instance if I phoned the day before (or even 4 days before) and cancelled they will still charge.

We really like this place and had been looking forward to going there but I think that we will look for somewhere else now.

I would also understand more for large Bookings but we are 2 people.

SusanC10

The €60 is also more than the cost of the 2 Course Early Bird Menu which we intended to have !

Wheety

SusanC10 wrote: »

The €60 is also more than the cost of the 2 Course Early Bird Menu which we intended to have !

I know I already posted saying I agree with it but in this case it is a bit excessive. Maybe the €60 is a standard charge, but 5 days is a bit much. If they can fill the table with walk ins then cancelling that morning should be enough notice.

Not cancelling at all or last minute should definitely carry some kind of charge though.

PCX

One person i work with regularly makes arrangements to go for meal with friends. She usually makes bookings well ahead of the date at 3 or 4 different places and then texts the group asking which they would prefer to go to closer to the time.
She then usually cancels the other bookings a couple of days before the meal when the decision has been made - if she remembers to.

If there are others who do this regularly as well then I can see it being a real problem for restaurants who end up having to turn other genuine bookings away.

CruelCoin

Wheety wrote: »

It's apparently a huge problem.

Can you imagine ordering a taxi, asking him to wait outside for 30 mins and then telling him, 'nah you're alright'. Or as happens with restaurants, don't say anything and ignore his phone calls.

Stuff like this happens a lot with Uber/Grab/EasyTaxi.

People will get them all to send a car, and they'll hop into the first one to arrive. Only Uber charge a tiny fee for a missed collection.

Wheety

CruelCoin wrote: »

Stuff like this happens a lot with Uber/Grab/EasyTaxi.

People will get them all to send a car, and they'll hop into the first one to arrive. Only Uber charge a tiny fee for a missed collection.

I would agree with a charge in this case too and they will come in if this is an issue for too long. At the moment they're all vying for business so probably won't bring it in just yet.

homer911

I agree with the concept, but the amount and notice period in this case is a bit excessive, particularly for a table for two - maybe it was reasonable for Valentine's Day?

Restaurants operate on very tight margins and staff, as a general rule, are not well paid. They cant afford to lose business through no-shows

haro124

I booked a restaurant in town and they have asked me to pay a €50 deposit. Seems to be quite normal these days, especially if its groups of more than 6.

C3PO

This is becoming the norm now but the terms in this case seem a bit excessive! The restaurant is obviously sick of being stung! Be interested to know where I can get a nice dinner for two for less than €60 though?

rubadub

Wheety wrote: »

Maybe the €60 is a standard charge, but 5 days is a bit much.

If 60 is standard they should think about it more, as they have put off this customer. If a single person is going at an earlybird or lunch is charged 60, and if a a party of 6 going later on (full price) are also 60 then it would be stupid.

The price should be based on the estimated loss of profit, not the price of the meal. So it is ludicrous that they are charging more than the OP was planning on spending.

C3PO

rubadub wrote: »

If 60 is standard they should think about it more, as they have put off this customer. If a single person is going at an earlybird or lunch is charged 60, and if a a party of 6 going later on (full price) are also 60 then it would be stupid.

The price should be based on the estimated loss of profit, not the price of the meal. So it is ludicrous that they are charging more than the OP was planning on spending.

Probably a €30 per head charge?

L1011

rubadub wrote: »

If 60 is standard they should think about it more, as they have put off this customer. If a single person is going at an earlybird or lunch is charged 60, and if a a party of 6 going later on (full price) are also 60 then it would be stupid.

The price should be based on the estimated loss of profit, not the price of the meal. So it is ludicrous that they are charging more than the OP was planning on spending.

Loss of profit and sunk costs add up to rather a lot of the total price - rates wages insurance etc.

CeilingFly

Its the norm in many countries.

Most restaurant seats are filled by reservations - the walk up market for the better restaurants is not that big.

Foods is ordered a few days in advance. A good chef will be able to manage the menu in a way that most fresh food is consumed whilst its at its best.

Staff are rostered at least a week in advance.

Its relatively easy to order extra food froma supplier - but difficult to send back / take items off an order with little notice.

Similarly its unfair to tell staff at short notice that they are not required.

€60 is probably excessive - €20/head is probaby better. But non-shows are a huge issue for restaurants - why should they be at a loss for those who change their mind at the last minute?

appledrop

I think this is absolutely ridiculous. As a parent of toddler we don't get out as much as used too but issues can arise that you might not be able to make a well intentioned meal e.g child sick, babysitter cancelled.

I wouldn't go near any restaurant who had this policy.

bucketybuck

Why does the charge have to be linked to the price if the meal?

It's there to discourage flakes who waste the restaurants time and money by making bookings they don't keep, as long as it does that effectively then nothing says that it needs to be the same price as meal option A or B.

Guy:Incognito

appledrop wrote: »

I think this is absolutely ridiculous. As a parent of toddler we don't get out as much as used too but issues can arise that you might not be able to make a well intentioned meal e.g child sick, babysitter cancelled.

I wouldn't go near any restaurant who had this policy.

Your children are your problem, not the restaurants. They are running a business, the reason for someone not turning up doesn't change them losing money.

appledrop

A well run business won't have this problem. Our most popular restaurant rings everyone on the day of their booking to check everything ok. This way they have reduced people not turning up + restaurant is always packed.

SusanC10

Update:- I decided to phone again and spoke to a Manager and explained my dissatisfaction with their policy. Also explained that we have eaten there before and enjoyed it and the circumstances of our Booking this time with the Show etc.
He explained why they have the Policy in question which is due to No Shows in particular from larger parties at weekends.
But he agreed to waive the Deposit and took my reservation without Credit Card Details over the phone. I in turn agreed to phone and cancel should anything unforeseen occur.

Happy with the outcome.

Btw - the Deposit is €30 per person and the 2 course Early Bird is €25 per person.

L1011

appledrop wrote: »

A well run business won't have this problem. Our most popular restaurant rings everyone on the day of their booking to check everything ok. This way they have reduced people not turning up + restaurant is always packed.

Assuming they can get new business at that short a notice. Which is a big assumption

dudara

Restaurants are being forced to turn to this due to the number of “no shows”. It’s quite a big problem with large parties and at festive times of year. Restaurants were reporting 30%, 40% no shows before Christmas.

In your case, the Ts&Cs did seem excessive, so I’m glad you were able to resolve it with the manager. Hopefully they’ll apply your feedback to their policy in general.

dudara

appledrop wrote: »

A well run business won't have this problem. Our most popular restaurant rings everyone on the day of their booking to check everything ok. This way they have reduced people not turning up + restaurant is always packed.

One the big complaints you’ll hear from restrateurs is that they rang the person on the day of the booking, who confirmed their table, but then never showed up. This is really hurting restaurants at the moment, especially the smaller ones. Nothing to do with them not being “well run” but more so to do with a lack of basic manners from their potential customers.

Tigger

SusanC10 wrote: »

We want to book an Early Bird in a particular Restaurant in Dublin before going to a Performance for which we have Tickets. The Restaurant in question wants a pre-authorisation of €60 on my Credit Card which it will take in the event of a Cancellation less than 5 days ahead of the reservation.

I have never heard of this before and we have eaten at this Restaurant before though not for about 18 months. We don't live in Dublin and don't get out there very often as we have young children.

Is this a common thing now ?

TBH in the unforseen event that we do need to cancel we know that we will lose the money already paid for the performance but I don't want to lose another €60 as well.

thats sound use a different resturant

ProudDUB

appledrop wrote: »

I think this is absolutely ridiculous. As a parent of toddler we don't get out as much as used too but issues can arise that you might not be able to make a well intentioned meal e.g child sick, babysitter cancelled.

I wouldn't go near any restaurant who had this policy.

Tough.

The restaurant still has to pay its staffs wages, rent, overheads, butchers bill etc , regardless of whether your child has a snotty nose or not.

Midnight Sundance

I think 5 days notice is excessive!!! Especially for a table of two !most hotels allow you 24 hours to give notice to cancel a room and a restaurant which can more than likely fill a seat with walk ins expects 5 days?!!
There are plenty more restaurants around, vote with your feet and choose one of them.
I can understand a booking fee for a large number but not for a table of two. Can’t see these type of restaurants staying in business too long if they decide to go down this route.

spurious

Courtesy is a two way street. I would be willing to bet most no shows don't bother to ring. It's the same phenomenon you can see with out-patient appointments, where the staff forlornly call lists of names for only a few to show up.

Restaurants with these policies are only reacting to rude punters. I don't blame them, though 5 days is excessive.

limnam

I'm guessing it's Chapter one, although doesn't sound like them doing something like this and I hope not as it's one of my favorite places when in Dublin and this would get on my goat.

circular flexing

limnam wrote: »

I'm guessing it's Chapter one, although doesn't sound like them doing something like this and I hope not as it's one of my favorite places when in Dublin and this would get on my goat.

The pre-theatre menu at Chapter One is 45 euro, so probably not.

I do expect this to become more common though.

circular flexing

Midnight Sundance wrote: »

I think 5 days notice is excessive!!! Especially for a table of two !most hotels allow you 24 hours to give notice to cancel a room and a restaurant which can more than likely fill a seat with walk ins expects 5 days?!!
There are plenty more restaurants around, vote with your feet and choose one of them.
I can understand a booking fee for a large number but not for a table of two. Can’t see these type of restaurants staying in business too long if they decide to go down this route.

It's a big assumption that a table can be filled with walk-ins.

The costs of an empty hotel room to a hotel are probably less than the costs of an empty reserved table to a restaurant.

OldMrBrennan83

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DaveyDave

If they have lots of no shows then stop taking bookings or do walk in bookings only.

If a restaurant is busy enough to need a booking there's no reason they can't fill the space after a no show. If you don't have the courtesy to call and inform you're late after say 15-30 minutes then you should lose your table.

Last time I was in town we got stuck in traffic, one of our party called ahead saying we'd be 5-10 minutes late as we had to park the car and walk over. We will also generally book wherever we go no matter what time or day as you never know how busy it is.

Former Former

They wouldn't be doing it without good reason.

Even cancelling the day you're due to go probably means they've had to turn other people down.

5 days notice is a lot but the general principle is fine.

uck51js9zml2yt

C3PO wrote: »

This is becoming the norm now but the terms in this case seem a bit excessive! The restaurant is obviously sick of being stung! Be interested to know where I can get a nice dinner for two for less than €60 though?

I can tell you where to go in 3 different spots within a spit of Dublin for a great 3 course meal under €20.

davo10

DaveyDave wrote: »

If they have lots of no shows then stop taking bookings or do walk in bookings only.

If a restaurant is busy enough to need a booking there's no reason they can't fill the space after a no show. If you don't have the courtesy to call and inform you're late after say 15-30 minutes then you should lose your table.

Last time I was in town we got stuck in traffic, one of our party called ahead saying we'd be 5-10 minutes late as we had to park the car and walk over. We will also generally book wherever we go no matter what time or day as you never know how busy it is.

Bookings are necessary because a lot of people like to eat at a particular time, not wait in a que for a table. Also, groups like to sit together.

You can fill a no show table if you have someone literally standing at the door, you can't if there isn't.

Guy:Incognito

limnam wrote: »

I'm guessing it's Chapter one, although doesn't sound like them doing something like this and I hope not as it's one of my favorite places when in Dublin and this would get on my goat.

If you're booking and going , how does it make a difference?

weldoninhio

Ridiculous policy. So if you want a meal in Dublin nowadays you have to pay the price of the meal and be down €30 per person for a week or so. So if I book a table for 10, I’m down €300 for a week.

Bob24

I guess if they can afford doing it they are a popular/successful restaurant. But I would never book from them.

I agree with the principle of retaining credit card details and charging a fee in case of a no show, this is good for everyone except inconsiderate customers who make reservations and don't show-up so no problem with that. But having a 5 days cancellation policy is a joke, it should be at most a few hours.

davo10

weldoninhio wrote: »

Ridiculous policy. So if you want a meal in Dublin nowadays you have to pay the price of the meal and be down €30 per person for a week or so. So if I book a table for 10, I’m down €300 for a week.

I would suspect it's the same method used in hotels when you check in, they get authorisation to remove the deposit from your account rather than actually removing it. It is only taken from your account if you cancel/don't show up.

In general I don't have a problem with this, restaurants are there to provide a service for profit, if you don't show up or cancel short notice, then you should expect to pay. The 5 days is a bit to punitive though, 24 hrs should be enough notice.

Uriel.

weldoninhio wrote: »

Ridiculous policy. So if you want a meal in Dublin nowadays you have to pay the price of the meal and be down €30 per person for a week or so. So if I book a table for 10, I’m down €300 for a week.

No, some (a small fraction) restaurants seem to be introducing this policy. It's not across the board.

Tbh I can fully understand it for large group bookings. Taking you example: imagine a restaurant has a booking for 10 people on Saturday night at 9pm and there's a no show. They're down a sizeable amount of business that can't be replaced. No restaurant is going to be able to fill that slot at short notice.

I'd be a bit more annoyed having to pay for my meal in advance though in a situation where I'm going out as one half of a couple.

BabysCoffee

I don't agree with having to give 5 days notice but I do think you should be charged for not turning up without giving notice.

However on the other hand I think it is good practise for the restaurant to call and confirm your booking a few days in advance. Forest Avenue call a few days before you are due to eat with them and they don't seem to have to threaten you with a charge for cancelling on them.

ct5amr2ig1nfhp

I do not see any problem with a cancellation policy being introduced. Perhaps having to cancel 5 days is too strict, but restaurants have to do something about no shows.

If you don't like it book a different restaurant.

Bob24

BabysCoffee wrote: »

However on the other hand I think it is good practise for the restaurant to call and confirm your booking a few days in advance. Forest Avenue call a few days before you are due to eat with them and they don't seem to have to threaten you with a charge for cancelling on them.

Yes and no. I understand why they are doing it but on the other hand if people book restaurants and can't even remember they have a booking or bother telling the restaurant when they decide not to go, they 100% deserve to be charged a no show fee. But as said before this should be a few hour notice, not 5 days.

OldMrBrennan83

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sassyj

One of my favourite restaurants recently tweeted how they had 14 no shows and 16 cancellations on same day, this is why restaurants do it and I fully support it. Camcelling day of reservation or even day before does not give enough time to fill. And if there's a cancellation list, the people talking the tables will no doubt be doing a late cancellation on another restaurant. People are far too casual with reservations, not fair on restaurants.

splinter65

appledrop wrote: »

I think this is absolutely ridiculous. As a parent of toddler we don't get out as much as used too but issues can arise that you might not be able to make a well intentioned meal e.g child sick, babysitter cancelled.

I wouldn't go near any restaurant who had this policy.

But can you explain why you think the restaurant should be down €50+ because your babysitter cancelled?

Bob24

splinter65 wrote: »

appledrop wrote: »

I think this is absolutely ridiculous. As a parent of toddler we don't get out as much as used too but issues can arise that you might not be able to make a well intentioned meal e.g child sick, babysitter cancelled.

I wouldn't go near any restaurant who had this policy.

But can you explain why you think the restaurant should be down €50+ because your babysitter cancelled?

The problem is the 5 days notice. If the babysitter doesn’t show up and the parents are a no show at the restaurant sur it is a problem between them and the babysitter and they should compensate the restaurant. Very different story if there is an advanced notification, and the only debate is on how long the notice period should be.