Rents to rise to 2500 a month in Dublin

Elessar

Just reading this piece on the latest Daft.ie report where the current national average rent price is €1227 while in Dublin it's now €2k a month. They expect the trend to continue until at least €2500 a month before the market starts to normalise. Supply is even more depressing:

With just 3,150 properties now available to rent across the country, the ongoing dearth of supply is undoubtedly a key factor behind the upwards trend in rents. This level of supply is down by more than 20 per cent on the same date in 2016, and according to Daft.ie, is the lowest level ever recorded for this time of year. In 2010, for example, stock across the country was about 22,500, while even in 2006/2007, the number of properties available for rent touched 10,000.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/dublin-rents-to-rise-to-2-500-before-they-start-to-slow-1.3389643

As someone looking to rent in Dublin soon I am dreading it. I can't see how people afford it.

Of the boardsies renting in the big smoke, how much of your take home pay does it devour?

DrumSteve

You have my pity.

Try a house share when you come up here; renting on your own (or even two people) can be really difficult.

super_furry

It's all feeding into rising house prices too. A mortgage of €550,000 over 30 years would leave your with repayments that are cheaper than €2500 a month rent.

God help us if the lending requirements are ever relaxed because it'll be carnage.

Kimbot

MOD Moved to Accom & Property as its better suited there: take note of the new charter.

maximoose

Elessar wrote: »

Of the boardsies renting in the big smoke, how much of your take home pay does it devour?

~20%

We have been lucky though. Landlord is an investment company - rent was unchanged for 3 years and now they have started the 4% annual rise but our place (1 bet apt in D8) is comfortably under the average for the area.

I don't envy someone looking to make the move to Dublin now.

DubCount

There are just not enough properties to rent, and nothing being done to encourage more rental properties to come onto the market. Affordability is only discussed in terms of property purchase prices. Rent controls only help (short term) those already in a rented home. Eventually, only those with most money can afford the limited rentals available. If supply is not encouraged, prices will continue to rise.

Westwood

Stay away from Dublin it's disastrous, always was , always will be, spoken like a true dub.

omb0wyn5ehpij9

I'm currently looking for a two bed apartment to rent. I came across a two bed in Belarmine (Stepaside) for 700 quid a week this morning :eek:

Theboinkmaster

Westwood wrote: »

Stay away from Dublin it's disastrous, always was , always will be, spoken like a true dub.

That's really helpful insight thanks - stay away from the country's capital where most of the jobs are :rolleyes:

jimgoose

BDJW wrote: »

I'm currently looking for a two bed apartment to rent. I came across a two bed in Belarmine (Stepaside) for 700 quid a week this morning :eek:

Faaark! The brother isn't paying much more than that for a fairly big, comfy pad in Battery Park, Manhattan!

Mickiemcfist

Not really the most relevant question as the earnings spread in Dublin in fairly large. FWIW I spend about 30% of take home salary.

If you're just moving up, the best deals are a room in a suburban 4 bed house.

belfe

Theboinkmaster wrote: »

That's really helpful insight thanks - stay away from the country's capital where most of the jobs are :rolleyes:

... And the salary earned is not for you but for your landlord.

VonBeanie

BDJW wrote: »

I'm currently looking for a two bed apartment to rent. I came across a two bed in Belarmine (Stepaside) for 700 quid a week this morning :eek:

Its not expensive enough for that area - its probably a scam :D

Samuel T. Cogley

belfe wrote: »

... And the salary earned is not for you but for your landlord.

Who gives quite a high proportion of it back to the tax man who spends it on providing subsidised housing in the capital to many deserving people and many not so deserving.

stateofflux

It is nuts..

4 years ago i was renting a big 2 bed georgian apartment in ranelagh for 650pm
now i am in a tiny studio (an eight of the size) paying 950pm.

the funny thing is back then i only had a part time job /casual dole. now i have a decent full time job and decent salary but my disposable income is the same.

jay0109

And 550 new jobs in 2 announcements for Dublin today. Carnage

awec

BDJW wrote: »

I'm currently looking for a two bed apartment to rent. I came across a two bed in Belarmine (Stepaside) for 700 quid a week this morning :eek:

Weekly rent is not really comparable. Properties advertised with weekly rates are usually available on short term lets which are always much more expensive.

Henbabani

jay0109 wrote: »

And 550 new jobs in 2 announcements for Dublin today. Carnage

350 from the 550 will be available only in 2021...
"
[font=Lato, sans-serif]Separately, pharmaceutical company MSD has announced the creation of 350 jobs.[/font]
[font=Lato, sans-serif]The positions will come on stream with construction of a new biotechnology facility in Swords.[/font]
[font=Lato, sans-serif]Site works will start immediately, and manufacturing is expected to begin in 2021."[/font]

BillyBobBS

Fail to prepare, prepare to fail. Irish governments housing policy has been a mess for the last 30 years and i see absolutely nothing indicating that is going to change anytime soon.

andekwarhola

If you made as bad a mess of your own work projects as highly paid government ministers have of the housing sector and related regulation for the last 20 years, you'd be fired in a instant.

Roger_007

It's important to remember that the Daft report refers to the asking price for new lettings.
It's also important to remember that Daft are a private company and a player in the market.
Are there any figures available from an independent source based on what existing renters are actually paying?

Fann Linn

Roger_007 wrote: »

It's important to remember that the Daft report refers to the asking price for new lettings.
It's also important to remember that Daft are a private company and a player in the market.
Are there any figures available from an independent source based on what existing renters are actually paying?

Spot on. The sister in law is in accomodation in Cabra where the state is paying her landlord €1400 pm. She however has to pay another €475 under the counter to them. Asking prices are not relevant when the person behind you in the queue is prepared to pay more.

CruelCoin

For that money you could pay the mortgage on !!!3!!! x 4-beds where i live, an hour from Dublin.

Christ, is saving 2 hours a day in the car worth the difference?

Malayalam

Ferfuxake, that is a disgrace.

But why don't people see that even if the ''jobs are in Dublin'' they would be better off looking for a job somewhere else, even if less well paid, because with a much cheaper rent somewhere else they will have more left over for actually living an actual life at the end of the week? What the heck has Dublin got that people flock in there to pay those kind of rents? It always seems kind of smelly, rushed and crowded to me.

I don't know. It's madness.

Mickiemcfist

stateofflux wrote: »

It is nuts..

4 years ago i was renting a big 2 bed georgian apartment in ranelagh for 650pm
now i am in a tiny studio (an eight of the size) paying 950pm.

the funny thing is back then i only had a part time job /casual dole. now i have a decent full time job and decent salary but my disposable income is the same.

Both of those rents seem pretty good value tbh. 4 years ago I was renting a basic 2 bed in Rathfarnham for 1300.

Samuel T. Cogley

Malayalam wrote: »

Ferfuxake, that is a disgrace.

But why don't people see that even if the ''jobs are in Dublin'' they would be better off looking for a job somewhere else, even if less well paid, because with a much cheaper rent somewhere else they will have more left over for actually living an actual life at the end of the week? What the heck has Dublin got that people flock in there to pay those kind of rents? It always seems kind of smelly, rushed and crowded to me.

I don't know. It's madness.

Many types of jobs are only in Dublin or only in Dublin with any meaningful supply. My wife can only work where there is a major University and ideally more than one so that's Cork/Limerick, Galway at a push and Dublin/Maynooth. All of which are expensive. Luckily we bought and weren't to snobby about where we lived so pay a very reasonable mortgage in a working class (meant in the true sense of the word) area of Dublin.

Fann Linn

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Many types of jobs are only in Dublin or only in Dublin with any meaningful supply. My wife can only work where there is a major University and ideally more than one so that's Cork/Limerick, Galway at a push and Dublin/Maynooth. All of which are expensive. Luckily we bought and weren't to snobby about where we lived so pay a very reasonable mortgage in a working class (meant in the true sense of the word) area of Dublin.

Thats my in laws problem. She works in either the Mater or James hospital and her husband is a barman. Both in effect low skilled jobs.

Malayalam

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Many types of jobs are only in Dublin or only in Dublin with any meaningful supply. My wife can only work where there is a major University and ideally more than one so that's Cork/Limerick, Galway at a push and Dublin/Maynooth. All of which are expensive. Luckily we bought and weren't to snobby about where we lived so pay a very reasonable mortgage in a working class (meant in the true sense of the word) area of Dublin.

Yeah, I can understand, really I can. It can be a bind. In a previous lifetime I worked lecturing in the law faculty of a Dublin University - surprise, surprise! - but in the end, I opted for a quieter life, changed career, dropped the ambitions, took the massive income hit and went to live rurally for the benefits of a less demanding, less expensive life. My children have never forgiven me!

threein99

CruelCoin wrote: »

For that money you could pay the mortgage on !!!3!!! x 4-beds where i live, an hour from Dublin.

Christ, is saving 2 hours a day in the car worth the difference?

It could take you 2 hours to get home in the evening if you have to go down the N7/M7

Samuel T. Cogley

Malayalam wrote: »

Yeah, I can understand, really I can. It can be a bind. In a previous lifetime I worked lecturing in the law faculty of a Dublin University - surprise, surprise! - but in the end, I opted for a quieter life, changed career, dropped the ambitions, took the massive income hit and went to live rurally for the benefits of a less demanding, less expensive life. My children have never forgiven me!

Floot around as a barrister on circuit and live in a Roscommon mansion for 250K :pac: (That's my - poorly conceived - plan)!

rossmores

belfe wrote: »

... And the salary earned is not for you but for your landlord.

Revenue takes 1/2 that rent from the landlord

Browney7

rossmores wrote: »

Revenue takes 1/2 that rent from the landlord

And dividends from stock market investments, coupon payments on bonds etc. Why should rental income obtained from property investment be different?

Samuel T. Cogley

Browney7 wrote: »

And dividends from stock market investments, coupon payments on bonds etc. Why should rental income obtained from property investment be different?

I thought they were subject to cap gains? Either way no one is suggesting it should be any different, but this misconception that LL's aren't contributing to society is getting a bit old.

Also being honest about it after deductible expenses we're not paying 52% we're paying less than that but it doesn't change the fact that if the government was serious about sorting the rental crisis out it would reinstate rent relief for tenants.

4ensic15

Funny how nobody is saying its all lies and industry propaganda.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=79006148

Browney7

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

I thought they were subject to cap gains? Either way no one is suggesting it should be any different, but this misconception that LL's aren't contributing to society is getting a bit old.

Also being honest about it after deductible expenses we're not paying 52% we're paying less than that but it doesn't change the fact that if the government was serious about sorting the rental crisis out it would reinstate rent relief for tenants.

You pay capital gains on gains in the share price. (Small annual tax free allowance in this regime which also applies to property capital gains).If you receive a 1000 dividend income off Vodafone or Coca Cola for instance you pay income tax on it. If you paid 20k for the shares and sell for 30k you pay capital gains. If you borrowed to invest in those shares you wouldn't get the 80% interest write off either although you'd likely use spreadbetting for this which is considered gambling

SlinkyL

BillyBobBS wrote: »

Fail to prepare, prepare to fail. Irish governments housing policy has been a mess for the last 30 years and i see absolutely nothing indicating that is going to change anytime soon.

Depends on your point of view.. if you are an ordinary person who needs somewhere to live..total disaster.....

if you are an investor, landlord, financial institution, this has been hugely successful, property prices have only gone up and when there has been blips in that trend, e.g., price crash circa 2008, Government policies such as stopping building the very scant amount of social housing that was being (this really stopped back in 80s),relying on private sector to for social housing via HAP and similar schemes, transferring state money to private property owners, creating Nama which ultimately sold off now publicly owned property after bailouts back to private interests at a loss to state..inviting vulture funds in to hoover up any slightly more affordable apartments preventing ordinary people with no access to credit from purchasing them, I could go on....section 23 tax incentives in the 1990s, tax incentives now for landlords by way of mortgage interest relief..
Thiis not caused by ineptness nor is it accidental...it’s a hugely successful policy for those with enough €€€€ to invest in property. God help the rest of us.. I feel very lucky to have bought a small house in 2006.
I truly despair for those younger than me in the rental market. I hate that my city has become so difficult to live in...I despair for my children, just primary school aged now, I feel sad when they talk about what they want to do when they grow up because I know most ordinary jobs are not enough anymore.. We have to demand better... we have to stop voting in the parties who have failed us ordinary people again and again and again...

Franz Von Peppercorn

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Many types of jobs are only in Dublin or only in Dublin with any meaningful supply. My wife can only work where there is a major University and ideally more than one so that's Cork/Limerick, Galway at a push and Dublin/Maynooth. All of which are expensive. Luckily we bought and weren't to snobby about where we lived so pay a very reasonable mortgage in a working class (meant in the true sense of the word) area of Dublin.

Ah you know that area is gentrifying. On the dart etc. Smart though.

_Puma_

SlinkyL wrote: »

Depends on your point of view.. if you are an ordinary person who needs somewhere to live..total disaster.....

if you are an investor, landlord, financial institution, this has been hugely successful, property prices have only gone up and when there has been blips in that trend, e.g., price crash circa 2008, Government policies such as stopping building the very scant amount of social housing that was being (this really stopped back in 80s),relying on private sector to for social housing via HAP and similar schemes, transferring state money to private property owners, creating Nama which ultimately sold off now publicly owned property after bailouts back to private interests at a loss to state..inviting vulture funds in to hoover up any slightly more affordable apartments preventing ordinary people with no access to credit from purchasing them, I could go on....section 23 tax incentives in the 1990s, tax incentives now for landlords by way of mortgage interest relief..
Thiis not caused by ineptness nor is it accidental...it’s a hugely successful policy for those with enough €€€€ to invest in property. God help the rest of us.. I feel very lucky to have bought a small house in 2006.
I truly despair for those younger than me in the rental market. I hate that my city has become so difficult to live in...I despair for my children, just primary school aged now, I feel sad when they talk about what they want to do when they grow up because I know most ordinary jobs are not enough anymore.. We have to demand better... we have to stop voting in the parties who have failed us ordinary people again and again and again...

This times a hundred. Noonan conceived it, Coveney executed it and Murphy is keeping it on track. If you are caught up in this mess and vote for the Incumbent government parties you need to have a good long look at yourself in the mirror.

Franz Von Peppercorn

rossmores wrote: »

Revenue takes 1/2 that rent from the landlord

This is where the marginal rate is a killer. Imagine a worker on the higher tax rate who gets a 6000€ raise. That’s 500 a month pre tax. 250 after tax. Let’s say his rent increases by 250 a month. All his gains are wiped out. His landlord is a mere 125€ richer. Which is why the marginal tax needs to come in at a much higher rate.

Geuze

rossmores wrote: »

Revenue takes 1/2 that rent from the landlord

Half the net rental profit, not half the rent.

JJJJNR

Why stay in Dublin, anywhere along the east coast from dundalk to arklow with a train station should still be fairly ok rent wise. There are two beds to rent in rathdrum for 600 a month last time I checked. Poor little snowflakes.

Mtx

Why are so many graduates working in Dublin then? I'm confused. Surely they must be counting pennies.

April 73

Fann Linn wrote: »

Spot on. The sister in law is in accomodation in Cabra where the state is paying her landlord €1400 pm. She however has to pay another €475 under the counter to them. Asking prices are not relevant when the person behind you in the queue is prepared to pay more.

This isn’t a dig at your sister-in-law Fann Linn, but I’m fascinated by the process and how this works. She works in a hospital & her partner works in a bar? They live in Cabra & the state pays €1400 a month in rent to a private LL? I presume at other times in our history they would have qualified for a council house.
But why must they live in Cabra? If the state wasn’t paying that rent then people would have no choice but to move to a part of the country where their jobs cover the cost of living. There are hospitals & bars all over the country & with much cheaper housing.
It’d be lovely for us all to live close to our jobs, but our incomes generally dictate where we live. That’s certainly the case when you qualify for nothing from the state. It’s why I leave my house at 6.30am to commute to work in the centre of Dublin & often don’t get home til 7.30pm.

Malayalam

SlinkyL wrote: »

Depends on your point of view.. if you are an ordinary person who needs somewhere to live..total disaster.....

if you are an investor, landlord, financial institution, this has been hugely successful, property prices have only gone up and when there has been blips in that trend, e.g., price crash circa 2008, Government policies such as stopping building the very scant amount of social housing that was being (this really stopped back in 80s),relying on private sector to for social housing via HAP and similar schemes, transferring state money to private property owners, creating Nama which ultimately sold off now publicly owned property after bailouts back to private interests at a loss to state..inviting vulture funds in to hoover up any slightly more affordable apartments preventing ordinary people with no access to credit from purchasing them, I could go on....section 23 tax incentives in the 1990s, tax incentives now for landlords by way of mortgage interest relief..
Thiis not caused by ineptness nor is it accidental...it’s a hugely successful policy for those with enough €€€€ to invest in property. God help the rest of us.. I feel very lucky to have bought a small house in 2006.
I truly despair for those younger than me in the rental market. I hate that my city has become so difficult to live in...I despair for my children, just primary school aged now, I feel sad when they talk about what they want to do when they grow up because I know most ordinary jobs are not enough anymore.. We have to demand better... we have to stop voting in the parties who have failed us ordinary people again and again and again...

That day does come around, unfortunately. The day when your grown up children, who are bright and hard-working and good, turn around and say to you, fcuk it, I don't think I will ever be able to buy a house, ever. They will say I don't know how people live on the wages I am getting, even though I have worked really hard, have a PhD, and have a lot to offer to the world. Etc.

There is certainly something seriously messed up on so many levels in the economic and political systems - but I would be here all day going into that - and it is the present and future generations who will have to live with it.

When your children say that to you - and they will, mine have said it to me - you will have to explain to them how they will have to find meaning and balance within the insecurity, how they will have to adapt to the realities of the global economic system with as much wisdom and pragmatism as possible, how they will have to balance their dreams and aspirations against stress, fine-tuning how much is acceptable to them. There are options they could choose if they don't want to play that game any more - lots of ways to live a meaningful, content life, with little money, if one is prepared.

It is simply a fact that right now the buying power of ordinary folk has been seriously constrained as compared to former generations. Wealth and ownership has been concentrated ever more into the hands of ever fewer. It is one of the biggest problems I see in our time - this subtle creep of wealth to the top of the pyramid - but it is largely ignored. People are entertained and amused as consumers and do not see how they are being economically castrated. If one looks at it from an over-arching point of view, this is an expected situation - small finite planet, finite resources, finite land, limited physical assets, ores, raw materials for production - of course those who own most now are going to continuously try to acquire and hoard as much of those finite resources as they possibly can, so that in the end the very, very few will own almost everything, and the rest of us own almost nothing - it is the natural narrative arc for the situation we live in. I am not conspiratorial - it makes perfect sense in a selfish story. And those who do not think the story is selfish are naive. As much as I have wished for it not to be selfish, history tells me a different truth.

strandsman

I can't understand why some IT professionals or other who can work mostly from home don't move out to the midlands and pay rent of 600pm or purchase for 100K . Even if a person had to commute to Dublin for 1-2 days a week how bad? Take Cashel for example, 700pm rent and 90 mins from Dublin/Cork/Limerick/Galway. Why do people go through with the missery of 600K mortgage, 2K rent, Traffic congestion etc etc. When will people cop on to the fact that the reason why living is so expensive in Dublin is because all the Jobs are there. If the jobs were spread around the country then people can return to or near their place of origin instead of moving to Dublin for work. On the other hand I know a few people living in Dublin because they say there is nothing for their profession closer to home and they speak of the misery of living in Dublin but when I suggest that they would be better off financially to locate closer to home and change profession or work in a shop or open a local practice etc they say they couldn't mainly because their profession and career is so important to them! Brain washed I say!

bigpink

Surely all theae non eu people here are driving rents up
Seems to be tonnes of Brazilians Indians etc here
Just going by Facebook rent groups

Samuel T. Cogley

Geuze wrote: »

Half the net rental profit, not half the rent.

Nope, the tax is calculated on the entire income. Yes you can write off expenses against tax and mortgage interest at 75% (80% this year) but then so can any other business (@100%).

super_furry

bigpink wrote: »

Surely all theae non eu people here are driving rents up
Seems to be tonnes of Brazilians Indians etc here
Just going by Facebook rent groups

It's really, really, really not.

LirW

strandsman wrote: »

I can't understand why some IT professionals or other who can work mostly from home don't move out to the midlands and pay rent of 600pm or purchase for 100K . Even if a person had to commute to Dublin for 1-2 days a week how bad? Take Cashel for example, 700pm rent and 90 mins from Dublin/Cork/Limerick/Galway. Why do people go through with the missery of 600K mortgage, 2K rent, Traffic congestion etc etc. When will people cop on to the fact that the reason why living is so expensive in Dublin is because all the Jobs are there. If the jobs were spread around the country then people can return to or near their place of origin instead of moving to Dublin for work. On the other hand I know a few people living in Dublin because they say there is nothing for their profession closer to home and they speak of the misery of living in Dublin but when I suggest that they would be better off financially to locate closer to home and change profession or work in a shop or open a local practice etc they say they couldn't mainly because their profession and career is so important to them! Brain washed I say!

There is no way in hell you do Cashel - Dublin in 90 minutes during the week if you have to leave from within the M50.
Also IT staff needs stable internet, that's a huge problem in a lot of rural and affordable areas.
Ireland doesn't have the infrastructure beyond Dublin to accommodate remote workforce. And I'm not talking about people that live in once-off housing, there are a lot of people in commuter towns that have a bad broadband connection that wouldn't allow remote working.

Also changing profession or shop-work is all nice but a lot of the areas you have in mind have virtually no job vacancies. For everything that comes up, you have 100 people that instantly jump at it.

piplip87

Two things need to happen hand in hand for this to get better.
1)- More apartments, less social housing within the city centre. Its absolute stupidity that long term unemployed people are sitting in flats in the city centre.

It may sound harsh but move them out to the suburbs or down the country. Take these council owned flats, do them up, rent to workers at reasonable rates. Even 600pm will pay off the costs of repairs in a couple of years. This will drive down prices of private rentals. The building of new social housing units I outside the city could provide jobs.

2)- Public Transport. Bus loads leave my town every morning, Virginia co Cavan, the same with Navan and Kells. It can take over two hours. If you have a city centre job its OK. We need investment in rail.

Examples of rail route
Leaves Cavan services the same route as the bus. Run bus services from surrounding areas (Ballyjamesduff,Oldcastle for example for Virginia) to train station, have free parking at the train stations.

This will encourage more people to look outside Dublin and if new rail links where inserted in all commuter route would cut back on traffic too.

CruelCoin

LirW wrote: »

There is no way in hell you do Cashel - Dublin in 90 minutes during the week if you have to leave from within the M50.
Also IT staff needs stable internet, that's a huge problem in a lot of rural and affordable areas.
Ireland doesn't have the infrastructure beyond Dublin to accommodate remote workforce. And I'm not talking about people that live in once-off housing, there are a lot of people in commuter towns that have a bad broadband connection that wouldn't allow remote working.

Also changing profession or shop-work is all nice but a lot of the areas you have in mind have virtually no job vacancies. For everything that comes up, you have 100 people that instantly jump at it.

Every single commuter town along the main trunk roads have fibre now...