New work problems

Willow30

Hi all,
Looking for some advice. Started a new job before xmas. Everyone was really nice at first.
This week gone there has been a few comments made to me by my boss. I feel like im being watched and anything i do or say is being reported back. I also found out that 2 of my colleagues went looking at my work contract which was on my desk but in a sealed envelope. Found out my salary and also said this to the manager. Im shocked and disgusted by the invasion of my privacy. I feel like im being alienated and not really being given a chance i spoke to my manager and the md and expressed my concern. They were really nice and supportive. I just dont feel right about the job now though. Is it too much too soon. Any advice would be appreciated

Tenigate

It doesn't sound like you're a good fit for the company.

Avatar MIA

Your boss made comments to you? That's kind of his role, assuming work related.

The two tools that took a look at your salary, it's a violation, for sure... but to walk away from a job because of it - really?

Would I be right in thinking this is one of your first jobs? You may need to develop a thicker skin.

Willow30

Tenigate wrote: »

It doesn't sound like you're a good fit for the company.

Im not a good fit because the people and snooping and causing trouble for me already..?

Willow30

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Your boss made comments to you? That's kind of his role, assuming work related.

The two tools that took a look at your salary, it's a violation, for sure... but to walk away from a job because of it - really?

Would I be right in thinking this is one of your first jobs? You may need to develop a thicker skin.

I have no problem my boss talking to me about what im doing right and wrong. Its a new role and im trying to fit in but it is all new to me

I have worked in many roles prebiously and always had a good relationship with colleagues customers etc..

I just feel really sad that im only in the door and there is issues already. I just want to know the best way to deal with it really

OldMrBrennan83

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Teyla Emmagan

What sort of comments did your boss make to you?

Willow30

I left 10 minutes early for a doctor's apt on Tuesday boss was gone so i said it to the next person in line. The man in question who i found out snooped at my contract. My boss assumed i just left without asking!

I took a call and obviously some one thought i didnt handle it correctly

Both were said to me

Avatar MIA

Willow30 wrote: »

I left 10 minutes early for a doctor's apt on Tuesday boss was gone so i said it to the next person in line. The man in question who i found out snooped at my contract. My boss assumed i just left without asking!

I took a call and obviously some one thought i didnt handle it correctly

Both were said to me

I see you asked permission, but without much notice.

Both seemed entirely reasonable discussions to be had with you.

Willow30

Patww79 wrote: »

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If they're not heavily disciplined for doing it then it would probably be a good idea to start looking as you'd be on a hiding to nothing in a cliquey place like that.[/quote]
I think they should be. Should i follow it up. Managers said theyll keep an eye on things and follow it up

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Avatar MIA

Patww79 wrote: »

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That was not right, and should be reprimanded. But, leaving a job even if they aren't? It'd be a factor, but not if it was the only thing.

The OP seems concerned that his manager is raising two issues that his manager has a right to bring up.

Willow30

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Willow30 wrote: »

I left 10 minutes early for a doctor's apt on Tuesday boss was gone so i said it to the next person in line. The man in question who i found out snooped at my contract. My boss assumed i just left without asking!

I took a call and obviously some one thought i didnt handle it correctly

Both were said to me

Did you ask permission to leave and if so from whom if not your boss?

Both seemed entirely reasonable discussions to be had with you.[/quote

Of course no managers were there so i said it to the person next in line. The snow was very bad and i was suffering from a kidney infection. My apt was after 5 but i left 10 minutes earlier due to weather conditions

I think your missing me point the problem isnt my boss making comments to me its my collegues and them causing trouble for me and violating my privacy

Avatar MIA

Willow30 wrote: »

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Did you ask permission to leave and if so from whom if not your boss?

Both seemed entirely reasonable discussions to be had with you.

Of course no managers were there so i said it to the person next in line. The snow was very bad and i was suffering from a kidney infection. My apt was after 5 but i left 10 minutes earlier due to weather conditions

I think your missing me point the problem isnt my boss making comments to me its my collegues and them causing trouble for me and violating my privacy

Leaving early even if for a good reason requires mention, especially as no manager was there to give permission - you might want to get their phone number in future. And if you've no problem with your boss discussing things with you why did you raise it here?

Willow30

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Willow30 wrote: »

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Did you ask permission to leave and if so from whom if not your boss?

Both seemed entirely reasonable discussions to be had with you.

Of course no managers were there so i said it to the person next in line. The snow was very bad and i was suffering from a kidney infection. My apt was after 5 but i left 10 minutes earlier due to weather conditions

I think your missing me point the problem isnt my boss making comments to me its my collegues and them causing trouble for me and violating my privacy

Leaving early even if for a good reason requires mention, especially as no manager was there to give permission - you might want to get their phone number in future. And if you've no problem with your boss discussing things with you why did you raise it here?

Ive already said what my issue is..i also did mention it to the next person in line if no manager is present. Im sorry but are you reading my posts. Im very upset and anxious about going into an environment were i feel im being alienated and where i have no privacy

Avatar MIA

Willow30 wrote: »

Ive already said what my issue is..i also did mention it to the next person in line if no manager is present. Im sorry but are you reading my posts. Im very upset and anxious about going into an environment were i feel im being alienated and where i have no privacy

Okay, there's only one issue, the lack of privacy. They've read your contract and know your salary. Nobody can say this isn't important to you. It seems to be. For me it'd need to be medical records or such before I'd consider it very serious.

What do you want your managers to do? Sack the two employees? This is unlikely due to employment protection.

Be clear in your mind what you would like done (bearing in mind the limitations the employers are under) and go talk to them.

Glen_Quagmire

Pushing to have the two employees disciplined for looking at your contract is only going to alienate you further with your new colleagues. However that would seriously piss me off if it happened me so I understand your frustration

Willow30

Glen_Quagmire wrote: »

Pushing to have the two employees disciplined for looking at your contract is only going to alienate you further with your new colleagues. However that would seriously piss me off if it happened me so I understand your frustration

Thanks - its not a great start really

OldMrBrennan83

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Glen_Quagmire

Willow30 wrote:

Thanks - its not a great start really

Its not unfortunately.

Did you catch them opening your contract or did someone tell you about it?

Glen_Quagmire

Patww79 wrote:

This post has been deleted.

I agree. If the OP makes a formal complaint and nothing is done about it then I would suggest the OP look for a different job if at all possible as the environment would appear to be toxic as you pointed out

Willow30

Glen_Quagmire wrote: »

Willow30 wrote:

Thanks - its not a great start really

Its not unfortunately.

Did you catch them opening your contract or did someone tell you about it?

I was told by management. I think they assumed i was carelessly leaving it out on view for everyone to see. I advised it was in an envelope and could only have been seen if someone opened it. I expressed my concern at them invading my privacy. I was imagine very little will be done to be honest. I also feel im not in a very strong position as im only in the door.

Batgurl

Why did you leave your contract on your desk at work? Even if it’s in an envelope, that’s not exactly secure. You are just as responsible for making sure confident information like that is not easily accessible to anyone else.

The doctor thing is also your responsibility as you should have flagged it with your manager as soon as you got the appointment and certainly before they left.

As for your colleagues being reprimanded, how do you know they haven’t been? You made the complaint and after that, it’s none of your business and your managers are not expected to keep you informed of how it’s being dealt with.

I agree with other posters who say you seem quite naive on working in a professional environment. You would do well to keep your head down and just get on with it from now on.

dennyk

Management is probably concerned that you left a private document unsecured on your desk while you were away; that's not a good habit, and while they may not be terribly worried about another employee seeing your contract specifically, they would certainly have been alarmed if it had been confidential company data (customer information, business plans, etc.) and was viewed by someone who wasn't authorized to see it. Data security is a very big deal these days, and an envelope is not sufficient to keep such things away from prying eyes (as you've now learned). You should get into the habit of locking all your paperwork in your drawers or filing cabinets every time you leave your desk. If you don't have a locking cabinet, talk to your management about obtaining one; it will demonstrate that you understand the importance of keeping things secure and are actively working on a solution instead of ignoring the problem.

As to the issue of leaving early, was this an emergency of some sort? If you knew about the appointment ahead of time, you should have notified your boss that you might have to leave a few minutes early in good time, not just waited until you were actually walking out the door on the day of. All you can really do now is apologize to your boss for not notifying them ahead of time and assure them that it won't happen again, but it's a small enough mistake really, so I wouldn't worry too much about it. Everyone errs from time to time, but as long as you're willing to take responsibility for your mistakes and take steps to ensure they don't happen again, you'll usually do well enough.

kurtainsider

dennyk wrote: »

Management is probably concerned that you left a private document unsecured on your desk while you were away; that's not a good habit, and while they may not be terribly worried about another employee seeing your contract specifically, they would certainly have been alarmed if it had been confidential company data (customer information, business plans, etc.) and was viewed by someone who wasn't authorized to see it. Data security is a very big deal these days, and an envelope is not sufficient to keep such things away from prying eyes (as you've now learned). You should get into the habit of locking all your paperwork in your drawers or filing cabinets every time you leave your desk. If you don't have a locking cabinet, talk to your management about obtaining one; it will demonstrate that you understand the importance of keeping things secure and are actively working on a solution instead of ignoring the problem.

As to the issue of leaving early, was this an emergency of some sort? If you knew about the appointment ahead of time, you should have notified your boss that you might have to leave a few minutes early in good time, not just waited until you were actually walking out the door on the day of. All you can really do now is apologize to your boss for not notifying them ahead of time and assure them that it won't happen again, but it's a small enough mistake really, so I wouldn't worry too much about it. Everyone errs from time to time, but as long as you're willing to take responsibility for your mistakes and take steps to ensure they don't happen again, you'll usually do well enough.

I am really at a loss as to how the point regarding a sealed envelope on a persons desk being opened by 2 snoops is twisted to becomes a point against the person who's privacy has been violated. I've worked in several environments and in none of them would opening a sealed envelope on a colleagues desk without their knowledge or permission be seen as acceptable. Before trotting out this "learn from this lapse and try to do better" horse manure please ask yourself how you would feel if someone opened a sealed envelope on your desk, bench, in your van etc. etc. I suspect most people would be outraged.
Why not go into your bosses office and open a sealed envelope there and go through the contents. Would your boss shrug his/her shoulders and silently vow to try to do a better in future? I imagine that you would be going home with your large intestine wound around your neck.

Batgurl

kurtainsider wrote: »

I've worked in several environments and in none of them would opening a sealed envelope on a colleagues desk without their knowledge or permission be seen as acceptable.

No one is saying it’s acceptable. However it’s fair to say both parties are at fault here.

The snoopers should be reprimanded (OP doesn’t get to be made aware of how though) AND the OP should be pulled up on their poor security practices. It doesn’t have to be one or the other.

kurtainsider

Batgurl wrote: »

No one is saying it’s acceptable. However it’s fair to say both parties are at fault here.

The snoopers should be reprimanded (OP doesn’t get to be made aware of how though) AND the OP should be pulled up on their poor security practices. It doesn’t have to be one or the other.

My fundamental point is that a sealed envelope on your desk with your contract in it is not in my view a poor security practice.

The debate is taking the direction of the person offended against being made to feel that they are in the wrong. I don't like that. That blaming approach will make it more difficult for the person who is already facing an uphill battle to stand up for themselves.

Avatar MIA

kurtainsider wrote: »

My fundamental point is that a sealed envelope on your desk with your contract in it is not in my view a poor security practice.

I'd very much agree with you on this. The OP should be allowed to have a sealed (or even unsealed) envelope on her desk and expect it not to be interfered with.

dennyk

kurtainsider wrote: »

I am really at a loss as to how the point regarding a sealed envelope on a persons desk being opened by 2 snoops is twisted to becomes a point against the person who's privacy has been violated.

Of course it's absolutely unacceptable to snoop through other people's private papers or belongings, but the OP was wondering why management brought the matter to their attention in the first place, and the reason is most likely that they want the OP to be more careful in the future about securing company information, which is a perfectly reasonable concern.

Hopefully the snoops have at least gotten a good lashing from management about their inappropriate behavior, or better yet some sort of formal write-up, but it would be inappropriate for management to share the details of that with the OP regardless; whatever disciplinary measures were taken are a private matter between the company and those two employees.

Escapees

Can't help but wonder if it really was a 'sealed' envelope? Also, there's been no mention of whether the envelope had any markings on it such as the OP's name etc. Presume the nosey colleagues used this fact as a get out of jail card or else the story doesn't quite add up.

I can imagine the crap that this has raised for mgt, especially if it emerged that the OP was on a better salary package than colleagues doing a similar role! This situation isn't unusual but noone except mgt and accounts ever know about it!!

kurtainsider

dennyk wrote: »

Hopefully the snoops have at least gotten a good lashing from management about their inappropriate behavior, or better yet some sort of formal write-up, but it would be inappropriate for management to share the details of that with the OP regardless; whatever disciplinary measures were taken are a private matter between the company and those two employees.

Well if the snoops felt that they could opened a sealed envelope on a colleagues desk and then go and discuss the contents with the boss I wouldn't hold out much hope for their being disciplined. Unfortunately the OP hasn't told us what the boss said in reference to the rifling of his/her property so all discussion around that is speculation.

Willow30

kurtainsider wrote: »

Batgurl wrote: »

No one is saying it’s acceptable. However it’s fair to say both parties are at fault here.

The snoopers should be reprimanded (OP doesn’t get to be made aware of how though) AND the OP should be pulled up on their poor security practices. It doesn’t have to be one or the other.

My fundamental point is that a sealed envelope on your desk with your contract in it is not in my view a poor security practice.

The debate is taking the direction of the person offended against being made to feel that they are in the wrong. I don't like that. That blaming approach will make it more difficult for the person who is already facing an uphill battle to stand up for themselves.

Thank you

beauf

dennyk wrote: »

Management is probably concerned that you left a private document unsecured on your desk ....

Its not ok to go through any paperwork on someone's else desk. Especially if its in an envelope.

You seem to think its ok. Its not.

Willow30

kurtainsider wrote: »

dennyk wrote: »

Hopefully the snoops have at least gotten a good lashing from management about their inappropriate behavior, or better yet some sort of formal write-up, but it would be inappropriate for management to share the details of that with the OP regardless; whatever disciplinary measures were taken are a private matter between the company and those two employees.

Well if the snoops felt that they could opened a sealed envelope on a colleagues desk and then go and discuss the contents with the boss I wouldn't hold out much hope for their being disciplined. Unfortunately the OP hasn't told us what the boss said in reference to the rifling of his/her property so all discussion around that is speculation.

He has said there will be serious words had.

kurtainsider

Willow30 wrote: »

He has said there will be serious words had.

If that's the boss's view then you might still get a fair shake with this employer.

beauf

I think in every job you meet people who you realize can't be trusted, and you just work around that.

You might also have to consider trying to have a paperless desk if there is a culture of snooping that isn't being dealt with.

dennyk

beauf wrote: »

Its not ok to go through any paperwork on someone's else desk. Especially if its in an envelope.

You seem to think its ok. Its not.

Where did I say it was OK for someone to go through it? Of course it's not. However, unscrupulous people exist, and most companies will reasonably expect their employees to take measures to secure sensitive data in their possession lest it fall into the hands of said people. It's not a matter of blame or of it being "OK" to steal private information, it's just practical advice on how to prevent such a situation from occurring in the first place.

Most people would tell you it's a good idea to lock your car doors when you leave your car parked somewhere; does that mean they all think it's OK to steal stuff from your car if it's unlocked?

tomwaits48

Are you generally prone to drama?

Willow30

tomwaits48 wrote: »

Are you generally prone to drama?

Excuse me?? Im not but i don't know what that got to do with anything or this situation. Im new to a job and my privacy has been this invaded. The while atmosphere sucks but its my fault in some peoples views!!

I

beauf

dennyk wrote: »

beauf wrote: »

Its not ok to go through any paperwork on someone's else desk. Especially if its in an envelope.

You seem to think its ok. Its not.

Where did I say it was OK for someone to go through it? Of course it's not. However, unscrupulous people exist, and most companies will reasonably expect their employees to take measures to secure sensitive data in their possession lest it fall into the hands of said people. It's not a matter of blame or of it being "OK" to steal private information, it's just practical advice on how to prevent such a situation from occurring in the first place.

Most people would tell you it's a good idea to lock your car doors when you leave your car parked somewhere; does that mean they all think it's OK to steal stuff from your car if it's unlocked?

Victim blaming is means to justify the unjustifiable. An office and professional work environment is nothing like parking a car in a public place. It's very odd that you think it is.

Maybe they should have a safe on ever desk and a security guard beside each one. Where does it end...It's not mission impossible. No place can work like that.

witchgirl26

beauf wrote: »

Victim blaming is means to justify the unjustifiable. An office and professional work environment is nothing like parking a car in a public place. It's very odd that you think it is.

Maybe they should have a safe on ever desk and a security guard beside each one. Where does it end...It's not mission impossible. No place can work like that.

Ah come on, the point being made was a valid one. It's not saying that the reprimand for both pieces are the same but having a chat to the OP about security of documents at work isn't a bad one to have. It's not victim blaming at all but people do have to take some personal responsibility for the safety of documents at work.

All of my workplaces have told us to secure documents if we're leaving our desks and mobile phones. Most offices provide a locker with a key in it for this purpose. I had one manager who would remove documents and phones from people's desks during lunch to teach this lesson. Obviously it depends on the department you work in but with the new data security regulations coming in shortly, it is something that companies are terrified about and will be drilling into staff I'd say. Otherwise the fines if information was obtained are massive.

OP if your manager has said that they will talk to the 2 individuals about reading the contract, then I would suggest trusting this and letting it go from your side. It sounds like they are taking it serious but you have no right to know about the outcome of that discussion same way as they had no right to know the details of your contract.

In regards the other issue with the phone call. I wouldn't see this as an issue to be honest. I've worked in places where employees were encouraged to talk to management if they felt a colleague hadn't handled a call with a client well and it would then be looked into and seen. If it's a malicious complaint, then that will show very quickly. It could also be a case that, as you're new, they were asked to keep an eye.

beauf

There is a world of a difference in having a policy about keeping all documents under lock and key.

... and having no policy and people opening sealed envelopes on other people desks without having any valid reason to do.

Middle Man

Tenigate wrote: »

It doesn't sound like you're a good fit for the company.

There by the grace of God goes I...

If you have nothing helpful to contribute, then just shut up!

razorblunt

OP, did you have any Data Privacy training provided to you in this new workplace?
I'm in no way blaming you but I'm wondering if there are two separate breaches of any potential policy, first with you leaving it on your desk (sealed envelope or no) and then those eejits looking at the data.

Regarding leaving early, you just need to take that on the chin. Chalk it down to "new management practices" and learn the process. Also drop the manager a mail too letting them know of your whereabouts, I've always done this to cover myself (provided the early finish was approved already).

Middle Man

Willow30 wrote: »

I left 10 minutes early for a doctor's apt on Tuesday boss was gone so i said it to the next person in line. The man in question who i found out snooped at my contract. My boss assumed i just left without asking!

I took a call and obviously some one thought i didnt handle it correctly

Both were said to me

You need to be careful - these issues that you're mentioning may not be all that uncommon - I don't obviously have all the facts, there are a lot of nasty backstabbers out there from what I'm hearing.

Middle Man

Avatar MIA wrote: »

I'd very much agree with you on this. The OP should be allowed to have a sealed (or even unsealed) envelope on her desk and expect it not to be interfered with.

I certainly would expect people to have a little bit of manners - especially in a professional environment - really, the standards are low!

Middle Man

tomwaits48 wrote: »

Are you generally prone to drama?

Drama? - If my documents were snooped upon, you'd know all about drama!

witchgirl26

beauf wrote: »

There is a world of a difference in having a policy about keeping all documents under lock and key.

... and having no policy and people opening sealed envelopes on other people desks without having any valid reason to do.

And I'm in no way defending what they did at all. It was wrong and unprofessional.
However management having a chat to the OP about documents on desk is not belittling what was done at all. It's not blaming the OP for the others actions.

Middle Man wrote: »

I certainly would expect people to have a little bit of manners - especially in a professional environment - really, the standards are low!

Manners are one thing but people can be nosey and just because you work in a professional environment does not mean that everyone is a professional by nature. I trust my colleagues completely but I wouldn't leave my payslip on my desk.

seamus

Definitely sounds like there's a bit of a cliquey, whispery work environment going on. Wasters who've been there forever doing their best to bring the newbie down a peg or two and teach them their place.

Who would tell the boss that you left ten minutes early in the first place? And making a complaint that you didn't handle a single call correctly?

Sounds like some weasely crap on going on. You've not been there long, so I would be inclined to tough it out for a while, just be aware that there are eyes and ears everywhere, dying to curry some favour with the boss by pointing out everyone's transgressions. Keep an eye out for better opportunities and jump ship when something better comes along.

As others say, the fact that they saw fit to snoop on your desk and didn't fear discipline for it, indicates that it's probably not the kind of place you want to be long-term.

Middle Man

seamus wrote: »

Definitely sounds like there's a bit of a cliquey, whispery work environment going on. Wasters who've been there forever doing their best to bring the newbie down a peg or two and teach them their place
<snip>

I've heard a lot of that sort thing going on from time to time - it's disgusting!

Powerfairy

Hi Willow30

My two cents,

Keep your head down and tough this job out for a while longer to try last 6-12 months if you are fairly new? (assuming you are), as you won't want a gap on your CV as sometimes it brings questions upon yourself (speaking from my personal experience). But in saying that I would most certainly be looking for other opportunities in the mean time, because:
1. It is not normal or OK, for someone to snoop through your stuff.
2. Your boss should have disciplined them for doing that. A strong talking to isn't good enough, They should be made apologise. Its promoting bad feeling amongst you all.
3. Telling on you for leaving 10 min's early for a doctors appointment, shows they have an issue with you. What did they hope to gain from that.
4. This information being fed back to the boss might be twisted to make you sound worse, so your boss is worse for listening to it. Its a sign that he/she isn't a great boss.

If you were to get an interview for another role in the time you are in this job, You could always say it wasn't challenging enough etc, put a positive spin on why you are leaving.

All I know is working in a toxic place is tough on your mental health, so I wish you the best of luck. People being mean to you for no reason isn't cool. Try not to let it get you down. And if it really is effecting you, get out of there. Life is too short. Work to live, don't live to work.