Condensation in house

whitelightrider

Hi Folks,

We seem to have a serious issue with condensation in our house and I was wondering if there's anything I should be looking at to improve the issue?
On windows downstairs the water can literally be dropping off the key's in the doors, and has seeped in behind the window boards in the rooms.
I find myself using kitchen roll to clear up any water from the windows almost every night.

This only seems to have during the colder months though.

mikeysmith

Open the vents

Keep the heat on constant

Don't dry clothes indoors

Make sure extraction is adequate for bathrooms and cooker

For a start anyhow

whitelightrider

Hi Mikeysmith,

One thing I noticed is that the plasterer has covered the vents in the rooms by plastering over them. 
I can get these opened, but what kind of vent should I be putting into the rooms to avoid draughts?

muffler

+1 on all of the above.

This is always a problem particularly at this time of year when the external temperature drops which results in moist warm air internally meeting cold surfaces and condensing into water droplets basically.

As stated above proper ventilation and heating are the key and not forgetting your levels of insulation.

mikeysmith

whitelightrider wrote: »

Hi Mikeysmith,

One thing I noticed is that the plasterer has covered the vents in the rooms by plastering over them. 
I can get these opened, but what kind of vent should I be putting into the rooms to avoid draughts?

You'd need to unblock the vents and fit grilles on them for a start anyhow

Is the house well insulated and double glazed

muffler

whitelightrider wrote: »

One thing I noticed is that the plasterer has covered the vents in the rooms by plastering over them.

Why would he do such a thing? The vents serve a very important purpose as do other fittings and features in the house. Blocking them is in breach of Building Regulations btw.

Is this a new house?

whitelightrider

Hi folks,

House was built about 10 years ago.  We're on the top of a hill and very open so Im assuming it was to stop any drafts coming into the house.
Im going to look at fitting some grills over the Christmas.  Are there any particular ones that people would recommend?  Last think I want is for a gale to be coming through the vents

9or10

All of your windows have vents on them? Are they open?

whitelightrider

No vents on the windows.

9or10

That's a pity. Assuming you have the bog standard white upvc double glazing they could be retro fitted.

https://www.windowanddoorparts.ie/shop/window-parts/window-trickle-vent/

If you started in the rooms where you have most problems.



ps: though read the warning on that page

EndaHonesty

A dehumidifier will solve the condensation issue overnight.

mikeysmith

EndaHonesty wrote: »

A dehumidifier will solve the condensation issue overnight.

Be cheaper to unblock the vents

whitelightrider

9or10 wrote: »

That's a pity.  Assuming you have the bog standard white upvc double glazing they could be retro fitted.

https://www.windowanddoorparts.ie/shop/window-parts/window-trickle-vent/

If you started in the rooms where you have most problems.



ps: though read the warning on that page

Are these hard to fit?  I can get in touch with Grady Joinery who fitted our double glazed windows to make sure they can be drilled into.

whitelightrider

mikeysmith wrote: »

EndaHonesty wrote: »

A dehumidifier will solve the condensation issue overnight.

Be cheaper to unblock the vents

Exactly.  And the problem is in most rooms to be honest.  Ive noticed mold in 1 of the rooms which has set off alarm bells as we have 2 young kids.

EndaHonesty

mikeysmith wrote: »

Be cheaper to unblock the vents

Would someone be able to cut into newly plastered walls, install and finish vents in the whole house for less than €200?

I don't think so.

A dehumidifier will cost less than €200, remove the condensation completely from the whole house, make the house more comfortable and keep expensive heating inside.

The dehumidifier will solve the mould issue too.

cruizer101

A dehumidifier might remove the moisture but you are still just re-circulating stale air and not getting any fresh air into the house. Have to add in running costs also. The proper solution is to put in the vents that are meant to be there.

Op I know in a friends house before they moved in they got a lot of insulation put in but still had the old windows and they used to get a lot of condensation even though it was ventilated correctly, once they got new decent windows in the problem was gone. So I'm no expert but I think it was in part caused by the difference big difference between very well insulated walls and crap windows.

whitelightrider

cruizer101 wrote: »

A dehumidifier might remove the moisture but you are still just re-circulating stale air and not getting any fresh air into the house. Have to add in running costs also. The proper solution is to put in the vents that are meant to be there.

Op I know in a friends house before they moved in they got a lot of insulation put in but still had the old windows and they used to get a lot of condensation even though it was ventilated correctly, once they got new decent windows in the problem was gone. So I'm no expert but I think it was in part caused by the difference big difference between very well insulated walls and crap windows.

We've spent a lot on insulation so the house is very well insulated.  But the windows are also high quality too.  My brother in law has the same ones and has no issue.  Then again, I do think he has vents, although has blocked a couple where the airflow was too great causing drafts in the room.

EndaHonesty

cruizer101 wrote: »

A dehumidifier might remove the moisture but you are still just re-circulating stale air and not getting any fresh air into the house. Have to add in running costs also. The proper solution is to put in the vents that are meant to be there.

Op I know in a friends house before they moved in they got a lot of insulation put in but still had the old windows and they used to get a lot of condensation even though it was ventilated correctly, once they got new decent windows in the problem was gone. So I'm no expert but I think it was in part caused by the difference big difference between very well insulated walls and crap windows.

You are overstating the issue of stale air. Once a window is opened for a few hours each day there will be no stale air in the house.

Modern dehumidifiers have air filters with silver particles in them to clean air too.

It's silly IMO to allow your heating out passive vents when there is a technological solution that is guaranteed to work.

whitelightrider

EndaHonesty wrote: »

cruizer101 wrote: »

A dehumidifier might remove the moisture but you are still just re-circulating stale air and not getting any fresh air into the house. Have to add in running costs also. The proper solution is to put in the vents that are meant to be there.

Op I know in a friends house before they moved in they got a lot of insulation put in but still had the old windows and they used to get a lot of condensation even though it was ventilated correctly, once they got new decent windows in the problem was gone. So I'm no expert but I think it was in part caused by the difference big difference between very well insulated walls and crap windows.

You are overstating the issue of stale air. Once a window is opened for a few hours each day there will be no stale air in the house.

Modern dehumidifiers have air filters with silver particles in them to clean air too.

It's silly IMO to allow your heating out vents when there is a technological solution that is guaranteed to work.

Hi Enda,

The only issue I see here is that you could potentially leave the house with air thats too dry, which can lead to issue with young children.  With 2 young girls, that would be my main concern with using the dehumidifier

EndaHonesty

whitelightrider wrote: »

Hi Enda,

The only issue I see here is that you could potentially leave the house with air thats too dry, which can lead to issue with young children.  With 2 young girls, that would be my main concern with using the dehumidifier

Modern household dehumidifiers only dry the air to "normal" levels, they don't just keep drying the air, they switch off once the excess moisture has been removed.

I have a Delonghi DES12 compressor type dehumidifier that has been working away for 4 years in an apartment I previously lived in but is now vacant.

I had a Meaco desiccant model before that which worked fine but died after 2 years.
When I was looking for a replacement I discovered that desiccant dehumidifiers are not as reliable as compressor dehumidifiers, so I chose the compressor type.

I leave the dehumidifier running pretty much all the time, it switches off when the tank is full.

They are brilliant little machines that make your place easier to heat in cold weather, cooler in warm weather and dries clothes inside quickly without any worries.

Some people mention the noise and cost of running as downsides but I've found that the noise is slight and actually is a dull background ambient noise that drowns
out external noises so it's IMO an upside.

The running costs are small and are more than made up for by the easier heating, easier clothes drying and overall improved atmosphere.

listermint

Will you stop Hocking dehumidifiers . It's getting ridiculous at this point.


It sounds like you sell them or something.

Dehumidifiers will not solve a condensation problem in a house. At best it's good for a small apartment.

Your house needs to be properly ventilated. that's why there was vents in it. Dehumidifiers are not for that purpose. Now if you came in talking about installing a hrv system then fair enough. But your not you keep coming on telling people to by free standing cheap dehumidifiers.

It's not a permanent solution it's a quick fix for small areas.

Enough with the half arsed solutions.

When you sell your house and take your little machine with you it will still be the same crap damp house.

fred funk }{

listermint wrote: »

Will you stop Hocking dehumidifiers . It's getting ridiculous at this point.


It sounds like you sell them or something.

Dehumidifiers will not solve a condensation problem in a house. At best it's good for a small apartment.

Your house needs to be properly ventilated. that's why there was vents in it. Dehumidifiers are not for that purpose. Now if you came in talking about installing a hrv system then fair enough. But your not you keep coming on telling people to by free standing cheap dehumidifiers.

It's not a permanent solution it's a quick fix for small areas.

Enough with the half arsed solutions.

When you sell your house and take your little machine with you it will still be the same crap damp house.

Thank you - thought I was the only one.

EndaHonesty

listermint wrote: »

Will you stop Hocking dehumidifiers . It's getting ridiculous at this point.


It sounds like you sell them or something.

Dehumidifiers will not solve a condensation problem in a house. At best it's good for a small apartment.

Your house needs to be properly ventilated. that's why there was vents in it. Dehumidifiers are not for that purpose. Now if you came in talking about installing a hrv system then fair enough. But your not you keep coming on telling people to by free standing cheap dehumidifiers.

It's not a permanent solution it's a quick fix for small areas.

Enough with the half arsed solutions.

When you sell your house and take your little machine with you it will still be the same crap damp house.

Have you used a dehumidifier in a house/apartment?

My guess is no.

And you're acting all butt hurt for why?

Passive vents are from the dark ages, we've moved on grandad.

muffler

EndaHonesty wrote: »

we've moved on grandad.

Very helpful and mature.


No doubt about it, dehumidifiers are a great piece of kit and serve a good purpose but only on a temporary basis. Its a bit like collecting water in a bucket thats stemming from a leak in the attic. The water will continue to flow until the root cause has been identified and repaired and when that's done the bucket can be dispensed with.

In the OP's case proper ventilation, heating and insulation will provide a permanent cure to a troublesome problem.

EndaHonesty

muffler wrote: »

Very helpful and mature.


No doubt about it, dehumidifiers are a great piece of kit and serve a good purpose but only on a temporary basis. Its a bit like collecting water in a bucket thats stemming from a leak in the attic. The water will continue to flow until the root cause has been identified and repaired and when that's done the bucket can be dispensed with.

In the OP's case proper ventilation, heating and insulation will provide a permanent cure to a troublesome problem.

Oh so accusing me of "hocking" dehumidifiers because I must be seĺling them is mature debate?!

Dehumidifiers are nothing like using a bucket to fix a leak, most moisture issues in modern homes are caused by human activity.

Cooking, heating, washing, moving and even breathing all introduce extra moisture into the household environment.

Dehumidifiers are a mechanical answer to a mechanical problem.

Advocating passive ventilation as the solution is ridiculous in this day and age.

Putting extra holes in walls and windows, hoping they take the moisture out without causing draughts, while venting your expensive heating at the same time is not the answer.

Are there other solutions? Certainly, but no other solution will work immediately and be as cheap or easy to implement as simply installing a dehumidifier.

Dehumidifiers are a guaranteed solution.

Seth Brundle

EndaHonesty wrote: »

Dehumidifiers are a guaranteed solution.

Guaranteed? By whom?

EndaHonesty

kbannon wrote: »

Guaranteed? By whom?

By the manufacturer.

They are designed to remove excess moisture, if they don't work you can return them.

They will work.

Seth Brundle

Do they pay you on commission or a salary?
:rolleyes:

denismc

While I find dehumidifiers fine for individual rooms, I'm not sure they are suitable for a whole house, as well as moving them from room to room they need to be emptied regularly.

A guy at work got one of these:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Nuaire-Drimaster-Heat-Condensation-Ventilation/dp/B0074KMAM0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1513338731&sr=8-1&keywords=nuaire+drimaster.
They draw air from the attic through a filter and push it into the house adding a little heat. My friend is very pleased with his and it seems to get good reviews.

muffler

EndaHonesty wrote: »

Oh so accusing me of "hocking" dehumidifiers because I must be seĺling them is mature debate?!

You can hardly blame people for thinking that as I've heard less drum beating in East Belfast on the 12th July

Dehumidifiers are nothing like using a bucket to fix a leak, most moisture issues in modern homes are caused by human activity.

That was an analogy used to demonstrate that the original problem still exists.

Cooking, heating, washing, moving and even breathing all introduce extra moisture into the household environment.

Couldnt agree more.

Dehumidifiers are a mechanical answer to a mechanical problem.

They merely help in the short term but as I have already said the root problem is still there and that needs to be addressed. Despite your persistent promoting of dehumidifiers there are other options available.

Advocating passive ventilation as the solution is ridiculous in this day and age.

Not every house or all activities in every house is the same. There are a lot of factors at play so it is possible for passive ventilation to work in certain occasions. I wouldnt be so dismissive of the idea given the fact that the lack of passive vents has most likely caused the OP's problems.

Putting extra holes in walls and windows, hoping they take the moisture out without causing draughts, while venting your expensive heating at the same time is not the answer.

As above. Its a very cheap and simple option to explore.

Are there other solutions? Certainly, but no other solution will work immediately and be as cheap or easy to implement as simply installing a dehumidifier.

As you said there are other options but here we go again - you had to start banging the drum again about the dehumidifier.

Dehumidifiers are a guaranteed solution.

No they're not. I dont know how many times I and others have to say that the root cause of the problem must be addressed. Mopping up or sticking a plaster on it doesnt solve the problem.

EndaHonesty

muffler wrote: »

blah

All that and you haven't offered one solid solution to the OP's problem and topic of the thread.

The problem is most likely human activity, you've admitted that yourself, it's unlikely to be an inherent fault with the house.

The solution is a dehumidifier, it's as simple as that.

I speak as someone who has had similar issues and used a dehumidifier to solve them.
I have nothing to gain from sharing my experience and giving this advice based on that experience. I know they work.

Do you have any helpful advice for the OP beyond "dehumidifiers won't work" and "add more vents"?

stiofan85

I have similar issues to the OP. Insulated and installed good windows and in the bedroom I have some condensation on these cold mornings. I think it is due to the blinds being very close to the window not allowing air to get in and clear the condensation. Have a passive vent on the other side of the room but I don't think that air can get to it.

I open the window in the morning and leave it open for the day and that solves it. Sometimes I get paranoid about the condensation and put the windows into a type of trickle vent position at night where they are open a few mm but locked in place. I don't do it during this very cold spell as I sleep beside the window and can feel the cold air coming in. Window open during the day has solved it pretty much entirely.

I might try to move the blind out from the window at some point.

Oh..and I use a dehumidifier in the kitchen at night to dry clothes. Works well there...but I find opening a window upstairs is easier than hauling the dehumidifier upstairs, plugging it in, moving it back downstairs to do the clothes a bit of a pain. Opening a window is pretty straight forward and as I'm not there during the day the cold air doesn't bother me.

muffler

I'll leave Enda to his immature and childish misquoting and promoting of his product.

Good luck to the OP, I hope you get sorted.

listermint

EndaHonesty wrote: »

All that and you haven't offered one solid solution to the OP's problem and topic of the thread.

The problem is most likely human activity, you've admitted that yourself, it's unlikely to be an inherent fault with the house.

The solution is a dehumidifier, it's as simple as that.

WRONG!

EndaHonesty wrote: »

I speak as someone who has had similar issues and used a dehumidifier to solve them.
I have nothing to gain from sharing my experience and giving this advice based on that experience. I know they work.

Do you have any helpful advice for the OP beyond "dehumidifiers won't work" and "add more vents"?

Yes he needs to reestablish the vents that were covered over.

'Its as simple as that'

Your short term little moveable box is not solving the problem.

'end of'

august12

whitelightrider wrote:

Are these hard to fit? I can get in touch with Grady Joinery who fitted our double glazed windows to make sure they can be drilled into.

I think you may lose the warranty if you do this, check with the window company who installed them.

whitelightrider

Thanks folks for all the good advice, and apologies for opening a can of worms!

I think the easiest option for all rooms is to open the vents and install the vents inside. My only concern again, is the draft issue. Being on top of a hill and wide open, I dont want an issue where the rooms are cold or a gale is blowing through

EndaHonesty

listermint wrote: »

'end of'

Lol 'end of'? Get over yourself 'listermint'

More vents will not solve the problem.

In fact they will probably cause more problems.

A dehumidifier will remove the excess moisture. Guaranteed.

gctest50

listermint wrote: »

............

Your short term little moveable box is not solving the problem.

'end of'

You can get wall mounted dehumidifiers,

http://bfy.tw/FbsP


.

dathi

i know brookfield student accommodation in cork put in nuaire flatmaster positive input ventilation and a wall mounted dehumidifier in there basement flats 3 years ago when one of our kids stayed. there worked a treat together and it would keep both sides of this argument sweet for Christmas:rolleyes:

beauf

whitelightrider wrote: »

Thanks folks for all the good advice, and apologies for opening a can of worms!

I think the easiest option for all rooms is to open the vents and install the vents inside. My only concern again, is the draft issue. Being on top of a hill and wide open, I dont want an issue where the rooms are cold or a gale is blowing through

You can get vents that have a baffle.

https://www.google.ie/search?q=Air+Vent+Baffle+Anti+Draught+Cowl&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiQ49C975DYAhVJAsAKHdqMDeYQ_AUICigB&biw=1920&bih=1069

Meaning to replace mine with same.

You could get a dehumidifier as a short term solution. Then redo the vents as you get time.

I would get vents you can close though. Unless you have gas heating in which case they have to permanently open.

listermint

Some amount of unqualified nonsense being spouted in this thread. No one wants to buy your poorly built house enda.

It appears you can't it together to sort it's construction problems.

Cantona's Collars

Did anyone ask the question of a damp problem before the vents were plastered over?

Vents are a legal requirement,carbon monoxide poisoning is lethal and one cause is blocked vents where solid fuel fires are used.
I know one fella who spent a fortune on getting a stove fitted and moaned about the smoke and it not burning fuel properly. Turns out he blocked the vent in the room "as it was stupid to have a stove lighting and cold air coming in through a vent".
If you know where the vents were before your plasterer did the stupid job of covering them it'd be easy enough to cut the plaster and fit new grills and baffles.

EndaHonesty

listermint wrote: »

Some amount of unqualified nonsense being spouted in this thread. No one wants to buy your poorly built house enda.

It appears you can't it together to sort it's construction problems.

I have the dehumidifier in an apartment I own. It's vacant and it's only used by family when they visit.
The dehumidifier is running all the time and keeps it reasonably warm and damp free without any requirement for heating during the cold months.

My house is an A rated passive house and the air is handled by a MVHR so no issues with damp.

listermint

EndaHonesty wrote: »

I have the dehumidifier in an apartment I own. It's vacant and it's only used by family when they visit.
The dehumidifier is running all the time and keeps it reasonably warm and damp free without any requirement for heating during the cold months.

My house is an A rated passive house and the air is handled by a MVHR so no issues with damp.

So basically you have a great mvhr system in your home which is appropriate for that dwelling (great)

But peruse forums telling others about the virtues of dehumidifiers which are totally unsuitable for houses with damp issues .but are quite ok for apartments with small areas.

I rest my case.

Nice gaff btw .

EndaHonesty

listermint wrote: »

So basically you have a great mvhr system in your home which is appropriate for that dwelling (great)

But peruse forums telling others about the virtues of dehumidifiers which are totally unsuitable for houses with damp issues .but are quite ok for apartments with small areas.

I rest my case.

Nice gaff btw .

Why would a dehumidifier be ok for an apartment but not ok for a house?

cletus

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Did anyone ask the question of a damp problem before the vents were plastered over?

Vents are a legal requirement,carbon monoxide poisoning is lethal and one cause is blocked vents where solid fuel fires are used.
I know one fella who spent a fortune on getting a stove fitted and moaned about the smoke and it not burning fuel properly. Turns out he blocked the vent in the room "as it was stupid to have a stove lighting and cold air coming in through a vent".
If you know where the vents were before your plasterer did the stupid job of covering them it'd be easy enough to cut the plaster and fit new grills and baffles.

I had a similarity issue in my house. Vented windows in the sitting room, but no wall vent. However, on the external wall there was a vent cover. Easy job to run a piece of 2mm rod from outside to make a hole in the plasterboard inside, giving me the location to cut for an internal vent cover.

Turns out there was no ducting put in either, so it was just venting into the wall void. Easy enough to run a length of 4" wavin, then put on a closable vent cover inside

listermint

EndaHonesty wrote: »

Why would a dehumidifier be ok for an apartment but not ok for a house?

I've found to pointless at this point explaining it


Decommission your mhvr system and throw one of your little machines in instead and see

EndaHonesty

listermint wrote: »

I've found to pointless at this point explaining it


Decommission your mhvr system and throw one of your little machines in instead and see

You haven't explained anything and you obviously don't understand how moisture in the air behaves if you think that the size of the building inhibits the effectiveness of the dehumidifier.

It's becoming more and more obvious that you know little or nothing about dehumidifiers.

All of my advice about is based on personal experience over many years and I have nothing to gain from offering it.

I'm just advocating the use of dehumidifiers because they are a beautifully simple way of removing excess moisture and improving living conditions.

gctest50

listermint wrote: »

I've found to pointless at this point explaining it


Decommission your mhvr system and

you can have both, and automate it if ya want - same as a modern car

listermint wrote: »

throw one of your little machines in instead and see

little machines makes that post look a feeble impotent effort


Anyway - no problem get permanent wall-mounted ones up to 100litres per day and more

Browse below to view our full range of domestic and commercial wall mounted fixed dehumidifiers with moisture extraction rates ranging from eight to over 100 litres per day capacity.

whitelightrider

cletus wrote: »

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Did anyone ask the question of a damp problem before the vents were plastered over?

Vents are a legal requirement,carbon monoxide poisoning is lethal and one cause is blocked vents where solid fuel fires are used.
I know one fella who spent a fortune on getting a stove fitted and moaned about the smoke and it not burning fuel properly. Turns out he blocked the vent in the room "as it was stupid to have a stove lighting and cold air coming in through a vent".
If you know where the vents were before your plasterer did the stupid job of covering them it'd be easy enough to cut the plaster and fit new grills and baffles.

I had a similarity issue in my house. Vented windows in the sitting room, but no wall vent. However, on the external wall there was a vent cover. Easy job to run a piece of 2mm rod from outside to make a hole in the plasterboard inside, giving me the location to cut for an internal vent cover.

Turns out there was no ducting put in either, so it was just venting into the wall void. Easy enough to run a length of 4" wavin, then put on a closable vent cover inside

What kind of internal vents did you use?

listermint

EndaHonesty wrote: »

You haven't explained anything and you obviously don't understand how moisture in the air behaves if you think that the size of the building inhibits the effectiveness of the dehumidifier.

It's becoming more and more obvious that you know little or nothing about dehumidifiers.

All of my advice about is based on personal experience over many years and I have nothing to gain from offering it.

I'm just advocating the use of dehumidifiers because they are a beautifully simple way of removing excess moisture and improving living conditions.

If you believe the size of a building and its design has no impact on a dehumidifier, Then again i rest my case. forums are fantastic but they dont half give folks to state opinion as fact.

Your posts right here are a swinging indictment of that.

Anyone who takes your posts seriously in relation to resolving damp control in terms of a buildings design needs to go off and get proper advice from a qualified professional. Not an amazon dehumidifier seller.

On that note, im out because im tired of pointing out the obvious.