Landlord won't pay for repairs

saraem1iy

Hi everyone,

I'm having an issue with my Landlord paying for a repair of a shower. Basically as I was in the shower last night I slid the door closed and it came off of one of the rollers, somehow the force made the glass shatter, cutting my hand and feet in the process.

The Landlord will fix it, however he says it is my responsibility to pay for it. Surely as it was under the strains of normal use, and because it was a facility that came with the property when the Lease was signed, it is the Landlord's responsibility to pay for it?

Any help is much appreciated!

Bob24

I’m not sure who’s responsible, but I think if I was to pay for it i would say I’ll have it organised myself. If they know they’re not paying th landlord are likely to go for the first and easiest solution they find which surely won’t be the cheapest on.

Wabbit Ears

If my tenant smashed a shower door I'd expect them to pay for it. The version of events you describe simply aren't credible.

It just slipped off a roller and the shower door panel just simply exploded. Just like that.


What I'm reading, is "I broke the shower door and expect the landlord to pay for it because *insert barely believable reason why its his fault*"

Sleeper12

OP you inspected the premises when you moved in. You've used the shower and shower door since yet you didn't report any problems to the landlord. It's your responsibility to report these issues before they get to the point where they would just break like that.

saraem1iy

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

If my tenant smashed a shower door I'd expect them to pay for it. The version of events you describe simply aren't credible.

It just slipped off a roller and the shower door panel just simply exploded. Just like that.


What I'm reading, is "I broke the shower door and expect the landlord to pay for it because *insert barely believable reason why its his fault*"

I don't care if it's not credible - it is what happened. It turns out the rollers are rusty, so the shower installed was not fit for purpose to begin with.

Lumen

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

The version of events you describe simply aren't credible.

It just slipped off a roller and the shower door panel just simply exploded. Just like that.

Google shower door exploded and see what comes up.

For instance, this:

http://www.thejournal.ie/shattered-shower-door-boy-injured-2723617-Apr2016/

saraem1iy

Sleeper12 wrote: »

OP you inspected the premises when you moved in. You've used the shower and shower door since yet you didn't report any problems to the landlord. It's your responsibility to report these issues before they get to the point where they would just break like that.

There weren't any problems with it - this is the first instance it had jammed.

handlemaster

OP you broke the door. Pay for it. There is no ifs and buts.

OnDraught

saraem1iy wrote: »

There weren't any problems with it - this is the first instance it had jammed.

Document your injuries and send them to your landlord. If he isn’t too keen on helping you pass them on to a personal injuries solicitor and see what they say.

AvonEnniskerry

OnDraught wrote:

Document your injuries and send them to your landlord. If he isn’t too keen on helping you pass them on to a personal injuries solicitor and see what they say.

Technically I suppose he/she could make an insurance claim for any injuries but all of these instances make for a very poor relationship between you and your landlord which will likely do you no favours in the long run.

OnDraught

AvonEnniskerry wrote: »

Technically I suppose he/she could make an insurance claim for any injuries but all of these instances make for a very poor relationship between you and your landlord which will likely do you no favours in the long run.

If the landlord won’t fix the issue thus causing even more potential damage to their bathroom I’d be inclined to think they aren’t going to be the most reasonable or attentive landlord going anyway.

percy212

Get a solicitor. Personal injuries cost landlords plenty. What a prick.

RHJ

This post has been deleted.

hawkelady

OnDraught wrote: »

saraem1iy wrote: »

There weren't any problems with it - this is the first instance it had jammed.

Document your injuries and send them to your landlord. If he isn’t too keen on helping you pass them on to a personal injuries solicitor and see what they say.

Is this what it's come to ?? God almighty , do you believe that the tenant is in no way responsible whatsoever ?? OP - are you adamant that you won't be repairing the door you broke?? How much would a replacement cost?
You say it jammed , you must have given it some jerk for it to smash to smithereens and yet you think you're not responsible at all???

0ph0rce0

Happened to me the other week in my own house. Pulled the sliding door shut.

Came off the rails, Solid glass door fell as I couldn't hold it up with the weight and it shattered everywhere. Fairly common to be fair when in use daily, Screws come loose on the clamp on the glass or the roller just pops out.

So it does happen.

To be honest If I was renting and something broke I'd be ringing the landlord, But if I was the one that pulled the door off and it smashed I'd say fair enough that was me.

OnDraught

hawkelady wrote: »

Is this what it's come to ?? God almighty , do you believe that the tenant is in no way responsible whatsoever ?? OP - are you adamant that you won't be repairing the door you broke?? How much would a replacement cost?
You say it jammed , you must have given it some jerk for it to smash to smithereens and yet you think you're not responsible at all???

If the landlord is going to be a prick I see no problem in being a prick back. What he should have done is apologised profusely and arranged to have the door repaired at his tenants earliest convenience.

If the shower door jumped the rail it was not fit for purpose and is the landlords responsibility.

hawkelady

OnDraught wrote: »

hawkelady wrote: »

Is this what it's come to ?? God almighty , do you believe that the tenant is in no way responsible whatsoever ?? OP - are you adamant that you won't be repairing the door you broke?? How much would a replacement cost?
You say it jammed , you must have given it some jerk for it to smash to smithereens and yet you think you're not responsible at all???

If the landlord is going to be a prick I see no problem in being a prick back. What he should have done is apologised profusely and arranged to have the door repaired at his tenants earliest convenience.

If the shower door jumped the rail it was not fit for purpose and is the landlords responsibility.

You think the LL is a prick ?? How so???

OnDraught

hawkelady wrote: »

You think the LL is a prick ?? How so???

I'd suggest reading the first post in this thread.

If you suffered cut hands and feet in someone else's property I doubt you would be running for your wallet to fix their faulty shower door.

syndrome777

0ph0rce0 wrote: »

Happened to me the other week in my own house. Pulled the sliding door shut.

Came off the rails, Solid glass door fell as I couldn't hold it up with the weight and it shattered everywhere. Fairly common to be fair when in use daily, Screws come loose on the clamp on the glass or the roller just pops out.

So it does happen.

To be honest If I was renting and something broke I'd be ringing the landlord, But if I was the one that pulled the door off and it smashed I'd say fair enough that was me.

this is why plastic is always a better option here

you never know in how bad of a shape something is, especially in rented accommodation

if I was the LL I would he scared of personal injury suit and replace the door myself...with a plastic one this time

Fair enough if she took something and thrown it through a closed window/door or even broke this by any other way except normal use

but normal use and deteriorated dangerous glass door....no way I would pay

hawkelady

OnDraught wrote: »

hawkelady wrote: »

You think the LL is a prick ?? How so???

I'd suggest reading the first post in this thread.

If you suffered cut hands and feet in someone else's property I doubt you would be running for your wallet to fix their faulty shower door.

Maybe you should re read it , I see the LL is going to fix the new door when the tenant pays for the door .. reasonable to me.

I also assume the tenant has had showers in the past there without him having to pull the door so hard it's come off the runner and ended up smashed !!
Maybe when the tenant noticed that the door was stiff or not closing , he should have investigated the reason more closely rather than going in like a bull and reefing it ... tenant should pay for new door. Op, are you going to stop showering now until the landlord pays for a new one?

DubInTheWest

This would be the usual with a lousy landlord. Just get you into a house with numerous issues and then turn it on the tenant to pay for repairs that he should be paying. The tenant ends up paying fearing they will be evicted. A good landlord would weigh up the agenda and if something broke legitimately they would get it fixed up.

I've seen some crazy things over the years, landlords wanting tenants to replace windows that were broken when they moved in, taps there were leaking from under the sink, old fuse boxes that had blown to kaput. These things should be fixed by LL's. If a tenant wrecked the couch or breaks items then the tenant should pay. If a rusty roller caused the door to come off the hing, the LL is responsible end of. Will he pay is the question.

elperello

No need for any drama.
The LL can write off the cost of repair.
Job done.

OnDraught

hawkelady wrote: »

Maybe you should re read it , I see the LL is going to fix the new door when the tenant pays for the door .. reasonable to me.

If the landlord shares your attitude I'd give up trying to deal with them over the issue and let a solicitor do my bidding for me and my injuries. I'd say there would be a quick correction in what they think is reasonable.

Blue bull

How dare you? It's always the landlords fault, isnt it? I look after over 30 properties and if a tenant broke a shower door, they would pay for it. They dont brake that easy. You attitude sickens me " get a good solicitor and make him pay". Disgusting..

Sleeper12

elperello wrote:

No need for any drama. The LL can write off the cost of repair. Job done.

Nope. The landlord might be able to write off the a small portion of the cost. It's not like a business according to revenue and they only allow I think 20 percent.

Anyway its not the landlords problem. Op will pay, even if it comes out of the deposit. The only way to avoid that is to open a dispute now with rtb.

OnDraught

Blue bull wrote: »

How dare you? It's always the landlords fault, isnt it? I look after over 30 properties and if a tenant broke a shower door, they would pay for it. They dont brake that easy. You attitude sickens me " get a good solicitor and make him pay". Disgusting..

Delighted to hear it. I'm glad you don't look after mine. I have a decent landlord who would have this fixed on him quick smart.

It's telling that you have no concern for the tenant and their injuries.

shaunr68

If the shower door was operated with normal force such as would be expected in everyday use then I'd say the landlord is liable.

If the OP slipped in the shower, grabbed the door and dragged it off the roller or otherwise used excessive force then it would be the OP's responsibility to put right.

Taking the original post at face value it would seem that the landlord should pay up but of course we don't know what was said. I'd suggest showing him the rusty rollers and calmly explaining that you didn't grab the door or force it in any way. If he won't pay up then weigh up whether you should just buy a shower curtain for now and let him fix it when your tenancy ends. If on the other hand you fell against it or accidentally dragged it off its hinges then you should put it right. All IMHO

GGTrek

OnDraught wrote: »

saraem1iy wrote: »

There weren't any problems with it - this is the first instance it had jammed.

Document your injuries and send them to your landlord. If he isn’t too keen on helping you pass them on to a personal injuries solicitor and see what they say.

I had a tenant who I was evicting for anti-social behaviour that tried to pull a fast one like you suggested, the insurance adjuster and insurance solicitor had a field trip on him (they refused any settlement) and his dumb solicitor (and he was evicted of course!): what you are suggesting without having any evidence is simple and pure blackmail. I mean your quote and parts of this thread are exactly the problem with tenants in Ireland: it is never their fault! I had a tenant painting over electrical sockets: he had the audacity of saying that it was not his fault!

I suggest the OP to avoid at all costs the blackmail tactics suggested by the quoted text which are a sure trip to eviction (sooner rather than later) and discuss reasonably with his landlord the cost of the shower repair (even it was an accident), suggest splitting the cost 50/50 for example.

Sleeper12

Op views the property then moves in. From that point on the tenant has an obligation to report any maintenance issues. The landlord can't replace rusty wheels if the tenant doesn't bring it to his attention.

It's possible that the shower door is 30 years old and was due to be retired and it's possible that the Op was a bit heavy handed. None of us here can tell for sure.

Op if landlord won't pay and you believe that he should, the only option is to open a dispute. Take lots of photos of the wheels and try keep one for the dispute. The arbitrator is the only one you will need to convince. There's no point getting more stressed trying to convince us.

OnDraught

GGTrek wrote: »

I had a tenant who I was evicting for anti-social behaviour that tried to pull a fast one like you suggested, the insurance adjuster and insurance solicitor had a field trip on him (they refused any settlement) and his dumb solicitor (and he was evicted of course!): what you are suggesting without having any evidence is simple and pure blackmail. I mean your quote and parts of this thread are exactly the problem with tenants in Ireland: it is never their fault! I had a tenant painting over electrical sockets: he had the audacity of saying that it was not his fault!

I suggest the OP to avoid at all costs the blackmail tactics suggested by the quoted text which are a sure trip to eviction (sooner rather than later) and discuss reasonably with his landlord the cost of the shower repair (even it was an accident), suggest splitting the cost 50/50 for example.

That's hilarious. Well done.

OnDraught

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Op views the property then moves in. From that point on the tenant has an obligation to report any maintenance issues. The landlord can't replace rusty wheels if the tenant doesn't bring it to his attention.

It's possible that the shower door is 30 years old and was due to be retired and it's possible that the Op was a bit heavy handed. None of us here can tell for sure.

Op if landlord won't pay and you believe that he should, the only option is to open a dispute. Take lots of photos of the wheels and try keep one for the dispute. The arbitrator is the one you will need to convince. There's no point getting more stressed trying to convince us.

Do most decent landlords not carry out regular inspections to ensure the property is up to standards. Sounds like they didn't in this case.

elperello

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Nope. The landlord might be able to write off the a small portion of the cost. It's not like a business according to revenue and they only allow I think 20 percent.

Anyway its not the landlords problem. Op will pay, even if it comes out of the deposit. The only way to avoid that is to open a dispute now with rtb.

https://www.revenue.ie/en/property/rental-income/irish-rental-income/what-expenses-are-allowed.aspx

Repairs are an allowable expense. This would include paying someone to fit a new door. If the LL fits it himself he cannot claim for his time.
He will be able to claim it back from Revenue if he keeps a receipt.
Might as well keep tenant happy and pay up, it will go to Revenue anyway at the end of the tax year.

Fol20

The best of both worlds is to go 50/50 on this. Landlord can then expense it so he pays a minimal amount and it only costs you half the amount. At least this way you avoid confrontation and this isn’t one of these things that would normally brake down in such a manner without some extra force

Gijoseph

You won't get much help here op. The forum seems to be teeming with overzealous landlords. I would get it repaired and take it out of the rent. Keep the receipts if the landlord decides to open a dispute.

Sleeper12

OnDraught wrote:

Do most decent landlords not carry out regular inspections to ensure the property is up to standards. Sounds like they didn't in this case.

Your not getting it. You rent the property after you inspect it. You then move in and you inspect it some more. Your lease that you sign says that you will notify the landlord of any defects or wear and tear. I'm not getting into who's fault this particular case is but had the landlord been told about rusty wheels he would have the option to replace the wheels instead of the whole door. If the landlord didn't replace the wheels when told about them then he is liable. If a tenant fails in their duty to notify the landlord about the wear and tear on the wheels how is it his fault when it actually breaks.

elperello

Gijoseph wrote: »

You won't get much help here op. The forum seems to be teeming with overzealous landlords. I would get it repaired and take it out of the rent. Keep the receipts if the landlord decides to open a dispute.

Please don't withhold rent. It's not a good idea.

Fol20

Gijoseph wrote: »

You won't get much help here op. The forum seems to be teeming with overzealous landlords. I would get it repaired and take it out of the rent. Keep the receipts if the landlord decides to open a dispute.

Do not follow this persons advice, he doesnt know the rules whatsoever. Never take money out of the rent due or you would fall into rent arrears and face eviction. If you believe you are not at fault, raise a rtb case. Not every ll is overzealous as you say, maybe some common sense here that if it was closed with normal force something like this wouldnt happen or as another poster mentioned if something is not reported to ll, it would be the tenants fault.

Sleeper12

elperello wrote:

Repairs are an allowable expense. This would include paying someone to fit a new door. If the LL fits it himself he cannot claim for his time. He will be able to claim it back from Revenue if he keeps a receipt. Might as well keep tenant happy and pay up, it will go to Revenue anyway at the end of the tax year.

I know that repair is an allowable expense. If a new door costs 400 Euro supplied and fitted he doesn't get 400 back from revenue. He gets a portion of it.

Your original statement suggests that it wont cost the landlord anything. He will be hundreds out of pocket even after tax relief.

OnDraught

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Your not getting it. You rent the property after you inspect it. You then move in and you inspect it some more. Your lease that you sign says that you will notify the landlord of any defects or wear and tear. I'm not getting into who's fault this particular case is but had the landlord been told about rusty wheels he would have the option to replace the wheels instead of the whole door. If the landlord didn't replace the wheels when told about them then he is liable. If a tenant fails in their duty to notify the landlord about the wear and tear on the wheels how is it his fault when it actually breaks.

That's fair enough but in the op's case rust building up on something that is in daily contact with water can hardly be expected and was probably not very visible when the door was in place. It is clearly a substandard and ultimately dangerous fitting. I'd be falling over myself to replace it if I was the landlord.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

OnDraught wrote: »

Do most decent landlords not carry out regular inspections to ensure the property is up to standards. Sounds like they didn't in this case.

"Surely", such entitlement :rolleyes:

You smashed the shower door, pay for the repair, simple.

It takes some force to smash a shower door.

You haven't come here for advice, you are looking for people to side with you. You have an issue with anybody who doesn't share your opinion.

Sleeper12

Gijoseph wrote:

You won't get much help here op. The forum seems to be teeming with overzealous landlords. I would get it repaired and take it out of the rent. Keep the receipts if the landlord decides to open a dispute.

Op has gotten good advice from landlords here. I already suggested opening a dispute. This is the only legal way to handle it. Your suggestion of withholding rent or deducting it from the rent is against the lease. Op will almost certainly ruin any chance of winning the dispute by taking this action. Also the landlord will just take it out of the deposit so Op will be no better off. The only way to handle this is to open a dispute

OnDraught

Adalynn Victorious Spine wrote: »

"Surely", such entitlement :rolleyes:

You smashed the shower door, pay for the repair, simple.

It takes some force to smash a shower door.

There was rust on the wheels. Nothing to do with force.

Sleeper12

OnDraught wrote:

That's fair enough but in the op's case rust building up on something that is in daily contact with water can hardly be expected and was probably not very visible when the door was in place. It is clearly a substandard and ultimately dangerous fitting. I'd be falling over myself to replace it if I was the landlord.

You are talking about something that you haven't seen. I am a shower repair guy. I'm in dozens of showers per week. First off Op says rusty wheels. Have a look at the wheels of your own shower. Shower doors don't have parts that rust Inc the wheels. A shower door company wouldn't be in business long if the parts rusted.

I'm gobsmacked that you can describe something that you've never seen as clearly substandard and dangerous.

OnDraught

Sleeper12 wrote: »

You are talking about something that you haven't seen. I am a shower repair guy. I'm in dozens of showers per week. First off Op says rusty wheels. Have a look at the wheels of your own shower. Shower doors don't have parts that rust Inc the wheels. A shower door company wouldn't be in business long if the parts rusted.

I'm gobsmacked that you can describe something that you've never seen as clearly substandard and dangerous.

I'm not describing anything. I'm taking the op at their word. Not much point in responding to this thread if you need to see the damage yourself in fairness.

The concept didn't sound so unbelievable to you earlier and you are the expert.

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I'm not getting into who's fault this particular case is but had the landlord been told about rusty wheels he would have the option to replace the wheels instead of the whole door.

elperello

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I know that repair is an allowable expense. If a new door costs 400 Euro supplied and fitted he doesn't get 400 back from revenue. He gets a portion of it.

Your original statement suggests that it wont cost the landlord anything. He will be hundreds out of pocket even after tax relief.

The entire amount paid in the year can be claimed. The documents relating to these costs must be retained for a period of 6 years, as per Revenue.

http://www.rentalincome.ie/tax-allowable-expenses/repairs/

the_pen_turner

OnDraught wrote: »

I'm not describing anything. I'm taking the op at their word. Not much point in responding to this thread if you need to see the damage yourself in fairness.

in fairness the op is saying the wheels are rusty. these parts are made from stainless steel and plastic. at least any I have seen.
I would like to see the damage before I rule it out but it unlikely to be rust.
probably years of dirt that have seized the bearings and the wheels have worn enough that they could come out

Tigger

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Op views the property then moves in. From that point on the tenant has an obligation to report any maintenance issues. The landlord can't replace rusty wheels if the tenant doesn't bring it to his attention.

It's possible that the shower door is 30 years old and was due to be retired and it's possible that the Op was a bit heavy handed. None of us here can tell for sure.

Op if landlord won't pay and you believe that he should, the only option is to open a dispute. Take lots of photos of the wheels and try keep one for the dispute. The arbitrator is the only one you will need to convince. There's no point getting more stressed trying to convince us.

glass showers are not 30
year old

Graham

elperello wrote: »

The entire amount paid in the year can be claimed. The documents relating to these costs must be retained for a period of 6 years, as per Revenue.

http://www.rentalincome.ie/tax-allowable-expenses/repairs/

That doesn't mean the landlord gets €400 back from revenue.

Fol20

elperello wrote: »

The entire amount paid in the year can be claimed. The documents relating to these costs must be retained for a period of 6 years, as per Revenue.

http://www.rentalincome.ie/tax-allowable-expenses/repairs/

Yea the entire amount can be expenses however it still costs landlords money

OnDraught

the_pen_turner wrote: »

in fairness the op is saying the wheels are rusty. these parts are made from stainless steel and plastic. at least any I have seen.
I would like to see the damage before I rule it out but it unlikely to be rust.
probably years of dirt that have seized the bearings and the wheels have worn enough that they could come out

If that is the case it doesn't sound like something the op should be paying for.

the_pen_turner

Tigger wrote: »

glass showers are not 30
year old

we had a glass shower door on my parents house up to a few years ago. it was aluminium and a yellow 70s textured glass. it was installed around 1985-6 . I'm 31 and they moved in the year before I was born