Bmw. Engine overheated.

from_atozinc

Was driving along earlier at about 100 km/h and got a warning in iDrive. (Attached) Saying:

“Engine Temperature :

Temperature too high. Drive moderately to allow the engine to cool down. “

So I did just that, just happened that I exited dual carriageway and slowed down to 60kph. Didn’t rev it etc


Then about 3 minutes later got a new message (attached also) on iDrive:

“Engine overheated.

Stop engine and allow to coool down. Do not open the bonnet. Risk of scalding. “

I stopped for 15 minutes at this point. Was 2 miles from home and then drove home. About a mile down the road again, got the messages again. First the engine temperature message, then the engine overheated message.

Managed to get home anyway.

Car is BMW 523i. E60
I don’t drive the car hard at all. Just mozey along.


Anyone have this issue before?

Any idea of what the problem is
or more importantly how expensive it may be to rectify ? (Or could it be a once off - never seen the message before)

king_of_inismac

Don’t drive it any further if it’s overheating. If you do, you can destroy the engine.

It could be a fault with any part of the cooling system:
The radiator
The water pump
The thermostat


Best to get it towed to a garage and get it diagnosed.

from_atozinc wrote: »

Was driving along earlier at about 100 km/h and got a warning in iDrive. (Attached) Saying:

“Engine Temperature :

Temperature too high. Drive moderately to allow the engine to cool down. “

So I did just that, just happened that I exited dual carriageway and slowed down to 60kph. Didn’t rev it etc


Then about 3 minutes later got a new message (attached also) on iDrive:

“Engine overheated.

Stop engine and allow to coool down. Do not open the bonnet. Risk of scalding. “

I stopped for 15 minutes at this point. Was 2 miles from home and then drove home. About a mile down the road again, got the messages again. First the engine temperature message, then the engine overheated message.

Managed to get home anyway.

Car is BMW 523i. E60
I don’t drive the car hard at all. Just mozey along.


Anyone have this issue before?

Any idea of what the problem is
or more importantly how expensive it may be to rectify ? (Or could it be a once off - never seen the message before)

from_atozinc

king_of_inismac wrote: »

Don’t drive it any further if it’s overheating. If you do, you can destroy the engine.

It could be a fault with any part of the cooling system:
The radiator
The water pump
The thermostat


Best to get it towed to a garage and get it diagnosed.

Thanks for reply.


Fook. Right. So a serious issue so.

Bollox, all I need.

kona

Is it actually overheating? What temperature did you see on the dash? Open the bonnet and see if there is coolant.. you may have a leak.

kona

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks for reply.


Fook. Right. So a serious issue so.

Bollox, all I need.

It may not be serious or expensive so dont get too worried until you get the facts.

from_atozinc

kona wrote: »

Is it actually overheating? What temperature did you see on the dash? Open the bonnet and see if there is coolant.. you may have a leak.

So this is the thing.
When I stopped, I opened the bonnet (and didn’t get scalded )

There was no steam or anything coming from the engine. I put my hand on the main middle part of engine.......and normally, this is very hot to the touch, but it wasn’t hot at all.

Then the fan (I think) was making a weird noise - like it was being severely overworked.

My car does not have a temperature gauge on the dash.

Don’t want to open coolant tank for a bit until car cools down a bit more. Will check later.

gctest50

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks for reply.


Fook. Right. So a serious issue so.

Bollox, all I need.

May not to too serious, some have electric water pump and stat that just fail

- better than the cylinder block corroding away and all the fluid leaking our


https://www.eurocarparts.com/en_ie/search/201110420?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7YKSofLZ1wIVp7vtCh3UXwzSEAQYASABEgKu9vD_BwE

from_atozinc

gctest50 wrote: »

May not to too serious, some have electric water pump and stat that just fail

- better than the cylinder block corroding away and all the fluid leaking our


https://www.eurocarparts.com/en_ie/search/201110420?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7YKSofLZ1wIVp7vtCh3UXwzSEAQYASABEgKu9vD_BwE

Is the euro car parts link = if it’s not too serious. ??
I.e. the electric water pump ?

kona

from_atozinc wrote: »

So this is the thing.
When I stopped, I opened the bonnet (and didn’t get scalded )

There was no steam or anything coming from the engine. I put my hand on the main middle part of engine.......and normally, this is very hot to the touch, but it wasn’t hot at all.

Then the fan (I think) was making a weird noise - like it was being severely overworked.

My car does not have a temperature gauge on the dash.

Don’t won’t to open coolant tank for a bit until car cools down a bit more. Will check later.

Best check the coolant and see where you are from there. After that a diagnostic might be needed.

You should be ok opening the coolant lid , just use a rag and do it slow like a well shaken bottle of coke, let the pressure bleed off before you fully open it.

coolisin

Had the same thing last year, it was the thermostat was shot, 6 cylinder BMW also

from_atozinc

coolisin wrote: »

Had the same thing last year, it was the thermostat was shot, 6 cylinder BMW also

What had to be done to fix it?

How much did it cost you?

Foxhole Norman

BMW's despite being known for being Kettles in my experience build very strong engines resilient to even overheating, it could be something as simple as a coolant leak from a cracked rad/thermostat housing or water pump gasket that caused you to loose coolant and overheat or something like a completely failed thermostat or pump, both really not too bad to fix to be honest.

from_atozinc

Foxhole Norman wrote: »

BMW's despite being known for being Kettles in my experience build very strong engines resilient to even overheating, it could be something as simple as a coolant leak from a cracked rad/thermostat housing or water pump gasket that caused you to loose coolant and overheat or something like a completely failed thermostat or pump, both really not too bad to fix to be honest.

Thanks.

When you say not too bad to fix, what kind of price are we talking about (ball park figure)

Foxhole Norman

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks.

When you say not too bad to fix, what kind of price are we talking about (ball park figure)

Depends what it is, I recently replaced my radiator in mine for €75 for a Nissens rad which would be a good quality aftermarket part, replaced myself so would only take a mechanic an hour or two labour plus fluid costs. Thermostat and Water pumps you're probably talking 75-150 each or thereabouts for parts.

from_atozinc

Thanks foxhole. So probably at least 300 then with labour etc.

So going back to when I pulled in.
When I pulled in, I touched the silver part of the attached picture — just around the BMW logo, and normally, that is very hot. But it wasn’t today, wasn’t anyway hot at all.

I also touched the coolant tank from outside and again that’s normally very hot, but wasn’t really hot at all. I was expecting these to be roasting and steam etc.

I just checked the coolant level now and it’s fine. Also when I opened it, there was no pressure release at all and the expansion tank felt cold. Normally this stays hot for a good while after engine is turned off, but was more a less cold just now.

kona

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks foxhole. So probably at least 300 then with labour etc.

So going back to when I pulled in.
When I pulled in, I touched the silver part of the attached picture — just around the BMW logo, and normally, that is very hot. But it wasn’t today, wasn’t anyway hot at all.

I also touched the coolant tank from outside and again that’s normally very hot, but wasn’t really hot at all. I was expecting these to be roasting and steam etc.

I just checked the coolant level now and it’s fine. Also when I opened it, there was no pressure release at all and the expansion tank felt cold. Normally this stays hot for a good while after engine is turned off, but was more a less cold just now.

How long was the engine running before the warning came on? Its looking like a waterpump or thermostat issue.

from_atozinc

kona wrote: »

How long was the engine running before the warning came on? Its looking like a waterpump or thermostat issue.

Drove 12 miles. Parked up for 30 mins
The drove a mile. Parked up for 20 mins.

Then drove home and warning came on after about 9 miles.

No traffic or hard driving etc.

selectamatic

Foxhole Norman wrote: »

BMW's despite being known for being Kettles in my experience build very strong engines resilient to even overheating.

The m43b19, n42b18 & n42b20 found in the e46 gave that rep fierce legs but the 6 pots have generally always been pretty stout.

CeilingFly

I had cracked coolant system in f11 - was told it was not uncommon. (it was at about 200k km)

Cost of repair in indy was about €500

Foxhole Norman

If you have no pressure in the system it could be a faulty expansion tank cap, the seals can be known to break down over time and pressure/coolant can escape causing potential overheating. Best to get it to a Mechanic Monday to have it checked over.

CalamariFritti

There is no point in speculating like 'I had this last year' and 'my neighbour had that last year' and then the OP asking how much was that. It could be any of the above, all of the above or none of the above.

I understand you being anxious OP. Such a thing never comes at a good time, but there is no point in fretting or thinking 'how much' until you actually get someone to diagnose the problem.

from_atozinc

CalamariFritti wrote: »

There is no point in speculating like 'I had this last year' and 'my neighbour had that last year' and then the OP asking how much was that. It could be any of the above, all of the above or none of the above.

I understand you being anxious OP. Such a thing never comes at a good time, but there is no point in fretting or thinking 'how much' until you actually get someone to diagnose the problem.

Fair points. Thanks.

Just another general question:

When the issue happened and I pulled over - does the fact that the coolant expansion tank and the main engine were cold rather than hot point towards a particular issue over another ?

kona

from_atozinc wrote: »

Drove 12 miles. Parked up for 30 mins
The drove a mile. Parked up for 20 mins.

Then drove home and warning came on after about 9 miles.

No traffic or hard driving etc.

Id say your worst case scenario is the water pump in that case, could be a thermostat sticking too.
Id get it to a garage on monday, if you have coolant a handy drive around the corner( under 3miles) to a garage u may get away with driving.
Any more and you may want to consider getting it towed there.

CeilingFly

CalamariFritti wrote: »

There is no point in speculating like 'I had this last year' and 'my neighbour had that last year' and then the OP asking how much was that. It could be any of the above, all of the above or none of the above.

I understand you being anxious OP. Such a thing never comes at a good time, but there is no point in fretting or thinking 'how much' until you actually get someone to diagnose the problem.

I'd disagree - if people give several possibilities of similar issue on similar car with price ranging from €100 - €600, then at least the OP won't be thinking its a 3k job (though i wouldn't be surprised at such a price from a BMW dealer) and can have some comfort over the weekend.

from_atozinc

kona wrote: »

Id say your worst case scenario is the water pump in that case, could be a thermostat sticking too.
Id get it to a garage on monday, if you have coolant a handy drive around the corner( under 3miles) to a garage u may get away with driving.
Any more and you may want to consider getting it towed there.

What do you mean by “ if you have coolant a handy drive around the corner( under 3miles) to a garage u may get away with driving“

Specifically the coolant bit.

I checked my cars coolant level and it’s fine.

kona

from_atozinc wrote: »

What do you mean by “ if you have coolant a handy drive around the corner( under 3miles) to a garage u may get away with driving“

Specifically the coolant bit.

I checked my cars coolant level and it’s fine.

If your water pump or thermostat is goosed then you will overheat the engine once the coolant in the block boils.
This will depend on how long and hard the engine is worked.
Basically it looks like you have coolant but its not being moved around the engine and into the radiator.

from_atozinc

kona wrote: »

If your water pump or thermostat is goosed then you will overheat the engine once the coolant in the block boils.
This will depend on how long and hard the engine is worked.
Basically it looks like you have coolant but its not being moved around the engine and into the radiator.

My mechanic is 2.2 miles away.
Do you think it’s safe to drive the car to him on Monday ?

barney 20v

from_atozinc wrote: »

My mechanic is 2.2 miles away.
Do you think it’s safe to drive the car to him on Monday ?

If he's 2 miles away get him to come you !
Exactly what you should have done when the problem showed itself the first time

from_atozinc

barney 20v wrote: »

If he's 2 miles away get him to come you !
Exactly what you should have done when the problem showed itself the first time

Not as easy as that.
He can’t just drop everything and come to me, anyway, He is closed on a Saturday.

he has other cars to fix booked in before me too so have to wait my turn.

So it’s not as black and white as you make it out to be.

Voodoomelon

Get a code reader on there, pretty sure you'll see a water pump code. Common failure on the petrol E60s and from what you describe regarding no physical high temperature of the engine, the warning and high fan speed, the water pump is very likely kaput. Thermostats usually fail open, which would keep engine temperature under optimal (ie the opposite of overheating) and a sticking closed failure would cause overpressure in the cooling system, so red hot coolant.

The electronics and/or bearings usually fail in these pumps anywhere from 50-100k miles, if you're in this ballpark or beyond, a new thermostat and water pump should be budgeted for. A quick google reveals startlingly low-mile failure rates in this model pump.

from_atozinc

Voodoomelon wrote: »

Get a code reader on there, pretty sure you'll see a water pump code. Common failure on the petrol E60s and from what you describe regarding no physical high temperature of the engine, the warning and high fan speed, the water pump is very likely kaput. Thermostats usually fail open, which would keep engine temperature under optimal (ie the opposite of overheating) and a sticking closed failure would cause overpressure in the cooling system, so red hot coolant.

The electronics and/or bearings usually fail in these pumps anywhere from 50-100k miles, if you're in this ballpark or beyond, a new thermostat and water pump should be budgeted for. A quick google reveals startlingly low-mile failure rates in this model pump.

Hi. Thanks. I’m at 87,000 miles.

What’s the rough ball park figure for new thermostat and water pump and labour - from an Indy ?

Voodoomelon

Stick your reg into Micksgarage, you'll get a rough idea on parts. Labour wouldn't be more than 2 hours i'd imagine.

from_atozinc

Voodoomelon wrote: »

Stick your reg into Micksgarage, you'll get a rough idea on parts. Labour wouldn't be more than 2 hours i'd imagine.

Oh. Ok. Good. So labour won’t be 8 hours etc. Thanks.

Edit : I see a water pump is about 500 Euro. And thermostat about 100.

Could be an 800 or more euro job.

Wailin

from_atozinc wrote: »

Oh. Ok. Good. So labour won’t be 8 hours etc. Thanks.

Edit : I see a water pump is about 500 Euro. And thermostat about 100.

Could be an 800 or more euro job.

Yep. Could be. Could be more. But you won't know until you find out what the issue is so no point in taking guesses.

Heroditas

from_atozinc wrote: »

Oh. Ok. Good. So labour won’t be 8 hours etc. Thanks.

Edit : I see a water pump is about 500 Euro. And thermostat about 100.

Could be an 800 or more euro job.

I had the same issue with my 523i E60 earlier this year. Turned out the water pump had failed.
New pump and stat, labour etc came to approx €800 IIRC.

from_atozinc

Heroditas wrote: »

I had the same issue with my 523i E60 earlier this year. Turned out the water pump had failed.
New pump and stat, labour etc came to approx €800 IIRC.

Thanks for input.

So I *could* be looking at a hefty enough bill. Will have to see, I may have to cut my losses if it’s too dear 😥

cnoc

from_atozinc wrote: »

Thanks for input.

So I *could* be looking at a hefty enough bill. Will have to see, I may have to cut my losses if it’s too dear ��

What year is your car?

from_atozinc

cnoc wrote: »

What year is your car?

2006.

tphase

could be your coolant temperature sensor.

I had the same over temperature warning in mine (08 520d) a couple of weeks ago. Engine was definitely not overheating. I could actually dip my finger in the coolant expansion tank but the engine would cut out once the apparent temperature went over about 124C.

It turned out to be a faulty sensor. 17 euro on line, DIY job if you have the right socket

Check the coolant temperature in the morning when the car is cold. If it's not close to ambient, the sensor is probably snafu'ed. Mine was reading 60-70C when ambient was below 10C

If you're sure it's faulty and you're happy to take the risk, you could disconnect the sensor until you get a replacement. In my case I would have done it but couldn't get the connector apart without applying more force than I was happy to so I left it to the mechanic.

How to activate the hidden menu on the dash (coolant temperature is section 7)
http://www.scoopz.com/m5board/E60_Hidden_OBC_Instructions.pdf

from_atozinc

tphase wrote: »

could be your coolant temperature sensor.

I had the same over temperature warning in mine (08 520d) a couple of weeks ago. Engine was definitely not overheating. I could actually dip my finger in the coolant expansion tank but the engine would cut out once the apparent temperature went over about 124C.

It turned out to be a faulty sensor. 17 euro on line, DIY job if you have the right socket

Check the coolant temperature in the morning when the car is cold. If it's not close to ambient, the sensor is probably snafu'ed. Mine was reading 60-70C when ambient was below 10C

If you're sure it's faulty and you're happy to take the risk, you could disconnect the sensor until you get a replacement. In my case I would have done it but couldn't get the connector apart without applying more force than I was happy to so I left it to the mechanic.

How to activate the hidden menu on the dash (coolant temperature is section 7)
http://www.scoopz.com/m5board/E60_Hidden_OBC_Instructions.pdf

Thank you.

Yeah, that was the thing with mine. When I pulled in to check things, Warning said “risk of scalding” “do not open bonnet”

I touched bonnet before opening and was not hot, there was no steam etc. Then when I opened bonnet, felt around and everything actually felt way cooler than normal - Expansion tank and centre engine area etc.

So must check the coolant temp tomorrow without turning on the car and see how it goes.


Thanks again.

Voodoomelon

How long were you driving before you touched the engine?

from_atozinc

Voodoomelon wrote: »

How long were you driving before you touched the engine?

Drove 12 miles (20 minutes) Parked up for 30 mins
The drove a mile ( 3 minutes) Parked up for 20 mins.

Then drove home and warning came on after about 9 miles (12 minutes)

So about 35 minutes in the space of about an hour.

from_atozinc

tphase wrote: »

could be your coolant temperature sensor.

I had the same over temperature warning in mine (08 520d) a couple of weeks ago. Engine was definitely not overheating. I could actually dip my finger in the coolant expansion tank but the engine would cut out once the apparent temperature went over about 124C.

It turned out to be a faulty sensor. 17 euro on line, DIY job if you have the right socket

Check the coolant temperature in the morning when the car is cold. If it's not close to ambient, the sensor is probably snafu'ed. Mine was reading 60-70C when ambient was below 10C

If you're sure it's faulty and you're happy to take the risk, you could disconnect the sensor until you get a replacement. In my case I would have done it but couldn't get the connector apart without applying more force than I was happy to so I left it to the mechanic.

How to activate the hidden menu on the dash (coolant temperature is section 7)
http://www.scoopz.com/m5board/E60_Hidden_OBC_Instructions.pdf

Checked the coolant temp just now - attached.

Reading as normal ambient 6c Feck, was hoping would read as 76c.

So looks like it’s not temperature sensor.

tphase

from_atozinc wrote: »

Checked the coolant temp just now - attached.
Reading as normal ambient 6c Feck, was hoping would read as 76c.
So looks like it’s not temperature sensor.

not necessarily. First couple of times I checked the temperature of the engine cold, the readings were very obviously wrong. On the morning I brought it to the mechanic, it was reading a reasonable temperature when I checked it cold. As soon as I started the engine, the temperature reading started climbing very rapidly and a bit erratically. Within minutes it was reading about 115C.

If you bring up the coolant temperature on the dash and then start the engine, the reading will continue to be displayed so you can monitor it as you drive. Personally, I'd be happy to drive it a couple of miles to a mechanic BUT I'm not a mechanic and it's not my car. As others have suggested, getting it to a mechanic for diagnosis is probably your best bet.

But, if you have a deep 22mm socket you could try changing it yourself and see if the error goes away - a cheap fix for €8.60 (mine was €17, diesel engine)
http://www.mister-auto.ie/en/engine-coolant-temperature-sensor/febi-bilstein-29344_g830_a10129344.html

from_atozinc

tphase wrote: »

not necessarily. First couple of times I checked the temperature of the engine cold, the readings were very obviously wrong. On the morning I brought it to the mechanic, it was reading a reasonable temperature when I checked it cold. As soon as I started the engine, the temperature reading started climbing very rapidly and a bit erratically. Within minutes it was reading about 115C.

If you bring up the coolant temperature on the dash and then start the engine, the reading will continue to be displayed so you can monitor it as you drive. Personally, I'd be happy to drive it a couple of miles to a mechanic BUT I'm not a mechanic and it's not my car. As others have suggested, getting it to a mechanic for diagnosis is probably your best bet.

But, if you have a deep 22mm socket you could try changing it yourself and see if the error goes away - a cheap fix for €8.60 (mine was €17, diesel engine)
http://www.mister-auto.ie/en/engine-coolant-temperature-sensor/febi-bilstein-29344_g830_a10129344.html

Thanks. For once, actually used my insurance companies breakdown assist and just got it brought to the garage. Just a phone call and better to be on the safe side and free so no major deal. (May as well make use of the 1000s I’ve paid them over the last 20 years without ever having an accident)


Mechanic will try and check it out today, will keep you updated.

from_atozinc

Got news back that it is indeed the water pump
Got quoted 565 in TOTAL for the job, which seems fair enough.

My thing is, is spending 565 euro on a nearly 12 year old car worth it?
what do people think high level?

Heroditas

from_atozinc wrote: »

Got news back that it is indeed the water pump
Got quoted 565 in TOTAL for the job, which seems fair enough.

My thing is, is spending 565 euro on a nearly 12 year old car worth it?
what do people think high level?

Not bad at all!
I think it's worth it anyway. There's very few Straight 6 petrol engines out there - enjoy it for as long as you can.

Alanstrainor

from_atozinc wrote: »

Got news back that it is indeed the water pump
Got quoted 565 in TOTAL for the job, which seems fair enough.

My thing is, is spending 565 euro on a nearly 12 year old car worth it?
what do people think high level?

It's worth it. There's no reason you wont get years more out of the car. What's the other option? Spend thousands on a newer/unknown car that could have it's own problems. And that price seems very reasonable.

EDIT: My 20,000 post.

from_atozinc

Alanstrainor wrote: »

It's worth it. There's no reason you wont get years more out of the car. What's the other option? Spend thousands on a newer/unknown car that could have it's own problems. And that price seems very reasonable.

EDIT: My 20,000 post.

2 thumbs up anyways so far. Any other thoughts from others?

congrats on 20,000 posts !

Foxhole Norman

Ditto, a water pump is a fairly serviceable item anyway so they'll almost always need to be done, sort it and drive in 6 cylinder bliss.

from_atozinc

Just another general question. Is 565 Euro for a water pump replacement expensive ?

Like if it was to be done on a Ford Focus or Corolla, Golf etc, would it be as expensive ?