Major political differences

Censorsh!t

So, I've been talking to a guy for a few weeks now, and I've met up with him twice, but I'm really stuck with how to feel in case it goes further.

I'll start with the good stuff - He seems like a nice person, and is interested in what I do, and asks me quite a lot about myself. He is funny, and has a similar sense of humour to me, and we also have quite a few common interests. When we met up we had no problem talking and spent a lot longer together than intended because we are having such a good time.


The only problem is we seem to be on the opposite spectrum of things politics-wise. I am very liberal, while he has a lot of - what I would consider - right-wing ideas. We do agree on a few things of course, and I believe his idea of feminism (and I would consider myself to be feminist) is very much tainted by the toxic side of "hating men" that seems to be associated with the ideology these days, and I agree is a problem (but one only espoused by a minority). When these things came up, we both talked about them in a bit of a jokey manner, but I guess I'm just wondering is there a point in pursuing things with these big ideological differences.

I like him quite a bit, so am really quite torn about the whole thing :S

strandroad

Hard to say at this stage. Is it just his definition of feminism, or is he going to give out about immigration in front of your immigrant friends etc. What does he think of men and women's roles in relationships? Does he use slurs?
Define your own red lines and keep observing.

GingerLily

Me and my husband used to have very different political views, but we enjoy debating the pros and cons of issues and are flexible in our convictions so it's not an issue - I actually enjoy the challenge.

Is he rigid in is views? Are you? Can you make it work?

Dial Hard

I agree with Standroad in that at this stage I'd just observe and see how entrenched his ideas are.

I had a discussion with a Boardsie I get on very well with before after he said "Id never date a feminist". I said "Well I'm a feminist" and he was like "No you're not", because to him, feminist = 4th wave, extremist misandrist. He was genuinely surprised to realise that plenty of "normal" women identify as feminist too.

Having said that, there's a lot more to politics than just gender issues and I personally would find it difficult to be with someone who had diametrically opposed political views to me.

Censorsh!t

Thanks for the replies.


There is more than just the feminism aspect - there is also stuff regarding right-wing leaders, and views on abortion. I don't know about his views on immigration, or things like race (and am almost scared to ask!).

It's tough to decide how rigid his views are - when we spoke about some of these things, he did agree with me on a number of points, both regarding sexism and government policies. And he did commiserate with me on how I've been treated with disrespect in my field for being a woman (but does still think women have full equality).
I myself am quite rigid in my views, especially concerning matters around women - but I am open to listening to other people and attempting to have a human conversation with them without trying to force my own views.

I guess for now I will just wait and see what happens. Perhaps the fact that he knows I am a feminist might make him rethink some of his ideas. I understand its tough when people live in an echo chamber and don't really get to talk to or hear from people of opposing views, so I imagine that has an impact (on both our sides).

drunkmonkey

Your going to have different views on lots of things as time goes on and things you didn't even know you had a view on crop up.
If you don't agree on politics don't keep coming back to it.
You've so much yet to find out about this person and your going to dislike some of it a lot more than their take on politics and he's going to dislike something's about you. That's a relationship though, you learn to compromise, sometimes you change your view. Don't let something like this bog you down so early if you like him.
Concentrate on having a good fun time, feminism and politics aren't fun, forget about them and enjoy each other.

Icepick

Topics like gender equality, personal freedoms etc. go much deeper than just politics.

eviltwin

It's a tough one. I agree it's early days but worth considering how his opinions could play out on a practical level down the road. Things like someone being disrespectful to my friends because they are gay or on the dole for example would be an issue for me and someone who wouldn't support my access to abortion would be out the door. If they are just beliefs though and he has a live and let live attitude then it can be overcome. And remember people can change as they are exposed to new things.

Augme

So he doesn't like femenism, holds right-wing views and is not a fan of abortion but because he has a good sene of humour, asks about you and you have some common interests you're possibly willing to ignore his believes? Honestly, I think what you deem important in a partner is completely backwards.

As Icepick said these issues are far deeper than just political issues. They say what a person is actually like, and a much better gauge of them than a sense of humour or common interests.

one world order

Augme wrote: »

So he doesn't like femenism, holds right-wing views and is not a fan of abortion but because he has a good sene of humour, asks about you and you have some common interests you're possibly willing to ignore his believes? Honestly, I think what you deem important in a partner is completely backwards.

As Icepick said these issues are far deeper than just political issues. They say what a person is actually like, and a much better gauge of them than a sense of humour or common interests.

Better if he didn't have a sense of humor, asked q's about you and had common interests. Instead he should be agreeing unconditionally about your view of the world. Now wouldn't that be a satisfying relationship!

Smegging hell

Icepick wrote: »

Topics like gender equality, personal freedoms etc. go much deeper than just politics.

Yeah, would agree with this. It's not about expecting others to agree 'unconditionally about your view of the world' as the last poster glibly put it, differing views on things are normal and healthy in any relationship.

However, if views on these issues are quite far apart then that could be a cause of incompatibility in terms of a relationship developing IMO - or at least it would be for me, tbh.

Augme

one world order wrote: »

Better if he didn't have a sense of humor, asked q's about you and had common interests. Instead he should be agreeing unconditionally about your view of the world. Now wouldn't that be a satisfying relationship!

Actually, it would be much better if he had all of that and agreed with her view of the world. When it comes to relationships people should aim high and not settle.

fungun

IMO your partner will always have some different views, its how you communicate about them and respect each others views that is important, and also the ability from both of you to let things go. If you sit there in a huff because you cant believe he has voted for SF or voted against your thoughts on abortion because you thought you could talk him around in time, its not going to end well.

The fact that you mention you hope he would rethink some opinions would worry me......you should love him for or not who he is now, not who he might be if you can persuade him to agree with your thoughts on these matters. Dont assume you can change him

wylo

I wouldn’t let this stuff stop you pursuing a relationship if you like him. Unless he is hard lined about it and it’s a constant issue.

My girlfriend believes in the bible and God, that’s fine but then one day we chatted and she talked about how we were created by him and how the idea that we came from a common ape ancestor is ridiculous.

Honestly it was off-putting, but I realised it was an issue for me more than the opposite was for her. She didn’t care that I disagreed. So I realised it was my problem not hers because she didn’t care.

My point is , if you’re torn it’s only because you like him. Go with that imo.

johnnyskeleton

Censorsh!t wrote: »

We do agree on a few things of course, and I believe his idea of feminism (and I would consider myself to be feminist) is very much tainted by the toxic side of "hating men" that seems to be associated with the ideology these days, and I agree is a problem (but one only espoused by a minority). When these things came up, we both talked about them in a bit of a jokey manner, but I guess I'm just wondering is there a point in pursuing things with these big ideological differences.

It sounds to me like you both agree that women should have equal rights and that stuff like manspreading is a bit ridiculous. The problem comes from you believing that the word feminism describes the former and him believing it describes the latter.

So rather than you having opposing political views, it sounds like you have similar views but that you dont accept his criticism of feminism because it is based on extremes and he doesnt like you calling yourself a feminist as it implys you agree with the extremists.

Sounds to me like something the two of you should be able to resolve between yourselves, perhaps by using different terminology.

As regards having different political views, my parents will often drive to the polling station together and one will vote yes the other no. Theyve been happily married for 40 years and it doesnt seem to bother them. But obviously if having the same political opinions is important to you then its different

qwerty13

wylo wrote: »

My girlfriend believes in the bible and God, that’s fine but then one day we chatted and she talked about how we were created by him and how the idea that we came from a common ape ancestor is ridiculous.

Honestly it was off-putting, but I realised it was an issue for me more than the opposite was for her.

Just quoting this to say that the poster who said this is clearly fine with it, but I personally couldn’t cope with this in a friend, let alone a partner. I just simply could not be with someone who held such views.

So I guess it’s down to what you’re prepared to compromise/negotiate on. For me, religion, sexism and racism are non-negotiable. You need to establish what your boundaries are. If you’d be embarrassed introducing this guy to friends/family because of his views, well, decision made in my book.

amtc

My parents vote differently every single election. Married 50 years.

My dad is a feminist. Totally. My mam is off to Australia Thursday for three months. Her fourth time this year.

My best friend is an atheist. I am a Catholic albeit not a very practising one.

Can you.not just have fun in these early days? As long as you're both kind and interested in each other no need to do personality tests so early!

wylo

qwerty13 wrote: »

Just quoting this to say that the poster who said this is clearly fine with it, but I personally couldn’t cope with this in a friend, let alone a partner. I just simply could not be with someone who held such views.

So I guess it’s down to what you’re prepared to compromise/negotiate on. For me, religion, sexism and racism are non-negotiable. You need to establish what your boundaries are. If you’d be embarrassed introducing this guy to friends/family because of his views, well, decision made in my book.

Genuine sexism and racism would be red line for me totally. In this case , other than that one conversation we had , it has no effect on our relationship. She is Brazilian as well so I made an allowance for cultural differences. She never mentions God or the bible and she is very liberal. More liberal than atheists I know. It was actually me that brought it up. I even jokingly banned her and my atheist flat mate from discussing it. These things don’t have to be serious.

This same girl even thought a Muslim friend to come out of her religious shell and start doing fun things like going to the pub , go on tinder etc.

Just shows nothing is black/white/good/bad

OP, these issues don’t have to be as big as our generation seem to make them out to be. It doesn’t stop him from having a good heart. Our parents seem to understand that.

There is something darker and more backward with lack of tolerance/racism though. I couldn’t be with someone with those views as there is suffering by others as a result.

Censorsh!t

Augme wrote: »

So he doesn't like femenism, holds right-wing views and is not a fan of abortion but because he has a good sene of humour, asks about you and you have some common interests you're possibly willing to ignore his believes? Honestly, I think what you deem important in a partner is completely backwards.

As Icepick said these issues are far deeper than just political issues. They say what a person is actually like, and a much better gauge of them than a sense of humour or common interests.

Thanks for the reply. I mean, I guess that's why I'm asking for advice and why I'm really torn. I agree that political beliefs are a reflection of someone's morals, but I'm just trying to figure out how strongly those beliefs are held and how long I should spend figuring that out.

Censorsh!t

Thanks for all the replies everyone. There's quite a few different points of view here! I think I'm gonna have to just find out a bit more about his beliefs and if they are very rigid and opposing mine I know what I'll have to do.

backspin.

Censorsh!t wrote: »

Thanks for the replies.


There is more than just the feminism aspect - there is also stuff regarding right-wing leaders, and views on abortion. I don't know about his views on immigration, or things like race (and am almost scared to ask!).

It's tough to decide how rigid his views are - when we spoke about some of these things, he did agree with me on a number of points, both regarding sexism and government policies. And he did commiserate with me on how I've been treated with disrespect in my field for being a woman (but does still think women have full equality).
I myself am quite rigid in my views, especially concerning matters around women - but I am open to listening to other people and attempting to have a human conversation with them without trying to force my own views.

I guess for now I will just wait and see what happens. Perhaps the fact that he knows I am a feminist might make him rethink some of his ideas. I understand its tough when people live in an echo chamber and don't really get to talk to or hear from people of opposing views, so I imagine that has an impact (on both our sides).

I don't really think you have a future. You sound like the one who is entrenched in your 'liberal' views. Lots of men have a problem with how feminism seems to have become a man hating ideology these days. And many of us are concerned with the current levels of immigration. Some people won't be compatible if they are adamant their views are correct and everyone else is wrong.

SterlingArcher

Censorsh!t wrote: »

So, I've been talking to a guy for a few weeks now, and I've met up with him twice, but I'm really stuck with how to feel in case it goes further.

I'll start with the good stuff - He seems like a nice person, and is interested in what I do, and asks me quite a lot about myself. He is funny, and has a similar sense of humour to me, and we also have quite a few common interests. When we met up we had no problem talking and spent a lot longer together than intended because we are having such a good time.


The only problem is we seem to be on the opposite spectrum of things politics-wise. I am very liberal, while he has a lot of - what I would consider - right-wing ideas. We do agree on a few things of course, and I believe his idea of feminism (and I would consider myself to be feminist) is very much tainted by the toxic side of "hating men" that seems to be associated with the ideology these days, and I agree is a problem (but one only espoused by a minority). When these things came up, we both talked about them in a bit of a jokey manner, but I guess I'm just wondering is there a point in pursuing things with these big ideological differences.

I like him quite a bit, so am really quite torn about the whole thing :S

Your user name is quite fitting.

I don't think I ever considered someone's political beliefs as a reason not to get involved with them. But it's my own personal opinion that being attached to your political beliefs like some religious fundamentalist is not healthy. You may say you're not like that but this very thread to me says otherwise.

Maybe I am naive. I'd look more for love, a soul mate, kindness, consideration, funny, affable.

Honestly do the guy a favor and let him go be happy in life.

silverharp

so you have had 2 dates and have got into politics in a big way, sorry but that sounds very boring and assuming its yourself thats leading this you are going to drive good potential partners away. Also you seem to have let the dumb political cornering and labeling escape into your private life, you have basically used language that suggest that you are on the good side and he is on the bad side. the vast majority of people are centre or centre left or centre right and get on perfectly well together. Maybe you are the "extremist" here?

kaymin

Have to agree with the last few posters. You don't come across as someone that is very open minded. There's rights and wrongs no matter which side you fall down on and you should be mature / intelligent enough to realise that. Things are rarely black and white.

It would be quite off-putting to me to be with someone that isn't willing to listen to others' viewpoints. Someone calling themselves a feminist just puts me off straightaway. I'm all for equality but the simple fact of the matter is that in some things men are physically more capable (building trade) whereas in others women are more (on average) nurturing / sympathetic and therefore better suited (nursing). Yes it's a generalisation so shoot me for it!

strandroad

I think you're being harsh on the OP. It's one thing to have right/left differences and argue about taxes and political parties the entire married life (I have an example in my family... otherwise they are getting along great), and another thing to want to explore any potential sexist/racist/antigay vibes as they appear.

Some people expect women to switch to homemaker mode when children appear, some people won't behave around a gay sibling or foreign best friend. These thing can absolutely ruin a relationship, you do want to know if they may potentially become an issue early on.

Censorsh!t

Thanks again for replies.

I might mention that I didn't bring up any of the political talk and I usually like to keep that separate, and I didn't engage with it too much to be honest.

I also understand that people can be quite put off when you say you're a feminist (although I didn't say it out straight, he asked me). I did mention that I find some aspects of the movement quite toxic.

I'm not sure if I'm completely closed minded. I do understand how people have differing views and I do make an effort to hear people out. I know it's wrong to talk about it all in an "I'm right" kind of way, but I guess I'm going to think my views are right aren't I :P

laserlad2010

Censorsh!t wrote: »

Thanks for the replies.


I myself am quite rigid in my views, especially concerning matters around women - but I am open to listening to other people and attempting to have a human conversation with them without trying to force my own views.

I guess for now I will just wait and see what happens. Perhaps the fact that he knows I am a feminist might make him rethink some of his ideas.

Why are you allowed to be entrenched in your views yet he needs to listen to you?

Whats wrong with being concerned about immigration? I work in a neonatal ICU where I keep babies from 23 weeks gestation alive - therefore I feel quite uncomfortable about some abortions. Does that make me an unattractive person?
Some "right wing" leaders make some very good points - just like some "left wing" leaders do.

And - newsflash - there's a lot more gender equality than you think.

Why does he need to rethink his ideas? I've seen no gender equality in this from your side. In fact, this guy sounds more open minded than you - listening to you and agreeing with you on many points which I suspect you simply won't do.

eviltwin

Censorsh!t wrote: »

Thanks again for replies.

I might mention that I didn't bring up any of the political talk and I usually like to keep that separate, and I didn't engage with it too much to be honest.

I also understand that people can be quite put off when you say you're a feminist (although I didn't say it out straight, he asked me). I did mention that I find some aspects of the movement quite toxic.

I'm not sure if I'm completely closed minded. I do understand how people have differing views and I do make an effort to hear people out. I know it's wrong to talk about it all in an "I'm right" kind of way, but I guess I'm going to think my views are right aren't I :P

You learn to pick your battles. I'm a vegan, my husband is a meat eater. We could argue the merits of both forever but neither of us is going to change so we don't. It's about looking beyond individual opinions on random issues to the bigger picture.

The only issues I wouldn't overlook are those that clash in terms of how we envisage our lives going. For example, I couldn't live with a partner who expected his wife to be a homemaker no matter how amazing he was because working is not something I'm willing to compromise on.

The only potential issues I can see are your views on abortion if that was something that you needed to consider.

Censorsh!t

laserlad2010 wrote: »

Why are you allowed to be entrenched in your views yet he needs to listen to you?

Whats wrong with being concerned about immigration? I work in a neonatal ICU where I keep babies from 23 weeks gestation alive - therefore I feel quite uncomfortable about some abortions. Does that make me an unattractive person?
Some "right wing" leaders make some very good points - just like some "left wing" leaders do.

And - newsflash - there's a lot more gender equality than you think.

Why does he need to rethink his ideas? I've seen no gender equality in this from your side. In fact, this guy sounds more open minded than you - listening to you and agreeing with you on many points which I suspect you simply won't do.

People seem to be assuming a lot of my views here. I do believe that there is a lot of gender equality now. And I am also of the opinion that men get a very bad deal when it comes to numerous things, eg custody etc.

I was in no way pushing my views and wasn't leading the conversation on these topics.

laserlad2010

Censorsh!t wrote: »

People seem to be assuming a lot of my views here. I do believe that there is a lot of gender equality now. And I am also of the opinion that men get a very bad deal when it comes to numerous things, eg custody etc.

I was in no way pushing my views and wasn't leading the conversation on these topics.

That wasn't my point. Your initial post said that he needed to reconsider his views whilst you weren't going to change yours.

I think you should consider why you wrote that - if you feel so strongly then find someone who aligns more closely with your viewpoints!

For what it's worth - it sounds like you wouldn't date me either! :D

Censorsh!t

laserlad2010 wrote: »

That wasn't my point. Your initial post said that he needed to reconsider his views whilst you weren't going to change yours.

I think you should consider why you wrote that - if you feel so strongly then find someone who aligns more closely with your viewpoints!

For what it's worth - it sounds like you wouldn't date me either! :D

Hmm yeah I agree I probably should have rephrased that and probably do need to be a bit more open minded regarding the language I use around it and expecting or hoping people to change.

Yerah sure, I think I'll see what happens, and make a concerted effort to be as open minded and respectful as possible.