FBD took my no claims bonus

twin27

Hi ive had commercial insurance with fbd on and off for the last ten years , n October 2015 I moved to zurich as they were cheaper , no problems there , I got a copy of my ncb from fbd and gave it to Zurich.
In 2016 I moved back to fbd as they were cheaper.
Now in 2017 I've moved to axa as they were cheaper, they requested my Ncb so I contacted fbd to forward me a copy of my ncb and they told me my last policy was rated on a ( non no claim discount earning basis) so basically they have deleted my full ncb without ever telling me .

Is this legal or can anyone give me any info on what to do?

uck51js9zml2yt

They normally have an option to add NCB protection to the policy.

CalamariFritti

^ That only applies if there was a claim.

Never heard of this before. Sounds crazy, but then I never had commercial insurance, could be different there.

Joeseph Balls

Op did you change to a car somewhere in the meantime? I lost ncb because I changed to a car

twin27

Joeseph Balls wrote: »

Op did you change to a car somewhere in the meantime? I lost ncb because I changed to a car

No , and haven't had any claim , as I say they just won't give me anything to say I had a full ncb when I went with them last year.
I wonder is it a scam to stop people from moving to another company?

Sono

Is there any difference in type of vehicle being covered before and now? That sounds bizarre btw, has to be more to it than the above.

Sue Pa Key Pa

No Claims Bonuses have no legal standing. Insurers are free to use, ignore or reject them as they deem fit. Basically, they are a marketing tool. FBD have a product which is flat rated and ignores NCB.

However, under regulations, an insurer is obliged to provide you with written confirmation of claim free driving while you are with them. Add this to your previous NCB letter and your new insurer will accept it. Nothing has been taken from you.

Sono

Sue Pa Key Pa wrote: »

No Claims Bonuses have no legal standing. Insurers are free to use, ignore or reject them as they deem fit. Basically, they are a marketing tool. FBD have a product which is flat rated and ignores NCB..

That makes no sense for a big insurance company to just ignore an NCB and not honour it, if this caught on Joe Duffy lines would explode!

Why would an insurance company ignore a perfectly good customer who is claims free and has proof of same, it does not stand up in this case unless they had other concerns but even still it would be harsh.

Sleeper12

twin27 wrote:

No , and haven't had any claim , as I say they just won't give me anything to say I had a full ncb when I went with them last year. I wonder is it a scam to stop people from moving to another company?

Your ncb is good for 2 years. Can you get a copy from the company before FBD? I know it won't cover last year but it might be enough for your new company.

I've never heard of it either btw

Sue Pa Key Pa

Sono wrote:

That makes no sense for a big insurance company to just ignore an NCB and not honour it, if this caught on Joe Duffy lines would explode!

Sono wrote:

Why would an insurance company ignore a perfectly good customer who is claims free and has proof of same, it does not stand up in this case unless they had other concerns but even still it would be harsh.

I don't think you grasp what happened when the insured went to FBD at last renewal. They quoted a premium which ignored the principle of NCB which was cheaper than the the insurer he was with at the time. Happy days! There are numerous motor products out there that do the same. The insured has not lost anything.

Joe Duffy my hole!

LiamaDelta

There should be a no-claims certificate for the insured period with your renewal. Add this to the other certificates you get every year and you're oxo!

twin27

Sue Pa Key Pa wrote: »

I don't think you grasp what happened when the insured went to FBD at last renewal. They quoted a premium which ignored the principle of NCB which was cheaper than the the insurer he was with at the time. Happy days! There are numerous motor products out there that do the same. The insured has not lost anything.

Joe Duffy my hole!

Yes but they never informed me at the time that if I leave them next year they will not give me any proof of my ncb! Then obviously I would NOT have taken out a policy with them.

twin27

LiamaDelta wrote: »

There should be a no-claims certificate for the insured period with your renewal. Add this to the other certificates you get every year and you're oxo!

That's the thing , there wasn't any proof or anything written on my renewal about my ncb.

Sue Pa Key Pa

twin27 wrote:

Yes but they never informed me at the time that if I leave them next year they will not give me any proof of my ncb! Then obviously I would NOT have taken out a policy with them.

But you have lost nothing. FBD will confirm you were insured claim free November 16 to November 17. Add this to your NCB from last year and you have your full entitlement acceptable to any future insurer

George Sunsnow

twin27 wrote: »

That's the thing , there wasn't any proof or anything written on my renewal about my ncb.

FBD can give you a to whom it concerns twin27 held a policy with us for such a length and had no claim in that period
Go get that off them

twin27

Sue Pa Key Pa wrote: »

But you have lost nothing. FBD will confirm you were insured claim free November 16 to November 17. Add this to your NCB from last year and you have your full entitlement acceptable to any future insurer

Yes I contacted them and they sent out a letter to state I am claim free but my new insurance company won't accept that letter obviously , so now I have to go to my insurer from 2 yrs ago to hopefully get proof of my ncb from them.

Also on my fbd policy it states on the back page ( no claims bonus deleted)

My whole point is why wasn't I informed last year that they were going to delete my ncb...

This is complete rubbish from a so called big player in insurance, and a whole lot of hassle that I don't need . And to make matters worse I have 3 more policies with fbd and they still treat people like this.

Sue Pa Key Pa

I think you are making more of this than there is. You haven't lost anything. It is just inconvenient that you have to go to your previous insurer for a letter. I presume FBD were a good bit cheaper than your previous insurer for you to move to them, yet you say you wouldn't have changed because of this? All for the sake of now having to make a phone call.

Sono

Sue Pa Key Pa wrote: »

I don't think you grasp what happened when the insured went to FBD at last renewal. They quoted a premium which ignored the principle of NCB which was cheaper than the the insurer he was with at the time. Happy days! There are numerous motor products out there that do the same. The insured has not lost anything.

Joe Duffy my hole!

Ah yeah I get ya!

twin27

Sue Pa Key Pa wrote: »

I think you are making more of this than there is. You haven't lost anything. It is just inconvenient that you have to go to your previous insurer for a letter. I presume FBD were a good bit cheaper than your previous insurer for you to move to them, yet you say you wouldn't have changed because of this? All for the sake of now having to make a phone call.

Am hello !! It states on the paperwork ( no claims bonus deleted) does deleted not mean lost or gone?? Therefore I have lost it.

AvonEnniskerry

Joeseph Balls wrote:

Op did you change to a car somewhere in the meantime? I lost ncb because I changed to a car

This doesn't sound right. I've switched between a car and a commercial numerous times and never lost my full no claims. Only my additional no claims for that year as I changed policy mid year.

However in renewal this year I received a no claims from axa stating I had 4 years. When I contacted the broker who I'd been insured with for a number of years previously they said that axa only recognise 4 years... I argued that that didn't matter as other insurers recognise the full 5 years so I wanted a cert stating that at the very least when I've over 10 years no claims. The correct paper work was sent straight out.

Sue Pa Key Pa

twin27 wrote:

Am hello !! It states on the paperwork ( no claims bonus deleted) does deleted not mean lost or gone?? Therefore I have lost it.

It doesn't mean that at all. There would be a section on their paperwork for NCB calculations (if applicable) but it doesn't apply to your policy. Proof of consecutive claim free driving = NCB and you have that

Sleeper12

twin27 wrote:

Am hello !! It states on the paperwork ( no claims bonus deleted) does deleted not mean lost or gone?? Therefore I have lost it.

The only way that I know of for losing your ncb is by putting in a claim or let your policy lapse for more than 2 years

Sue Pa Key Pa

Sleeper12 wrote:

The only way that I know of for losing your ncb is by putting in a claim or let your policy lapse for more than 2 years

Exactly

twin27

Sue Pa Key Pa wrote: »

It doesn't mean that at all. There would be a section on their paperwork for NCB calculations (if applicable) but it doesn't apply to your policy. Proof of consecutive claim free driving = NCB and you have that

Yes so why then won't they just send me proof of ncb instead of 1 years claim free driving ? And why didn't they inform me of this company policy when they quoted me because to be fair I'm driving 20 years and this is the first time an insurance company won't give me proof of my Ncb. It's not like I'm asking for something I don't have and we'll they know it.

twin27

AvonEnniskerry wrote: »

This doesn't sound right. I've switched between a car and a commercial numerous times and never lost my full no claims. Only my additional no claims for that year as I changed policy mid year.

However in renewal this year I received a no claims from axa stating I had 4 years. When I contacted the broker who I'd been insured with for a number of years previously they said that axa only recognise 4 years... I argued that that didn't matter as other insurers recognise the full 5 years so I wanted a cert stating that at the very least when I've over 10 years no claims. The correct paper work was sent straight out.

At least they did send it out to you , I've been speaking to fbd on 2 occasions and they won't give me the paperwork for the ncb.

Sono

twin27 wrote: »

Yes so why then won't they just send me proof of ncb instead of 1 years claim free driving ? And why didn't they inform me of this company policy when they quoted me because to be fair I'm driving 20 years and this is the first time an insurance company won't give me proof of my Ncb. It's not like I'm asking for something I don't have and we'll they know it.

The 1 year NCB is correct as per the policy you took out with your previous insurance company. They are telling the truth

twin27

Sono wrote: »

The 1 year NCB is correct as per the policy you took out with your previous insurance company. They are telling the truth

They never told me anything about not taking my ncb into consideration when they quoted me last yr and asked me at the time if I still had my ncb.

Sue Pa Key Pa

twin27 wrote:

Yes so why then won't they just send me proof of ncb instead of 1 years claim free driving ? And why didn't they inform me of this company policy when they quoted me because to be fair I'm driving 20 years and this is the first time an insurance company won't give me proof of my Ncb. It's not like I'm asking for something I don't have and we'll they know it.

Because they don't operate with the NCB system for your type of policy. Look, I appreciate it is inconvenient to make a call to your previous insurer for a letter, but trust me, this has not cost you an extra penny for your new policy

twin27

Sue Pa Key Pa wrote: »

Because they don't operate with the NCB system for your type of policy. Look, I appreciate it is inconvenient to make a call to your previous insurer for a letter, but trust me, this has not cost you an extra penny for your new policy

I understand that I can get it from my previous insurer , my whole point is to make people aware of their policy because I have never come across it before and if they are going to use this without informing new clients that they will not be carrying on their ncb then at the very least their staff should be trained to explain the situation clearly for when the likes of me phones up looking for my ncb proof that they explain I need to go back to my previous insurer for it instead of just keeping repeating on the phone that I'm sorry sir but your policy was on a non no claims bonus which means feck all to me .
Also , if I stayed with them for three years and left would that not mean my previous bonus would be gone or is there a time limit how far you can go back.

Sue Pa Key Pa

Sorry, I can't explain it any clearer than I already have

LiamaDelta

OP you're somewhat confusing a No Claims Bonus with a Certificate of No-Claims. Just because they gave you a policy that didn't incorporate a bonus for not having made a claim doesn't mean they took away the fact that you haven't made a claim. An NCB is used to calculate your premium, a Certificate of No Claims is just a statement that you haven't made a claim.

twin27

LiamaDelta wrote: »

OP you're somewhat confusing a No Claims Bonus with a Certificate of No-Claims. Just because they gave you a policy that didn't incorporate a bonus for not having made a claim doesn't mean they took away the fact that you haven't made a claim. An NCB is used to calculate your premium, a Certificate of No Claims is just a statement that you haven't made a claim.

Yes I understand that , they gave me a certificate of no claims, but it's a statement of my no claims bonus is what I need and as I've said in a previous post the client should be made aware on taking out a policy that fbd will not be able to provide proof of their no claims bonus , should the client decide to move insurers the following year .

LiamaDelta

I'm not following you tbh...can you explain exactly what you expect to receive from them, I don't understand what a 'statement of no-claims bonus' is. If they have calculated your premium without a bonus then clearly they can't give you a statement saying that they have given you a bonus. Unless you want a statement saying NCB = 0%. They are not obliged to give you a bonus...they offer you a premium at price and you took it. Possibly you're just looking for a breakdown of your premium which will show that no bonus was applied?

twin27

LiamaDelta wrote: »

I'm not following you tbh...can you explain exactly what you expect to receive from them, I don't understand what a 'statement of no-claims bonus' is. If they have calculated your premium without a bonus then clearly they can't give you a statement saying that they have given you a bonus. Unless you want a statement saying NCB = 0%. They are not obliged to give you a bonus...they offer you a premium at price and you took it. Possibly you're just looking for a breakdown of your premium which will show that no bonus was applied?

Hi , ok , last year I insured my jeep with fbd and I had proof from my previous insurer that I had a full no claims bonus I.e 5 plus yrs.

Bearing in mind they never told me anything about my premium being calculated without a bonus as I told them I had a 5 year + no claims bonus I went ahead and took out a policy with them.

Now oct 17 my insurance was up for renewal and I've moved to another insurance company as they were cheaper but I have to forward on a copy of my 5yrs+ ncb which is standard with most insurance companies so I contact fbd for same and this is where the problem is , they told me they deleted my ncb but gave me a letter saying I had 1 yr with themselves claims free .

Hope that clears it up a bit.

Cushie Butterfield

OP, are you saying that you suspect that you were mis-sold an insurance product?

LiamaDelta

Somewhat. FBD won't give you a No Claims cert for years that you weren't insured with them (for obvious reasons). You can't expect them to say that you didn't make a claim in years you weren't insured with them, they couldn't stand over that. Also the statue of limitations is 2 years so it's even possible to have a claim off your previous insurance at this stage.
Your new insurance company is looking for evidence of your no-claims period of 5 years...it doesn't have to be just from fbd. As long as the dates match up for each of your insurers then it's fine. You just have to get the certs from the other insurance companies. For private motor insurance they are obliged to issue the cert every year - it comes with the renewal quote.
Would you accept the word of a mechanic that a 15 year old car had a perfect mechanical history if it somehow only had one nct certificate for the past year?

twin27

Cushie Butterfield wrote: »

OP, are you saying that you suspect that you were mis-sold an insurance product?

If there is such a thing , I just always presumed if you took out insurance holding a full no claims bonus that if you didn't make any claims on that policy then you should be able to get it in writing that you still hold that bonus because you didn't make any claims. When I took out that policy I was not made aware that I would not be able to get proof anymore from that company of my no claims bonus. I guess you could be right .

Henry Ford III

How can you expect to get a no claims bonus confirmation from a policy that didnt use a no claims bonus in its premium calculation?

A letter stating you had no claim is all that you'll ever get in the circumstances. After that it's between you and your new insurer.

twin27

Henry Ford III wrote: »

How can you expect to get a no claims bonus confirmation from a policy that didnt use a no claims bonus in its premium calculation?

A letter stating you had no claim is all that you'll ever get in the circumstances. After that it's between you and your new insurer.

Why wasnt all that explained to me so when I got my quotation because I've never heard of that and I'm driving 21 years and never had a policy with ncb deleted written on it..they still didn't clarify it to me on the phone last week like you just did so to me it sounded as if it was gone .

amcalester

twin27 wrote: »

Why wasnt all that explained to me so when I got my quotation because I've never heard of that and I'm driving 21 years and never had a policy with ncb deleted written on it..they still didn't clarify it to me on the phone last week like you just did so to me it sounded as if it was gone .

It was explained, you just didn't read it or if you did read it didn't understand what you were reading.

cplwhisper

This is how I have dissected this scenario

OP has vehicle 1 with 5yrs hard earned NCB upto 2016.
OP bought new-to-them Jeep to have as 2nd vehicle
FBD gave favourable premium using a Mirror NCB %/accelerated % to cover the jeep
Renewal ‘17 OP now has 1yr hard earned NCB

If OP explained to new company that’s he’s owned jeep for 5yrs then they looking for 5yrs earned NCB

FBD are 100% correct in issuing 1yr NCB.
If vehicle 1 Policy was cancelled in ‘16 and cancelled NCB given to FBD then and only then could they give OP 5yrs earned

PM me if you wanna chat offline as u just frustrating yourself reading text here

No I’m not FBD staff !!!

twin27

cplwhisper wrote: »

This is how I have dissected this scenario

OP has vehicle 1 with 5yrs hard earned NCB upto 2016.
OP bought new-to-them Jeep to have as 2nd vehicle
FBD gave favourable premium using a Mirror NCB %/accelerated % to cover the jeep
Renewal ‘17 OP now has 1yr hard earned NCB

If OP explained to new company that’s he’s owned jeep for 5yrs then they looking for 5yrs earned NCB

FBD are 100% correct in issuing 1yr NCB.
If vehicle 1 Policy was cancelled in ‘16 and cancelled NCB given to FBD then and only then could they give OP 5yrs earned

PM me if you wanna chat offline as u just frustrating yourself reading text here

No I’m not FBD staff !!!

Appreciate the offer .im getting copy from my previous insurer now so all should be sorted. Won't be goin back to fbd again . Thanks to all who contributed.

Henry Ford III

twin27 wrote: »

Why wasnt all that explained to me so when I got my quotation because I've never heard of that and I'm driving 21 years and never had a policy with ncb deleted written on it..they still didn't clarify it to me on the phone last week like you just did so to me it sounded as if it was gone .

I can't answer that one I'm afraid.

AvonEnniskerry

Oh so this is on a second vehicle? Not your primary vehicle... Because in that case your no claims can only be active on one policy at a time...

commited

Why don't you just contact Zurich and get NCB cert from year before? I had to do this previously to prove continuous NCB to an insurer so it shouldn't be an issue.

Just read bit about second vehicle - is this accurate? If so, you can't use 1 no claims history on 2 policies.