Car broken into - log book stolen

artanevilla

As the title says someone I know had a highish value car broken into. No sign of forced entry and it's keyless entry so maybe a cloned key to get access. (also possible it was left unlocked)

The only thing taken was the log book. But if they cloned the key why not take the car? And if they're looking to clone from the VIN number why not just take a photo of it rather than taking the log book?

The person is worried the car will be stolen in the next few days with a cloned key, I've secured the car from being driven away the best I could, but I'm thinking they just wanted the log book rather than the car.

Why would you take just the log book though?

Harry Palmr

How would they know the log book (no such thing these days by the way) was in the car? Why would anyone keep it in the car?

Fishy.

punisher5112

If someone were to put in their name they could then get a dealer to redo a key and away they drive.

Hal1

Just inform shannon about it, and maybe they can issue a replacement or is that the nct centre that do that now. I think it's €12 for a replacement cert.

punisher5112

Hal1 wrote: »

Just inform shannon about it, and maybe they can issue a replacement or is that the nct centre that do that now. I think it's €12 for a replacement cert.

Vlc has nothing to do with nct

colm_mcm

But the old cert would still exist and look exactly the same.

xavier8228

I would go to the gardai and report the log book stolen if the person hasn’t already done this. Then ask the garda for a letter stating they have seen the vehicle with that chassis number and the matching log book has been reported stolen by this person. The reason being that the culprit could change the registers owner details and report the vehicle stolen. Send the letter and the application form to Shannon.
I will say that it is highly unusual for a thief to only take a log book from a vehicle. Makes me believe that there’s more to the story like a relationship gone bad.

artanevilla

Harry Palmr wrote: »

How would they know the log book (no such thing these days by the way) was in the car? Why would anyone keep it in the car?

Fishy.

Apologies. Form RF105.

This person kept all car related documents in the wallet that contains service manual etc.

Robber wouldn't have known, it was opportunistic, centre console was left open, glove box etcetera and documents left strewn about, but only thing missing is log book.

artanevilla

xavier8228 wrote: »

I would go to the gardai and report the log book stolen if the person hasn’t already done this. Then ask the garda for a letter stating they have seen the vehicle with that chassis number and the matching log book has been reported stolen by this person. The reason being that the culprit could change the registers owner details and report the vehicle stolen. Send the letter and the application form to Shannon.
I will say that it is highly unusual for a thief to only take a log book from a vehicle. Makes me believe that there’s more to the story like a relationship gone bad.

It's been reported. Car belongs to a married elderly lady. No chance of relationship gone bad.

Atlantic Dawn

Keeping your logbook in your car is a fairly dim thing to do.

xavier8228

artanevilla wrote: »

It's been reported. Car belongs to a married elderly lady. No chance of relationship gone bad.

That’s fair enough. Just my cynicism then 😊

artanevilla

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Keeping your logbook in your car is a fairly dim thing to do.

I'll explain that to the elderly lady.

Why would it be stolen though and not the car itself?

colm_mcm

Not being funny, but was the logbook definitely there before?

Atlantic Dawn

artanevilla wrote: »

I'll explain that to the elderly lady.

Why would it be stolen though and not the car itself?

Perhaps for theft of the car afterwards but they wouldn't have known it was there in the first place so hard to say, maybe they intended to take it but were disturbed? There's plenty of people will buy a car not checking identification of the seller as being the actual owner.

artanevilla

colm_mcm wrote: »

Not being funny, but was the logbook definitely there before?

Fair question. Person is fairly certain it was there.

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Perhaps for theft of the car afterwards but they wouldn't have known it was there in the first place so hard to say, maybe they intended to take it but were disturbed? There's plenty of people will buy a car not checking identification of the seller as being the actual owner.

Why would they make it obvious it was taken if this was the case though? Why not put the wallet back in the glovebox? The person (let's caller her Jane) wouldn't have noticed in a million years it was gone.

Is there any value in a log book alone that would make it worth stealing without taking the car.

As I said in my original post I've done things to make the car harder to drive away but it involves Jane a non-technical person to go through process everyday to make the car drivebale.

This is only to make it harder for them if/when they come back in the near future, so what I'm really asking is this normal and is the car about to be taken?

(it is genuinely someone else btw. If it was me I'd say it and besides I've not got a car worth taking)

antodeco

Steal another car the same. Change plates. Sell it privately with correct car, correct reg and correct log book.

artanevilla

antodeco wrote: »

Steal another car the same. Change plates. Sell it privately with correct car, correct reg and correct log book.

This was my best guess. But it was an opportunistic crime as far as I can see. It's a Lexus as well so not as common as a BMW or Audi to easily match the car.

Maybe I'm over thinking it also.

my3cents

antodeco wrote: »

Steal another car the same. Change plates. Sell it privately with correct car, correct reg and correct log book.

First thing that occurred to me.

worded

antodeco wrote: »

Steal another car the same. Change plates. Sell it privately with correct car, correct reg and correct log book.

But chassis # not matching the paperwork ?

my3cents

worded wrote: »

But chassis # not matching the paperwork ?

Just how many people check the chassis number when they buy a car?

artanevilla

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/inner-south/car-owners-urged-to-secure-log-book-indoors-after-worrying-crime-trend/news-story/7089f93dec268ae7fc4eb3e3f3e9b9e7


According to this it was becoming a trend in Australia last year, nothing about Ireland.

I don't mean to sound callous but hopefully this is the case here.

bazz26

More than likely taken to be used as false documents on a similar car that was possibly stolen or previously written off. Stick false plates on the car that match the false log book and you have what would appear to a legitimate car for sale to an unsuspecting or non meticulous buyer.

artanevilla

bazz26 wrote: »

More than likely taken to be used as false documents on a similar car that was possibly stolen or previously written off. Stick false plates on the car that match the false log book and you have what would appear to a legitimate car for sale to an unsuspecting or non meticulous buyer.

So probably best to be aware of any toll or speeding fine issues that may be generated on false plates than the car itself being stolen?

bazz26

Very probable. I'd be contacting Shannon and inform then that it was stolen.

uck51js9zml2yt

It's needs to be reported to Shannon and the Gardai that it's been stolen. A note can then be made on the system to that effect.
€12 to get a new one from your local MTO.

mgbgt1978

xavier8228 wrote: »

I would go to the gardai and report the log book stolen if the person hasn’t already done this. Then ask the garda for a letter stating they have seen the vehicle with that chassis number and the matching log book has been reported stolen by this person..

Not a hope.....;)
Not having a go at yourself Xavier, but the Gardai have a particular aversion to putting anything in writing, apart from a summons maybe.

Snotty

I think we are giving the thief more credit than they deserve. If they didn't know the log book was in the car and the car is unusual, they really lucked out finding the exact same car as they have already stolen AND one that contained the logbook. (Logbooks are rarely kept in the car, unlike Australia where you produce it regularly).
If that was true, then they must have had a key to open it and if they did, why didn't they just steal this car right infront of them?

More than likely the thief was a moron, nothing in the car worth stealing, they see a logbook and think "I can make myself the owner" but then their tiny brain cells kicked in and no doubt they dumped the logbook in the next hedge.

xavier8228

mgbgt1978 wrote: »

Not a hope.....;)
Not having a go at yourself Xavier, but the Gardai have a particular aversion to putting anything in writing, apart from a summons maybe.

It’s not a letter stating it was stolen. It’s a letter stating the owner reported it stolen. And I know plenty of gardai that would do it.

colm_mcm

Just wondering, was everything in the car moved around or how did they know someone had gotten in?

Sixtoes

artanevilla wrote: »

Fair question. Person is fairly certain it was there.

Elderly person being fairly certain? My guess is it's in the house.

lawred2

antodeco wrote: »

Steal another car the same. Change plates. Sell it privately with correct car, correct reg and correct log book.

Chassis number?

johndaman66

Snotty wrote: »

If that was true, then they must have had a key to open it and if they did, why didn't they just steal this car right infront of them?

Maybe the thief used a scanner to clone the signal when the owner was locking the car in a car park, giving them access to enter the car but no physical ignition key to steal it with?

Snotty

johndaman66 wrote: »

Maybe the thief used a scanner to clone the signal when the owner was locking the car in a car park, giving them access to enter the car but no physical ignition key to steal it with?

With the intension of stealing the logbook? Don't think so.
This is pure opportunistic and the thief can do very little with it, it's probably been dumped already.

my3cents

The only thing that would make me think that the log book was deliberately stolen (targeted) was if it had been left on display in the car for some time prior to the theft.

anewme

antodeco wrote: »

Steal another car the same. Change plates. Sell it privately with correct car, correct reg and correct log book.

My sister was selling a black 2010 golf in Dublin. She was contacted by a woman(?) in Galway (not English as a first language) online about the car and said she would be up at the weekend to view it. Alarm bells went off, it was a bog standard golf, not even the cheapest one online, so why would you drive from Galway to Dublin when there were tonnes of others there. I think lady owner might have been the draw.

The next day my sister got an email asking her to scan them a photo of her vlc, so they could "check things" before they arrived. She asked the lady what exactly she wanted to check? Once the scammers copped she was into them, they were not seen for dust.

We were advised they were going to use my sisters logbook details to try legitimise a stolen car.

Harry Palmr

Another reason to get rid of paper documents. Is there any reason why a car cannot have a "credit card" style passport with the info encrypted?

colm_mcm

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Another reason to get rid of paper documents. Is there any reason why a car cannot have a "credit card" style passport with the info encrypted?

Would does this help a potential buyer in this situation?


Have you got the documents for the car? "Yes, here is a credit card with encrypted information you can't access or verify"

Harry Palmr

colm_mcm wrote: »

Would does this help a potential buyer in this situation?


Have you got the documents for the car? "Yes, here is a credit card with encrypted information you can't access or verify"

Pfft, get with the times - the card would have a unique number printed on it which could be put into an online database with a pin code - hey presto information.

elperello

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Pfft, get with the times - the card would have a unique number printed on it which could be put into an online database with a pin code - hey presto information.

So some random guy comes to see the car and I pass him the card and tell him the PIN so he can check the details on his mobile phone.

Harry Palmr

Well obviously you'd not do that, just send him/her a screen grab on the initial inquiry if they ask or do it on your phone at the inspection.

colm_mcm

That all sounds a bit over complicated

elperello

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Well obviously you'd not do that, just send him/her a screen grab on the initial inquiry if they ask or do it on your phone at the inspection.

I suppose that could work if the seller had a smart phone, signal and credit.
I'm still sceptical about your suggestion.
I have deeds for my house and would feel much more secure with a piece of paper for vehicles.

Harry Palmr

I'm just musing really but I'm sure paper will be a memory in a decade for new cars. Actually maybe the data will be stored in the car itself - called up on a screen when needed.

elperello

Harry Palmr wrote: »

I'm just musing really but I'm sure paper will be a memory in a decade for new cars. Actually maybe the data will be stored in the car itself - called up on a screen when needed.

It's no harm to speculate but I'd say it's a long term thing.