Bus Stops within Viewing Distance of each Other

cherryghost

Really bloody irks me. 13 for example has no more than 5 stops in one direction in Clondalkin village, 3 are within 150m of each other, then the other 2 are less than 50m apart. People waiting at all of them. Cut the stops to 2 or 3 and you've saved time. There should be no problem for most people to journey a couple of seconds of their lives to the next stop.

151/27/77a another one. Crumlin hospital has 2 stops either way within 50m of each other. Then towards Dolphins barn there's a similar situation. And AGAIN on St. Luke's avenue.

I'm sure there's loads more but these are just stops along some of my common routes. It's really stupid and inefficient to have so many extra stops along a line.

/rant

Is it only me that gets irritated by this? Do you have similar thoughts? Does it drag down travel time for you?

Gravelly

cherryghost wrote: »

Really bloody irks me. 13 for example has no more than 5 stops in one direction in Clondalkin village, 3 are within 150m of each other, then the other 2 are less than 50m apart. People waiting at all of them. Cut the stops to 2 or 3 and you've saved time. There should be no problem for most people to journey a couple of seconds of their lives to the next stop.

151/27/77a another one. Crumlin hospital has 2 stops either way within 50m of each other. Then towards Dolphins barn there's a similar situation. And AGAIN on St. Luke's avenue.

I'm sure there's loads more but these are just stops along some of my common routes. It's really stupid and inefficient to have so many extra stops along a line.

/rant

Is it only me that gets irritated by this? Do you have similar thoughts? Does it drag down travel time for you?

Sneak down at night and remove the offending ones. Shure the old, infirm, and sick can walk an extra hundred meters or two, feck 'em.

magicbastarder

which stops are only 50m apart? i had a look on google maps and the closest i could find were 120m apart.

howiya

cherryghost wrote: »

151/27/77a another one. Crumlin hospital has 2 stops either way within 50m of each other.

You'd be doing well to see one stop from the other around the corner. These stops are 150 metres apart.

I find it strange though that the distance between the stop immediately before the first of these two stops is significantly longer (600m) and I think it's why this pair stand out.

brokenarms

howiya wrote: »

You'd be doing well to see one stop from the other around the corner. These stops are 150 metres apart.

I find it strange though that the distance between the stop immediately before the first of these two stops is significantly longer (600m) and I think it's why this pair stand out.

The stops he is talking about are outbound and about 100 meters apart. They are in clear view from each other. stop 2099 and stop 2101

It is common throughout the network.

Problem is local councillors will kick up a fuss about removing them. They dont care about the bigger picture.

howiya

brokenarms wrote: »

The stops he is talking about are outbound and about 100 meters apart. They are in clear view from each other. stop 2099 and stop 2101

It is common throughout the network.

Problem is local councillors will kick up a fuss about removing them. They dont care about the bigger picture.

OP is talking about both directions but my response only referred to the inbounds. (7043 and 1424) as I only tend to use the bus in one direction.

I'd move one of them (7043) rather than remove it. Nearer the junction of Errigal Road would make the distances between stops along that strip being closer to 300m. As i said before the distance between the stop at the Halfway House and 7043 is 600m

LXFlyer

Ideally, a review of bus stop locations should form part of the Bus Connects project, including distance between stops and whether the stop design is adequate for the number of services using it and also from a safety perspective.

listermint

Gravelly wrote: »

Sneak down at night and remove the offending ones. Shure the old, infirm, and sick can walk an extra hundred meters or two, feck 'em.

A hundred meters to a bus stop will not make a difference. Are you proposing a bus stop outside every old persons door ?


Sorry but this is a tad on the silly side.

Bus stops beside each other on the same route is ridiculous it plagues the network too.

bucketybuck

Travelling along Walkinstown avenue this morning I came up behind a bus at a stop, indicating to pull out. I stopped to let it pull away, it started moving forward and then immediately indicated left and stopped at another bus stop.

Two stops right beside each other, I'd love to know how that is good for anybody?

Phil.x

The 39a/39 on the hartstown road is like that, stop after stop after stop, bus is only moving 30seconds before it's stopping again, which is one reason I avoid it.

Dravokivich

Those 2 pair of stops may appear close on the 13 route, but they are for completely different areas.

Inbound:
- On top of Woodford Hill is for Monastery Rd.
- The bottom of Woodford Hill is for the first part of Knockmitten.

Outbound,
- Across from the Garda Station is for the North end of the village
- By Molloys is for the South end of the village. Which would possibly more likely contend with the stop outside Moyle Park College.

Which others do you have an issue with? I haven't used it much around Bawnouge/Grange Castle since re-merging the 51 B/C. but most of the stops that appear close on that route do target a wider range of areas.

Dial Hard

It's the same on the 15 route at the top of the Ballycullen Road. Terminus is about 50m away from the next stop. It's ridiculous. And, of course, it affects fares as they go up depending on the number of stops you travel.

Dravokivich

Dial Hard wrote: »

It's the same on the 15 route at the top of the Ballycullen Road. Terminus is about 50m away from the next stop. It's ridiculous. And, of course, it affects fares as they go up depending on the number of stops you travel.

The number of stages has no relation to the number of stops.

AngryLips

cherryghost wrote: »

151/27/77a another one. Crumlin hospital has 2 stops either way within 50m of each other. Then towards Dolphins barn there's a similar situation. And AGAIN on St. Luke's avenue.

I agree with the concept of placing bus stops closer together where they are located nearer to major trip generators or where they are near to centres for the mobility impaired, such as nursing homes, hospitals and other HSE facilities. There are planning authorities that recommend bus stop distances should be 4 times more densely located near such places. What you're complaining about is the exception, not the rule.

ED E

The 16 stops three times in the same straight section of 550m. Drop the middle stop, leave one at top and bottom of the hill.


Chances are if you can't walk 200m you cant walk 100m either nevermind walk to the destination at the far end. This OAP argument is silly.

devnull

Just a handy tip - if you pop the route number in here:
http://journeyplanner.transportforireland.ie/nta/XSLT_SELTT_REQUEST?itdLPxx_page=rop

And click the route below and select inbount/outbound and show on map it'll show you all the stops for that route.

LXFlyer

ED E wrote: »

The 16 stops three times in the same straight section of 550m. Drop the middle stop, leave one at top and bottom of the hill.


Chances are if you can't walk 200m you cant walk 100m either nevermind walk to the destination at the far end. This OAP argument is silly.

Can you please post specific locations for these stops?

It's kind of difficult to assess your post without that kind of information?

LXFlyer

Phil.x wrote: »

The 39a/39 on the hartstown road is like that, stop after stop after stop, bus is only moving 30seconds before it's stopping again, which is one reason I avoid it.

Yes but look at the distance people may have to walk along spine roads to get to those stops in the first place.

There can be legitimate circumstances for stops being closer than 400m apart, and that's one location where it is warranted.

Dial Hard

Dravokivich wrote: »

The number of stages has no relation to the number of stops.

Are you sure? On that route roughly every second stop is a stage (sometimes two in a row) so they certainly seem to correlate there.

devnull

Dial Hard wrote: »

Are you sure? On that route roughly every second stop is a stage (sometimes two in a row) so they certainly seem to correlate there.

It differs wildly by route to be honest, there are some routes, like the 40D for example where the last stage is down as Tyrrelstown but there are about 5-6 stops there.

There are also used to be some routes where one stop would be one stage and the next stop would be 2-3 stages later, but I can't remember what they were other than they ran past the Hermitage

Dial Hard

devnull wrote: »

It differs wildly by route to be honestQUOTE]

I'd love to know how they're calculated. If I walked from my house to the shops I'd have walked two stages.

ED E

LXFlyer wrote: »

Can you please post specific locations for these stops?

It's kind of difficult to assess your post without that kind of information?

Thats just off the top of my head.

LXFlyer

Dial Hard wrote: »

Are you sure? On that route roughly every second stop is a stage (sometimes two in a row) so they certainly seem to correlate there.

Every stop is most definitely not a stage.

Look at the stage listing at the bottom of every bus timetable on the Dublin Bus website and that will be obvious.

endacl

Doesn't bother me at all. That said, I'd say I've been in 5 buses in the last 10 years. Got off the last one and got a taxi because I was bored.

ED E

8 Doors down. You'd go that far to ask for a cup of sugar. The 15.

Densely populated areas will have multiple stops- it's been that way for decades for the older areas of Dublin- not sure how it works for more modern areas built over the last 20 years like Ballycullen etc.
Personally i think it's fair enough. also, rather than one huge crowd at a bus-stop you have smaller groups which is usually safer in heavily built up areas where there's little room on the path.

LXFlyer

ED E wrote: »

Thats just off the top of my head.

I'd disagree with that.

Look at where people may be walking from to get to those stops - eliminating one would not be a good idea. You have to factor making the bus service useful as well - just simply removing stops because you think they're too close isn't always correct.

Now on the far side of the Dodder the northbound stop halfway up the hill should never have been put in place (it's relatively new and I can't understand why it was put there in the first place).

sbs2010

Paint every second stop purple and only stop at the purple ones during rush hour.

I'd walk an extra 100m to get on bus that went a bit faster.

Plus the extra diesel, wear and tear on brakes and engine caused by all the stops can be reduced by half.

Let the old folk wait until 10am to get their bus to the shops. They're not even paying

LXFlyer

sbs2010 wrote: »

Paint every second stop purple and only stop at the purple ones during rush hour.

I'd walk an extra 100m to get on bus that went a bit faster.

Plus the extra diesel, wear and tear on brakes and engine caused by all the stops can be reduced by half.

Let the old folk wait until 10am to get their bus to the shops. They're not even paying

You solve the issue of too many stops at peak times along a route by adding express services that stop at all stops in the outer areas and then operate limited stop en route to the city.

This sort of blasomments about stopping at every second stop is just nonsense I'm afraid - you have to look at each individual stop and look at where people are coming from to get it - some people may have already walked a significant distance.

brokenarms

150 route.
Apparently FF councillor insisted on it .
Pathetic .. Especially when a youth stops the bus to get out after its left the first stop.

sbs2010

LXFlyer wrote: »

You solve the issue of too many stops at peak times along a route by adding express services that stop at all stops in the outer areas and then operate limited stop en route to the city.

This sort of blasomments about stopping at every second stop is just nonsense I'm afraid - you have to look at each individual stop and look at where people are coming from to get it - some people may have already walked a significant distance.

Like I said, I'd walk another 100m (on top of my current door to bus stop walk) to get a bus that went a bit faster. And I think most rush hour commuters would agree.

LXFlyer

sbs2010 wrote: »

Like I said, I'd walk another 100m (on top of my current door to bus stop walk) to get a bus that went a bit faster. And I think most rush hour commuters would agree.

I think you might be surprised.

john boye

brokenarms wrote: »

150 route.
Apparently FF councillor insisted on it .
Pathetic .. Especially when a youth stops the bus to get out after its left the first stop.

Came in to post that very one! It's utterly absurd. The bus has barely started and it's already stopping again. Must be the 2 closest in the network, pax have to get up and ring the bell for the second one before the bus is even near the first one!

Cookie_Monster

7 stop inbound, top of Churchview Rd is 130m from the next one on Church Rd

And then inbound opposite the Killiney shopping centre in only 150m from the next one at Drumkeen manor

Pearse St Shops in Sallynoggin to St Kevin's School, next stop and then around the corner to the stop outside Power City is 450m total between 4 stops.

As posters have amply demonstrated, it's chronic all over Dublin.

LeinsterDub

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057382414/1/#post94326200

We had a great game around this very issue a few years ago

LXFlyer

LeinsterDub wrote: »

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057382414/1/#post94326200

We had a great game around this very issue a few years ago

I doubt that the the ludicrously short gap on Rathmines Road Upper can be beaten.

vmb

15 Route towards city centre.

Going up to Connoly takes usually 30 minutes, 30 stops!!!!!

it drives me nuts!!!!!

stop

cherryghost wrote: »

R

151/27/77a another one. Crumlin hospital has 2 stops either way within 50m of each other. Then towards Dolphins barn there's a similar situation. And AGAIN on St. Luke's avenue.

On the inbound side, historically these routes stopped at the stop closest to Errigal Rd (used only by the 18). Ringsend Drivers cited "Health & Safety" as they found it difficult to pull out from a stop where a 122 would frequently be laying over. So the Ringsend routes moved to the stop in between the existing stop & the next one at Cooley Rd junction. Some time later, DB/Conyngham Rd drivers realised the 151 was left behind with the 18 and it was moved to the new stop with the rest of the routes, maybe Ringsend drivers are a bit more precious?

If anyone using joint up thinking had looked at this set of stops they would have realised that the solution here was to find a place to park the 122, rather than introduce a needless walk for pax joint this stop from Errigal Rd side.

I complained to DB at the time. They didn't want to listen.

ArmaniJeanss

About 9 metres walking distance between two stops on the 70 at Littlepace estate, which beats all these marathon 120 metre distances being posted.

Technically the bus travels more than that as the stops are on opposite sides of the road and the bus travels into the estate then out again before continuing into town. No real need for it to pick up on both sides of the road though, pretty mad.

plodder

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

About 9 metres walking distance between two stops on the 70 at Littlepace estate, which beats all these marathon 120 metre distances being posted.

Technically the bus travels more than that as the stops are on opposite sides of the road and the bus travels into the estate then out again before continuing into town. No real need for it to pick up on both sides of the road though, pretty mad.

Same situation with stops 3653 and 3655 in Swords. They are directly opposite each other, but both serve both directions of all passing buses (eg 102). What's worse is that the distance traveled between the two stops is barely a couple of hundred metres. Yet, you see people waiting at both.

I'd have thought it would be simpler for passengers (to avoid getting on the wrong bus) that one side would serve one direction, and the other side the other direction.

PhilipsR

There's three on the Drumcondra Road both ways, outside Pats which are ridiculously close. They added another bus stop in the middle only last year due to the new library opening. The opening of those two bus stops show that they haven't learnt any lessons anyways.

Isambard

we've only got one stop in our town, but that's enough I guess as we only have 3 buses a day.

There are 2 stops about 110m apart on the road approaching the M1 through Holywell that the 142 bus takes. It's completely daft.

Ciaran_B

There are 2 stops on Cashel Road for the 83 and 18 about 100 metres apart. Then when the bus turns left onto Armagh Road there's a stop. 3 stops serving the same route about 400 metres apart.

Kh1993

The 102 stopping on opposite sides of Montgorry Way an odd one too. Stops, goes round roundabout and then stops parallel. No traffic lights to cross the issue, I guess.

the dark phantom

The Lough in Cork has three bus stops for the 214...

dfx-

LXFlyer wrote: »

I doubt that the the ludicrously short gap on Rathmines Road Upper can be beaten.

49m for the first two eastbound stops on the 123 outside the Supervalu in Walkinstown.

The last problem the 13 has or the 15 or 16 has is too many bus stops. The routes are just far too long with associated bottlenecks because they were designed to accommodate cuts by merging routes. The number of stops or the design of the stops can't solve that key issue.

The same stops in Clondalkin were no problem for the 51B and 51C to run on time like clockwork (even managing it with just one set of doors).:eek::eek::eek:

Neon_Lights

ED E wrote: »

8 Doors down. You'd go that far to ask for a cup of sugar. The 15.

Who takes 2 mins to walk 170m?

LXFlyer

dfx- wrote: »

49m for the first two eastbound stops on the 123 outside the Supervalu in Walkinstown.

Kudos - I'll grant you that one!!

Didn't see that one coming.

That's one of those locations where one of the two stops is a relatively recent addition (the terminus on Kilnamanagh Rd) - I'm surprised that they didn't set the second stop up as one where the 123 didn't stop given the proximity of the two.

They did that in Ballinteer where the last physical outbound stop on the 14 (the old 14/14A terminus) before the old 48A terminus is only served by the 161, while the 14 & 75 bypass it.

As I've said before there is a need for a review of stop locations, from both a proximity perspective and a design/safety/capacity perspective also.

But rather than a black and white "serve every second stop only" basis as someone suggested, this should be assesseed on a stop-by-stop basis looking at the individual circumstances of each sto.

LXFlyer

ED E wrote: »

8 Doors down. You'd go that far to ask for a cup of sugar. The 15.

What you neglected to notice was the 550m gap from the first of those stops at Knockaire and the previous one at Knockcullen Rise.

The first stop ideally should be further back along the road, but there are few suitable locations to do so.

Again you're not looking at where people could in theory have to walk to/from to get to/from the stops.

Those two stops are outbound on the 15 not far from the terminus - I doubt the impact on the overall schedule is particularly great.

ArmaniJeanss

Neon_Lights wrote: »

Who takes 2 mins to walk 170m?

Seems a fairly reasonable estimate. 1K in 10/11 minutes would be a normal enough walk which is about 100/90 metres a minute.

People underestimate the length/time of 100/200 metres because of athletics on TV imo !