Too many tourists….

seachto7

Well. Not trying to be a hypocrite or come across as selfish (I want to see it all, but only me me me!)

I was in Lisbon last week, and it was packed packed packed. Peak season I know, so it’s to be expected, but everywhere was so rammed, it was uncomfortable. There was no escape. It was almost impossible to find somewhere or someplace worth seeing that didn’t have queues or crowds.

I was in Granada in May, and it was similar. The Alhambra was rammed.

I do think that if attractions like castles etc charged a bit more, you might filter out a lot of people who wouldn’t have been too bothered going in the first place? On the other hand, you can’t blame the locals for making hay.

e.g. The Alhambra in Granada was “only” €12. I’d have gladly paid twice that. I was there for over 4 hours. When the signs stated "Do not touch the walls", people touched the walls. Maybe being able to pay for more security would fix that! Hike the price!

I can see why people in Spain recently were/are protesting against tourism. Well, not against tourists, but against how tourism is regulated. Air B&B seems to have spread like wildfire. That can be a good thing and a bad thing depending on how you see it.

Even in Dublin. It’s rammed with tourists. It’s a good thing in many ways, but is there a tipping point?

I know we all want our own little "experience" but you can't stop people getting on a plane...

endacl

Just back from Prague. I stayed in a lovely apartment just beside Charles Bridge. There I was every morning. A tourist complaining about how awkward it was walking across the bridge because of all the tourists walking across the bridge.

And there I was this morning. Back in Dublin traffic, sitting in my car, bemoaning all the other people sitting in their cars...

killbillvol2

seachto7 wrote: »

Well. Not trying to be a hypocrite or come across as selfish

I'm afraid you've failed.

fits

I thought the same in Dingle at easter time. And reports from Dingle first two weeks in august were similar. IT was grand in June thoough. I guess people might make more of an effort to get off the beaten track. Plenty of lovely places in Ireland and Europe that arent runover with tourism and could do with the revenue.

seachto7

Well, I'm a tourist too so it's hard one to define! More of an observation than anything over the years. Cheaper flights + cheaper accommodation = lots of tourists. Some cities can cope with the increase over others though, that's for sure.

It is a bad thing.

Go to Venice - there are no Venezians left, only Americans.

Firenze, no local people, only tourist and tourist services.

It is sad, the colour is washed from the cities

gizmo81

Anti-tourist sentiment is spreading

https://www.theguardian.com/travel/2017/aug/10/anti-tourism-marches-spread-across-europe-venice-barcelona

Dubrovnik is going to restrict numbers soon.

It's easy to understand why I think.

Cities are living breathing things not monuments.

dudara

I regularly travel to Amsterdam and I've lived there before and this year alone I've also travelled to cities like Barcelona, Venice, Verona, Paris and London. The main areas are all jointed with tourists with Venice being particularly horrible. It's the same here in Dublin and TBH you can see why locals are starting to get frustrated. Tourists also result in swathes of souvenir shops and restaurants that cater solely for tourists, to the detriment of the locals.

The irony of course is that I'm a tourist but I want to see the actual city not the tourist trap areas. It's a bit of a vicious circle really.

angiogoir

Dublin is the same. Jam packed. And now tourism has become a year round event. It's too much.

seachto7

Some cities are turning into Disneyland for adults. We managed to find local restaurants away from the tourist restuarants and felt like we had won a prize when we did so. Again, one can't blame somewhere like Lisbon for wanting to make buckets of money, but long queues for every single monument and attraction can be frustrating. Again, I am part of the problem, so I shouldn't complain. Venice, from what I hear is gone really bad. I was there, but a long time ago.
Half of these monuments/museums/attractions should charge more for entry too. Filter out the tyre kickers...

seachto7

angiogoir wrote: »

Dublin is the same. Jam packed. And now tourism has become a year round event. It's too much.

Too much for who though? You can't stop people getting on a plane, so what do you do?

Would a solution be to drive booking for museums etc all online, so they'd be able to cap the number of visits per day, so you'd minimise the long queues and time wasted getting into somewhere already packed out.
People are doing it for flights and accommodation so why not go the extra step.

Nomis21

My favourite spot in Ireland is Tory Island. Five times this year and I only ever see at most a handful of people with me, enjoying some of the most magnificent scenery in Ireland:

http://www.wildatlanticway.com/stories/islands/tory-island-the-secret-kingdom

lisasimpson

I must admit i love travelling april may sept oct. Still busy but not a crazy. I was in porto in may and was beginning to get busy happy i went when i did.

harr

We stayed in Ireland this year for holidays and spent a week in the west. Had two days in Doolin and it was nearly impossible to enjoy it, traffic was a nightmare and getting dinner at night was near impossible, queues out the door of anywhere that sold food.
Then into Galway again it was uncomfortable with the crowds as we had two kids under 10 with us..Dingle and Westport were the same.
We have had holidays in Ireland before but never seen it so packed before...
Wife was in Edinburgh with friends a few weeks back and she said it was the same just massive crowds everywhere..

MysticMonk

Santorini has dozens of tour busses and cruise ships discharging their cargo of americans daily.
In Fira for example they literally clog the narrow streets,elbowing and jostling for selfie snaps and buying nothing.
Similar on Charles' bridge in prague..absolutely thronging with idiots.

gucci

Popular tourist places being populated by people, popular bands/sports events being difficult to buy tickets for, the popular sandwiches are gone first at the café, its hard to get a table in a popular restaurant....

Is this just a general moan tread, or do you want to be able to make tourism more exclusive and elitest (by hiking the prices and air fares?)

There are plenty of places to go that are quieter, that have better food or service (not churned out because they know there are limited choice and a constant delivery of new paying guests) or carefully chose when to go for a better quieter experience......?!

otnomart

I was in Palma in June and it was absolutely jammers. Not just people staying overnight, but thousands of cruise ships passengers. I saw in the local English language paper that there are several ships every day and the daily number of passengers (and potential day trippers) is in the low thousands !
In July and last week I was somewhere quieter.
Was going to say where but now want to keep it to myself so they don't get mobbed next year !

The main reason really is that, years ago, mass tourism in the Med was more spread out and included destinations like Tunisia, Turkey, the Red Sea and so on.

The number of tourists has not gone down, and there are less places.

Having said that, Europe is not only Marbella, Dubrovnik...

You can get sunny weather, good food and keen prices in other places, too.

gizmo81

gucci wrote: »

Popular tourist places being populated by people, popular bands/sports events being difficult to buy tickets for, the popular sandwiches are gone first at the café, its hard to get a table in a popular restaurant....

Is this just a general moan tread, or do you want to be able to make tourism more exclusive and elitest (by hiking the prices and air fares?)

There are plenty of places to go that are quieter, that have better food or service (not churned out because they know there are limited choice and a constant delivery of new paying guests) or carefully chose when to go for a better quieter experience......?!

For me it's not a general moan. Barcelona's anti-tourist demonstration are in regard to the lack of housing for residents now with the influx of Air BnB wannabe hoteliers.

This is a very real problem and will reach these shores soon.

Tourism is to support the local economy not take from it.

dennyk

Well, like you said, it's peak season at a popular destination; massive crowds are to be expected. I prefer to travel in the less busy early spring or late autumn seasons myself, as things are much less crowded. Went to Seville for a few days last November and it was great; perfect weather and not crowded at all.

Try to find some less popular places to visit as well; everyone goes to Rome, Venice, Dubrovnik, etc., but there's plenty of hidden gems out there as well that get far fewer crowds. Definitely avoid any city where cruise ships dock if you're looking to avoid crowds.

spookwoman

A good way to find places is go to google maps make sure the explore bar is up with all the pictures and move around the map. Find plenty of gems that way.

Erik Shin

Went to Lisbon last April, Plenty of tourists...but not uncomfortable....but the day in Sintra was different gravy.... absolutely heaving and I was told that was a quiet day

artichoke

The cruise ships have a huge impact on overcrowding, more so than cheap flights I'd say. I was in Lisbon in December and my first day in the city there was a cruise ship in the harbour and the city was packed. I talked to some Portuguese about the overcrowding. They blame the cruise ships and there is already another pier built so more ships can come in. The city was already busy in December!They told me in summer it is worse, pavements/ trams packed and it's hard for the locals to get onto public transport for work. They do feel overwhelmed by so many tourists and also resent airbnb because there is nowhere affordable for them to rent in the city now. Wages are very low in Portugal while rents are rising.

I saw a lot of boarded up houses though.
Went to LX factory, while it was nice there it was also packed. I went a bit outside the city and it was less busy. Most people stick to the main sights and do not venture further.

Porto is a great city as well, not as busy as Lisbon. Guess it will not be long and Porto is equally crammed, or maybe it is already in summer? I went to the Harry Potter bookshop, and already there was a big queue, people everywhere with selfiesticks. This in winter season, so I can't imagine the crowds in summer. Biggest problem are the cruise ship passengers, as all they buy is a bottle of water and a fridge magnet which doesn't benefit local business and restaurants that are dependent on income from tourism.

The Chinese have discovered Europe as a travel destination now and so I guess the number of tourists will go further up. It is amazing how tourist numbers have increased in Europe despite all the terror attacks.

artichoke

Erik Shin wrote: »

Went to Lisbon last April, Plenty of tourists...but not uncomfortable....but the day in Sintra was different gravy.... absolutely heaving and I was told that was a quiet day

Yep, same here. Big queues at the bus stop in Sintra, people everywhere...in January....

flutered

artichoke wrote: »

The cruise ships have a huge impact on overcrowding, more so than cheap flights I'd say. I was in Lisbon in December and my first day in the city there was a cruise ship in the harbour and the city was packed. I talked to some Portuguese about the overcrowding. They blame the cruise ships and there is already another pier built so more ships can come in. The city was already busy in December!They told me in summer it is worse, pavements/ trams packed and it's hard for the locals to get onto public transport for work. They do feel overwhelmed by so many tourists and also resent airbnb because there is nowhere affordable for them to rent in the city now. Wages are very low in Portugal while rents are rising.

I saw a lot of boarded up houses though.
Went to LX factory, while it was nice there it was also packed. I went a bit outside the city and it was less busy. Most people stick to the main sights and do not venture further.

Porto is a great city as well, not as busy as Lisbon. Guess it will not be long and Porto is equally crammed, or maybe it is already in summer? I went to the Harry Potter bookshop, and already there was a big queue, people everywhere with selfiesticks. This in winter season, so I can't imagine the crowds in summer. Biggest problem are the cruise ship passengers, as all they buy is a bottle of water and a fridge magnet which doesn't benefit local business and restaurants that are dependent on income from tourism.

The Chinese have discovered Europe as a travel destination now and so I guess the number of tourists will go further up. It is amazing how tourist numbers have increased in Europe despite all the terror attacks.

less countrys to visit, how many did tunisia egyt and turkey cater for, this is been felt down in the canarys, less places more tourists, = congestion

artichoke

flutered wrote: »

less countrys to visit, how many did tunisia egyt and turkey cater for, this is been felt down in the canarys, less places more tourists, = congestion

yes, that was predictable. I noticed a rise in tourist numbers in Ireland too. Noticeable more visitors this year in my area.

Caroleia

artichoke wrote: »

The cruise ships have a huge impact on overcrowding, more so than cheap flights I'd say. I was in Lisbon in December and my first day in the city there was a cruise ship in the harbour and the city was packed. I talked to some Portuguese about the overcrowding. They blame the cruise ships and there is already another pier built so more ships can come in.

Aren't they planning to improve Dublin port to attract more cruise ships? yikes!

artichoke wrote: »

I went a bit outside the city and it was less busy. Most people stick to the main sights and do not venture further.

I find this is worth doing even when visiting parks -we were in the Botanic gardens recently -it was crammed up near the entrance and coffee shop, hardly anyone at the back towards the cemetery - it was heaven

I was lucky enough to visit Paris, Galway, the Alhambra and Florence (just the obvious ones that spring to mind) before the overwhelming hordes started going to them. I don't feel I can complain though, seeing as I was a tourist myself in all of them. I'm worried about Dublin though, don't want it to become too Disneyfied

killbillvol2

gizmo81 wrote: »

For me it's not a general moan. Barcelona's anti-tourist demonstration are in regard to the lack of housing for residents now with the influx of Air BnB wannabe hoteliers.

This is a very real problem and will reach these shores soon.

Tourism is to support the local economy not take from it.

Barcelona has been overcrowded for 20 years. It has nothing to do with Airbnb. Have you even been there?

artichoke

killbillvol2 wrote: »

Barcelona has been overcrowded for 20 years. It has nothing to do with Airbnb. Have you even been there?

True, I visited Barcelona in August 2004 and it was busy. Airbnb didn't exist back then.

_Brian

If ya want a break head to Cavan, not so many tourists find their way here.

artichoke

Caroleia wrote: »

Aren't they planning to improve Dublin port to attract more cruise ships? yikes!



I find this is worth doing even when visiting parks -we were in the Botanic gardens recently -it was crammed up near the entrance and coffee shop, hardly anyone at the back towards the cemetery - it was heaven

I was lucky enough to visit Paris, Galway, the Alhambra and Florence (just the obvious ones that spring to mind) before the overwhelming hordes started going to them. I don't feel I can complain though, seeing as I was a tourist myself in all of them. I'm worried about Dublin though, don't want it to become too Disneyfied

Is it that bad in Dublin? Haven't been up there in a long time.

Tenigate

Op it's simple. Go off the beaten track. Or go off-peak. Just don't complain about the lack of tourist attractions, facilities, public transport or signage.

As for willingness to pay more.. money talks. I was in Israel recently and apparently you can hire the tower of David as a venue for $100,000.
But expecting somewhere to double their prices to €24 so you can float around an empty museum for 4 hours is a bit silly.

jamesthepeach

Destinations will complain about the amount to of.tourists and want them gone when it's popular. Then next recession they'll be crying for them to come back.
See egypt, Tunisia and turkey at the moment. You can get extremely cheap holidays there.

killbillvol2

jamesthepeach wrote: »

Destinations will complain about the amount to of.tourists and want them gone when it's popular. Then next recession they'll be crying for them to come back.
See egypt, Tunisia and turkey at the moment. You can get extremely cheap holidays there.

Can you quote me an example of Egypt, Tunisia or Turkey complaining about too many tourists?

What an absolutely idiotic comparison.

pauliebdub

Consider going off peak, even October and November can be nice in Lisbon. I went to Granada in February a while back and it was very quiet.

Caroleia

artichoke wrote: »

Is it that bad in Dublin? Haven't been up there in a long time.

I'm a Dub was out of the city for 5/6 years just back working centrally and am constantly amazed by the amount of tourists and just the population in general. Started back in November but the numbers really seemed to shoot up around the start of March. It's a nightmare trying to get down any pavement quickly ie lunchtime or running for the bus home. Having said that I well remember when it was a ghost town in the eighties so better not complain too much.

jamesthepeach

killbillvol2 wrote: »

Can you quote me an example of Egypt, Tunisia or Turkey complaining about too many tourists?

What an absolutely idiotic comparison.

When I was in Egypt about 5 years ago there were demonstrations anlgainst tourists. When I was in instanbul, same thing.
You think those areas aren't crying about the tourism loss these days. Go over and see what you think.
You build your economy on tourism you might want to be thankful for the tourists.
Barcelona might survive without tourists. Venice won't.

killbillvol2

jamesthepeach wrote: »

When I was in Egypt about 5 years ago there were demonstrations anlgainst tourists. When I was in instanbul, same thing.
You think those areas aren't crying about the tourism loss these days. Go over and see what you think.
You build your economy on tourism you might want to be thankful for the tourists.
Barcelona might survive without tourists. Venice won't.

People aren't going to those countries because of a fear of terrorism, justified or otherwise. It has nothing to do with anti-tourist sentiment.

Demonstrations against tourism in Istanbul? You made that up.

jamesthepeach

killbillvol2 wrote: »

People aren't going to those countries because of a fear of terrorism, justified or otherwise. It has nothing to do with anti-tourist sentiment.

Demonstrations against tourism in Istanbul? You made that up.

You are not.getting what I'm saying at all. It doesn't matter what the reason people stop going to your country, so don't get hung up on terrorism.just because it's the most recent events to deter tourists. Also things like recessions, could etc happen on a regular basis.
Those things a country/city has no say in, and can all out and dent in tourism.

What I'm saying is that whatever the reason, whether you instigated it yourself or outside forced did, you will be crying to get the tourists back after they have gone. Basically don't bite the hand that feeds you.

artichoke

Caroleia wrote: »

I'm a Dub was out of the city for 5/6 years just back working centrally and am constantly amazed by the amount of tourists and just the population in general. Started back in November but the numbers really seemed to shoot up around the start of March. It's a nightmare trying to get down any pavement quickly ie lunchtime or running for the bus home. Having said that I well remember when it was a ghost town in the eighties so better not complain too much.

A record number of 3.1 million passengers have used Dublin airport in July. That is a massive amount. Rising numbers of visitors from North America. Expect more to come next year....although I think after Brexit there will be less visitors from the UK to Ireland. Their numbers are already dropping due to the weak sterling.

Considering that the summer is short lived in Ireland what with all the rain I can't imagine Ireland will ever be overrun with tourists as is e.g Spain.
with the exception of Dublin

cailin8

Went to Lisbon a few weeks ago including Sintra just outside Lisbon, didn't experience any big queues tbh. Waited at a bus stop with several other people, that's about it. Really didn't struggle with big queues despite doing a lot of the touristy stuff

gizmo81

gizmo81 wrote: »

For me it's not a general moan. Barcelona's anti-tourist demonstration are in regard to the lack of housing for residents now with the influx of Air BnB wannabe hoteliers.

This is a very real problem and will reach these shores soon.

Tourism is to support the local economy not take from it.

killbillvol2 wrote: »

Barcelona has been overcrowded for 20 years. It has nothing to do with Airbnb. Have you even been there?

I said Barcelona's anti-tourist demonstrations are in regard to Air BnB! I said nothing about 'overcrowding' and yes i have been in Barcelona.

The picture in the first article shows signs stating 'No tourism apartments'.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/aug/01/barcelona-anti-tourism-activists-vandalise-bikes-and-bus

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jun/02/airbnb-faces-crackdown-on-illegal-apartment-rentals-in-barcelona


32 million visitors last year.
23 million day trippers.
8 million hotel guests.
Where did the 2 million stay?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/news/bus-attack-in-barcelona-adds-to-fears-as-tourism-protests-grow/

lisasimpson

The cruise ships are becoming a big problem in some parts of Europe right now. They can dump loads in a city for a few hours. How much money will tourist spend in those few hours in these cities... lessons can be learnt from this take note Cork a place thats going after the cruise market. Croatia is having a big problem this year with cruises and then have the whole game of thrones effect thrown in
Also some resorts need to look at what they are offering and for how long. I was in Crete a number of years ago mid sept and a lot of the places had started to close down for the summer. Looking at a catelogue recently thinking of going away in october and many paces such a Italy options run to sept.

beauf

Go off peak end of problem.

lisasimpson

beauf wrote: »

Go off peak end of problem.

Unfortuntely off peak is practical for everyone esp if you have school going kids or work in certain sectors. However more needs to be done to encourage others to go travel outside of june july aug.

bucketybuck

artichoke wrote: »

I went to the Harry Potter bookshop, and already there was a big queue, people everywhere with selfiesticks.

This is the sort of thing I wonder about when it comes to tourists, the fact that they rock up to these places and then do all manner of inane **** just because its listed in the guide book.

Richard Hillman

Venice is more of a theme park. All the shop's are the selling are tourist tat. I went during high season though.

I was in Florence and thought it was wonderful. Again tbough it was completely out of season

J Mysterio

_Brian wrote: »

If ya want a break head to Cavan, not so many tourists find their way here.

The only thing Cavan had going for it was the mouth of the Shannon... Which is now said to actually be in Fermanagh.

J Mysterio

I too was in Lisbon last week and was surprised at how thronged it was with tourists. I guess it shouldnt have been a surprise for August.

What was worse though, was the dealers. They were everywhere and brazen as hell.

grogi

seachto7 wrote: »

Well. Not trying to be a hypocrite or come across as selfish (I want to see it all, but only me me me!)

I was in Lisbon last week, and it was packed packed packed. Peak season I know, so it’s to be expected, but everywhere was so rammed, it was uncomfortable. There was no escape. It was almost impossible to find somewhere or someplace worth seeing that didn’t have queues or crowds.

There are more elitist places for the elite... If you cannot afford it, you have to accept being the cattle.

killbillvol2

killbillvol2 wrote: »

Barcelona has been overcrowded for 20 years. It has nothing to do with Airbnb. Have you even been there?

As someone who has visited Barcelona on and off for over 20 years I can tell you it is way, way worse than it was 20 years ago.

At this point it is on the list of places I wouldn't go as a tourist. It reaches a point where the experience cannot be enjoyed because so many other people are doing the same thing and you hear more English than Spanish or Catalan.

Go down the coast to Valencia. The truth is you could stick a pin in a map of Europe and have a decent holiday wherever you end up, there are a huge number of places that have little tourism and they are infinitely more enjoyable to visit as a result.

MysticMonk

J Mysterio wrote:

What was worse though, was the dealers. They were everywhere and brazen as hell.

Drug dealers? I remember throngs of gypsy dealers selling fake hash in albufeira..they could apparently turn nasty if you tried to get your money back too.