trapped in sexless marriage and "cheating"?

NEhope

I've been in a sexless relationship for years. Sure we have kids and stresses, but she sure has time to watch TV series until she falls asleep. I do more than my fair share with work and kids, and this has been remarked upon by others. So there's no just do more dishes solution, in any case I don't feel that sex should be “bought” with doing chores, it should be mutually relevant and important. An “adult” relationship implies sex, otherwise its just an unnecessarily complex friendship?

I've pleaded, begged and rationalised how this situation is destroying me and us. I feel utterly rejected, emasculated and ashamed. They say sex is only a small part of a relationship, but when its not there, believe me it becomes the major part!

We've been through this so many times, even in counselling, and nothing changes, she's admitted “it doesn't affect her”...

At this stage I've little or perhaps no emotional connection with her, with all the constant rejections I can only view as my abuser, my gaoler. We have spoke of an open relationship, but she cannot handle that... I find it unacceptable that she demands the idea of monogamy yet unilaterally enforces celibacy?

I really cannot afford to escape, and such turmoil would effect my access to another child I have with a previous relationship. Not having a room for him etc...

So, the way I feel is that after all the pleading, to hell with her, I'm considering outside options and staying put. I owe her nothing any more. After the years of pain she has caused me, I feel no pressure to be honest with her, a liar who by implication promised a monogamous relationship. I would never have entered a life of celibacy. Looking back it seems she only ever initiated sex when we / she wanted to get pregnant.

For sure I would be discrete, I don't want to be Mr. Bad Example to the kids, but I don't want to be depressed Dad either, entombed in bitterness.

I have threatened this to her before... she doesn't seem to care how desperate i am.

My question, before I embark on an equally sophistic lifestyle and re-engage in normal, natural, and healthy human sexual activity ... with someone else... is :

Has anyone ever found sexless relationships, that have no medical reason for such, to recover?

See, part of me, the dumb part, still hopes. That hope is starting to feel like a dying animal in agony that just needs to be put down?

Airyfairy12

I wouldnt go as far as to call her abusive, youre not being abused but you have every right to feel frustrated and hurt, I think anybody would be.

That being said once you start cheating the marriage is over anyway, when she finds out (and she will) you'll be out of the house regardless but you'll also be the bad guy and you'll have nothing to fall back on.

I think your best option is to leave the marriage, over the coming months save all you can, get your things in order and plan to be out of the house within the next 6 months. Youre only tormenting yourself by staying in this relationship and by the sounds of you, from your description you sound like a genuinely good guy so with that mind, its her loss. Cheating will only create drama and a bigger mess for you to clean up, id just focus on getting my ducks in a row and then make a break for it.

...And Justice

Op if I was in a sexless marriage I'd be getting it elsewhere. I worked with a guy who was in that situation, he couldn't leave because of mortgage and his financial situation. He's still with the wife, she's still happy to not have sex with him and he gets the bit on the side when he needs it.

leggo

The practical solution isn't always to leave the marriage. Why should she keep the house while the OP still pays half the mortgage? She broke her vows as far as I'm concerned by refusing to have sex with the OP and not allowing him to get it elsewhere.

I can only imagine what you're going through, but if it was me OP I'd flat out tell her that you're going to be sexually active, with or without her (though ideally with), and you plan on keeping your home too and won't be leaving. Don't sneak around or ask for her permission, tell her this is how it is so she knows you're serious and there's no way she can stop this from happening. Then, if she decides she wants to work on the marriage, be supportive and go through the steps she needs to to get back to a happy middle ground. If she doesn't like it, then she can leave herself. She broke her vows, she moved the goalposts, she can be the one to suffer the inconvenience so. Though, in truth, I'd hope that this conversation would start another real conversation about the marital problems that can hopefully end well.

redfox123

No don't lie, don't sneak around. Be courageous and have the conversation. I'm astonished the amount of adults who cannot sit down and calmly speak the truth, and would rather avoid it/sneak around, just to avoid any confrontation or emotional reaction. Say you can no longer live a celibate life. That's not what you signed up for. Tell her you're planning on leaving. Tell her you want a separation, then go and stay at a friends for a few days for it to sink in. If she says she will work on it then give her a time frame. If not then get everything in order to make the change.

nikkibikki

leggo wrote:

The practical solution isn't always to leave the marriage. Why should she keep the house while the OP still pays half the mortgage? She broke her vows as far as I'm concerned by refusing to have sex with the OP and not allowing him to get it elsewhere.

I don't remember promising to have sex with my husband whether I wanted to or not? I did promise to be faithful to him however and him me.

redfox123 wrote:

No don't lie, don't sneak around. Be courageous and have the conversation. I'm astonished the amount of adults who cannot sit down and calmly speak the truth, and would rather avoid it/sneak around, just to avoid any confrontation or emotional reaction. Say you can no longer live a celibate life. That's not what you signed up for. Tell her you're planning on leaving. Tell her you want a separation, then go and stay at a friends for a few days for it to sink in. If she says she will work on it then give her a time frame. If not then get everything in order to make the change.

DO NOT LEAVE THE HOUSE UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES! Get legal advice on this.

OP, why does she not want to have sex? Has she no sexual desire at all? Perhaps she needs to see her GP about why that is and get her hormone levels checked. She may need to take supplements.

judeboy101

Op, convert to Islam or LDS and bring home a sister-wife (preferably young and willing). You don't have to legally marry new wife just do so in eyes of your new religion.

leggo

nikkibikki wrote: »

I don't remember promising to have sex with my husband whether I wanted to or not? I did promise to be faithful to him however and him me.

I knew someone would take this line. And it's a ridiculous line: you can't enforce celibacy on another person. This isn't a one-off where she's not in the mood. He's begged her and she's told him their sex life is over, but also said that she doesn't want him to sleep with others, and isn't leaving the marriage. That's moving the goalposts. If she's not happy with the OP and doesn't want to have sex with him anymore, of course that's her right, but then give up your home and let them find someone else because you changed the agreement you made.

Being faithful doesn't mean just 'not cheating' either. The idea is that they agreed to commit to a relationship for life, physical intimacy being a part of it (else it's no different than a friendship). If she took one of those pieces away without any discussion, she's the one who's unticked that box as far as I'm concerned.

eviltwin

Cheating won't address the emotional vacuum that your marriage has become. Personally if it were me I'd be taking steps to end the relationship and move on to find someone I'm more compatible with. I appreciate your concerns re access and they are valid but if you cheat and get caught you will be in much worse position. I imagine you've tried to have a conversation about this with your wife before and its gone nowhere so at this point its not going to achieve much. Seems like the marriage is already over, you just need to actually make the physical split.

Jurgen Klopp

Hold on a second kid, don't assume if you want a break up you need to finance yourself, she can get the fcuk out if that's her attitude to you

Don't leave the house

Armchair Andy

Jurgen Klopp wrote:

Hold on a second kid, don't assume if you want a break up you need to finance yourself, she can get the fcuk out if that's her attitude to you

I agree. Can he change the locks and throw her stuff out the window?
Seriously.

Jurgen Klopp

Armchair Andy wrote: »

I agree. Can he change the locks and throw her stuff out the window?
Seriously.

I wouldn't do that just yet, but he should keep a smile on with her and sneak off and get a solicitor and see his options

Colser

Jurgen Klopp wrote: »

I wouldn't do that just yet, but he should keep a smile on with her and sneak off and get a solicitor and see his options

It's very difficult to even get anywhere with a solicitor when the other party won't play ball.If there's a mortgage and young children he has very few options as its unlikely that his wife would be willing to sell/ move and financially he probably cannot work around that.

It's a horrible situation OP but one I believe is happening in a huge amount of marriages but not much discussed with friends or family.

You say that you've no feelings left for her but end up saying that you'd like to sort things out...do you fancy /love her still?

What is she like otherwise,do ye socialise together,has she friends,does she work?

The one thing I'd say to you is don't make idle threats,if you tell her that you're finished and will be looking elsewhere for someone then do it ,also tell her that you will be telling people that you've separated but living together for financial reasons.Sometimes a sharp shock like that can work to make the other person realise what they have and what they stand to lose,it's a tough one but it sounds like you've exhausted every other avenue and life can pass you by very quickly living in hope but knowing that you're pretty much stuck.

nikkibikki

leggo wrote:

I knew someone would take this line. And it's a ridiculous line: you can't enforce celibacy on another person. This isn't a one-off where she's not in the mood. He's begged her and she's told him their sex life is over, but also said that she doesn't want him to sleep with others, and isn't leaving the marriage. That's moving the goalposts. If she's not happy with the OP and doesn't want to have sex with him anymore, of course that's her right, but then give up your home and let them find someone else because you changed the agreement you made.

Being faithful doesn't mean just 'not cheating' either. The idea is that they agreed to commit to a relationship for life, physical intimacy being a part of it (else it's no different than a friendship). If she took one of those pieces away without any discussion, she's the one who's unticked that box as far as I'm concerned.

And I agree with with those points, she has indeed unticked the box, but to say that she broke her vows is false. I'd agree that sex/intimacy is definitely part of the wider commitment to spend the rest of your life with someone. If the OP cheats, he'll get caught and come out looking like the bad guy. And I don't think he deserves that TBH. I don't know how he has lasted this long. It's not fair on him.

I really think the OP would hugely benefit from professional financial and legal advice with a view to possibly dissolving this relationship. There are ways to manage debt and debt management firms will be experienced in scenarios where relationships have broken up.

OP, you deserve to be happy. I don't think cheating will give you that happiness. Freedom and possibly a new relationship in the future, has definitely got way more potential.

NEhope

Jurgen Klopp wrote: »

Hold on a second kid, don't assume if you want a break up you need to finance yourself, she can get the fcuk out if that's her attitude to you

Don't leave the house

I appreciate the intent... but I've even been divorced before in my life, I'm well aware of the legal process as I represented myself for all but the final hearing.
Truth is if you commit "adultery" you place your spouse in an "untenable" position which gives them grounds for divorce.... and an exclusion order as your behavior is deemed unacceptable.

You can imagine, I've had this one circling the brain for a while now. ;-) For sure, tit for tat, the way I've been treated I'd have no scruples bringing the potential girlfriend home.

If you mean let her leave prior to living life again... she won't, as she says "it doesn't affect her".... I'd think affair, but she's at home all the time and I work from home. So I'd probably notice that...

I've been meaning to answer quite a few posts, but... life... arguments etc.. tonight, after more calm discussion, she told me to go down to the local town and "find some teen to ****..." Now, I'm middle aged, so not particularly into dealing with young ladies, under 30, (but seriously, mental compatibility and so life experience is a thing for me, attraction fails otherwise, and she probably knows this) ... but I guess it captures her sentiments on sex... its only for the young? (Its also no the first time I've been given the green card only to have it withdrawn once finalizing such an agreement was at hand)

NEhope

...And Justice wrote: »

Op if I was in a sexless marriage I'd be getting it elsewhere. I worked with a guy who was in that situation, he couldn't leave because of mortgage and his financial situation. He's still with the wife, she's still happy to not have sex with him and he gets the bit on the side when he needs it.

I don't think it a long term solution, I can forsee emotional issues in a threeway...

But yea... I totally understand... if you asked me 10-15 years ago, I'd have a different opinion, isn't it easy for the inexperienced to adopt a moral high ground?

NEhope

leggo wrote: »

The practical solution isn't always to leave the marriage. Why should she keep the house while the OP still pays half the mortgage? She broke her vows as far as I'm concerned by refusing to have sex with the OP and not allowing him to get it elsewhere.

I can only imagine what you're going through, but if it was me OP I'd flat out tell her that you're going to be sexually active, with or without her (though ideally with), and you plan on keeping your home too and won't be leaving. Don't sneak around or ask for her permission, tell her this is how it is so she knows you're serious and there's no way she can stop this from happening. Then, if she decides she wants to work on the marriage, be supportive and go through the steps she needs to to get back to a happy middle ground. If she doesn't like it, then she can leave herself. She broke her vows, she moved the goalposts, she can be the one to suffer the inconvenience so. Though, in truth, I'd hope that this conversation would start another real conversation about the marital problems that can hopefully end well.

;-)....
I'm going to shock some of you now...
we're not married, but have kids, I was once married, and got divorced, so not mad into repeating that mistake under an Irish system.... 4 years separated before applying for divorce, then waiting another couple of years for all to be sorted in order to be heard...

I have actually done exactly what you suggest on two occasions and a reluctant ad infrequent sexlife ensued for a couple of weeks...

I just dont seem able to convince her how much this kills me... every day.. I can't bare even looking at her anymore. I've started to zone out to her conversations... I'm not like that with anyone else, I'm actually not self-involved... she seems, or at least her treatment of me seems to bring out the worst...

BTW thanks for your advice.. much appreciated.

NEhope

redfox123 wrote: »

No don't lie, don't sneak around. Be courageous and have the conversation. I'm astonished the amount of adults who cannot sit down and calmly speak the truth, and would rather avoid it/sneak around, just to avoid any confrontation or emotional reaction. Say you can no longer live a celibate life. That's not what you signed up for. Tell her you're planning on leaving. Tell her you want a separation, then go and stay at a friends for a few days for it to sink in. If she says she will work on it then give her a time frame. If not then get everything in order to make the change.

been there, done that X 1000

Re. separation...My continued existence within our "relationship" I guess proves otherwise?

This uncomfortable fact makes me disgusted with myself.

professore

Why did you marry her? Go for separation and shag to your heart's content. You seriously don't want to get married again after your previous experiences?

I also think someone who has no interest in sex has no right to restrict their partner from it, married or single. Without sex you are just roommates. A marriage without sex is just as pointless as a marriage without love. It's just an arrangement for one person to leech financially off another person.

EDIT: You're not married? WTF are you waiting for? Maybe she needs a more masculine approach i.e. "**** me or **** you". Or maybe she's not the woman for you.

NEhope

Colser wrote: »

It's very difficult to even get anywhere with a solicitor when the other party won't play ball.If there's a mortgage and young children he has very few options as its unlikely that his wife would be willing to sell/ move and financially he probably cannot work around that.

It's a horrible situation OP but one I believe is happening in a huge amount of marriages but not much discussed with friends or family.

You say that you've no feelings left for her but end up saying that you'd like to sort things out...do you fancy /love her still?

What is she like otherwise,do ye socialise together,has she friends,does she work?

The one thing I'd say to you is don't make idle threats,if you tell her that you're finished and will be looking elsewhere for someone then do it ,also tell her that you will be telling people that you've separated but living together for financial reasons.Sometimes a sharp shock like that can work to make the other person realise what they have and what they stand to lose,it's a tough one but it sounds like you've exhausted every other avenue and life can pass you by very quickly living in hope but knowing that you're pretty much stuck.

Thanks Colser!

Its a disaster.. she's from mainland Europe... and so the legal issue of kids, day to day custody, and kidnapping /removal from state comes into play... complex or what??? My understanding is that she will most likely gain day to day custody but wont be allowed leave the state without my consent which wont be happening. I want to be able to speak to my boys later in life, and I'm not too great with languages unless I live somewhere for about a year... when her family visits, despite the lads not having a word of her language they all speak it (they all have fluent English) and fair enough... I'm glad they can be comfortable.. but maybe it's just me, but in situations where I've been which are multi-lingual, out of consideration, people adopted the language everyone knew.. at one time french.. but I digress...

Anyway, I like your idea of publicly proclaiming the separation whilst having to live together... isn't that exactly whats been going on?

NEhope

professore wrote: »

Why did you marry her? Go for separation and shag to your heart's content. You seriously don't want to get married again after your previous experiences?

I also think someone who has no interest in sex has no right to restrict their partner from it, married or single. Without sex you are just roommates. A marriage without sex is just as pointless as a marriage without love. It's just an arrangement for one person to leech financially off another person.

EDIT: You're not married? WTF are you waiting for? Maybe she needs a more masculine approach i.e. "**** me or **** you". Or maybe she's not the woman for you.

Ah.. I know all the theory of red-pill ****... but reality is I'm highly educated, was an international athlete, now coach, have all that "alpha-male" **** to my detriment... never beg as in begging(some misunderstood), I meant I've argued the point again and again...

Strangely... i'm possibly anarchist in viewpoint, and so actually respect and listen to her opinions...

so why do I stay... one word... children. I'm the only provider financially... Realistically, having been divorced with a kid involved.. I know... the truth, the idea of bi-nuclear families is a fallacy, when the new partners come in, the old ones are detrimental to harmony... and we all put kids first!

My insistent involvement with my eldest probably made my partner insecure (not my fault for being a Dad) but, I can understand the mental dynamics... the ex and children V the new "fling"...

And is that not a natural insecurity for a new partner in such a situation?

And hey.. its complex, and hey.. I totally agree without sex its just an "arrangement for one person to leech financially off another person."

njs030

NEhope wrote: »

Thanks Colser!

Its a disaster.. she's from mainland Europe... and so the legal issue of kids, day to day custody, and kidnapping /removal from state comes into play... complex or what??? My understanding is that she will most likely gain day to day custody but wont be allowed leave the state without my consent which wont be happening. I want to be able to speak to my boys later in life, and I'm not too great with languages unless I live somewhere for about a year... when her family visits, despite the lads not having a word of her language they all speak it (they all have fluent English) and fair enough... I'm glad they can be comfortable.. but maybe it's just me, but in situations where I've been which are multi-lingual, out of consideration, people adopted the language everyone knew.. at one time french.. but I digress...

Anyway, I like your idea of publicly proclaiming the separation whilst having to live together... isn't that exactly whats been going on?

If you aren't married it changes the situation quite a lot.

Do you have legal guardianship of your children? An unmarried father has very little rights to his children if he separates from their mother if she chooses not to let him see them so before you rock the boat too much I'd suggest you get those important things sorted out.
See a solicitor first and foremost if you don't have all the legal issues relating to your children tied up properly.

Neyite

judeboy101 wrote: »

Op, convert to Islam or LDS and bring home a sister-wife (preferably young and willing). You don't have to legally marry new wife just do so in eyes of your new religion.

Mod:

judeboy101 banned for this post.

Posts in this forum need to be helpful, constructive and civil. Trolling or taking the piss out of someone's issue is NOT permitted.

nikkibikki

notjustsweet wrote:

Do you have legal guardianship of your children? An unmarried father has very little rights to his children if he separates from their mother if she chooses not to let him see them so before you rock the boat too much I'd suggest you get those important things sorted out. See a solicitor first and foremost if you don't have all the legal issues relating to your children tied up properly.

Yep was just about to suggest this too. Make sure asap, before you do anything else, that you have guardianship of the kids.

...And Justice

NEhope wrote: »

I don't think it a long term solution, I can forsee emotional issues in a threeway...

But yea... I totally understand... if you asked me 10-15 years ago, I'd have a different opinion, isn't it easy for the inexperienced to adopt a moral high ground?

The guy I work with is in his late 40's, has two grown up children and for the sake of keeping the family together, he gets the bit on the side. His wife told him that she wasn't going to have sex anymore, so that is the deal. I'm not sure whether she's aware of what he gets up to or that she's that silly to think that he'll be fine living his life for the next 40 years without sticking it in anywhere. I'd be the same as him tbh.

The Princess Bride

Longwinded reply but anyway.

Unfortunately OP, if you have a relationship outside your current one, you'll be labelled as a cheat.
Few people would take the time to consider that you've been in an unbalanced relationship and are frustrated, they'd merely see that you acted on impulse and would most likely look on your partner with sympathetic eyes, "poor her and he being unfaithful."

I agree with the other posters who've advised you to seek legal advice re: your guardianship of your children.
Do so tomorrow.
Also don't assume that she'd automatically get custody if you separate-every situation is different.

I have a few male friends who are in sexless marriages, the only reason they're staying put is for the children.
While I acknowledge why they stay, some day their children will move on and then what happens to their own relationship?

For what it's worth, many of us posting here have left unhappy marriages and survived and so have our children.
And we had the doubts as to whether we could do it.
But we did and are the better and are happier as a result.

Life is more important than merely putting up with hassle and misery and frustration.
Best of luck.

NEhope

nikkibikki wrote: »

Yep was just about to suggest this too. Make sure asap, before you do anything else, that you have guardianship of the kids.

Law changed back in 2015 I think...

After January 2017 once the father lives with his child for 3 months post birth he's automatically a guardian, marriage not required.

Or something like that... I'm well aware of the legal position, my 6 year divorce only concluded a few years ago... somethings you never forget... all that family law stuff.

Appreciate the thoughtful replies though!

NEhope

The Princess Bride wrote: »

Longwinded reply but anyway.

Unfortunately OP, if you have a relationship outside your current one, you'll be labelled as a cheat.
Few people would take the time to consider that you've been in an unbalanced relationship and are frustrated, they'd merely see that you acted on impulse and would most likely look on your partner with sympathetic eyes, "poor her and he being unfaithful."

I agree with the other posters who've advised you to seek legal advice re: your guardianship of your children.
Do so tomorrow.
Also don't assume that she'd automatically get custody if you separate-every situation is different.

I have a few male friends who are in sexless marriages, the only reason they're staying put is for the children.
While I acknowledge why they stay, some day their children will move on and then what happens to their own relationship?

For what it's worth, many of us posting here have left unhappy marriages and survived and so have our children.
And we had the doubts as to whether we could do it.
But we did and are the better and are happier as a result.

Life is more important than merely putting up with hassle and misery and frustration.
Best of luck.

This will be my second time through the mill regarding access etc... My eyes are wide open. Thanks though.

I hear what you and others are saying about cheating... and I guess unless I find someone of the opposite sex in a similar situation complications could well arise, and even then, emotions are volatile things.

It leaves the hollowness of one-night stands... which probably lacks the acceptance, closeness and bonding that I'm probably really seeking from my partner. Isn't that what sexual intimacy really means?

Still... any port in a storm?

Interesting that my OP left off questioning whether anyone recovered from a prolonged sexless period in their relationship... and so far there's not much that contradicts my gut feeling on the matter.

The Princess Bride

You've not said what ages your children are.

If you have a fling/affair/one nighter and your children find out, they will (probably) be too young to understand how daddy had needs.
They would be told-possibly- that daddy left mammy for another woman.
They won't be told that daddy was unhappy because mammy didn't want sex at all.

I'm trying to simplify it not to insult you here, but that ^^ is as real as it gets for young children.

I have one pal who was similar to you and he had an affair.
But he stopped it when the woman wanted more.
So now he sleeps beside his wife who no longer is sexually attracted to him.
His youngest child is still primary school and he loves his children so won't leave wife.
He's also said that if by some miracle she turned to him and initiated sex, he'd probably refuse because he's so used to being ignored-he's only late 40s so still young.
So yeah, he is putting up and shutting up, but while I admire his love for his children, I couldn't stay unhappily married - I left an unhappy marriage and am glad I did.

You've been there before, why is it so much more difficult this time around?

rcarroll

if you're worried about getting access to the kids if you seperate, would it not be more likely if you had a relatively amicable separation rather than the sh*tstorm that could happen if she found out you were having an affair? It's a perfect weapon to use to prevent access - most people would side with her regardless of how unhappy the marriage is.

Also, I can't imagine she's happy either..perhaps it would be a release for both of you? It seems you had trouble with access to your previous children when a new partner came on the scene. I know it can be awkward and tense and difficult, but if you keep insisting on access and be fair and calm..things can be worked out in time...but it rarely runs smoothly if there's a bitter separation due to an affair rather than a breakdown in the relationship and parting ways....

NEhope

The Princess Bride wrote: »

You've been there before, why is it so much more difficult this time around?

When you've been to war you tend to do your upmost not to repeat the experience?

I guess I'm hanging on to a last hope... procrastinating, seeing if the negotiation call comes at the 11th hour? while taking a deep breath before the charge...

Ma Walton

Your original question was has anyone encountered these kinds of sexless relationships that have gone on to recover....as yet no-one has said they have.

The reality is even with kids involved you're as stuck as you want to be. You've already created the ideal scenario in your head where you're getting it elsewhere on the quiet so that relations remain cordial at home and you retain access to your younger children. So if that's your choice, and it seems to be, and you're the catch you think you are.....well go do it. You seem to enjoy the drama of the seeing what's around, the 'will I, won't I' which gives a lot of guys in your situation a thrill. Join the ranks of the many men who claim to be in the same boat as you. I'm sure plenty are, but I do wonder sometimes if the women would classify their relationships as being as sexless as the men seem to think they are.

I've inadvertently had 'flings' with two guys who claim their situation at home is like yours - dating websites/apps are littered with you! Sexless, maybe even loveless relationships, staying for the kids, wife/girlfriend at home doesn't know etc. Typically they enjoy the thrill for a little bit, then they realise that the bit on the side is an 'ordinary' woman too (as opposed to laying around in their knickers being cute and sexy full-time) and the shine wears off. Maybe there's a disagreement about a date and then she sounds just like her indoors and you're off home because 'she wanted more' when really she just wanted to know what time you were meeting on Friday. A one-night stand might seem tawdry to you and I can see you've pooh-poohed the idea but really what else have you to offer? A two night stand? A 'connection' with a married woman who isn't getting any at home? Maybe.

My point is your posts spend a great deal of time dressing this up into a literary-type drama when the point is that you're in a sexless relationship which you've elected to stay in and you're looking for sexual options outside of it.

tea and coffee

I think that's a bit unfair Ma Walton. I think he wishes it would resolve with his partner but she won't compromise on the sex.
He's worried about access to his kids.
I appreciate that there are men who intimate they're "basically broken up" and are lying. But some may genuinely be in that situation and can't/won't leave for genuine reasons.

Airyfairy12

NEhope wrote: »

When you've been to war you tend to do your upmost not to repeat the experience?

I guess I'm hanging on to a last hope... procrastinating, seeing if the negotiation call comes at the 11th hour? while taking a deep breath before the charge...

Youre being a bit dramatic. People break up all the time, its stressful, a big readjustment and nobody likes doing it but it happens.

You sound incredibly bitter towards your girlfriend. Its understandable that youd be frustrated and feel rejected but you make her sound like shes some evil, abusive partner, she's not actually doing anything to you, she just wont have sex with you which she is in her right to do just like youre in your right to leave the relationship.
You keep making excuses as to why you cant leave while simultaneously playing 'victim' and thinking up vindictive ways to teach your partner a lesson by cheating on her.

Grow up, be an adult and leave the relationship.

eviltwin

I've gone nearly a year without sex due to depression. We came through it though and all is now good. Difference with us is that we still loved each other and we were still having regular physical contact and connecting on an emotional level. We both still felt loved and knew the problem wasn't us so to speak. Not having sex isn't a problem if its a temporary issue and you work on keeping the connection, plenty of relationships have to deal with it from time to time, the thing is though, from the OP it doesn't read like there is any love there to sustain things and when love is gone you need to move on.

Having an affair might give you a bit of physical release but do you really think its going to be enough long term?

Ma Walton

tea and coffee wrote: »

I think that's a bit unfair Ma Walton. I think he wishes it would resolve with his partner but she won't compromise on the sex.
He's worried about access to his kids.
I appreciate that there are men who intimate they're "basically broken up" and are lying. But some may genuinely be in that situation and can't/won't leave for genuine reasons.

My intent wasn't to be unfair to the OP but as several other posters have outlined, he does have choices. They may not be choices he wants to take, but they are there. I don't doubt the truth of what the OP is saying about his situation, but to say there are no options other than staying and suffering or staying and playing away sells both him and his partner short.

rcarroll

Harsh Ma Walton might be, but they bring up a good point - what are you looking for and realistically what can you offer? If it's just sex, then a one night stand might work better for you. If it's a regular thing/a relationship, are you looking for a thrill or to actually connect with someone. Because connecting and building a relationship means work and bad times too. I'm not saying that what you have with your wife is a bad patch - or that you haven't worked on it as it seems like you really have and tried to go to counselling etc. But just be careful - the next relationship won't be magical and perfect, it will have problems too. Also, realistically, can you offer a relationship to someone when you're living at home with your wife? I don't know how desperate you think a woman must be to get entangled in a situation like that and be happy.....the new woman will have needs too, will want to build a relationship, not share you with someone else

bmwguy

A few of my friends were in this situation, as soon as they had been used as a sperm donor that was it. No sex anymore. Zero. None. Not a hope. Not interested.

They did the same as you want to, got a bit on the side and I don't blame them one bit. I define cheating as having sex with someone else outside your relationship, but if there is none in the relationship I can't see how it's cheating. How could it be? Cheating on who? The woman that won't sleep with you? Give me a break.

Only problem is some of these guys then found the grass greener and left altogether and are now labelled the ones at fault walking out on the family. Which I suppose they did.
There are any amount of women that want a relationship with married and separated men, so it's up to you whether you want to get into a new relationship, get a friends with benefits situation or just visit a hooker.

redfox123

Ok you've been through all this before. So I think your procrastination is that little suspicion in the back of your mind that maybe, perhaps, this is about you. Not about what you can get from anyone else. You went from a divorce to this, maybe your gut is telling you that walking away is not the answer. Couples have got through far worse than the relationship going non physical. You asking your gf for sex will do nothing. You are asking her for the end product of something that is non existent. You are objectifying her. Surprisingly she doesn't want that. There is no connection, no love, no bond. And you want sex? How does that work. Have you gone to counseling? We all have needs, and the real skill in life and relationships is digging deep into what exactly these needs are, and communicating them well. Sometimes (most often) there's a trauma there from very early that is subconscious and plays out in your attachment style and affects everything.
Before you leave I think you should try couples counseling, or to really get to the root of the issue, therapy by yourself. The answers are usually not in what you're getting from anyone outside yourself, but how you feel inside, how you feel about yourself, and unravelling a lot of confusion from years of unhealed emotional trauma. Try the counseling before moving on. I would advise this before thinking about using anyone else to fill that feeling of emptiness and disconnection, so even if you do decide to leave, your head will be clearer.

dr.fuzzenstein

The answer is no. After a few years so much resentment has built up on both sides, there is no way to get over that. I've been there.
In my case it was always tied to conditions. If I do more dishes, do more round the house and so on. And then you find you never quite have fulfilled all the conditions correctly, points deducted for leaving a work surface in the kitchen wet, not doing the hoovering correctly, sorry, not tonight.
And I tried talking about it with her, she would say "JESUS will you shut up about it already, I can't listen to it anymore".
I was told I was mentally ill and no woman would like me because of that.
Even if you don't move out now OP, at the very least move out of the bedroom NOW. That helped me a lot, because I hated lying beside the woman I now resented. Things were bad for years.
Then I found an incredible woman (or she found me) and we moved in together.
The tune from my ex changed dramatically once I told her I met someone and I was moving out. From being told I was selfish and mentally ill and I OWED her my support, she suddenly said she loved me. Well, only in the last week before moving. Before that she mentally terrorized for weeks and months. I was called every insult under the sun. But I don't ever recall her turning to me and say I love you. Ever. And that pissed me off more than anything else. I must have said it to her a million times.
Once you decide to leave, there will be threatening and pleading. The house, the kids, all will be used as bargaining chips. Not because she loves you, but because she has gotten used to an advantageous situation.
But my biggest warning, don't fall for the whole tying of sex to conditions thing. This whole idea of "if you do the dishes I'll sleep with you" is ludicrous. Either your partner desires you or she doesn't. It can't be tied to conditions and a checklist. Those are just delay tactics and designed so you seek the fault with yourself. If it's gone it's gone and it won't come back.

professore

bmwguy wrote: »

A few of my friends were in this situation, as soon as they had been used as a sperm donor that was it. No sex anymore. Zero. None. Not a hope. Not interested.

They did the same as you want to, got a bit on the side and I don't blame them one bit. I define cheating as having sex with someone else outside your relationship, but if there is none in the relationship I can't see how it's cheating. How could it be? Cheating on who? The woman that won't sleep with you? Give me a break.

Only problem is some of these guys then found the grass greener and left altogether and are now labelled the ones at fault walking out on the family. Which I suppose they did.
There are any amount of women that want a relationship with married and separated men, so it's up to you whether you want to get into a new relationship, get a friends with benefits situation or just visit a hooker.

I've heard the argument that if sex isn't important to your spouse they can't object to you getting that unimportant thing somewhere else.

professore

But my biggest warning, don't fall for the whole tying of sex to conditions thing. This whole idea of "if you do the dishes I'll sleep with you" is ludicrous. Either your partner desires you or she doesn't. It can't be tied to conditions and a checklist. Those are just delay tactics and designed so you seek the fault with yourself. If it's gone it's gone and it won't come back.

100% this. This is a textbook abusive relationship.

Airyfairy12

professore wrote: »

100% this. This is a textbook abusive relationship.

Not having sex with someone isnt abuse, would you get a grip.

the_pen_turner

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

Not having sex with someone isnt abuse, would you get a grip.

of course not but telling them you will and then don't , making the op feel bad about himself, etc could be abuse. just like controlling money is abuse so can mental torture like this

Airyfairy12

the_pen_turner wrote: »

of course not but telling them you will and then don't , making the op feel bad about himself, etc could be abuse. just like controlling money is abuse so can mental torture like this

Withholding money and withholding sex are two completely different things. I feel for the OP but this isnt abuse and suggesting it is belittles real cases of relationship abuse. He can leave the relationship if he wants to, relationships fall apart some times, such is life. Suggesting she's abusing him and mentally torturing by withholding sex is ridiculous, hes a grown man.

dr.fuzzenstein

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

Withholding money and withholding sex are two completely different things. I feel for the OP but this isnt abuse and suggesting it is belittles real cases of relationship abuse. He can leave the relationship if he wants to, relationships fall apart some times, such is life. Suggesting she's abusing him and mentally torturing by withholding sex is ridiculous, hes a grown man.

It's withholding something with the aim of controlling the other person and control their behavior. This is achieved by belittling the other person's feelings, making them feel guilty and unreasonable.
I do understand that the intent isn't always abusive, sometimes the passion just dies, but when the partner (it's not always the women that goes off sex) refuses to deal with it or insists on the relationship continuing and that there's nothing wrong and that wanting sex is somehow wrong or unreasonable, then it quickly slides into abuse.
Or are you saying that abuse is always a man hitting a woman and everything else is just men being crybabies? Because, a man hitting a woman, she can also always leave the relationship if she wants to, right?
Abuse is a situation where a partner suffers, be that mentally or physically and the other person tells them it's their fault

Airyfairy12

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

It's withholding something with the aim of controlling the other person and control their behavior. This is achieved by belittling the other person's feelings, making them feel guilty and unreasonable.
I do understand that the intent isn't always abusive, sometimes the passion just dies, but when the partner (it's not always the women that goes off sex) refuses to deal with it or insists on the relationship continuing and that there's nothing wrong and that wanting sex is somehow wrong or unreasonable, then it quickly slides into abuse.
Or are you saying that abuse is always a man hitting a woman and everything else is just men being crybabies? Because, a man hitting a woman, she can also always leave the relationship if she wants to, right?
Abuse is a situation where a partner suffers, be that mentally or physically and the other person tells them it's their fault

Where did I say that only men are abusive??? also violence is a totally different situation to withholding sex, women or men dont leave physically or emotionally abusive partners for allot reasons, like fear being one, their self esteem being destroyed from years of being bullied, and from becoming disconnected from friends and family because the abuser has destroyed their victims relationships.
This isnt abuse. Shes got every right to not have sex with him, like a man would be in his right to not have sex with his partner. Would he rather have sex with her knowing shes not into it? I wouldnt like sleeping with someone, partner or otherwise, knowing they didnt want to be there. Sex is mutual.

She's not withholding sex to control him, youve created an imaginary situation. she's not abusing him. I feel for him, its frustrating and I bet he feels like sh!t but its not abuse. Lots of couples end their relationship because of disagreements with their sex lives, it happens.

njs030

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

She's not withholding sex to control him, youve created an imaginary situation. she's not abusing him. I feel for him, its frustrating and I bet he feels like sh!t but its not abuse. Lots of couples end their relationship because of disagreements with their sex lives, it happens.

She is however saying she won't have a sexual relationship with him, won't try to work on her issues but won't allow him to have one with anyone else and that is control.

LegacyUser

I think it's hard to pin down a definition of "abuse" in cases like this, but imo, withholding intimacy is abusive. Intimacy is obviously about far more than sex, but sex is a part of it.

Hell of a choice OP, good luck.

Airyfairy12

notjustsweet wrote: »

She is however saying she won't have a sexual relationship with him, won't try to work on her issues but won't allow him to have one with anyone else and that is control.

I agree that the situation is unfair and its unfair that she wont compromise but I still dont see it as abuse. Abuse implies she's gaining something from depriving him of sex, it doesnt sound like she's intentionally trying to hurt or control him, she wants a sexless relationship, he doesnt. Neither are wrong, theyre just sexually incompatible .

leggo

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

I agree that the situation is unfair and its unfair that she wont compromise but I still dont see it as abuse. Abuse implies she's gaining something from depriving him of sex, it doesnt sound like she's intentionally trying to hurt or control him, she wants a sexless relationship, he doesnt. Neither are wrong, theyre just sexually incompatible .

The part about not wanting him to sleep with other people is the part where she's trying to control him. So now he's not 'allowed' have sex, at all.

When the word 'controlling' gets brought up here, people always lock in on whether it's intentional or not. The point is that it doesn't have to be. You don't have any right to control another adult's life in any way, so you can choose to not have sex with them, but you can't try and control whether they just aren't allowed have sex anymore. It doesn't matter whether it's intentional, the affect on the victim is the same, so intent is irrelevant.