Proposal to lower motorway limits to 110.

bear1

Well fook this:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/motorists-may-have-to-drive-slower-on-motorways-under-climate-plan-1.3159387

Billions spent on motorways and now we may well end up having to drive just slightly over an N-road limit.
Instead of reducing the speed limit, how about actually sorting out public transport.
Limerick/Galway/Cork, what sort of adequate public transport have they? Never mind those that live rurally.
Gob****es of the highest order.
They mention the eletrification of the Balbriggan line, why not then explore the options of electrifying all rail lines connecting major cities.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Atlantic Dawn

I think it's a crazy idea, it will cost millions to update all the speed signs. Would be better instead to have a public awareness campaign to tell people that driving at 100kmh or so will save 20% of fuel compared to driving at 120kmh.

The Balbriggan line is competing with the mainline to Belfast, there's not the capacity to add additional DART lines to. In addition everyone living in Malahide, Portmarnock and Clongriffin can kiss goodbye to getting space on the DART in the morning if it happens.

bear1

You could also argue that the planners refusal to start building up instead of outwards forces people into cars which then leads to tailbacks stretching for miles whereas the higher they build the less people would need cars as they already within the city.
Mind boggles at the suggestions thrown around sometimes.

Atlantic Dawn

bear1 wrote: »

You could also argue that the planners refusal to start building up instead of outwards forces people into cars which then leads to tailbacks stretching for miles whereas the higher they build the less people would need cars as they already within the city.
Mind boggles at the suggestions thrown around sometimes.

Yes and you have developers hoarding lands within the city where the transport infrastructure already exists and no penalties on them.

testicles

This post has been deleted.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

bear1

testicles wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

The money to pay for this will have to come from somewhere and where better than the cash cow which is the fellow motorist.

gammygils

Should increase N-road limit to 110

ba_barabus

Phew, not gonna make much difference without enforcement.

Move along, nothing to see here

Atlantic Dawn

In other news Santiago had snow for the first time in decades, global cooling, we should zero rate the motor tax on the V8's to warm the place up...

About two inches of snow was most common in the city, but up to 16 inches fell in parts of the region, according to the Associated Press. “Chile’s Meteorological Office said it was the biggest snowfall in the capital in 46 years,”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/capital-weather-gang/wp/2017/07/17/photos-santiago-chile-sees-most-snow-in-decades/

TherapyBoy

Global warming doesn't mean warmer weather, just more extreme weather. Both hot & cold.

Atlantic Dawn

TherapyBoy wrote: »

Global warming doesn't mean warmer weather, just more extreme weather. Both hot & cold.

It can mean whatever you want it to mean when you bankroll the scientists telling you what you want to hear.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

TherapyBoy

I have a bankroll? Screw you guys, I'm off to buy a v8!! :cool:

Atlantic Dawn

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Well with the government promotion of diesel a lot of us won't be

fancy pigeon

Marginally slower than the pre 2005 limits, but that's not the point; I can see this as being a money making exercise.

Why don't they consider staggering school times even further? I'm getting to work and back in plenty of time without having to hurry, come end of August panic starts again and we're back to gridlock... Leaving extra early/alternative routes make negligible differences in that instance

Or maybe a proper public transport system for rural commuters? Like the plans to update the Navan rail link shelved due to lack of GAA matches funds?

Or maybe educate drivers on how to save fuel/drive more efficiently when driving normally?

You're right. What would we know.

SSr0

fancy pigeon wrote: »

Or maybe educate drivers on how to save fuel/drive more efficiently when driving normally?

But I thought that the vast majority of Irish drivers do this? They all seem to love slowing down and speeding up on perfectly straight roads, for no apparent reason other than to save fuel surely?

The Rape of Lucretia

fancy pigeon wrote: »

Marginally slower than the pre 2005 limits, but that's not the point; I can see this as being a money making exercise.

Money making exercise ? How so that ?

Its a money saving exercise, and a planet saving exercise. Drive more efficiently, costs you less in fuel. Purchase less fuel, govt takes less of your money in tax. Emit less carbon, the who planet's a winner.

Some people just wanna bitch, but this move is a winner all round for the consumer. He will probably still whine, though. It what he does. Just because de gubbernmint is behind it. Even if something is good for him.

bazz26

grogi

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

I think it's a crazy idea, it will cost millions to update all the speed signs. Would be better instead to have a public awareness campaign to tell people that driving at 100kmh or so will save 20% of fuel compared to driving at 120kmh.

Millions could buy and maintain a decent electric charging network...
The effect would be much more profound that this joke of a proposition.

fancy pigeon

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Money making exercise ? How so that ?

Its a money saving exercise, and a planet saving exercise. Drive more efficiently, costs you less in fuel. Purchase less fuel, govt takes less of your money in tax. Emit less carbon, the who planet's a winner.

Some people just wanna bitch, but this move is a winner all round for the consumer. He will probably still whine, though. It what he does. Just because de gubbernmint is behind it. Even if something is good for him.

Well, allow me to share my thoughts. Bearing in mind, this is just thought and not forced opinion like a lot of people like to assume

Speed limit goes down, everyone who keeps well above the limit will be penalized more so... Yes?

Slower limits may also entice those to go on single carriage roads in the view it will be quicker, thus policing it more and more people caught. The M3/R147 is a prime example... Possibly yes?

What if someone want's to drive 110kmh in 3rd gear? Hows that good for the consumer, the greater good? Granted highly unlikely but possible isn't it? I just thought I'd throw that in there, not that it has much to do with the main scope

I've already hinted at other aspects to look at that can't be ignored. Staggering school runs and better driver education is where I'd start personally. It's amazing what a bit more conscience to the right foot/anticipation will do under normal circumstances and with a bit of planning fuel costs on journeys come cown

But no. Lets revert to pre 2005 motorway limits without actually addressing driver behavior and traffic management. That will work, on paper it always does!

Some people just wanna patronize others, because they see themselves as do-gooders for the greater good: the consumer, the pillar of society, the smug "I told you so". Even if it's complete, utter nonsense

Cabaal

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

In other news Santiago had snow for the first time in decades, global cooling, we should zero rate the motor tax on the V8's to warm the place up...



https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/capital-weather-gang/wp/2017/07/17/photos-santiago-chile-sees-most-snow-in-decades/

It's evident you don't understand climate change,

Wibbs

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Some people just wanna bitch, but this move is a winner all round for the consumer. He will probably still whine, though. It what he does. Just because de gubbernmint is behind it. Even if something is good for him.

For me the "consumer" is the biggest word there. Consumerism is what is buggering the environment more and more. Actually want to affect the environment in a big way? Ban all new car production except for EV's. Encourage owners to hang onto their older cars for much longer. As I've said before driver A who has owned and maintained a twenty year old Toyota Corolla is being kinder to the environment than Owner B who has "upgraded" to a new car every three years in the same time period. The cost to the environment of six odd new cars is much larger. OH and he'll have saved significantly more money into the bargain. Dropping the speed limit is time and motion thinking at work and in real terms about as much use as sticking a bandaid on a shotgun wound. But it'll never happen. Too much is invested in our throwaway consumer culture with only lip service to being "green".

bear1

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Money making exercise ? How so that ?

Its a money saving exercise, and a planet saving exercise. Drive more efficiently, costs you less in fuel. Purchase less fuel, govt takes less of your money in tax. Emit less carbon, the who planet's a winner.

Some people just wanna bitch, but this move is a winner all round for the consumer. He will probably still whine, though. It what he does. Just because de gubbernmint is behind it. Even if something is good for him.

People can drive slower than the limit anyway so what difference does it make on that front?
If someone wants to drive at 120/130 then it's going to the be that person who will pay marginally more.
It's the government turning more and more into a nanny state - instead of making life harder for those that are completely reliant on the car how about improving public transport?
If rural areas or even cities were provided with much better transport options then you'd see car use would drop.

Diemos

Nearly nobody pays attention to the 120 limit, why do you think anything wll change?

stesaurus

As long as EVs are allowed to drive at more than 110 then I'm happy!

DaveyDave

In my limited experience of driving on motorways outside of Dublin, nobody sticks to 120 anyway. 130-150 seems very common and in my opinion is safe. I prefer driving on two lane motorways outside of Dublin than the likes of the M50 or the N3.

The speed limits are low enough as it. Too many roads are 50kph that should be 60. The road from Woodies in Lucan to Griffeen is 50kph, everyone including the Gardai do 60-65.

One thing I miss about driving in Orlando was doing 45mph/72kph everywhere.

If they want to make money on fines without spending money on new rules and signs how about actually enforce the 30kph limit on the Dublin north quays? Everyone doing 50-60kph, even morning rush hour if I'm cycling at 35kph a taxi will fly past...

Special Circumstances

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Well with the government promotion of diesel a lot of us won't be

SSSHHH! Don't bring him in here too!

challengemaster

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Money making exercise ? How so that ?

Its a money saving exercise, and a planet saving exercise.

In the same way that Gardaí having regular speed checks at 11pm on 3 mile long motorway stretches with unnecessary "road works" speed limit is definitely for safety purposes and not a money making exercise either.

The Rape of Lucretia

challengemaster wrote: »

In the same way that Gardaí having regular speed checks at 11pm on 3 mile long motorway stretches with unnecessary "road works" speed limit is definitely for safety purposes and not a money making exercise either.

Agree with you fully. The money making jibe some like to make is really just a conspiracy theory of the simple minded to gripe about why they arent being allowed to break the law unpenalised. The cling to the myth though, without out a shred of evidence to support it.

mikeecho

Has anyone got the text of the entire article.

Rather than jumping to conclusions having only read the opening paragraph

Vexorg

http://www.dccae.gov.ie/documents/National%20Mitigation%20Plan%202017.pdf

It's an interesting read.

frozenfrozen

first impressions:

how much money was spent pissed away on this lovely looking pdf?

bear1

Still maintain there are far more things the government could do than lowering speed limits.

fancy pigeon

bear1 wrote: »

Still maintain there are far more things the government could do than lowering speed limits.

We'll all end up back with red flags again at this rate

georgefalls

Staggering school runs, brings up an interesting question:

Why are the schools closed for months during the summer, and open all during the winter, when the heating bills must be enormous..?

Closing the schools for the winter, would not only reduce the carbon footprint, but save a feckin' fortune..!

Wanderer78

Holidays in winter, that would kinna suck

....actually wouldnt homes need to heated to keep the kids warm while on winter holidays?

K.Flyer

Typical government answer to a problem, screw the motorists over again with more inane rules.
Maybe they should go look at some of the real causes of Global Warming and deal with them accordingly.
Cow emissions more damaging to the planet than cars!

AndyBoBandy

DaveyDave wrote: »

how about actually enforce the 30kph limit on the Dublin north quays? Everyone doing 50-60kph, even morning rush hour if I'm cycling at 35kph a taxi will fly past...

Complaining about breaking the speed limit while admitting you break it yourself....

There's your problem.

Wanderer78

K.Flyer wrote:

Typical government answer to a problem, screw the motorists over again with more inane rules. Maybe they should go look at some of the real causes of Global Warming and deal with them accordingly.

As noam chomsky says about these matters, it's deep institutional change that's required to tackle these issues, you'd have to wonder, are we actually capable of doing that?

coolisin

I've no problem with this, if they think this will save the envoirment!
It shows they've no idea its all about the money end of.

i'm more worried about throwing this out as a headline while distracting the fact they are going to screw everyone over with a massive motor-tax hike.
There was no way 2008's motor tax policy could be sustained, I'm more concerned about the cc bands.

georgefalls

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Holidays in winter, that would kinna suck

....actually wouldnt homes need to heated to keep the kids warm while on winter holidays?

Do kids go away on holiday for all the summer then..? Maybe a week or two, tops. Might as well be at school the rest of the time, while the days are long and less accidents happen due to rain and snow in the winter.

I'd say its cheaper to heat a lot of smaller homes, than it is to heat massive open classrooms in a school.

Vexorg

If you have a look at the Mitigation document, it is just one of 24 proposals up for consideration under the "decabonising transport" category, electricity generation and build environment have many proposals also. Carbon neutral Agriculture, forestry and land use is in there as well.

The document has a very wide scope and given how far off Ireland is from meeting its emissions targets, it is not surprising that a speed reduction was identified as a way use less fuel and lower emissions. It is unlikely to adopted short term for a number of reasons, some outlined in the document, one being a "step change in speed enforcement".

Other proposals include reduction of public parking, the emerging role of the sharing economy in vehicle ownership (could this be something like uber?, a grant scheme to educate drivers of HGVs and Buses to encourage eco-driving, carbon taxes, review of motor tax and vrt and many more.

fancy pigeon

georgefalls wrote: »

Staggering school runs, brings up an interesting question:

Why are the schools closed for months during the summer, and open all during the winter, when the heating bills must be enormous..?

Closing the schools for the winter, would not only reduce the carbon footprint, but save a feckin' fortune..!

It's to do with olden times in America, the childers would work on the farm during the summer months and harvest at the start of autumn.

They tried all year round schools, but nobody in that scenario was pleased with that.

Procrastination brings one to strange reading material

djan

Another example of the government attempting to give the public a perception of them doing something. Consumer vehicles count for extremely little in the grand scheme of global pollution, we are talking sub 3%, so considering how much money is wasted on all this, it is extremely inefficient.

Lowering limits, increasing speeding fines, emmision tax and road tax changes all just stink of a money making scheme as the useless co2 emmision rates which favour diesels (not to mention their hugely carcinogenous pollutants) and are not bringing in nearly as much as the cc days.

If the true aim is to better the environment, a clearly better solution is to develop the cleanest viable source that we as a civilization have, nuclear energy. Due to Ireland's low heavy industry economy, a single plant with 2 reactors would suffice and have some left to sell off to make profits. The initial high construction costs would be covered within 7-10 years and then for the next 30ish years its a goldmine. This would allow for the use of electric vehicles throughout Ireland and would generally be a win win situation. Of course, first, there would have to be lots of campaigning done to educate the "look at what happened at chernobyl gang"...

Sam Kade

TherapyBoy wrote: »

Global warming doesn't mean warmer weather, just more extreme weather. Both hot & cold.

That's the reason they changed it to climate change :rolleyes:

Special Circumstances

Sam Kade wrote: »

That's the reason they changed it to climate change :rolleyes:

It's still warmer on average everywhere, even when it's colder.
If we could fit cows with VW developed defeat devices then they could pass stricter emissions testing and save the planet.

Wanderer78

georgefalls wrote: »

Do kids go away on holiday for all the summer then..? Maybe a week or two, tops. Might as well be at school the rest of the time, while the days are long and less accidents happen due to rain and snow in the winter.

I'd say its cheaper to heat a lot of smaller homes, than it is to heat massive open classrooms in a school.

should we have schools('educational' factories) at all!

VeVeX

The most logical route soon will be to drive without tax, insurance, a license and speed everywhere.

hi5

Special Circumstances wrote: »

It's still warmer on average everywhere, even when it's colder.
If we could fit cows with VW developed defeat devices then they could pass stricter emissions testing and save the planet.

Whilst on the subject, adding seaweed to cows diets could go a lot further in helping the environment than reducing the speed limits.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/seaweed-shown-to-reduce-99-methane-from-cattle-1.3156975