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FF and FG want to cut speaking time for independents and small parties to allow...

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    #32
    For Reals
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,964 ✭✭✭For Reals


    Thankfully we've people making statements not on the FF/FG agenda. For smaller parties and individuals the Dail is the best place for them to speak out/have a voice. That's very important for a healthy democracy. If you're a large party with money and media behind you, I can see people having the platform of the Dail as a problem.


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    #33
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,194 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    For Reals wrote: »
    .
    People might hear something they like and help rid us of the civil war see-saw.

    If people vote for the "civil war see-saw" as you call it (is that an abusive term and forbidden?), then what is wrong with that?

    Are you one of those who believes democracy is only right if it gives the right result?


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    #34
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,194 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    For Reals wrote: »
    Maybe they've something important to say? The whole suggestion smacks of protectionism, the big two griping tighter on the throat of our democracy, like they need to. I'd suggest different views get equal time. Worse case scenario some Indy says something and it adds nothing. Best case scenario some Indy points out an issue of national importance the big two are trying to ignore. Well worth it. The only argument for this move is administrative, but not the goal, censorship is the goal, IMO.

    Would you agree that Senator Ronan Mullen should get half of the time for any debate on abortion in the Oireachtas as he is the only pro-life Senator or TD?

    Should a speaker for ISIS get equal time? Or the Church of Scientology get time as well? These are minority viewpoints but different. If you just want different views to be heard, why not ignore the electorate completely and bring in whoever holds a different view to the debate.

    FG and FF should get most of the speaking time because the people (you know the electorate) have voted to give them the most speaking time through electing their TDs.


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    #35
    foxtrot101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 907 ✭✭✭foxtrot101


    The Independent Alliance, who just so happen to be propping up FG, aren't going to countenance this for a second. It's not going to happen. Just a bit of silly season nonsense.


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    #36
    For Reals
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,964 ✭✭✭For Reals


    blanch152 wrote: »
    If people vote for the "civil war see-saw" as you call it (is that an abusive term and forbidden?), then what is wrong with that?

    Are you one of those who believes democracy is only right if it gives the right result?

    I can only post my opinion. I believe FF/FG are not doing a good job. I believe the 'go to' of all apologist supporters is 'no other option'. So it's important we hear all sides equally.
    In regard to 'see-saw' it refers to one in, the other out and vice versa since the inception of the state, (civil war era). I can't see any issue there, feel free to flag.
    blanch152 wrote: »
    Would you agree that Senator Ronan Mullen should get half of the time for any debate on abortion in the Oireachtas as he is the only pro-life Senator or TD?

    Should a speaker for ISIS get equal time? Or the Church of Scientology get time as well? These are minority viewpoints but different. If you just want different views to be heard, why not ignore the electorate completely and bring in whoever holds a different view to the debate.

    FG and FF should get most of the speaking time because the people (you know the electorate) have voted to give them the most speaking time through electing their TDs.

    If there's an argument, we should hear all elected sides on it, right?

    I disagree. As explained. We don't require several TD's coming out with the same line. That's a waste of everybody's time.


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    #37
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    blanch152 wrote:
    FG and FF should get most of the speaking time because the people (you know the electorate) have voted to give them the most speaking time through electing their TDs.


    Why so basically every member can parrot what has been said by the previous FF/FG speaker?


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    #38
    Ronaldinho
    Registered Users Posts: 829 ✭✭✭Ronaldinho


    I would lean towards FG myself but I think this idea stinks.

    I might not agree with very many of the policies of the marginal parties/independents but I think at least they can go some way towards keeping FG/FF 'honest'.


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    #39
    expectationlost
    Registered Users Posts: 11,753 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    foxtrot101 wrote: »
    The Independent Alliance, who just so happen to be propping up FG, aren't going to countenance this for a second. It's not going to happen. Just a bit of silly season nonsense.

    The Independent Alliance don't really need it at the moment, Halligan has used "bachbencher" speaking time a couple of times but otherwise they have access to gov.

    I don't understand why you would call silly season story, the new Taoiseach mentioned it (disingenuously) in his first Dail speech.

    anyway the chief gov whip says it been "agreed" http://www.donegaldaily.com/2017/07/16/44-pieces-of-legislation-expected-to-pass-before-end-of-july/

    although the whip often says it been agreed when he means pushed through. not sure if its gone through the admin commmittees and it would need a standing order motion too.


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    #40
    expectationlost
    Registered Users Posts: 11,753 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    they are going back to having the Dail and committees on at the same time supposedly giving that time to back benchers, rather then 'reducing time smaller parties get' http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/despite-public-anger-its-too-late-to-tidy-up-our-dishevelled-tds-ceann-comhairle-35983093.html
    a compromise has been reached whereby nobody will lose time but the larger parties will have extra speaking opportunities.
    Fine Gael, Fianna F and Sinn F are to get more time during debates, meaning the D may have to sit longer. "So without anybody losing any time and having regard to proportionality, the bigger party blocks will get more time," he confirmed.
    but this is reducing time smaller parties get compared to larger parties.


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