Pacquiao/Conlan/Povetkin/Shambles of a Sky Card Thread

Morrison J

Surely tonight is the night Pacquiao gets that long awaited stoppage? Horn looks quite wrecklessly open from what I've seen of him.

Robert Easter got a joke of a decision last night apparently against Shafikov. 120-108 scorecards when there was a round in it at most. Julian Williams back to winning ways too.

walshb

Sky card stacked tonight..

Can't take Povetkin seriously anymore.

At least your global superstar is on later..

PeterTheNinth

What's on Sky, the Matchroom Summertime Brawl?

Looks like a very weak card. I think Hearn was hoping to get a few bigger names.

Morrison J

walshb wrote: »

At least your global superstar is on later..

Fighting in front of millions on ESPN in his third pro fight. Not bad.

Morrison J

PeterTheNinth wrote: »

What's on Sky, the Matchroom Summertime Brawl?

Looks like a very weak card. I think Hearn was hoping to get a few bigger names.

Aye it's a York Hall standard show put on in the O2. Awful.

BT delivering far better shows than Sky this year.

normanoffside

Povetkin not as powerful when off the steroids

Morrison J

Buatsi looks a bit small for a light heavy to me.

Joeseph Balls

pac_man wrote: »

Buglioni is always in a war. He just doesn't move his head.

What you making of the fight?

Burial.

normanoffside wrote: »

Povetkin not as powerful when off the steroids

Seemed to not be as energetic and as much of a stamina machine as the post Wlad/pre test fail version was either. C**t!

Dick phelan

This sky card is shocking fair for prime time saturday night, nothing of any interest on the card at all. Povetkin fcuk him couldn't care less about the guy proven drug cheat have no interest in his career anymore. Pacquiao should stop Horn but don't think he will, he's clearly just going through the motions at this stage expect him to win wide on points. The undercard isn't great either although i like Ancajas interested in seeing him again and of course nice to follow Conlan's progress.

Joeseph Balls

pac_man wrote: »

Only switched it on at fourth round and noticed he's going toe-to-toe, blocking punches with his head. He trained in Dublin for a while and was the exact same. Nothing has changed.

I know nothing of this other guy, seems to have little power

Morrison J

pac_man wrote: »

Whats the story with Povetkin? Did he a fail drug test and if so, why are certain sanctioning bodies allowing him to fight? Always thought he would be the fighter that would cause Joshua the most problems but didn't see the fight this evening.

Failed two tests didn't he? Fury is suspended but hasn't been convicted of a doping offence. Povetkin fights away despite failing two tests. Doesn't add up at all. Probably some Russian brown envelopes involved.

normanoffside

pac_man wrote: »

Whats the story with Povetkin? Did he a fail drug test and if so, why are certain sanctioning bodies allowing him to fight? Always thought he would be the fighter that would cause Joshua the most problems but didn't see the fight this evening.

Failed 2 tests afaik, got off on a technicality on the first; banned by WBC on the second. WBC ban doesn't seem to apply to other bodies :rolleyes:

Joeseph Balls

Morrison J wrote: »

Failed two tests didn't he? Fury is suspended but hasn't been convicted of a doping offence. Povetkin fights away despite failing two tests. Doesn't add up at all. Probably some Russian brown envelopes involved.

Did he not fail a test for a recently banned substance, but on the b he passed, raising questions that he took it before the ban came into play? Something like that Russian tennis player, whatever she's called.

normanoffside

Joeseph Balls wrote: »

Did he not fail a test for a recently banned substance, but on the b he passed, raising questions that he took it before the ban came into play? Something like that Russian tennis player, whatever she's called.

Yes, meldonium (a stamina drug)- the same drug that Sharapova was done for and he got let off on that one but he failed a second test for Ostrsnine on the eve of his WBC elimintor with Stiverne: https://www.rt.com/sport/379342-alexander-povetkin-banned-indefinitely/

It's pretty clear he didn't look half as ripped tonight as he did in recent fights and his power was lacking.
I agree it's pretty shambolic that the WBC ban him and not other organisations. Rudenko was WBC silver champion coming into tonight but his belts was not on the line.

Eyes Down Field

Anyone have an idea what time to expect Conlon in the ring and Pacquiao?

Joeseph Balls

Eyes Down Field wrote: »

Anyone have an idea what time to expect Conlon in the ring and Pacquiao?

I think coverage is starting on my telly in 5 mins, but I'm not watching sky. Don't know how far up the card Mick conlan is
Sorry it starts 1am

Morrison J

Eyes Down Field wrote: »

Anyone have an idea what time to expect Conlon in the ring and Pacquiao?

Approx 3am apparently. Wouldn't be surprised if it was a bit earlier.

DVD-Lots

Mosley Jnr in the ring now, Conlon on after this one.

tinpib

Walking to the ring now.

Morrison J

Conlan in the ring.

Morrison J

Another awful opponent with no intention of exchanging. Conlan a bit sloppy again chasing down a negative fighter but decent finish after hurting him to the body.

Like to see a slight step up next if possible. Just someone who'll at least try mix it with him instead of coming to survive. No point in rushing him all the same though.

Absoluvely

Holy ****

Copper_pipe

117-111 was a mad score to have it I thought

Eyes Down Field

Fair play to Horn. But that was really all over the place, scrappy, brawling, dirty, heads, elbows, etc... Really unpleasant to watch, I'll take a Mayweather masterclass of precision and technical brilliance over a backyard scrap like that anytime.

ricero

Dont understand the hype around conlon

EagererBeaver

ricero wrote: »

Dont understand the hype around conlon

He's Irish.

Eyes Down Field

The US media seem convinced that Pacquiao was robbed, some suggesting the fight was fixed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnMypPCBRqE

ASOT

I taught 115-113 was fair enough but theres mass outrage all over any post on social media. Pac simply wasnt busy enough bar rounds 8 & 9. It did look like he could finish it at any time but didnt bother.

Eyes Down Field

The level of Manny Pacquiao felatio on ESPN today is downright pornographic.

titan18

Whatever about the 115-113 score, the 117-111 one is crazy. I don't see any justification for that at all.

Even with the 115-113 scores, I don't really get it as Pacquiao was clearly the better fighter to me, but a few rounds had not much happen so if you swing them to Horn for aggression, it's understandable.

Pacquiao said he'll take the rematch and I hope if he wins that, he retires. He's nowhere near the same boxer he was, doesn't have the power anymore - especially in this weight class and is just getting slower. He needs to hang the gloves up tbh

StringerBell

A joke of a decision in the Pacman fight, credit to him for being gracious in defeat but a poor decision no less. He really needs to start putting these guys away or just retire, can't keep letting it go to the judges when they can be so unpredictable.

blade1

StringerBell wrote: »

A joke of a decision in the Pacman fight, credit to him for being gracious in defeat but a poor decision no less. He really needs to start putting these guys away or just retire, can't keep letting it go to the judges when they can be so unpredictable.

Was it a joke though?
I had Horn definitely winning 6 rounds and Manny definitely winning 4.
The other 2 could have went either way.
The stats probably say Manny landed a lot more punches but were most of them in the 4 rounds I had giving him?

StringerBell

blade1 wrote: »

Was it a joke though?
I had Horn definitely winning 6 rounds and Manny definitely winning 4.
The other 2 could have went either way.
The stats probably say Manny landed a lot more punches but were most of them in the 4 rounds I had giving him?

I would have to go back and check the round by round but from the top of my head I think I scored 7/8 rounds clearly for Manny, I'll do a rewatch tomorrow maybe and see.

It's a sidetrack to my real point though, which is Manny needs to stop letting these fights go the distance, he was clearly a superior fighter then Horn but just doesn't seem bothered anymore.

Maybe he doesn't care about the losses, even the last round which I scored for Horn I was expecting him to just stay away and protect (what I assumed was) his comfortable lead, thinking the only way Horn could win was a KO, which seemed to be his thinking too as he gave it his all.

snowflaker

https://twitter.com/trboxing/status/881512811381145600

Morrison J

Fell asleep after Conlan so gonna download the Manny fight tonight and catch up. Very surprised Manny lost but get the impression it's just another example of boxing fans being too eager to shout robbery though.

walshb

I'm 5 rds in and IMO Manny is not all that worse or better than a few years ago.

Just struggling to deal with a big and awkward and capable boxer..

blade1

walshb wrote: »

I'm 5 rds in and IMO Manny is not all that worse or better than a few years ago.

Just struggling to deal with a big and awkward and capable boxer..

How you scoring it so far walshb?

Burial.

A draw at best for Horn when I watched it, admittedly drunk and not paying laser focus to it. Bad cards it looks though. That 117-111 card is CJ Ross bad. Manny couldn't give a f*ck I'd imagine though, it means nothing to him and his legacy except it probably screws his chances of a few more paydays. Spence and Thurman will be pissing themselves laughing looking at Horn being a guy stopping unification. With Thurman's injuries and the fact he just got married Spence could have first dibs and could add a very easy belt. Makes the Thurman fight next year all the sweeter too.

walshb

blade1 wrote: »

How you scoring it so far walshb?

I rather enjoyed that fight. Yes, scrappy for a lot, but real effort and guts and commitment from both. Gruelling for both.

Manny not looking to me as past it. Just found it very tough against a bigger man who was relentless, tough, and awkward.

7-4-1

Horn 116 - Manny 113.

blade1

walshb wrote: »

I rather enjoyed that fight. Yes, scrappy for a lot, but real effort and guts and commitment from both. Gruelling for both.

Manny not looking to me as past it. Just found it very tough against a bigger man who was relentless, tough, and awkward.

7-4-1

Horn 116 - Manny 113.

Yeah, fairly similar to me but I gave 2 rounds drawn which I wouldn't complain if either man got.
If you take rounds 8 and 9 out, I didn't see Horn in any trouble from Pac.
Only thing that was a worry was had he enough in the gas tank to go the distance.

Morrison J

Watched it there. Pacquiao looked gun shy a lot of the time, unwilling to pull the trigger, Horn was the aggressor even if a lot of it was ineffective aggression. Have it to Pacquiao but never a robbery, plenty of swing rounds. Horn did the better work early but gassed late and his output dropped fairly significantly. Good fight though. A smart, fresh fighter like Spence times Horn with a counter and makes easy work of him. No doubt he's awkward though.

RD1-Horn
2-Pac
3-Horn
4-Horn
5-Pac
6-Horn
7-Pac
8-Pac
9-Pac
10-Horn
11-Pac
12-Pac

115-113 Pac

walshb

I thought Pac fought his ass off, and let his hands go plenty. Just not able to really get an effective rhythm against a big and awkward and disjointed type of fighter.

Manny, as I said many times has next to no inside game, and that kind of showed up the other night. Horn used angles and sideways movement when attacking, and before Manny knew it Horn was up close and using his size and strength to bully the clearly smaller Manny.

Manny can look tremendous against methodical and predictable opponents, or stationary type fighters. Allow his to let his rapid fire combinations go and land. But against a thinker and mover and disjointed boxer he can look a little lost, as well as quite reckless and wild.

walshb

BTW, I'd expect Thurman and Spence to destroy Horn...

walshb

blade1 wrote: »

Yeah, fairly similar to me but I gave 2 rounds drawn which I wouldn't complain if either man got.
If you take rounds 8 and 9 out, I didn't see Horn in any trouble from Pac.
Only thing that was a worry was had he enough in the gas tank to go the distance.

Agreed. A few rds could have went either way.

As for the point about Horn being in trouble....

I read a comment here about Manny being able to take him out whenever he wanted...That is just flat out untrue..

Manny was fighting his ass off simply trying to compete and win.

There was one rd, I think rd 8 or 9 where Manny was dominating, but that was it, and even then a lot of his shots were missing and falling short.

walshb

pac_man wrote: »

Anyone score that round 10-8 ,think it was either the 8th or 9th?

Tempted to, but no. Horn was firing back, and Manny was missing a fair bit.

walshb

pac_man wrote: »

Yeah I was the same. The key for me was that he landed something back.

I loved the fact that when the ref warned him that he was close to stopping the fight after that round, that he went out and won the next round.

Indeed. The rd took a lot out of Manny...

I scored the last rd to Horn.

Some of the moaning online as regards the scores is bewildering. 117-111 looks wide, but several rds could have went either way, hence scores could be anything for any man.

Morrison J

walshb wrote: »

I thought Pac fought his ass off, and let his hands go plenty. Just not able to really get an effective rhythm against a big and awkward and disjointed type of fighter.

Horn was awkward but still so open coming forward. So many opportunities for Pacquaio to counter with the left but he wouldn't let it go. He also completely avoided going to the body which was just strange given Horn's head movement. That was nowhere near a classic Pacquiao performance. Time for him to retire for me. If he was to fight Crawford he'd get knocked out. Don't want to see that.

walshb

Morrison J wrote: »

Horn was awkward but still so open coming forward. So many opportunities for Pacquaio to counter with the left but he wouldn't let it go. He also completely avoided going to the body which was just strange given Horn's head movement. That was nowhere near a classic Pacquiao performance. Time for him to retire for me. If he was to fight Crawford he'd get knocked out. Don't want to see that.

He threw plenty to everywhere. Picking instances like you have here is a little off. He threw every shot in his arsenal. It was one of his busiest ever fights.

The facts are that Horn being that much bigger, as well as being physically imposing and awkward, it was going to interfere with Manny a fair bit, and it did.

Manny was mauled and mugged of the win by a relentless and tough man...

I also felt that Manny's actual hand speed was very good. Big issue was he was missing more because Horn was taller and bigger and all over the place in terms of movement. All wrong for Manny in that sense.

One shot that seemed to let Manny down more than any was the right hook counter over Horn's left jab. Didn't throw it that much and was missing it, again because he had to overextend it to compensate for Horn's height and arm reach. It just didn't work for Manny like it did vs. the lower positioned type fighters like Cotto and Hatton.

Morrison J

walshb wrote: »

He threw plenty to everywhere. Picking instances like you have here is a little off. He threw every shot in his arsenal. It was one of his busiest ever fights.

The facts are that Horn being that much bigger, as well as being physically imposing and awkward, it was going to interfere with Manny a fair bit, and it did.

Manny was mauled and mugged of the win by a relentless and tough man...

I also felt that Manny's actual hand speed was very good. Big issue was he was missing more because Horn was taller and bigger and all over the place in terms of movement. All wrong for Manny in that sense.

One shot that seemed to let Manny down more than any was the right hook counter over Horn's left jab. Didn't throw it that much and was missing it, again because he had to overextend it to compensate for Horn's height and arm reach. It just didn't work for Manny like it did vs. the lower positioned type fighters like Cotto and Hatton.

Not picking instances when it's applicable to 12 rounds of boxing. His feet looked slower than ever to me. No use of angles. The Pacquiao of the past shifts his feet and times Horn with a counter coming in. Seemed way slower to react on Saturday and more hesitant when in his prime those punches flowed naturally.

No denying that Horn was awkward for him. I agree with all your points there but there's much more to it than that imo. 22 years a pro for Pacquiao and I think it's finally caught up with him despite the fact I think he won the fight.

walshb

Morrison J wrote: »

Not picking instances when it's applicable to 12 rounds of boxing. His feet looked slower than ever to me. No use of angles. The Pacquiao of the past shifts his feet and times Horn with a counter coming in. Seemed way slower to react on Saturday and more hesitant when in his prime those punches flowed naturally.

No denying that Horn was awkward for him. I agree with all your points there but there's much more to it than that imo. 22 years a pro for Pacquiao and I think it's finally caught up with him despite the fact I think he won the fight.

You could be right. I just felt that Horn was the type of dude that didn't allow Manny to look as good as he was in the past.

BTW, Manny did shift the feet, did time Horn time and time again, but he couldn't stop him in his tracks. That was the issue. Horn being awkward, big and tough was the main reason for that. Manny landed plenty of shots that he was landing several years ago.

Your saying it was a little slower and not as good as years gone by is a bit off in my opinion. I didn't see it like that.

Tell you one thing, Manny's gas tank was as good as ever! Almost better, all things considered.