What is the solution here?

LegacyUser

Hi all.

I am looking for advice please, as I am in quite a complicated situation at the moment. I will try synopsise it as best I can. I am 30 and Irish. My girlfriend is 31 and non-European (Venezuelan to be precise).

We are going out together nearly 12 months, although the last two months have been pretty rocky to say the least, including more than one break-up (I'll get to this).

Essentially, we love each other very much, but cannot come to an agreement with regards how to proceed in our relationship from this point.

A bit of background: she has a degree, as well as plenty of career experience in her home country. However, despite having a good CV, and applying for close to 100 jobs here, she cannot even get an interview, let alone a job, for something in her field. This is mainly due to restrictions on her visa at the moment, which make it close to impossible for her to get a "career job", if you want to call it that.

At present, she is studying for a degree full-time, as well as working part-time in a local bar. This is very frustrating for her, as she is over-qualified for the job she is in, and has to serve rude customers on a regular basis. This set-up also means she works extremely unsocial hours, including most weekends (Friday and Saturday nights) when everyone else is off. Due to her frustrations with this life, our relationship has become extremely strained lately.

If we were to get married, this would solve the visa issue, and she would probably get a job in her field as a result. However, I have several reservations about this, namely: we don't even live together, 11 to 12 months is a very short time-frame before getting married, and basically I am not sure I am 'ready' to be married. I believe marriage is something you need to be 100% sure about, and there are too many question marks at this current time.

I have suggested living together first, and for her to complete her degree (which would take another two years). Although we spend a lot of time with each other at present, we would then be able to see how we get along in a cohabiting environment. We could subsequently even look at getting the required stamp as a result of said cohabiting, as opposed to the marriage route. I feel this is a very logical solution to the issue, although not ideal from her point of view, as she is the one, and not me, who has to continue her current lifestyle struggling with money and working unsocial hours, etc.

Another possible solution I suggested was for her to do a Masters in September and, although the year would be very taxing on her, she would then be able to get a "career job" in 12 months time. The Masters would cost €10,000, but I offered to give her a loan of half of that (€5,000). The idea would be she would repay me once she got proper full-time employment. She considered this initially, but now says it's not an avenue she wants to take. To be fair, I have done a Masters myself, and know how intense it is. I think a Masters, in a language that isn't her native, as well as working part-time, would probably be too much of an ask on her.

A third solution would be for her to continue with her degree. This is my preferred option, I think. The degree would cost €4,000 per year. I have offered to pay as much as I can of this (not a loan this time, but as in, I would actually pay and not get back). I'm not in a position to cover the entire €4,000 without taking out a loan myself, but said I would pay at least €2,000. She said she thinks I should pay the full amount. Asking me to to pay entire €4,000 is a bit excessive, is it not? She has said if I pay the entire €4,000 she would probably continue the course.

But moving on, she is pushing the marriage route as she says she cannot go on living like a student at her age, not even for another year or two. However, for reasons outlined above, this is not a route I am prepared to go down at this stage of the relationship. It's basically a non-runner as far as I'm concerned. If the relationship has to end because of this, then so be it.

At this point, you may (possibly) be getting a bad picture of her, so for what it's worth it, and you may question this, she is actually a lovely girl, genuinely loves me and wants the relationship to work. (Even for arguments sake, let's just assume this to be the case). This, however, in her view, is the best solution to the predicament. She was going out with an Irish guy previous to me who wanted to marry her, but she didn't, as she did not love him. The relationship ended and then we met not long after.

I really don't want to lose her but that's what's going to be the inevitable outcome - and soon - if we cannot come to an agreement on this. The reality is that she will be snapped up by someone else pretty much instantly, as she is a very good looking girl, kind, good personality, etc. We also have similar interests and get along really well apart from this (albeit major) issue.

Me, on the on other hand... Time is a healer, and I have no doubt that, despite being initially devastated, I would eventually get over this (hopefully). However, I don't want her to be the "one that got away" as such. Or alternatively, a situation arising in a few months time when I (inevitably) see her out with someone else and get that sinking feeling. That would be very hard for me to swallow if I'm honest. She is beautiful, funny, kind, etc... You get the jist.

That's pretty much it. This has been a real headache for me every day for the past few months. I want to retain the relationship with her, but we cannot come to an agreement on how to go about it. So... What are people's thoughts on this situation please? What is the solution (if any)? Am I being unreasonable? Is she? Should I keep trying to make it work, or just get out of this entire thing now?

In reality, it's probably a bit of messier situation than the above would suggest, but that's the crux of it.

Thanks in advance for any feedback.

tea and coffee

If you move in together she'll be able to save more money as the bills will be split so would your initial solution not be palatable?
She's going to need to finish her degree irrespective of the situation in order to get a career job anyway, no?
Also, do you doubt the veracity of her assertion that the other guy asked her to marry.?

s15r330

Asking you to pay the lot and pushing to be married?!
Alarm bells should be going off and you've obviously heard them or you wouldn't be here.

This story is almost word for word what happened to a friend of mine, with a Venezuelan girl too funnily enough.

She wanted to go to college but he had to pay, she had all these qualifications she couldn't use, made him buy her a car and insure it etc.

Turned out she had no qualifications at all and was caught out with her lies. When she cleaned him out and saw no more money coming she took off, just disappeared.

I'd think very carefully about my next steps if I were you.

If people are willing to risk their lives to get to Europe you'd be surprised what some people may do to stay here.

Sarn

I think you are approaching this quite sensibly. You have been seeing each other for less than 12 months, the last two have been rocky and you have broken up a few times, all of this without you having lived together. While the situation is difficult, based on the above issues, getting married is not the answer. Living together first would be the first step and then take it from there. As pointed out above, this would ease the monetary side of things and give you time to check compatibility further before considering marriage. IMO getting over visa issues is not a good reason to rush into marriage.

Airyfairy12

Its ridiculous to expect you to fund her education and push you into a marriage, she's being very unreasonable. Youve suggested moving in together which would be a huge release for her financially and assuming you did get married youd be moving in together anyway so cohabiting at this stage shouldn't be an issue. Marriage is not the solution here, it will create more problems and if you decided to get divorced- which is likely as you hardly know each other, its not even been 12 months and you already have big problems in the relationship - This would only cause you bigger problems in the long run.

You say she's good looking and funny with a 'good personality' but tbh these are shallow qualities and not grounds for marriage or signing your life away/funding her education. Its not even been a year and she's demanding you fund her education and get married knowing you dont want to..that doesnt sound very kind in my opinion, she wont even meet you half way, its what she wants or nothing at all.

Most people who go to college and dont have financial supports either take out a student loan, work to save up the money or work throughout their degree but she's expecting you to give her a free ride. Her situation sounds very frustrating but surely she would have done the research regarding visa's and working in Europe. Its hard enough for Irish graduates to get a job in their degree subject never mind a non EU citizen without a proper Visa. She needs to take a bit of responsibility here and not drag you down to get her needs met. Im sure she loves you but regardless of that fact she's attempting to use you as a means to an end which is a major red flag despite how lovely and kind she appears to be now.

Id really be putting my foot down, youre scared that if you dont do what she wants, she'll leave you.. that doesnt sound like love to me. If she really does love you she'll compromise on a situation that suits you both.

Aspadeaspade

Definitely alarm bells would be ringing for me with this girl. You haven't been together that long, you've had a reasonably rocky relationship.. You're pressuring yourself to lend her money, a very generous amount might I add, plus marry her to solve her problems? I have lots of experience with South Americans and don't want to generalise but the majority of them only have 'visa' and 'money' at the forefront of their minds. Please don't be taken for a mug and find out if she's genuine about you first, which I have a feeling she's not.. bear in mind they come from very different cultures to us, a lot of hardship where their priorities are very different to ours.. best of luck OP

s15r330

Aspadeaspade wrote: »

Definitely alarm bells would be ringing for me with this girl. You haven't been together that long, you've had a reasonably rocky relationship.. You're pressuring yourself to lend her money, a very generous amount might I add, plus marry her to solve her problems? I have lots of experience with South Americans and don't want to generalise but the majority of them only have 'visa' and 'money' at the forefront of their minds. Please don't be taken for a mug and find out if she's genuine about you first, which I have a feeling she's not.. bear in mind they come from very different cultures to us, a lot of hardship where their priorities are very different to ours.. best of luck OP

I wasn't going to say the South American bit but you're right. I know of 2 lads who were with them, the 2 lads didn't know each other but the background story these separate women told them was word for word.

Had qualifications, both were "administrators" back home but they couldn't work here.
Both needed to go to college here but couldn't pay themselves.
I could go on. Seems to be a running theme.

A friend was meeting a Brazilian girl here, she had a visa and good job etc. There is a certain pub on Harcourt street frequented by South American women, this girl told my friend they all want visas to stay, they are actively looking for Irish men for this purpose. This coming from one of their own.

rcarroll

If she was an average looking Irish girl, would you still think it's cool to get married a year into the relationship, without living together first, and pay for her to go to college? My brother had the same story - dated a south american, desperate to get married after 9mths dating, refused to live together as 'in her culture it's not respectable', wanted him to support her through college bla bla...long story short, when he refused to get married she jumped ship. A good friend from the same country (Brazil) told me that it's perfectly fine to live together before getting married, it was just a line she used.

Look, I get it, she's in a foreign country, financially it's tough..but she decided to come here, knowing that visa's and cash would be a problem...why? Because it's a better deal than where she was. So sorry, having been in her position (without visa problems), suck it up and find a way out of your problems without relying on a guy to pay for you, because that's what she's doing. You even offered a very decent solution to the visa issue by living together. If you want to be the sucker that pays for sex, fine, but don't confuse that with loyalty or love, who's to say she won't bail once she has her college sorted out, or that she even finishes college after you paying for it...

zoobizoo

Get married because you really want to, not because it's a good idea.

As for thinking "she'll get snapped up quickly" - well, if she is that invested in you, that won't happen. She'll look at one of the solutions that you have provided and work with that.


As for the "she was seeing an IRish guy who wanted to marry her because she did not love him", having read the above posts, I'd query how true that is... maybe she tried something similar on him and he told her to get lost.

LegacyUser

Hi again all.

Many thanks for your feedback - I really, really appreciate it.

I have re-read my original post, and yes, she does come across quite callous in it. While I do feel she is definitely being unreasonable here (I wouldn't be posting otherwise), she probably isn't as bad as that post makes out. Anyway, I think I need to provide further details for a little bit more perspective.

tea and coffee wrote: »

If you move in together she'll be able to save more money as the bills will be split so would your initial solution not be palatable?
She's going to need to finish her degree irrespective of the situation in order to get a career job anyway, no?
Also, do you doubt the veracity of her assertion that the other guy asked her to marry.?

Cheers for your feedback. He was trying to get her back for months after the break-up. He said he was going to propose to her more than once. I have seen evidence, put it that way.

The marriage idea only came into her head in March. Basically, a girl in her class in college is getting married to an Irish guy after approx. 15 months of going out together. This girl has now basically stopped going to classes and will be able get a job here in due course, because of then having the required stamp (she has a degree in her home country). Also, within the last while, a second girl she knows got engaged after three months to an Irish guy, while a third girl got *married* after three months. Each time this happens, she gets upset and takes it out on me. Which is completely unfair. We could be out having a good time, and she will see a post on her social media in relation to same, and this will set her off so to speak, for the rest of the day. I mean, three months... I had to bite my tongue at that one. I told her to come back to me in five years and see how those relationships play out. She says at least they would tried and have done something to help someone they love.

Her attitude is essentially, "if all these people can do it for a person they love, why can't I?" I get how it's upsetting for her seeing people she knows taking the easy way out, or a quick-fix solution, but it's not for me unfortunately. Way too much risk. She also thinks I am in a small minority of people who wouldn't get married in this situation. Most of her friends have taken her side as well on this, and think I'm the 'bad guy' here. I just have to laugh at times. I told her that she can give me examples of people who are getting married, but that I am very confident the vast, vast majority of people in my position would not go down this route. One year going out including break-ups, don't even live together. She can't get this into her head. She genuinely believes I'm the excpetion to the rule here. I've given up trying to convince her otherwise.

She sees marriage as "just a piece of paper". I tell her it's a lot more than that. It's a legally binding contract. Even if I agreed to it personally, my family wouldn't stand for it. So, to emphasise: I'm in a complicated enough relationship here, but I am not completely naive: marriage is not happening at this point. I think it's clear to see that would be a very stupid thing for me to do right now.

Therefore, at this stage, she has reluctantly "accepted" that we won't be going down the marriage route. I say "accepted", because she knows that it's a non-runner, but she keeps bringing it up in conversation, which leads to her getting upset and angry. It's the same argument over and over again. On repeat. Currently, I would say it gets brought up pretty much every day. This is something that will need to stop if the relationship is to have any chance, as, despite being an extremely patient person, I cannot keep going around in circles on this having the same conversation a thousand times. She simply can not understand my point of view. Needless to say, she is the one who is always provoking the arguments. I am a very laid-back guy, whereas she, on the hand, is very emotional. Maybe that's a cultural thing.

Aspadeaspade wrote: »

Definitely alarm bells would be ringing for me with this girl. You haven't been together that long, you've had a reasonably rocky relationship.. You're pressuring yourself to lend her money, a very generous amount might I add, plus marry her to solve her problems? I have lots of experience with South Americans and don't want to generalise but the majority of them only have 'visa' and 'money' at the forefront of their minds. Please don't be taken for a mug and find out if she's genuine about you first, which I have a feeling she's not.. bear in mind they come from very different cultures to us, a lot of hardship where their priorities are very different to ours.. best of luck OP

Yep, I completely get why you say alarm bells should be ringing. If I was an outsider reading my original post, "alarm bells" or "red flags" would be the words coming to mind too. I think she shouldn't be putting this pressure on me, a person she says she loves, but, despite all this, I am confident her love for me is genuine. If I wasn't sure of that, I would have pulled the plug a long time ago on this.

To the poster who said: "She's going to need to finish her degree irrespective of the situation" - yes, this is a good point, and is true. However, she says she is so disappointed in me as a result of all this that, if she was to stay and continue her degree, she would likely have to do so without me as she couldn't look at me the same way anymore. However, when push comes to shove, she doesn't seem to be able to leave me.

Also, just to point out: she could go back to her home country in the morning and get a good job there. She had a decent way of life there before leaving for Ireland. However, despite being fed up here right now, being broke all the time and working crazy hours, she doesn't want to return home as she prefers living here to South America.

At this moment, the most likely way this will play out, is for her to continue with her degree in September. The question is whether that will be with or without me. She has said many times in the past that she doesn't feel "safe with me", that I can't do things for her, or look after her, etc. When she is angry, she will say things like she needs a man at this point in her life, a more mature person than me, and that I am immature for my age. She has said if the situations were reversed she would do everything in her power to help me.

I get that we are in a serious relationship, and, as I am in a more comfortable position than her, that I should help her to an extent. In relation to the course, the fee is €4,000 for next year as previously stated. I said I would contribute as much as I can to this. I think me paying around €2,000 is more than fair to be honest. I don't have €4,000 just laying around that I can just give to her (if I did, I would). I have a decent paying job, I would say average for a qualified person my age, but living where I am is expensive and rent is high, etc. It's difficult to save as a result. She could probably get the other €2,000 from her parents back home but doesn't want to ask them, as they basically think she should come home to them permanently seeing as she is no unhappy here. She has tried to get out a loan herself, but was refused - I think because she has a loan out at the moment already, which she is currently in the process of repaying to get through year one of her degree.

While happy to help her, I don't think it's my responsibility to pull the full whack of her education. As another poster said, who is to say in 12 months time the relationship still even exists?

In conclusion, I would be prepared to move in with her at this point and see how that goes. It is an infinitely more logical next step. I would be paying about two-thirds of the rent if so. I am also prepared to contribute to her education, as it is a serious relationship and I do love her. I think approx €2000, or as much as I can, is a reasonable amount. I could maybe do a little more, but the full amount is a bit unfair. I feel she should ask her parents, regardless of whether they want her here or not. And also save as much as she can herself.

Thoughts people?

LegacyUser

zoobizoo wrote: »

Get married because you really want to, not because it's a good idea.

As for thinking "she'll get snapped up quickly" - well, if she is that invested in you, that won't happen. She'll look at one of the solutions that you have provided and work with that.

This is very true, I completely agree. If a situation arose where the relationship ended and she quickly moved onto someone else, then I will most certainly bear this point in mind and would write the whole thing off as a 'wasn't meant be'.

Cheers.

The Princess Bride

She was going out with an Irish guy previous to me who wanted to marry her, but she didn't, as she did not love him. The relationship ended and then we met not long after.

Are you sure about this?
Could it be the other way around, that he wouldn't marry her and he left her?

She's 31, less than a year going out with you, and has been suggesting marriage since March.
What is her excuse for not being financially more secure until now?

I think you might be blindsided by her good looks etc...
Bottom line, she's putting you under pressure in a relationship which you say yourself, has been rocky of late.

OP you're only 30, there's no rush, let her off with herself to do whatever.
But don't let her continue to make you feel responsible because her life choices have placed her exactly where she doesn't wanna be right now.
You deserve better, don't you think?

Loveinapril

You seem like a really nice fella but despite how lovely your girlfriend is, she is emotionally blackmailing you. You are together less than a year, and you are thinking about essentially giving her €2,000. It sounds like she feels like you should fix all of her problems by marrying her and paying for her education. Would you deal with this nonsense from an Irish girlfriend or are you giving her allowances due to the cultural differences? It is horrible that she is trying to coerce you by telling you of all of these stories about great Irish lads marrying their foreign girlfriends. She is trying to guilt trip you and that is just unacceptable.

rcarroll

" She had a decent way of life there before leaving for Ireland. However, despite being fed up here right now, being broke all the time and working crazy hours, she doesn't want to return home as she prefers living here to South America."

Have you not watched the news? Or talked to any other Venezualans? There country is a mess at the moment, people getting shot on the street, the people are angry, hungry, broke and rioting...seriously what the honest to god....even if you didn't know what was going on there and did for one second believe she had a better life.....who would prefer being broke all the time, working crazy hours?????

She is emotionally abusing you by arguing with you every day hoping to grind you down and wear you out until you submit to her drive to get married. As for her absolute bat-**** crazy logic of "all my friends are getting married so why can't you"...all her friends are a very narrow subsection of society - a group of people that need and are desperate for visas..I'd be careful that her view of normal is coming from that.

It shows very little love for you to keep pushing for marriage knowing you're (rightly) seeing it as a ploy for a visa. She's willing to argue with you every day over it, with all the stress that puts on both of you. She's happy to have you feel bad, to put you down as not man enough, to convince you that you 'don't truely love her', to challenge your loyalty to her, to compare you to other men....I honestly don't know where to even begin with this.... I wouldn't be moving in, or paying for a penny until she proves she actually values the relationship, and supports and loves YOU and not the visa you can bring.

zoobizoo

Those comments about "not being safe with you" and "not being able to look after" her are things you don't want to hear and are not warranted.. It's not up to you to be her saviour.


YOU DID NOT CAUSE THIS SITUATION AND IT'S NOT UP TO YOU TO SOLVE IT

You've offered her a few solutions. If she's bringing it up daily, how is that ever going to stop being brought up? If you thnk about when you started going out with her, had you considered marriage and if so, at what age? As in, "I'll meet a girl, we'll go out for 4 years, get engaged and get married two years later....." so maybe by 36?


If it was me, I'd bail, take some time off and start dating someone who can live and work in the country.

How many months of the 12 months have been hassle? Just re read the OP.
You're not even together a year and for two months it has been rocky. So you've had nine months or so of a normal relationship... hardly any time at all.

s15r330

alec12345 wrote: »

Also, just to point out: she could go back to her home country in the morning and get a good job there. She had a decent way of life there before leaving for Ireland. However, despite being fed up here right now, being broke all the time and working crazy hours, she doesn't want to return home as she prefers living here to South America.

This is gas, she's filling you with lies, as the above poster said, Venezuela is in bits, i'd say you coudn't pay her to go back!!!

She is desperate to stay here and i'd put money on the fact that if she doesn't get what she wants from you she'll be gone to the next sucker.

Bambi985

TBH it sounds like she's been influenced by a culture of South American women making mugs of Irish men for a visa and thinks she should be entitled to the same.

Your instincts are dead right on this. I wouldn't marry someone either without being very, very sure that our relationship was on solid ground and we can be equal partners in the relationship and you've got neither of these things here. You've got a pretty girl blackmailing you and using every weapon in her armour to get you to do something you don't want to do.

So what if she's good-looking and kind and looks good on your arm. Can you build a life with those things? Don't think so, not one where your needs and your feelings come into the equation anyway. You'll spend your life bank-rolling and placating this one if you give in now. You're dead right that she'll probably latch onto the next Irish eejit that looks her way and rope him into the same situation if you let her go. With a bit of distance and perspective that won't so much hurt as it will feel like a bullet dodged.

leggo

I'm so so glad that marriage is a red line issue for you OP. One day, people are going to look back on a generation of Irish men who were totally blown away by these beautiful South American girls and ended up getting conned out of thousands on college expenses and agreeing to sham marriages for the sake of visas. Don't be one of them. I even think you're mental to be paying for her college tbh, that's insanity...on what planet is that your responsibility less than a year into this relationship?!

I get that you want to think this beautiful girl is besotted with you and isn't like this, and who's to say she isn't, it's just that all the evidence says she's clearly going for this con too. Like, how are you writing down some of the stuff she's telling you and not twigging the basis lies, like "she could do so well for herself in her (war torn) country". Just Google Venezuela and realise right there that your girlfriend is selling you a pretty basic pony like.

I understand you're probably over the moon right now with this relationship and aren't going to listen to people telling you stuff you don't want to hear, but your instincts are doing the same. Listen to them. You didn't end up posting here by accident. If she truly does love you, she'll stick around in spite of you not marrying her. If she doesn't, then be proud you didn't cave and were smart enough to see past the charms of a beautiful woman telling you what you want to hear if she eventually walks, many men don't.

MissShihTzu

OP - just how much do you know about this lady and her situation? You've only been together a year, and already she wants a ring?

How much do you know about the situation in Venezuela? You do know despite the oil, they are broke? There's no jobs there even for the educated classes. So her assertion that she could walk into a good job there is bull, frankly. The situation there is volatile and very violent. People with money (what's left of it) are legging it as fast as they can to the Caribbean, Brazil and surrounding countries to get away from all the ****. If they can afford it, they flee further afield like the US and Canada. I have to say Ireland is a new one to me. There's a big South American community in the Elephant and Walworth in London where I'm from, but don't know too much about the community here, so can't comment. But you have to ask yourself - Why is she here otherwise?

Not being funny, are you sure all is well with her visa? Doesn't sound like it to me, if she's in such a hurry to get married.

I'm English of Caribbean descent, and see this all the time. Trust me this script ain't new. I can practically call her next move!

Move in together, that's logical. But she has to pay her own way. How about you pay the rent, and she the bills? But marriage? No way, no how. Not until you've been together for a while (years!) and know what you're dealing with.

Hope it works for you, whatever you decide

Yellow pack crisps

So she is disappointed in a guy who wants to move in with her, pay more, offer To pay half her tuition on a no repayment basis, a guy who is looking and bending over backwards to help and be open to helping in any way he can. And she is disappointed! Yep great catch you have there! What exactly did she bring to your relationship. She is emotionally blackmailing the **** out of you and that is not what a loving partner does, an adult deals with their own problems and of course seeks support from a SO but not to the detriment of forcing them into things. Oh her friends agree and think of you as the bad guy eh? No your partner does. You say she is kind. A kind person does not act like this. You're a mark regardless of whether you feel like one.

dellas1979

When I was your age, and still for years after, I had this very "romantic" view of life and relationships. I used to become totally disconnected, i.e., I had this idealistic view of people, because I myself am good natured. I couldnt see the reality of someone or situations.

I'd see the best in everyone. Id "help" people I was in relationships, to a fault.

I still have that quality. And always will. But time (and experience) has weaned the "dreaming" part out of me, and firmly planted my head and thoughts in reality. Ive learned to help only people who deserve it (especially in massive emotional and financial situations like this). Who I know. And who Im confident with.

I think you need to get your head out of the clouds and see this situation and her in reality. Am not saying she is out to con you. I dont know.

But, you always need to evaluate what someone's motivation is from them wanting something from you.

She is thinking of herself, and her situation. She is not thinking of you. And that is a huge warning sign. If she continues like this, the attractiveness you feel for her will fade.

I would find it sad and loose respect for someone who is only thinking of themselves, seeing me as their solution for visas and money and their education and work situation. Thats massive on you!

She is a grown woman, who isnt taking responsibility for her situation. In my head, that would freak me out. And self protection mode would (now) be on. I am to solve her problems?

LegacyUser

Hi All.

OP here again. I first of all want to thank you all once more for your very helpful advice so far. I'm going to read all the posts again shortly, to ensure the advice properly sinks in. Sometimes, as I'm the one embroiled in the situation, and hearing the same things from her every day, I actually start to doubt myself at times. I think things like, "Am I actually doing something wrong here?"... "Maybe she's right"... "Maybe I'm not doing enough here to make her stay and this to work"... All of her friends naturally take her side (for the most part), but I've spoken to my friends about it too. I gave them an honest assessment and they assure me I'm being completely reasonable. Your posts are also particularly helpful in this respect, so thank you.

I want to point out a couple of more things, if I may. A lot of people are jumping on the whole 'Venezuelan' situation. I should clarify this point: she was born Venezuela but her father is from Brazil. She moved to Brazil at an early age, and this is where she was educated and worked previously. When she says "return home", she means back to Brazil. However, I get the jist of what you are saying, and the crux of your points on this largely remain the same.

Ok. A lot of other posters also query some of the other things she has told me about her background, e.g. the previous guy wanting to marry her, etc. Again, I completely understand these concerns. However, without sounding naive, I don't have much doubt about whether what she is telling me is true. I really don't. I know this girl twelve months, which is not a long time of course, but I know her family, friends and a lot of her history. I'm not saying there is zero chance of certain things being portrayed a slightly different way than the actual reality, but at the same time, I am very confident what she has told me for the most part is true.

Let's just assume it is, for argument's sake, because the problem for me, is more so how she is currently going about all of this and her ideas on how to progress the relationship from here. Things like:
- not accepting my stance on the marriage. Constantly pushing me, and pushing me, and pushing me on this on a daily basis. She sees the negative affect it is having on me and how it is beginning to take its toll, but keeps pushing. This has been going on for months at this stage.
- being out with her and having a good time. She then sees something on Instagram about another friend who is getting married. A little part of me dies inside at this point, and I ask "how long are they going out then?". I get an answer: "3 months". Huge argument ensues (I'm not even arguing, I'm more so just trying to diffuse the situation). Day over from that point anyway. In my head, I'm like, are you serious? 3 months? Farcical, to be honest.
- being portrayed as the "bad guy" in all of this by her and her friends. One friend telling her to leave me for someone who can help me, that she could do way better than me... I know full well I'm not a bad person. I would consider myself to be a good catch for a lot of people to be fair. I have a lot going for me. I don't need to listen to this nonsense from a biased, crazy friend of hers
- her telling me all the time how she can't see my point of view. She can't understand my reasons. "Just a piece of paper", etc. Same argument on repeat a thousand times.
- offering a €2,000 contribution to pay for her course. Granted, she was angry already at this point, but the response was not a "thanks, that would be helpful". It was, "it needs to be €4,000"

At this moment in time, the writing appears to be on the wall sadly. Just this morning is another example. She was actually off from work all weekend, and went out with her friends Saturday night. Last night, we had a nice time together chilling out. Today, upon waking up, she has to go to college and and finish an assignment due today. She then has to go to work until 3am tonight. Cue her getting angry again with her situation and taking it out on me from the moment she wakes. She says she cannot go on like this. I get it, today is a tough day for her. I completely understand this. I tell her, look, this is Monday. Pretty much no one is going to enjoy today for the most part, you just have to get through it. You had a nice weekend, etc. It doesn't matter what I say, it falls on deaf ears.

She is now telling me she wants to go back to Brazil again, and says she means it this time. She says we are done. To be honest, maybe the Brazil thing is true and we are done, maybe it isn't, but I have heard this so many times that I barely take notice any more. (She recently lied to me saying she had booked a one-way flight to go back. It turned out a few days later that she hadn't - she was just seeing how I would react.) So yeah, this is it for the day again now. Texts will come in throughout. What can I do to resolve this, apart from getting married? I'm not sure. The following advice is going off in my head right now:

zoobizoo wrote: »

Those comments about "not being safe with you" and "not being able to look after" her are things you don't want to hear and are not warranted.. It's not up to you to be her saviour.

YOU DID NOT CAUSE THIS SITUATION AND IT'S NOT UP TO YOU TO SOLVE IT

I did not make her come to Ireland. She says I am the main reason that she is still here, and I am prepared to help her as I love her, but her outlook on the situation is so wrong in my opinion. It's all being laid on me. It's just not right.

So yeah. Maybe going back home might not be a bad idea for her, as she is clearly so unhappy here. I think it's only a matter of time before the break-up becomes a permanent one to be honest. She may stay in Ireland, she may not... I don't really know any more.

All this being said, I would potentially contribute towards her college (€2,000) as I do want to help her, but I think any more is too much unfortunately. Her parents or herself should be contributing the rest in my view. However, if this was indeed to happen (unlikely, as I type this), then she would seriously need to change her attitude, and drop the marriage tantrums. I don't think these will stop any time soon though, if I'm being truly honest.

I realise again that I am probably painting a bad picture of her here. When she is not like this, she is a lovely person, she honestly is. She helps me out in many ways herself, and is a good person. However, it's getting to the point where this is all becoming too much for me, and I have just about had as much as I can take.

It's very sad in a way because, if she was from here, I believe she would be the one I would settle down with. She has said many times she wants nothing more than for this work out, and for us to build a family together, etc. You can tell me I'm crazy, but she means this. She has a good heart underneath all this but she's being very unreasonable in her expectations on me.

People fight all the time, but this is different. I don't believe a relationship at this point (11 or 12 months in) should be so intense and stressful.

I'm trying my best here, but I'm not sure it's going to work.

If any one as has any further contributions to make, I would appreciate it. If not, thanks for listening

LegacyUser

Yellow pack crisps wrote: »

So she is disappointed in a guy who wants to move in with her, pay more, offer To pay half her tuition on a no repayment basis, a guy who is looking and bending over backwards to help and be open to helping in any way he can. And she is disappointed! Yep great catch you have there! What exactly did she bring to your relationship. She is emotionally blackmailing the **** out of you and that is not what a loving partner does, an adult deals with their own problems and of course seeks support from a SO but not to the detriment of forcing them into things. Oh her friends agree and think of you as the bad guy eh? No your partner does. You say she is kind. A kind person does not act like this. You're a mark regardless of whether you feel like one.

Cheers. I agree with everything you are saying to be honest. If a friend of mine was telling me this story, I know what advice I would be telling them.

I think I need to take my head out of the clouds here and accept the sad reality.

LegacyUser

dellas1979 wrote: »

When I was your age, and still for years after, I had this very "romantic" view of life and relationships. I used to become totally disconnected, i.e., I had this idealistic view of people, because I myself am good natured. I couldnt see the reality of someone or situations.

I'd see the best in everyone. Id "help" people I was in relationships, to a fault.

I still have that quality. And always will. But time (and experience) has weaned the "dreaming" part out of me, and firmly planted my head and thoughts in reality. Ive learned to help only people who deserve it (especially in massive emotional and financial situations like this). Who I know. And who Im confident with.

I think you need to get your head out of the clouds and see this situation and her in reality. Am not saying she is out to con you. I dont know.

But, you always need to evaluate what someone's motivation is from them wanting something from you.

She is thinking of herself, and her situation. She is not thinking of you. And that is a huge warning sign. If she continues like this, the attractiveness you feel for her will fade.

I would find it sad and loose respect for someone who is only thinking of themselves, seeing me as their solution for visas and money and their education and work situation. Thats massive on you!

She is a grown woman, who isnt taking responsibility for her situation. In my head, that would freak me out. And self protection mode would (now) be on. I am to solve her problems?

Hi OP,

By reading your post, I feel obliged to reply as this is a very clear cut case of her using you for immigration/green card purposes. Sorry to be blunt, but it is what it is.

This is why I would be very hesitant to get involved with someone who does not have a permission to stay in country beside 'student visa'. Also I would be very wary of her 'getting pregnant' accidently.. Just a thought, I personally know few people who have done this to gain the right to stay here when gf/bf didn't want to marry them.

Sometimes it's a hard pill to swallow, but I wish you the best and hope things work out for the better:)

silverharp

alec12345 wrote: »

I really don't want to lose her but that's what's going to be the inevitable outcome - and soon - if we cannot come to an agreement on this. The reality is that she will be snapped up by someone else pretty much instantly, as she is a very good looking girl, kind, good personality, etc. We also have similar interests and get along really well apart from this (albeit major) issue.

Me, on the on other hand... Time is a healer, and I have no doubt that, despite being initially devastated, I would eventually get over this (hopefully). However, I don't want her to be the "one that got away" as such. Or alternatively, a situation arising in a few months time when I (inevitably) see her out with someone else and get that sinking feeling. That would be very hard for me to swallow if I'm honest. She is beautiful, funny, kind, etc... You get the jist.

I think you have her on a bit of a pedestal, you say she would be snapped up, lets say sure for the purposes of dating but the next guy would face the same issues a year down the road. She is in her 30's and sounds quite desperate and she played her hand. In reality her market is a 40 something or a divorced well off 50 year old who can afford to subsidise her.

LegacyUser

dellas1979 wrote: »

When I was your age, and still for years after, I had this very "romantic" view of life and relationships. I used to become totally disconnected, i.e., I had this idealistic view of people, because I myself am good natured. I couldnt see the reality of someone or situations.

I'd see the best in everyone. Id "help" people I was in relationships, to a fault.

I still have that quality. And always will. But time (and experience) has weaned the "dreaming" part out of me, and firmly planted my head and thoughts in reality. Ive learned to help only people who deserve it (especially in massive emotional and financial situations like this). Who I know. And who Im confident with.

I think you need to get your head out of the clouds and see this situation and her in reality. Am not saying she is out to con you. I dont know.

But, you always need to evaluate what someone's motivation is from them wanting something from you.

She is thinking of herself, and her situation. She is not thinking of you. And that is a huge warning sign. If she continues like this, the attractiveness you feel for her will fade.

I would find it sad and loose respect for someone who is only thinking of themselves, seeing me as their solution for visas and money and their education and work situation. Thats massive on you!

She is a grown woman, who isnt taking responsibility for her situation. In my head, that would freak me out. And self protection mode would (now) be on. I am to solve her problems?

OP here again.

Thanks for your post. I will take what you have said on board.

I know deep-down what the right thing to do here is (walk away). I believe I have possibly been putting this off before now for a couple of reasons. I.e. Silly, negative thoughts of, "oh, I won't meet someone this good looking again" - completely shallow of course. Or, the thoughts of seeing her with someone else and how hard this would be to take.

In reality, when I think rationally, I know I should view it as something that just wasn't meant to be. Something that I tried to make work, but was put under unfair pressure and unrealistic expectations. I will, touch wood, meet someone in future myself who I am more compatible with. I know if she loved me as much as she says, she would continue her degree or Masters, and/or move in together first. Find a way to make it work basically.

If she decides to stay in Ireland and, hypothetically, in a few months' time, I'm single and see her out with a new guy, I should just think "best of luck to that guy". There may be a happy exterior but I will know all is not as rosy as it seems.

I am very likely to look back on all this in future and think "what the f*ck was I even thinking to tolerate this up until now?"

To summise, I was fine before this relationship started and, should it end (which is looking inevitable at this point), I know, after an initial grieving period, that I will be fine after it too.

Cheers again.

PokeHerKing

s15r330 wrote:

A friend was meeting a Brazilian girl here, she had a visa and good job etc. There is a certain pub on Harcourt street frequented by South American women, this girl told my friend they all want visas to stay, they are actively looking for Irish men for this purpose. This coming from one of their own.

What's the name of this pub?

Asking for a friend..

suicide_circus

leggo wrote: »

I'm so so glad that marriage is a red line issue for you OP. One day, people are going to look back on a generation of Irish men who were totally blown away by these beautiful South American girls and ended up getting conned out of thousands on college expenses and agreeing to sham marriages for the sake of visas. Don't be one of them.

Not just beautiful South American girls either, I know three separate gay irish guys who have had remarkably speedy marriages to south american lads, one has gone sour already.

OP, go with your gut here. You are offering perfectly sensible arrangements which she is not happy with. Nobody gets married these days without cohabiting first because it's just madness. A marriage rushed is a marriage regretted. She might be a good person but she is using you here and you know it.

suicide_circus

PokeHerKing wrote: »

What's the name of this pub?

Asking for a friend..

Diceys

ManOfMystery

I have to agree with everyone else OP. This stinks to high heaven. What would she do if she was single? It's much too early in your relationship to be making big loans never mind get married or similar. Major alarm bells.

You say she's a lovely girl etc, but her actions and attitude here are questionable. Real life isn't like a Hollywood film; those people who are using us and manipulating us aren't caught off-camera cackling and rubbing their hands whilst coming up with new and awful schemes. In real life they can extremely nice, extremely pleasant, and extremely lovely to the extent that some even hoodwink their own families who have known them for years. That doesn't change the fact that they have an agenda. The only way to spot that agenda is usually by their actions, despite whatever reasons and cover stories they come up with.

Look at the big picture here.

s15r330

suicide_circus wrote: »

Diceys

That's the one!

leggo

ManOfMystery wrote: »

You say she's a lovely girl etc, but her actions and attitude here are questionable. Real life isn't like a Hollywood film; those people who are using us and manipulating us aren't caught off-camera cackling and rubbing their hands whilst coming up with new and awful schemes. In real life they can extremely nice, extremely pleasant, and extremely lovely to the extent that some even hoodwink their own families who have known them for years. That doesn't change the fact that they have an agenda. The only way to spot that agenda is usually by their actions, despite whatever reasons and cover stories they come up with.

Look at the big picture here.

To add to this: someone can genuinely love you and use/manipulate the **** out of you at the same time. It's not black and white at all. So just because you think she's kind and genuinely loves you...that may be so, but it doesn't mean what everyone here is saying isn't true either.

Not to mention that, in different cultures, they value attraction differently to us. We tend to look for attractiveness, connectio etc, but I remember working with one girl who told me how, in her country, the goal was to find the richest man possible to look after them and how the woman would look after him then in other ways too. No sense of irony or apologies, this was her culture and she was proud of it. She told me how her friend got lucky and married a guy in his 60's who spoils her and "will die soon so she'll get all his money". Her and her friends were all jealous of this. She'd laugh when I brought up stuff like fancying a guy, good conversation/connection/sex etc, she saw it all as naive things kids may value, like a princess dreaming of a prince.

You can be this girl's patsy if you want OP, we all end up making choices and compromises in what we want and I don't particularly judge lads who decide to give up 'true love' in favour of having a gorgeous girl on his arm who sees him as a wallet. But that doesn't sound like what you want.

LegacyUser

Your with this Venezuelan woman for less than 12 months. She is pushing you to get married so she can get a better visa and so you can sort out her money issues. Sorry their is no other way of putting this. The truth is you have offered to help her pay for college and to move in with her where you will pay 2/3 of the rent and most of the bills also.

I know some non national woman who can spot a nice guy and can find out very quickly what they have to offer ie good job, savings, a nice house ect. They then tell the man what he wants to hear and keep him happy in bed. Their eye is on the main prize of getting married/pregnant to stay here long term.

At this stage there are so many red flags here with her I would think of ending things with her. It not your job to pay for her college along with her rent and bills. The truth is you have offered her a great deal here for now but she is still on about getting married. Your right in not rushing into getting married as it is a big step. You want to marry someone who loves you and not someone who sees you as a meal ticket.

If you told your parents or some close friends what she wanted I know they would tell you to end things with her.

If you give her the €2,000 for her fees you need to be aware she won't give you this money back.
Also if you move in with her and pay 2/3 of the rent and bills your not going to be able to save much money so long term you end up putting your own plans on hold due to a lack of cash.

At this stage I would tell her that you have though about moving in with her but you have decided your not going to do this. Tell her I don't want to hear about getting married the whole time and you don't want to get her hopes up in regards to a marriage as your still paying off the loans you took out for college.
Tell her that you can't afford to get married for a few years.

My feeling is that she is just using you and once she hears the above she will end things.
If she does this just be thankful and be glad you got away from her before you end up losing money or end up in an unhappy marriage.

LegacyUser

I know this Irish man who had a few relationships with non national woman. He would not be regarded as a good looking man and he is a few stone overweight. However he owns his own home, has a good job and savings. In other words all box's were ticked off for his girlfriends.
One thing all these ladies had in common was a least one of the following: kid/kids/partner or husband living abroad, a lack of money, here on student visa or had issues with visa's, family that needed money abroad and living in a place with cheaper rent which were normally horrible or in a bad areas.

He became single for a while and one night him and a friend of mine hooked up. She is Irish and a lovely woman with no baggage and no kids. Him and her were friends for a few years before this happened. He told her he did not want a relationship with her but they stayed friends after this and became **** buddies for a while. My friend give him some advice back then and he refused to listen to her.

He then went on to meet another non national woman and blocked my friend on fb. She then heard that he had a new girlfriend. Within 14 months this woman was living in his house and had a baby with him. This baby may or may not be his.
His girlfriend would not mention his weight to him even though she knows he is very overweight and has health issues.

My friend saw him recently and said that he has put on more weight, has got very old looking and she figures it is only a matter of time before he has a heart attack. My friend said it is sad that he is with someone who just see him as a meal ticket and she is waiting for him to die to get her hands on his house and money.

LegacyUser

solJ21 wrote: »

From the sounds of things OP is pushing above his weight looks wise otherwise there wouldn't be a reference 'unsure of finding someone this good looking again'. There is always 'a compensation' in these type of relationships. It amazes me when men expect their SO to be visually pleasing yet fail to acknowledge their lack of good looks. There will always be a trade off, in your case she is after finances & immigration status by what I gathered. There is no such thing as a free meal.

Sorry to be so blunt but this is life. Of course there might be exceptions, but it's rare and your case doesn't sound like one.

Hi.

I'll have to respectfully disagree on some of this

This is not a situation of me being some ugly guy who is minted or anything. It's hard to assess one's own looks. but I'd like to think I'm definitely not bad. Put it this way, if you saw us together, you wouldn't think "that lad is punching well above his weight". She is probably better looking to be fair, and has the whole exotic thing going on, but we would be an even...ish match in that department.

When I read that line 'unsure of finding someone this good looking again', it's actually cringeworthy to be honest. And not a healthy outlook. It was a silly thing for me to say.

Anyway, the latest update is that (although this has happened many times before), I think that's it. We're finished. She is not bowing down on the marriage front, and neither am I.

Very sad

s15r330

alec12345 wrote: »

Hi.

I'll have to respectfully disagree on some of this

This is not a situation of me being some ugly guy who is minted or anything. It's hard to assess one's own looks. but I'd like to think I'm definitely not bad. Put it this way, if you saw us together, you wouldn't think "that lad is punching well above his weight". She is probably better looking to be fair, and has the whole exotic thing going on, but we would be an even...ish match in that department.

When I read that line 'unsure of finding someone this good looking again', it's actually cringeworthy to be honest. And not a healthy outlook. It was a silly thing for me to say.

Anyway, the latest update is that (although this has happened many times before), I think that's it. We're finished. She is not bowing down on the marriage front, and neither am I.

Very sad

You are going to look back on this and think yourself lucky.
Consider it a bullet dodged.

solJ21

alec12345 wrote: »

Hi.

I'll have to respectfully disagree on some of this

This is not a situation of me being some ugly guy who is minted or anything. It's hard to assess one's own looks. but I'd like to think I'm definitely not bad. Put it this way, if you saw us together, you wouldn't think "that lad is punching well above his weight". She is probably better looking to be fair, and has the whole exotic thing going on, but we would be an even...ish match in that department.

When I read that line 'unsure of finding someone this good looking again', it's actually cringeworthy to be honest. And not a healthy outlook. It was a silly thing for me to say.

Anyway, the latest update is that (although this has happened many times before), I think that's it. We're finished. She is not bowing down on the marriage front, and neither am I.

Very sad

Hi OP,

I apologise for the post I made yesterday. I actually deleted it, but you somehow managed to copy & reply.
Anyway, there is always light at the end of tunnel even if it doesn't look like it now:) You made the right choice. God bless:)

Bambi985

Better for it to end now than in a few years when you're married / have kids / own a place together and it's a lot more complicated.

You're very young OP and sound like a catch so you have nothing to worry about. Let yourself wallow for a while and feel the way you feel abs you'll come out the other side with the perspective you need on the relationship

leggo

OP look at it as proof of what you've been told here. You didn't potentially offer her a marriage and visa anymore, so she ran. Maybe she's doing it as a temporary measure to try pressure you into going back on your word, but stay strong, she's telling you who she is and how she saw your relationship and accept you deserve better than that. It is sad to think that ultimately she saw a visa as part of the deal with you, but all failed relationships are lessons for the future. You'll get past this and be happy with the outcome in time, believe me.

Yellow pack crisps

alec12345 wrote: »

solJ21 wrote: »

From the sounds of things OP is pushing above his weight looks wise otherwise there wouldn't be a reference 'unsure of finding someone this good looking again'. There is always 'a compensation' in these type of relationships. It amazes me when men expect their SO to be visually pleasing yet fail to acknowledge their lack of good looks. There will always be a trade off, in your case she is after finances & immigration status by what I gathered. There is no such thing as a free meal.

Sorry to be so blunt but this is life. Of course there might be exceptions, but it's rare and your case doesn't sound like one.

Hi.

I'll have to respectfully disagree on some of this

This is not a situation of me being some ugly guy who is minted or anything. It's hard to assess one's own looks. but I'd like to think I'm definitely not bad. Put it this way, if you saw us together, you wouldn't think "that lad is punching well above his weight". She is probably better looking to be fair, and has the whole exotic thing going on, but we would be an even...ish match in that department.

When I read that line 'unsure of finding someone this good looking again', it's actually cringeworthy to be honest. And not a healthy outlook. It was a silly thing for me to say.

Anyway, the latest update is that (although this has happened many times before), I think that's it. We're finished. She is not bowing down on the marriage front, and neither am I.

Very sad

Not to be too tough OP, but it ain't sad! You're lucky! Anyone who does those things doesn't deserve an honest person as a SO. Think of it like this, she called your bluff eg. Lied about buying a ticket to force your hand. If you did go on to have kids etc that devious nature does not change and would have led to an awful lot of heartache for you. You had a lucky escape whether she was South American or Irish! Find someone who appreciates you and works as a team and not a dictator.

LegacyUser

Hi s15r330,

She saw you as a meal ticket, a man to marry so she could get a visa to stay here long term and you would end up footing all the bills.
Be thankful you saw what she was like now before you got married or had children with her.

Every bad relationship teaches us something to be aware of the next time we meet someone.
I have seen people learn from past mistakes and other people who keep going towards the same type of bad or wrong person the whole time. Then with a x period of time they wonder way they are in another mess, a broken relationship or going though difficulties.

I believe that everything happens for a reason and sometimes you don't see or know this but in time you find out something or hear something. It then becomes clear why things did not work out the way you wanted and the fact your better off as a result.