Smart turbo trainers

Borris123

Hi,

I'm currently looking at smart turbo trainers and, after a lot of research, am considering the Tacx Vortex. Just wondering if anyone has experience of this trainer, or would recommend any alternative for roughly the same budget (circa €350).


Thanks!

Daroxtar

I have one. It's a great piece of kit IMHO. I use it at least once a week as I'm very restricted to when I can get out.

DC rainmaker rates it highly, in the previous years list he ranked it as just about the best turbo under €1000
https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.dcrainmaker.com/2016/10/annual-winter-2016-2017-bike-smart-trainer-recommendations.html/amp

It's quiet enough to use while the kids are asleep in the next room. I use Zwift a fair bit and bought a few of the Tacx climbs videos too, they have some very tough workouts.

Keep an eye on what you're buying. Some places sell the fully connected version with the Tacx upgrade software to allow better laptop usability /Google Street view rides and other things.

Anyway, in short, I can't fault it.

Borris123

Thanks Daroxtar, really appreciate the helpful response!

I plan on using it in the garden shed with an iPad, so will need to get some home plugs or wifi extenders! Hope it's not too noisy for the neighbours

SuperSean

I got the tacx flow from halfords: http://www.halfords.ie/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductMobileDisplay?catalogId=15551&langId=-1&categoryId=310541&productId=1237660&storeId=11101

It's currently 240e and you can get a 10% voucher off halfords easy enough from places... It's only purchased through halfords so there isn't many reviews for it online etc. But from what I gather it's similar to the vortex.

Anyway, I went from a dumb trainer to this and it made such a difference. Used it with trainerroad and have to say I cannot fault it.
It's pretty quiet.
I've never used a high end trainer, only a crappy old one so I can't say how it compares unfortunately but definitely worth considering.

nordicb

I was torn apart between Vortex and Kickr Snap, ended up with the latter, even though it is a bit more expensive. It has twice the weight flywheel, which feels a bit more realistic compared to smaller ones as it rolls a lot longer and also harder to accelerate, just like on the road.

Macy0161

I went for the non-smart but direct drive Turbo Muin, also from halfords, in the same ballpark price.

For what it's worth, they've said on the TrainerRoad podcast that they'd go direct drive over smart. However, that episode was out just as I was considering changing to a wheel-on Smart turbo - I find the non smart fine for intense work, but during base phase/ endurance stuff, it would definitely help to switch off mentally and just concentrate on the TV! If I was going again at the same price point, I'm not sure which way I'd go tbh (next one will be smart and direct drive!)

smacl

I've had an Tacx i-flow for some years now and find it provides good variety and fun when going outside is not an option. Was one on here recently at a good price but reckon it is gone. While the climbing resistance isn't that realistic, it just means pushing a higher gear. For me the best thing about the VR is being able setup virtual opponents on a course where those opponents represent your previous best times on that course. It really does make you go balls out to continuously improve, if only by a few seconds.

yop

I have the Snap, can't say I Am overly happy with it, I use it with Zwift and when I'm doing a hard interval session it mis behaves badly.
For example say u do a 10 minute warm up, then 3 mins on, 5 off, after the the first 2 segements of that it starts to grind, so maybe 2 minutes into the 3 minute effort it grinds to a halt, I have to switch off the turbo and restart it.
I have tried EGR mode on and off, but then u lose the gradient effect.

Kickr is dearer, but might be a better option.

Only my own thoughts.

dahat

Macy0161 wrote: »

I went for the non-smart but direct drive Turbo Muin, also from halfords, in the same ballpark price.

For what it's worth, they've said on the TrainerRoad podcast that they'd go direct drive over smart. However, that episode was out just as I was considering changing to a wheel-on Smart turbo - I find the non smart fine for intense work, but during base phase/ endurance stuff, it would definitely help to switch off mentally and just concentrate on the TV! If I was going again at the same price point, I'm not sure which way I'd go tbh (next one will be smart and direct drive!)

Strongly considering this as an upgrade for my current turbo.
Using this with a Stages is the most cost effective way of upgrading a turbo for me.

mirrormatrix

This looks a smashing deal (thinking of picking up one myself now!)

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/elite-turbo-muin-ii-fluid-direct-drive-trainer/

Oh, its also Zwift compatible apparently

nordicb

yop wrote: »

I have the Snap, can't say I Am overly happy with it, I use it with Zwift and when I'm doing a hard interval session it mis behaves badly.
For example say u do a 10 minute warm up, then 3 mins on, 5 off, after the the first 2 segements of that it starts to grind, so maybe 2 minutes into the 3 minute effort it grinds to a halt, I have to switch off the turbo and restart it.
I have tried EGR mode on and off, but then u lose the gradient effect.

Kickr is dearer, but might be a better option.

Only my own thoughts.

It's strange and sorry to hear that, I don't experience any of these, perhaps it needs software update? I've done many sufferfest videos on it, numerous FTP and it never missed a beat. The flywheel gets very very hot though, I hooked up a PC fan to cool it down a little, similar to what you see on fluid trainers. Haven't tried zwift as they require 64bit windows machine these days.

Macy0161

dahat wrote: »

Strongly considering this as an upgrade for my current turbo.
Using this with a Stages is the most cost effective way of upgrading a turbo for me.

It's very quiet. Doesn't come with the speed and cadence sensor, that's extra, but you won't need it with a stages afaik with TrainerRoad anyway.

I'm a bit torn on going for a power meter to use outside too, or upgrade to a smart direct drive. I get that with a power meter you can use it outside, but pretty committed to TrainerRoad/ indoor for my structured training rides now. It's probably a no brainer, and I'm just missing the point on the usefulness of a power meter for outdoor rides, and races. Anyway, n+1 next on the list!

Lemon3

I had 3 Tacx Flow Smart Trainers from Halfords and returned them all due to the well documented clicking sound from the brake, and i took the refund option on the last one. Apart from that issue, the trainer was pretty good and provided a very cheap way into the Zwift world that i wanted. I ran it with my Stages for power and it connected well with my computer and HR monitor.
I just got the Wahoo Snap (€545) as a replacement and it feels way more solid. I also run this with my Stages as the power source so everything remains constant. No issues with it so far except that i got a puncture, which i never got using the Tacx. If you are a strong cyclist or even expect to be and are committed indoor training then i think it is worth investing something you can grow into. The Tacx has 800w and 7% limit while the Snap is 1500w and 12% which might be worth bearing in mind.

Delboy007

I am in the market for a Turbo too, I am going to ask a silly question what is the difference between the Tacx Flow T2240 and the Tacx Vortex apart from the €43.18 price difference, I what to use it with trainerroad
http://www.halfords.ie/cycling/turbo-trainers/trainers/tacx-flow-t2240-smart-turbo-trainer
http://www.wiggle.com/tacx-vortex-smart-trainer/

yop

nordicb wrote: »

It's strange and sorry to hear that, I don't experience any of these, perhaps it needs software update? I've done many sufferfest videos on it, numerous FTP and it never missed a beat. The flywheel gets very very hot though, I hooked up a PC fan to cool it down a little, similar to what you see on fluid trainers. Haven't tried zwift as they require 64bit windows machine these days.

Thanks, ya I have updated the whole lot. Its frustrating as I'm working off programs so it getting very annoying.

harringtonp

mirrormatrix wrote: »

This looks a smashing deal (thinking of picking up one myself now!)

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/elite-turbo-muin-ii-fluid-direct-drive-trainer/

Oh, its also Zwift compatible apparently

That is a great price, mine cost 310 sterling a few months back and that was after looking around and comparing prices. The combination of direct drive and fluid provides as good a turbo experience as you will find. I could never go back to a cheap one after it. The only downside is its size and weight but these negatives bring their own benefits

Macy0161

And it is not smart - zwift compatible with the sensor, but that's one way from the turbo.

I only had a very cheap turbo before this one, but can't see myself going back to wheel-on.

harringtonp

Macy0161 wrote: »

It's very quiet. Doesn't come with the speed and cadence sensor, that's extra, but you won't need it with a stages afaik with TrainerRoad anyway.

I'm a bit torn on going for a power meter to use outside too, or upgrade to a smart direct drive. I get that with a power meter you can use it outside, but pretty committed to TrainerRoad/ indoor for my structured training rides now. It's probably a no brainer, and I'm just missing the point on the usefulness of a power meter for outdoor rides, and races. Anyway, n+1 next on the list!

I've a powermeter which I use with the Turbo Muin. Fair point about outdoors, recently I've stopped using a PM for races never looked t it during races even though I analysed it extensively after. The only thing is when the weather is warm, its nice to have the option of doing your structured sessions outdoors.

On a separate note unlike other trainers there is very little difference between power you will put out on the Turbo Muin and outdoors.

Macy0161

harringtonp wrote: »

I've a powermeter which I use with the Turbo Muin. Fair point about outdoors, recently I've stopped using a PM for races never looked t it during races even though I analysed it extensively after. The only thing is when the weather is warm, its nice to have the option of doing your structured sessions outdoors.

Ah yeah, thinking on it after posting it is a no brainer if it was power meter or smart direct drive as an upgrade from the muin.

jon1981

I've a http://eu.wahoofitness.com/devices/bike-trainers/kickr-snap-bike-trainer ... highly recommend it too if your budget allows, has built in power meter also with heavy freewheel for allowing spin down.

mosstin

Thinking of going down this route. Anyone own an Elite Qubo? Sounds a decent bike and my budget wouldn't be much bigger than what this would cost. €260 for something that can be connected to Zwift - downsides?

Mr. Grieves

mosstin wrote: »

Thinking of going down this route. Anyone own an Elite Qubo? Sounds a decent bike and my budget wouldn't be much bigger than what this would cost. €260 for something that can be connected to Zwift - downsides?

This is equivalent apparently:
http://www.halfords.ie/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductMobileDisplay?catalogId=15551&langId=-1&categoryId=310541&productId=1384769&storeId=11101

I just bought one but haven't used it yet.

mosstin

Mr. Grieves wrote: »

This is equivalent apparently:
http://www.halfords.ie/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductMobileDisplay?catalogId=15551&langId=-1&categoryId=310541&productId=1384769&storeId=11101

I just bought one but haven't used it yet.

I saw it, and it was looking at it that made me look further into buying one. Maybe that one but I'd be happy to pay a little more if it was worth it.

Delboy007

mosstin wrote: »

Thinking of going down this route. Anyone own an Elite Qubo? Sounds a decent bike and my budget wouldn't be much bigger than what this would cost. €260 for something that can be connected to Zwift - downsides?

Hi I bought the Wahoo Kickr Snap from the below link, it is €219 upfront and the €33 for 10 months,  
http://www.chaindrivencycles.com/productdisplay/wahoo-kickr-snap

Can anyone recommend a fan for turbo sessions?

Irish Raven

anyone notice a considerable difference between powermeter and smart turbo trainer....

i use vector pedals....and tacx bushido turbo controlled by trainerroad on phone. i calibrate both, and pm reads approx 30 to 60 watts higher than displayed on trainerroad app...

doozerie

ronoc wrote: »

Can anyone recommend a fan for turbo sessions?

I use a Honeywell 3-speed pedestal fan that I got from Argos a few years ago. It has worked well, it certainly makes a huge difference and did so from day one, it instantly made turbo sessions easier.

I'd be very interested to try a high velocity fan though, these days my turbo sessions are in a more enclosed space with no open windows and unsurprisingly the fan isn't quite as effective as I used to find it before. A high velocity fan is obviously going to just push the same warm air around faster, but that extra speed and volume might be enough to make a difference.

Also, there have been times when I've climbed on the bike, started my session, and realised I forgot to turn the fan on. I have the fan positioned right in front of the front wheel these days (to get maximum benefit from it) so with some ridiculous leaning and balancing I can reach the dial to switch it on, but on those occasions I'd value a remote control.

So my dream fan is high velocity, probably pedestal since it pushes the air at the "right" height", and has a remote control (which I'd no doubt forget to bring with me when I climb on the bike...).

doozerie

Irish Raven wrote: »

anyone notice a considerable difference between powermeter and smart turbo trainer....

i use vector pedals....and tacx bushido turbo controlled by trainerroad on phone. i calibrate both, and pm reads approx 30 to 60 watts higher than displayed on trainerroad app...

The power meter in many/most turbo trainers are not "real" power meters typically i.e. no strain gauges, they just estimate power based on the speed of the wheel and the resistance algorithm/graph for their turbo (same as TrainerRoad does, basically). As a general rule they tend to be inaccurate, although some of them have a reputation for being consistent so remain useful for that reason.

To get power meter measurements with some reputation for accuracy you have to look at turbos at the top end of the price range, models like the Tacx Neo, the Wahoo Kickr, and the Elite Drivio. I'm not sure how they measure power, whether they actually use strain gauges, but from the online reviews I've read where people checked their measures against a real power meter, they compared favourably.

If you have your Vector pedals on the bike you use on the turbo, then you can get TrainerRoad to take the Vector power figures and control the turbo based on those. That's if you can pick up the Vector pedals within your TrainerRoad app - I can't recall for sure but I think the Vector use ANT+ so if you are using your trainer in Erg mode I assume you already have ANT on your phone.

SwissToni

doozerie wrote: »

I use a Honeywell 3-speed pedestal fan that I got from Argos a few years ago. It has worked well, it certainly makes a huge difference and did so from day one, it instantly made turbo sessions easier.

I'd be very interested to try a high velocity fan though, these days my turbo sessions are in a more enclosed space with no open windows and unsurprisingly the fan isn't quite as effective as I used to find it before. A high velocity fan is obviously going to just push the same warm air around faster, but that extra speed and volume might be enough to make a difference.

Also, there have been times when I've climbed on the bike, started my session, and realised I forgot to turn the fan on. I have the fan positioned right in front of the front wheel these days (to get maximum benefit from it) so with some ridiculous leaning and balancing I can reach the dial to switch it on, but on those occasions I'd value a remote control.

So my dream fan is high velocity, probably pedestal since it pushes the air at the "right" height", and has a remote control (which I'd no doubt forget to bring with me when I climb on the bike...).

I use a WiFi plug controlled by my phone to turn the fan on/off works great.

https://www.woodies.ie/tk-link-hs100-wifi-smart-plug-1132980?utm_source=google_shopping&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIwPHL2aKD2QIVzrvtCh1x7QZ5EAQYAyABEgK5bfD_BwE

doozerie

@SwissToni, Mostly I want a remote to be able to adjust the setting/power on the fan as needed. I always just turn it up to full (when I remember!) and grit my teeth if it feels a bit cool for the first few minutes, but on those days where I'm feeling a bit more fragile it would be handy to be able to start with it on a low setting and then remotely turn it up as I get warmer.

Mind you, mostly this all seems a good option to me while I'm on the turbo and suffering and it could be argued that anything seems like a good option in those circumstance, however illogical!

Zen0

For someone with waaay too much time on their hands:

http://www.instructables.com/id/Internet-Connected-Fan-for-Use-With-Zwift/

Whyner

Throw a top on for first few minutes, then remove......simples

I use this guy and have it tilted upwards - http://www.argos.ie/static/Product/partNumber/4250090.htm