Driving offence fine

beya2009

Hi anyone know what happens if your brought to court for driving without insurance and escape disqualification but get a €400 fine? What I mean is that how many penalty points are deducted? Obviously conviction is a fine but what are the specific consequences? Like how much would insurance go up now you have a driving conviction although avoiding disqualification?

childsplay

I don't know the answer to any of those questions. Driving without insurance is beyond selfish and is one reason why the cost of insurance is so high. Can't afford insurance don't get a car. It's pretty much as simple as that in my opinion.

beya2009

childsplay wrote: »

I don't know the answer to any of those questions. Driving without insurance is beyond selfish and is one reason why the cost of insurance is so high. Can't afford insurance don't get a car. It's pretty much as simple as that in my opinion.

Then your reply is utterly of no help in this regard. I'm not looking for judgement...just advice on the matter.

Fred Swanson

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beya2009

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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Ok thank you for your reply. Am I right in saying insurance only goes up if 6 penalty points or more?

Fred Swanson

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Needs Must

beya2009 wrote:

Then your reply is utterly of no help in this regard. I'm not looking for judgement...just advice on the matter.

Easy to be smart now, pity you didn't have this in the first place and you may have avoided the situation you now find yourself in.

coylemj

beya2009 wrote: »

Ok thank you for your reply. Am I right in saying insurance only goes up if 6 penalty points or more?

It depends on the insurance company. The policy document will tell you if you need to inform them for any points or for 2 or 4 or 6 or whatever. If in doubt, tell them.

But as you were convicted of no insurance, I guess you don't have anyone to inform but you will definitely need to disclose when seeking quotes.

And as Fred says above, the conviction itself will hurt you more than the points.

Big C

beya2009 wrote: »

Ok thank you for your reply. Am I right in saying insurance only goes up if 6 penalty points or more?

Insurance can go up for any reason, being caught driving without insurance is really giving insurance copmpanies a good reason to give a 200% loading.

Just as aside why are u worried about cost going up ? Up from what ?
you were paying nothing

beya2009

Needs Must wrote: »

Easy to be smart now, pity you didn't have this in the first place and you may have avoided the situation you now find yourself in.

I don't see how I'm being smart:S I'm the first to admit I've done wrong and regret my actions but people judging and stating the obvious is hardly productive when I'm looking for information.

beya2009

Big C wrote: »

Insurance can go up for any reason, being caught driving without insurance is really giving insurance copmpanies a good reason to give a 200% loading.

Just as aside why are u worried about cost going up ? Up from what ?
you were paying nothing

Incident happened last year and since then I have been fully insured for the past 7 months so that's why I'm asking. My renewal is due in 3 months. I got my conviction recently and know I was lucky not to be disqualified but first offense was crucial in my case.

Fred Swanson

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beya2009

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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Thanks. My solicitor told me insurance on drivers previously disqualified can cost in the region of 4-5k so I hope it's nothing like that.

flower tattoo

beya2009 wrote: »

Ok thank you for your reply. Am I right in saying insurance only goes up if 6 penalty points or more?

Axa told me 5 points make a difference

Dionysius2

How do Ins Co get to know of PPts if driver doesn't tell them ?

Fred Swanson

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Stheno

beya2009 wrote: »

Thanks. My solicitor told me insurance on drivers previously disqualified can cost in the region of 4-5k so I hope it's nothing like that.

How long have you had a full licence?

nuac

Mod
Childsplay/Beya2009/Needsmust
On this forum let us all be nice and civil to each other, OK?

beya2009

Stheno wrote: »

How long have you had a full licence?

Under 2 years why?

Cows Go µ

beya2009 wrote: »

Incident happened last year and since then I have been fully insured for the past 7 months so that's why I'm asking. My renewal is due in 3 months. I got my conviction recently and know I was lucky not to be disqualified but first offense was crucial in my case.

Did you tell your insurance company when you were setting up the policy that you had been caught driving without insurance and were going to court?

Galwayguy35

beya2009 wrote: »

Thanks. My solicitor told me insurance on drivers previously disqualified can cost in the region of 4-5k so I hope it's nothing like that.

He is right it could well be that.

I was off for a year back in 1998 and when I went to get insurance in my own name back in 2002 it cost me 4 k

You're in for years of pain, most insurance companies won't touch you and those that you do get a quote from will charge thousands.

Did you tell the company you are currently insured with that you had a court case pending?

beya2009

Cows Go µ wrote: »

Did you tell your insurance company when you were setting up the policy that you had been caught driving without insurance and were going to court?

No and I was not aware you had to. Just thought you have to inform them once convicted since you have been charged or at least for renewal.

Stheno

beya2009 wrote: »

No and I was not aware you had to. Just thought you have to inform them once convicted since you have been charged or at least for renewal.

They will now have grounds to cancel your current policy depending on their terms. That would add further to your loading

L1011

Dionysius2 wrote: »

How do Ins Co get to know of PPts if driver doesn't tell them ?

If they get the licence number, they are allowed query the database. They may also ask for it after a claim and if you've been found to lie you are going to have severe trouble

flower tattoo wrote: »

Axa told me 5 points make a difference

1 can make a difference with some insurers; also different reasons for getting them are loaded differently

Cows Go µ

beya2009 wrote: »

No and I was not aware you had to. Just thought you have to inform them once convicted since you have been charged or at least for renewal.

You could have serious problems then. Most motor proposal form will have something like "ever been convicted of any offence in connection with any motor vehicle or are there any Garda enquiries or prosecutions pending?" And when they find out you had a conviction pending when the policy was set up, they will likely cancel the policy from inception for a non-disclosure. So not only will you have to declare the conviction when getting quotes, you will also have to disclose that you have a cancelled policy.

beya2009

Stheno wrote: »

They will now have grounds to cancel your current policy depending on their terms. That would add further to your loading

Fair enough but will just wait it out until next renewal. I understand insurance will go up significantly and that but surely it would be far worst if it was after serving disqualification that I was trying to get insurance.

Cows Go µ

beya2009 wrote: »

Fair enough but will just wait it out until next renewal. I understand insurance will go up significantly and that but surely it would be far worst if it was after serving disqualification that I was trying to get insurance.

Do not do this. You are basically still driving around without insurance at this stage. If you have an accident tomorrow, the insurance company would find out about the conviction, more than likely cancel the policy and then come after you for any money they had to pay out to the third party.

Galwayguy35

beya2009 wrote: »

Fair enough but will just wait it out until next renewal. I understand insurance will go up significantly and that but surely it would be far worst if it was after serving disqualification that I was trying to get insurance.

Not really, you will still have a conviction

beya2009

Cows Go µ wrote: »

Do not do this. You are basically still driving around without insurance at this stage. If you have an accident tomorrow, the insurance company would find out about the conviction, more than likely cancel the policy and then come after you for any money they had to pay out to the third party.

Fair point but a cancelled policy would make obtaining insurance ten times harder.

L1011

beya2009 wrote: »

Fair point but a cancelled policy would make obtaining insurance ten times harder.

Which is why its quite critical to ensure you don't get one, surely?

beya2009

L1011 wrote: »

Which is why its quite critical to ensure you don't get one, surely?

Best thing to do is to call to have my policy cancelled as I know there's a big difference between them cancelling or you calling to cancel. Going forward I will then know what new insurance with a conviction will set me back.

Stheno

beya2009 wrote: »

Best thing to do is to call to have my policy cancelled as I know there's a big difference between them cancelling or you calling to cancel. Going forward I will then know what new insurance with a conviction will set me back.

And what will your reason for cancelling be?

beya2009

Stheno wrote: »

And what will your reason for cancelling be?

You have to give a reason? surely it's within your right to cancel?

Fred Swanson

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coylemj

Don't cancel the policy, read it first.

The policy document will set out your responsibilities in relation to traffic offences, pending or post conviction. If an event is 'notifiable' such as a change in occupation, permanent address, change of vehicle etc. then you are required to tell them immediately, you don't wait until renewal time. The same applies to a significant conviction such as driving without insurance.

Asking about the threshold for points suggests that you are looking for an excuse to not tell the insurance company, that would be a big mistake.

beya2009

coylemj wrote: »

Don't cancel the policy, read it first.

The policy document will set out your responsibilities in relation to traffic offences, pending or post conviction. If an event is 'notifiable' such as a change in occupation, permanent address, change of vehicle etc. then you are required to tell them immediately, you don't wait until renewal time. The same applies to a significant conviction such as driving without insurance.

Asking about the threshold for points suggests that you are looking for an excuse to not tell the insurance company, that would be a big mistake.

Just looked at the insurance policy,

"If you are in any doubt as to whether a fact is material, it should be disclosed. This duty of disclosure also applies before renewal of the policy."

Examples of material facts are health matters, motor accidents, pending persecutions, fixed penalties, penalty points or Road Traffic Act convictions.

by the looks of that I must call and inform them I have been convicted of driving without insurance which means they will cancel my policy.

Skatedude

beya2009 wrote: »

Just looked at the insurance policy,

"If you are in any doubt as to whether a fact is material, it should be disclosed. This duty of disclosure also applies before renewal of the policy."

Examples of material facts are health matters, motor accidents, pending persecutions, fixed penalties, penalty points or Road Traffic Act convictions.

by the looks of that I must call and inform them I have been convicted of driving without insurance which means they will cancel my policy.

I think that pretty much covers it,

coylemj

beya2009 wrote: »

Examples of material facts are health matters, motor accidents, pending persecutions, fixed penalties, penalty points or Road Traffic Act convictions.

by the looks of that I must call and inform them I have been convicted of driving without insurance which means they will cancel my policy.

From the policy it appears that you should have told them the minute you got the summons. They may not cancel the policy and if I was you I would not voluntarily cancel it because you will have a really hard time getting a quote from anyone else.

Call them, tell them and see what happens.

Stheno

Did you get the summons before or after you took out the policy?

beya2009

Stheno wrote: »

Did you get the summons before or after you took out the policy?

I got the summons after I took out the policy.

beya2009

coylemj wrote: »

From the policy it appears that you should have told them the minute you got the summons. They may not cancel the policy and if I was you I would not voluntarily cancel it because you will have a really hard time getting a quote from anyone else.

Call them, tell them and see what happens.

Probably will not be good but I will call them tomorrow.

ella23

Sent you a PM there.

beya2009

ella23 wrote: »

Sent you a PM there.

Thanks I replied.

Stheno

beya2009 wrote: »

Probably will not be good but I will call them tomorrow.

Call them and see what they say, the likelihood is that they will potentially load your policy

CeilingFly

You'll always get scaremongering on boards.

My advice is to

1 - read the terms and conditions in full.

2 - ring an insurance broker and ask them for advice and quote for next policy.

Dionysius2

Very difficult to avoid the conclusion that this is a huge grey area laden with widespread non-compliance in regard to points meted out to offenders and the subsequent under-reporting thereof for insurance assessment purposes.
What say ye ?

beauf

coylemj wrote: »

... if I was you I would not voluntarily cancel it because you will have a really hard time getting a quote from anyone else...

Why would self canceling a policy make it hard to get a quote.

boardsuser1

In relation to the OP's issue, I was never convicted of no insurance, but was convicted of dangerous driving reduced to careless on appeal.

It was in 2006.

I was never disqualified,had my licence endorsed, or received the points.

Nor did i ever say it to my insurers.

I got away with it but times were a bit different back then.

Still with the same insurer to this day.

Got online quotes with and without it.

I was either being refused quotes or getting nothing sub 5k.

I was in the wrong to not declare it 100%.

If this had happened in 2016 i would not have gotten way with it.

beya2009

No conviction..just a court fine so I know I got lucky. Lessons learned for sure.

boardsuser1

beya2009 wrote: »

No conviction..just a court fine so I know I got lucky. Lessons learned for sure.

A fine is a conviction.

GM228

beya2009 wrote: »

No conviction..just a court fine so I know I got lucky. Lessons learned for sure.

Cork Truck Driver wrote: »

A fine is a conviction.

A fine in itself is not a conviction.

It is either:-

A - as a result of a conviction, or

B - in lieu of a conviction (i.e application of the Probation Act/the poor box).

But B can't apply to driving with no insurance.