Applying to Correct State Exams

Dylan94

I am considering applying to correct exams for the junior or leaving certificate as they are currently short in my subjects. However, I am expecting to get surgery this summer (a date has not been set yet). If I have to drop out due to this during the time will this be held against me for future years?

mtoutlemonde

Dylan94 wrote: »

I am considering applying to correct exams for the junior or leaving certificate as they are currently short in my subjects. However, I am expecting to get surgery this summer (a date has not been set yet). If I have to drop out due to this during the time will this be held against me for future years?

If you are unsure of surgery date - I wouldn't apply if you think it would be during the marking period. It would be more hassle for the SEC as your scripts would have to be collected and redistributed and the people who receive the extra scripts have to go through the numbering system again and also add extra pressure to them. There could be pay implications if you couldn't complete your scripts. You could also ring and see what they say as they are short.

evolving_doors

Maybe be proactive about the surgery date if you can wait... rather than waiting and then it being in July.. see if you could postpone it to August now. Rather than getting a date and then trying to postpone. Sometimes medical admin are amenable to kicking it forward if you are early enough.
It could be the difference of a couple of days .

RealJohn

How serious is the surgery? The first year I was marking (not 'correcting', marking) I had surgery scheduled during the marking period so I got the head down and got myself a couple of days ahead of schedule by the time I went in. Would have been fine except that I ended up being in two days longer than planned so I did screw things up a bit. They didn't take any papers off me in the end though and, while I skipped the following year, I marked every year since.

I was only in for four days though and that put me under pressure. Any longer than that and it's probably not doable.

spurious

Would agree with RealJohn, if it's only a couple of days and doesn't have you sleeping it off for a few days, it's doable, especially in the later part of correcting. Were it to be scheduled at the start, I think you'd miss deadlines and that would mess it all up. The suits in Athlone would have multiple breakdowns.

If there was any way you could ask for it to be in August that would be the way to go.

Crazyteacher

There's an urgent appeal on the SEC website for examiners for certain subjects. I don't remember appeals like this before?

https://www.examinations.ie/?l=en&mc=re&sc=lwe

Dylan94

I rang the hospital. They said at the moment they cant narrow it down more than itll be between July 10th and August 18th. I got the impression that it'll more likely be August, but I cant be sure.

I would also be in for 4 days and then be able to go straight back to marking (if things arent so good it could be 7 days max). As Ive never done it before I dont know how it works. If I was gonna be out for a week say and I managed to mark every exam that I had in my possession before then can I just send them back early?

clunked

Crazyteacher wrote: »

There's an urgent appeal on the SEC website for examiners for certain subjects. I don't remember appeals like this before?

https://www.examinations.ie/?l=en&mc=re&sc=lwe

And why do you think that is the case Crazy??????????

evolving_doors

You could work ahead if you're the super efficient type with zero distractions and know your subject exams pretty well. Get the exam paper as soon as the exam is over and get familiarised as much as possible with previous years marking schemes. Read the corrections handbook over and over so you do the paperwork correctly.

I seem to remember something about waiting for the go ahead from your advising examiner (AE) every 100 papers. A change in the marking scheme or an addition to allowed answers wrecked my head. Also as it's your first time you might have a lot of questions for your AE once you get into it, so you could be waiting a day or two for them to get back with an answer (if you know anyone at the marking conference get their email address, the usually divide ye into small groups with yer AE ).. meanwhile carry on and keep careful record of which papers you have doubts about.

Depends on the subject too though! Some of them the answers can be pretty clear cut. It's doable but be prepaired for very long days and nights.

happywithlife

Crazyteacher wrote: »

There's an urgent appeal on the SEC website for examiners for certain subjects. I don't remember appeals like this before?

https://www.examinations.ie/?l=en&mc=re&sc=lwe

Am I alone in being secretly delighted at this? They've cut the conditions to a demeaning level - 2.50 for a CUP of coffee ?! at break time; no overnight the night before; less mileage not to mention the taxes and PRD....are they really surprised?

spurious

happywithlife wrote: »

Am I alone in being secretly delighted at this? They've cut the conditions to a demeaning level - 2.50 for a CUP of coffee ?! at break time; no overnight the night before; less mileage not to mention the taxes and PRD....are they really surprised?

I must admit to a certain level of schadenfreude, though realistically the people who HAVE applied to examine are the ones who will suffer if they can't get enough examiners, extra workload etc..

For any first time examiners reading this thread, I STRONGLY recommend you get the mobile number of another examiner along with that of your Advising Examiner, as there can be times you think you might be making a bags of it all and a quick supportive text from someone else in the same boat can help.

ccazza

happywithlife wrote: »

Am I alone in being secretly delighted at this? They've cut the conditions to a demeaning level - 2.50 for a CUP of coffee ?! at break time; no overnight the night before; less mileage not to mention the taxes and PRD....are they really surprised?

Cups of tea/coffee and biscuits are back for free this year!

deiseindublin

I never get the big deal with the coffee/biscuits tbh. If I wanted them I'd pay for them, if not, I wouldn't.

It does seem petty in the scheme of things but it was explained to me once (however true) that giving the coffee/biscuits would/may interfere with the subsistence allowance.

happywithlife

deiseindublin wrote: »

I never get the big deal with the coffee/biscuits tbh. If I wanted them I'd pay for them, if not, I wouldn't.

It does seem petty in the scheme of things but it was explained to me once (however true) that giving the coffee/biscuits would/may interfere with the subsistence allowance.

If you've had a long drive up that morning a welcome cuppa isn't too much to ask. You may not necessarily have time to stop to grab one or forget till you are there. Some conferences are held in places where you can't easily pop back out to get one - I'm thinking of my own conference held in a secondary school. I think it was just miserly to take it away tbh and in light of revelations of the utter waste of money in other areas the savings were miniscule and the illwill overshadowed the megre savings

Crazyteacher

ccazza wrote: »

Cups of tea/coffee and biscuits are back for free this year!

What subject was tea available for ? Was this in the SEC?

rainbowtrout

Dylan94 wrote: »

I rang the hospital. They said at the moment they cant narrow it down more than itll be between July 10th and August 18th. I got the impression that it'll more likely be August, but I cant be sure.

I would also be in for 4 days and then be able to go straight back to marking (if things arent so good it could be 7 days max). As Ive never done it before I dont know how it works. If I was gonna be out for a week say and I managed to mark every exam that I had in my possession before then can I just send them back early?

No you can't, and there isn't a hope in hell even with the best will in the world that you would be able to get ahead of schedule by a week.

That and you mark to a schedule, changes may crop up over the course of the four weeks and when it happens you are required to go back and make those changes when they happen. You are also not able to send back exams and paperwork etc until you have been given the go head by your advising examiner. There's no early finish.

rainbowtrout

deiseindublin wrote: »

I never get the big deal with the coffee/biscuits tbh. If I wanted them I'd pay for them, if not, I wouldn't.

It does seem petty in the scheme of things but it was explained to me once (however true) that giving the coffee/biscuits would/may interfere with the subsistence allowance.

Just a flimsy excuse. Complimentary tea and biscuits were provided at all practical and written conferences until a couple of years ago. Never had an effect on subsistence allowances.

Incidentally, there was a post on here recently enough where an examiner mentioned how they were given tea and scones free at their conference last year and I enquired if it was one of the exams that was trialled for online correction and the examiner confirmed that it was - so the SEC were literally buttering up the examiners to keep them sweet for the new system.

Pay peanuts, get monkeys.

doc_17

RealJohn wrote: »

How serious is the surgery? The first year I was marking (not 'correcting', marking) I had surgery scheduled during the marking period so I got the head down and got myself a couple of days ahead of schedule by the time I went in. Would have been fine except that I ended up being in two days longer than planned so I did screw things up a bit. They didn't take any papers off me in the end though and, while I skipped the following year, I marked every year since.

I was only in for four days though and that put me under pressure. Any longer than that and it's probably not doable.

Forgive me, why was it necessary to correct the poster's use of correcting to marking? I think we all understand the difference but we all knew what the poster meant!!!

evolving_doors

doc_17 wrote: »

Forgive me, why was it necessary to correct the poster's use of correcting to marking? I think we all understand the difference but we all knew what the poster meant!!!

I think 'correcting' can imply altering

rainbowtrout

Gebgbegb wrote: »

I think 'correcting' can imply altering

ah here.

Dylan94

rainbowtrout wrote: »

No you can't, and there isn't a hope in hell even with the best will in the world that you would be able to get ahead of schedule by a week.

That and you mark to a schedule, changes may crop up over the course of the four weeks and when it happens you are required to go back and make those changes when they happen. You are also not able to send back exams and paperwork etc until you have been given the go head by your advising examiner. There's no early finish.

Thanks. Pretty sure that Im not going to apply now. But just out of curiosity what would happen if an examinet was to become ill during this time and wasnt able to continue.

Crazyteacher

They would want the scripts back asap to be redistributed. I have heard of advising examiners collecting the scripts from examiners to redistribute them sooner.


They do tell you at conference that we are human and people get ill so just get back to them as soon as possible.

happywithlife

Dylan94 wrote: »

I rang the hospital. They said at the moment they cant narrow it down more than itll be between July 10th and August 18th. I got the impression that it'll more likely be August, but I cant be sure.

I would also be in for 4 days and then be able to go straight back to marking (if things arent so good it could be 7 days max). As Ive never done it before I dont know how it works. If I was gonna be out for a week say and I managed to mark every exam that I had in my possession before then can I just send them back early?

As a fairly experienced marker I find I can just about keep on top of deadlines and no way would a first timer be a week ahead- you've no idea of the paperwork and remarking due to tweaks in the marking scheme. Even if by some miracle you did manage to get ahead you are not allowed to finish early as they eant to see the overall grades for each 100 and you may end up tweaking borderline scripts depending on overall results as they must fit the bell curve. Also at the end you must wait for clearance before filling in your marks sheet and there's a report to be done before posting of your scripts

happywithlife

Dylan94 wrote: »

Thanks. Pretty sure that Im not going to apply now. But just out of curiosity what would happen if an examinet was to become ill during this time and wasnt able to continue.

I remember hearing of a corrector whose parent died in the middle of marking and someone from the SEC was down the day after - as in the day of the removal- to pick up their scripts and paperwork
They push hard to keep.to those deadlines and there's no shifting them

man_no_plan

doc_17 wrote: »

Forgive me, why was it necessary to correct the poster's use of correcting to marking? I think we all understand the difference but we all knew what the poster meant!!!

I'm looking at my letter here

"The scripts rate for the subject you are correcting is xx.xx Euro"

They always say marking but the letter definitely says correcting! I do know the difference, just saw it here this morning and remembered the knicker twisting that went on here.

deiseindublin

Is it a new thing for examiners to be told script rate in advance. My friend never knew what to expect for her bag load, seemed like the best kept secret.

Crazyteacher

No the rate was on the letter only we don't know the amount until we open the envelopes and count them.

man_no_plan

Crazyteacher wrote: »

No the rate was on the letter only we don't know the amount until we open the envelopes and count them.

Wasn't there's list of rates for all subjects in the examiner handbook years ago?

spurious

man_no_plan wrote: »

Wasn't there's list of rates for all subjects in the examiner handbook years ago?

That does ring some sort of bell for me, now that you mention it.

Millem

I have been to two marking conferences so far in 2017 and at both I had to pay for tea and biscuits! So I wouldn't get my hopes up
I did get overnight allowance the night before the conferences.

Funny enough when I was on Inservice with pdst in sept/oct 2016 tea/coffee was provided for free as was lunch. They even paid mileage

spurious

I was at a 2017 conference and the start time was set after 11am to do away with any chance of the night before. No tea/coffee/water either.
Not everyone showed up - I wonder why.

Millem

spurious wrote: »

I was at a 2017 conference and the start time was set after 11am to do away with any chance of the night before. No tea/coffee/water either.
Not everyone showed up - I wonder why.

I think both mine were 9.30. For the first one I forgot cash I had to go to the bar and pay with my card. That one was in a hotel. You were literally given a (small) cup of tea. Can't remember how much I had up pay maybe €3.

The second one was in the SEC building where you have to go to canteen. (They also don't accept cards). The canteen is subsidised so can't remember how much a tea was maybe €1.

Crazyteacher

man_no_plan wrote: »

Wasn't there's list of rates for all subjects in the examiner handbook years ago?

Maybe it was once. I can't remember. Once we send back those instructions, it's gone out of my head.

Crazyteacher

Millem wrote: »

I think both mine were 9.30. For the first one I forgot cash I had to go to the bar and pay with my card. That one was in a hotel. You were literally given a (small) cup of tea. Can't remember how much I had up pay maybe €3.

The second one was in the SEC building where you have to go to canteen. (They also don't accept cards). The canteen is subsidised so can't remember how much a tea was maybe €1.

Had the same issue in the IT the first year and ATM not working. Was parched all morning. It was a long time until lunch.

mtoutlemonde

Crazyteacher wrote: »

Had the same issue in the IT the first year and ATM not working. Was parched all morning. It was a long time until lunch.

I'm more annoyed with the mileage from either your school or home address than the tea.

deiseindublin

What's the cut off start time for no overnight the night before?

Millem

deiseindublin wrote: »

What's the cut off start time for no overnight the night before?

I think if you can leave your house anytime after 7.30am they won't pay overnight allowance.

deiseindublin

Not sure how true it is but read on VFT page that new teachers contracted to examine JC and then got call to ask would they examine LC.

There must be a lot turning the work down this year.

mtoutlemonde

deiseindublin wrote: »

Not sure how true it is but read on VFT page that new teachers contracted to examine JC and then got call to ask would they examine LC.

There must be a lot turning the work down this year.

Would you blame people turning this work down? The SEC are going to get increasingly difficult to find people to examine until however it will be written into our contracts.

I wouldn't believe everything on that page - I think the mods go on the sauce for the summer and let any kind of rubbish on their page. Look at this weekend, they had two controversial posts and had to issue a notice not to be abusing to the poster - I ask myself and have asked VFT why they post such idiotic posts when all they do is divide us. I think it's Richard Bruton in secret

Crazyteacher

deiseindublin wrote: »

Not sure how true it is but read on VFT page that new teachers contracted to examine JC and then got call to ask would they examine LC.

There must be a lot turning the work down this year.

Saw that all right. I take what I read on that with a pinch of salt though. Just from observing , it can very nasty on there, especially when the nqts ask questions.

deiseindublin

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

Would you blame people turning this work down?

Not surprised at all.

Wouldn't really be happy to have non-experienced LC teachers correcting the exam though.

I'd love if there was a bit of number crunching published on years experience with each syllabi that is being marked.

mtoutlemonde

deiseindublin wrote: »

Not surprised at all.

Wouldn't really be happy to have non-experienced LC teachers correcting the exam though.

I'd love if there was a bit of number crunching published on years experience with each syllabi that is being marked.

+1 I can't understand how a teacher with no experience or graduates who have no teaching experience at all can mark/correct papers without errors etc. I didn't start correcting/marking until I had a few years experience.

evolving_doors

deiseindublin wrote: »

Not sure how true it is but read on VFT page that new teachers contracted to examine JC and then got call to ask would they examine LC.

There must be a lot turning the work down this year.

I Wonder will there be an increase in appeals in September.

Bean Scoile

For me, the two big issues with the pay are the pension levy and the way expenses are calculated.

The work is not pensionable, and as such, I shouldn't be losing 10% of my pay because of a pension I have elsewhere. It's ridiculous.

I see no reason whatsoever to calculate an examiners expenses from their school during July, that should have been resisted more strongly by the unions. It defies all logic that 2 neighbours would get different travel expenses based on their place of work which they are not attending.

I think if those two issues were dealt with, it would be easier to get examiners.

rainbowtrout

Bean Scoile wrote: »

For me, the two big issues with the pay are the pension levy and the way expenses are calculated.

The work is not pensionable, and as such, I shouldn't be losing 10% of my pay because of a pension I have elsewhere. It's ridiculous.

I see no reason whatsoever to calculate an examiners expenses from their school during July, that should have been resisted more strongly by the unions. It defies all logic that 2 neighbours would get different travel expenses based on their place of work which they are not attending.

I think if those two issues were dealt with, it would be easier to get examiners.

I agree wholeheartedly with this. While I'm working for the SEC they are my employer, which is completely different to my ETB. Where I work for my ETB should have no bearing on how I get paid expenses for correcting.

mirrorwall14

rainbowtrout wrote: »

I agree wholeheartedly with this. While I'm working for the SEC they are my employer, which is completely different to my ETB. Where I work for my ETB should have no bearing on how I get paid expenses for correcting.

I think this was the single worst idea the SEC implemented and has backfired spectacularly. They pissed off the backbone of their employees who seem to have pulled out in droves since it came in

rainbowtrout

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

I think this was the single worst idea the SEC implemented and has backfired spectacularly. They pissed off the backbone of their employees who seem to have pulled out in droves since it came in

Yep, to be honest it doesn't affect me as I live and work in the same town, I only live a mile from my school, but I know plenty of others it has affected. It's the same craic with special centres. We are finding it hard to cover special centres because teachers who would live 30 miles from the school would have done them in the past but with no mileage it's not worth their while.

Millem

Absolutely agree about the nonsense on home/school distance
Since they changed the rules I request to be sent 8km+ for marking and for superintending. I would end up losing money as I would pay more childcare.

What annoys me is the fact they are (over) charging everyone 10.5% pension levy automatically. You have to wait until the end of the year and claim back the .5%. (Only learned this in the last few weeks). I never claimed any back.

All sec work should also be charged at prsi rate j 0% not just superintending. When I mark I get charged a1 prsi.

Bean Scoile

How do you claim that back millem? I'd never heard that!

And the prsi, can that be claimed back?

mtoutlemonde

Bean Scoile wrote: »

How do you claim that back millem? I'd never heard that!

And the prsi, can that be claimed back?

Contact revenue and ask them to look at assess your tax - they will go back four years. I did it a few years ago and got a nice bit back. You can also go onto revenue.ie and calculate it yourself - I have looked at the website - it seems difficult to me - always easier to speak to a person. Better wait until you get paid.

Millem

Bean Scoile wrote: »

How do you claim that back millem? I'd never heard that!

And the prsi, can that be claimed back?

No you don't contact revenue at all!!!

You contact sec and ask for statement of earnings for as many years as you need. They will literally send you a4 typed sheets for each year with breakdown of deductions. You then forward them to your payroll in my case dept of ed post primary and you ask them to review your pension contributions. It is nothing to do with revenue. You may end up owing a few cent to revenue in paye as your paye is calculated after your pension contribution.

Prsi is what it is. Superintending is charged at 0% rate j but my marking is charged at a1 as is my preparatory work. They are the correct rates but IMHO I feel it should all be rate j!!!!!