Our legacy of road deaths, is it time we were more honest?

NIMAN

It seems every couple of days there is another road death in the country.

Every one a tragedy, a family ruined for life, lives lost needlessly.

At this point, it feels like we are just paying lip service to the issue, and things don't seem to be getting any better.

Is it not time for us to be more honest and face up to what is causing these fatalities? They are reported for the day it happens, and then usually we move on to the next news story until another person dies.

Unless its a high profile crash, like the one that killed 8 up here in Donegal, we usually never hear any follow up. Perhaps it would be cruel to admit the cause for the grieving family? But is it achieving anything by us saying "those poor lads, so young, dying on that country road at 4am", instead of being told that those poor lads were 6 times over the limit to drive?

I think we could at least compromise and release annual figures to explain all the crashes. For example, if 100 die this year, perhaps have something like 33 caused by driver being drunk, 22 caused by suicide, 20 caused by excessive speed, 5 caused by defective car, 3 were unaccompanied L drivers etc?

Usually you tackle a problem by admitting whats wrong.

Thoughts?

shar01

Totally agree with an overview of the causes (you could add in poor road surface conditions).

drunkmonkey

The Gardai and sneaky little men in vans might lose justification for fishing with dynamite if it turns out it's not really about road deaths as the stats don't back up the need for mass theft from motorists.

We should also know what's the vehicles most likely to leave you dead. If it's an 89 Honda Civic well then let's tax the bejazus out of them.

I spoke with a guy in the flying squad could be 5 years ago and he said injuries were going up again as people were more inclined to drive a small cheap car as it was a recession.
We make it impossible for the youth to drive a good sized safe car starting off and then scratch our heads when their Clio folds like a Tayto bag in a crash killing everyone.

freshpopcorn

In 2014 almost half of 42% were not wearing seat belts according to the RSA.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/road-safety-authority-says-42-of-those-killed-in-vehicles-not-wearing-seat-belts-1.2052342

Hers's statics about road deaths between 2008-2012 saying excessive speed was a factor.

http://www.rsa.ie/en/Utility/News/News-2016/Excessive-Speed-a-Factor-in-322-Road-Deaths-Between-2008-and-2012/



I do know somebody who was a witness to fatally collision(lead up to it). It was one of these accidents that was discussed about a lot of the time. It wasn't as clear cut as the people on the net made it out to be tough.(How it could have being prevented).
Well the person I know saw a journalist at the inquest. Their was no mention of it in the papers at the time because their was other things going on in the news.
If you are interested in reading about inquests OP I find their often in local papers such as The Corkman and Kerryman print editions seem to feture them and they don't seem to appear online.

vicwatson

A good start might be that you cannot tax or insure your car unless you have a valid NCT cert, if they were serious about tackling ****e cars on the road like (maybe give a period of grace where you cannot legitimately get an NCT Test) and police the damn thing.

But of course, like lots of other things, there is no political will to do this.

vicwatson

freshpopcorn wrote: »

Hers's statics about road deaths between 2008-2012 saying excessive speed was a factor.

Yes excessive speed, but due to what? being drunk, drugged, suicide?

Atlantic Dawn

There should be a website listing the full details of each crash where a fatality has occured, the condition of the driver(s), car, legal status of car and driver on the road and the weather on the day etc.

shar01

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

There should be a website listing the full details of each crash where a fatality has occured, the condition of the driver(s), car, legal status of car and driver on the road and the weather on the day etc.

Can't remember where I read it but in some states in America, the very detailed accident report is available online.

Fighting Tao

shar01 wrote: »

Totally agree with an overview of the causes (you could add in poor road surface conditions).

Should snow be recorded as a cause because someone is driving 120kph on a snow covered road on summer tyres? People should drive in accordance to the conditions. Blaming the conditions is just another cop out.

Ursus Horribilis

vicwatson wrote: »

Yes excessive speed, but due to what? being drunk, drugged, suicide?

Or maybe because they're cnuts who treat the road like their personal racetrack?

antodeco

Unfortunately it's not as black and white as some of the replies here.

Better safety in cars, mean people feel safer driving them, meaning they're not as frightened to drive. Coupled with the disjoint a modern driver has with their car, they really aren't always in control.

For example, if I'm driving my car, built in 1980, no electronic assists, no safety equipment bar a seatbelt, I drive completely different, than if I'm driving my car built in 2015. I know if the older car, one slip up, and I could be cream crackered, so I drive differently. The modern car, in my mind I don't need to drive as "safe" as I've more room for error, and a significantly higher chance of survival/serious injury.

drunkmonkey

freshpopcorn wrote: »

In 2014 almost half of 42% were not wearing seat belts according to the RSA.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/road-safety-authority-says-42-of-those-killed-in-vehicles-not-wearing-seat-belts-1.2052342

Hers's statics about road deaths between 2008-2012 saying excessive speed was a factor.

http://www.rsa.ie/en/Utility/News/News-2016/Excessive-Speed-a-Factor-in-322-Road-Deaths-Between-2008-and-2012/



I do know somebody who was a witness to fatally collision(lead up to it). It was one of these accidents that was discussed about a lot of the time. It wasn't as clear cut as the people on the net made it out to be tough.(How it could have being prevented).
Well the person I know saw a journalist at the inquest. Their was no mention of it in the papers at the time because their was other things going on in the news.
If you are interested in reading about inquests OP I find their often in local papers such as The Corkman and Kerryman print editions seem to feture them and they don't seem to appear online.

Think you've just proven op's point with the first article. 42% weren't using a safety belt but it doesn't say 42% of what number in the article. It's a headline stat all we know from the article is 36 dead passengers but we don't know what % of them were wearing a belt and we don't know how many drivers were killed. It's doing everything bar tell the truth about how much danger the driver is actually in.

shar01

Fighting Tao wrote: »

Should snow be recorded as a cause because someone is driving 120kph on a snow covered road on summer tyres? People should drive in accordance to the conditions. Blaming the conditions is just another cop out.

But wouldn't that report reflect the weather conditions, the tyre type and the speed of the car also?

Macmillan150

If they were in a taxi they would probably still be alive. The fact is you rarely read about young people in Dublin dying like this, because there are options to socialise safely. There really needs to be some outside-the-box thinking to help young people socialise and drive safely. Being the designated sober driver, driving home on small dark country lanes at 4am is no easy job either. Sure we can tax, punish and overcharge our young people for driving. But realistically, we need some options to allow them to socialise safely. Tax breaks for rural taxis? Incentives for pubs to run buses? I don't know, but it's a problem that needs a solution.

Allinall

sandraiwhite@ya wrote: »

If they were in a taxi they would probably still be alive. The fact is you rarely read about young people in Dublin dying like this, because there are options to socialise safely. There really needs to be some outside-the-box thinking to help young people socialise and drive safely. Being the designated sober driver, driving home on small dark country lanes at 4am is no easy job either. Sure we can tax, punish and overcharge our young people for driving. But realistically, we need some options to allow them to socialise safely. Tax breaks for rural taxis? Incentives for pubs to run buses? I don't know, but it's a problem that needs a solution.

Thousands upon thousands of young people get themselves home safely every weekend.

Are all these just lucky?

NIMAN

Agreed, we simply need to instill the idea that its not ok to drink and drive, or take drugs and drive. Or speed crazily.

But then again, we have been trying to do that for decades now, and its not working.

Perhaps if accidents were reported openly it might be a small deterrent?
OR would that be cruel on a family who just lost a son or daughter for the country to know their child was plastered at the wheel?

I know of a few deaths in recent times locally where you'd hear "what about that accident, wasn't it terrible", when information has come out that the person was really drunk. Is it time we stopped this sympathy for idiots who want to drink and drive and often kill innocent people?

Macmillan150

We don't need sympathy for them. But thousands of Euro are spent checking to see if I'm doing 4km over the limit on a sunny Wednesday afternoon. I wouldn't mind if a little bit of that funding went on a taxi service in Donegal. Do I think the good teenagers of Dublin are a better class of citizen that those up in Donegal. Nope I don't. They just have more options. If we assume that 99.99% of teenagers can get home safely that's great. We either care or we don't care about the rest. If they want to kill themselves we are either bothered or we are not. I'd gladly allow some of my tax to go towards some late hours bus service. I subsidise the young crowd here getting buses into town when they could easily walk. Or could easily go the local pubs 100m down the road.

Ursus Horribilis

I don't think reporting is going to help one way or the other. There is feck all enforcement out there and an anti-social culture amongst a significant minority of motorists. The road which runs past my parent's house appears to be part of the local racetrack. The roads around there are black with doughnuts and skid marks and you can hear the cars screaming down the main road once evening time comes. Even if someone tried to ring the guards, nothing's going to be done about them. These gob****es know they can tear around the place with impunity. Anecdotally I've heard of quite a few walls/fences been hit locally. But of course, if any of these lads get killed they'll be eulogised from on high.

bmwguy

The excessive insurance costs on anything bigger than a Micra is a very valid point and one I didnt think of before. For some cases. Other cases are definitely people acting the boll*X in their cars though and bigger cars could make this worse.
Some are definitely suicide. Most are just bad driving and not driving to the conditions. Not necessarily by the deceased but by some party to the accident. Drink undoubtedly a factor too.

And speed. I drive motorways regularly and not ashamed to admit I go over the limit sometimes. 140/150 kmph on an empty dry road but never more. I will admit i should not do this. And I have a car designed for the job, it will do near 250 kmph top speed. The amount of older small cars I see doing the same speeds and more is surprising. Micras, Clios etc People pushing their cars as hard as they possibly can. I remember having a Peugeot 206 and it was pretty difficult to do those speeds and the car didn't feel stable at all.

nhunter100

NIMAN wrote:

I think we could at least compromise and release annual figures to explain all the crashes. For example, if 100 die this year, perhaps have something like 33 caused by driver being drunk, 22 caused by suicide, 20 caused by excessive speed, 5 caused by defective car, 3 were unaccompanied L drivers etc?

No thoughts on the condition of roads? this is also a mitigating factor is the cause of crashes.

Harry Palmr

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

There should be a website listing the full details of each crash where a fatality has occured, the condition of the driver(s), car, legal status of car and driver on the road and the weather on the day etc.

There used to be an Irish website some years back which used google maps for just this sort of thing. Dunno if it's still out there, I expect it was the work of one person so probably not.

As for the opening lament, the fatality rate is pretty low by international standards and nearly as low as it's ever been in Ireland. The swing upwards in the last couple of years is entirely links to the economy - more people driving more distance as jobs are created. Every death is a tragedy for some family but in the bigger scheme of things it's less of a pressing matter than suicide, preventable cancers, alcohol, strokes, fuel poverty etc.

Fatalities per 100,000 persons per year

World 17.4
Ireland 4.1 (14 lowest)

Fatalities per 100,000 cars per year

Ireland 7.6 (16th lowest)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_road_traffic_accidents_deaths_in_Republic_of_Ireland_by_year

corkgsxr

i would say the biggest 2 issues on roads are condition of roads and tire type.

if the roads were a good surface you can brake and corner better even with iffy mechanics, old cars and ****e tires

but i think the standard for tires should be increase hugely. how some of those things get through legislation is beyond me

also thing like i can buy brake pads for about 15/20 euro for most cars and there absolute ****e.

its a combo of issues. you can play with stats all you want but speed and drinking/drugs arent the biggest issues there just easy things to blame

carzony

The whole system needs to be renewed if they want to take road safety seriously.

Most people in Ireland complete their driving test in housing estates, this is not a good enough test of someones driving ability. The test should be extended to motorways, main roads, round-abouts, vehicle maintenance, ect..

There needs to be some serious crackdown by the Gardai as I don't think road safety is really taken very seriously anymore. They have great advertising campaigns but does the normal guard on the street really care?

In relation to the stats collected I don't really believe them. I just don't think younger drivers are as dangerous as they say. Most will be wearing seat belts because we have been trained to for the last 10+ years to do so. Any young driver I know or even any kids I know straight away put on a belt.

The standard of driving is just very bad in Ireland and it will never change unless their is wide spread reform.

The Rape of Lucretia

Governing all cars to a max 120kph would be a start.

But yes, OP's point has merit. The '19 year old lone driver killed when his car "left the road" at 3am on a Saturday. No other cars were involved'. We know what it was. But acknowledging that publicly seems to be a problem.

freshpopcorn

carzony wrote: »

In relation to the stats collected I don't really believe them. I just don't think younger drivers are as dangerous as they say. Most will be wearing seat belts because we have been trained to for the last 10+ years to do so. Any young driver I know or even any kids I know straight away put on a belt.

I'm 25 this year and when I went to college when I was 18 I thought all young people wore seat belts. However I was amazed at the amount of people who didn't either driving or being passengers.
We had all the road safety demonstrations in school and some at college and if I'm being honest I don't think it made any really difference to us.

The Rape of Lucretia

carzony wrote: »

In relation to the stats collected I don't really believe them.

Nobody is cooking the stats. Not believing them because they dont conform to preconceived beliefs, or with the infinitesimal sample of personal experience, is just a head in the sand reaction.

IsaacWunder

Road deaths have halved over the last 10 years. They're down to nearly 1/3 of where they were 20 years ago. I think it's no coincidence that the same period saw the introduction of better roads, particularly the motorway network linking Dublin to the cities. Imagine how many more lives could be saved if they built a decent road network linking the rest of the country?

The Rape of Lucretia

IsaacWunder wrote: »

Road deaths have halved over the last 10 years. They're down to nearly 1/3 of where they were 20 years ago. I think it's no coincidence that the same period saw the introduction of better roads, particularly the motorway network linking Dublin to the cities.

You are correct to think that it is no coincidence. It is not contested that it is one of several factors. As it is no coincidence that in the same period saw the introduction of penalty points, increased speed detection, a change in drink driving culture, the elimination of unaccompanied learners, and the NCT.
For the influence of each of these beyond coincidence, it is necessary to study the statistics.

marno21

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

You are correct to think that it is no coincidence. It is not contested that it is one of several factors. As it is no coincidence that in the same period saw the introduction of penalty points, increased speed detection, a change in drink driving culture, the elimination of unaccompanied learners, and the NCT.
For the influence of each of these beyond coincidence, it is necessary to study the statistics.

Indeed. The days of hearing of frequent fatal head on collisions on well over capacity roads such as the old N1, N3, N4, N6, N7, N8, N9 and N11 are thankfully gone. A lot of dangerous stretches were also bypassed or realigned over the years, especially notorious stretches like the Ballinameesda bends on the N11 and that chronic stretch on the N6 west of Ballinasloe.

More needs to be done in this regard, such as the 6 people that died on the N20 Cork-Limerick road last year, and the frequent crashes on the busy but poor roads such as the N4 in Sligo, the N17, the N21, N22 and N24. National secondary roads need a good look at too such as the N72 and the N76.

Improving roads such as the N20 will go a lot further in cutting the rate of deaths than GoSafe vans and introducing bans for people between 22mg and 35mg of alcohol per 100ml of blood.

oppenheimer1

corkgsxr wrote: »

i would say the biggest 2 issues on roads are condition of roads and tire type.

if the roads were a good surface you can brake and corner better even with iffy mechanics, old cars and ****e tires

but i think the standard for tires should be increase hugely. how some of those things get through legislation is beyond me

also thing like i can buy brake pads for about 15/20 euro for most cars and there absolute ****e.

its a combo of issues. you can play with stats all you want but speed and drinking/drugs arent the biggest issues there just easy things to blame

I would throw in dangerous overtaking as well.

Donegal does have a specific cultural problem though - boy racers acting the bollocks on lonely country roads at weekend nights

Victor

Harry Palmr wrote: »

There used to be an Irish website some years back which used google maps for just this sort of thing. Dunno if it's still out there, I expect it was the work of one person so probably not.

http://www.rsa.ie/RSA/Road-Safety/Our-Research/Collision-Statistics/Ireland-Road-Collisions/

http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Road-Safety/Our-Research/Collision-Statistics/

carzony wrote: »

In relation to the stats collected I don't really believe them. I just don't think younger drivers are as dangerous as they say.

Then disprove them. The attached is information that I collected myself over a period of years. Many cases include names. You can check the facts yourself.

orcam

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

I would throw in dangerous overtaking as well.

Donegal does have a specific cultural problem though - boy racers acting the bollocks on lonely country roads at weekend nights

Donegal is such a good example. 20 year olds, 4 am, ditch and dead. Week in, week out it's Donegal and its another family destroyed. So put your police force and your speeding vans to best effect and put them on these roads, not the 60km limit dual carridgeway where you pick up easy money. And it would be nice if our representatives provided jobs for our youngsters in such areas. It's understandable that kids in these areas would be bored senseless when they are provided no future. And its easy to respond and say let them go to Dublin. But families can't afford that when parents livelehoods,for example fishing, has been sold to Europe by our political 'friends' in dublin

mikemac2

NIMAN wrote: »

For example, if 100 die this year, perhaps have something like 33 caused by driver being drunk, 22 caused by suicide, 20 caused by excessive speed, 5 caused by defective car, 3 were unaccompanied L drivers etc?

I don't see falling asleep at the wheel there and I think there are fatalities every year because of it. The RSA have a campaign specifically about resting during your journey

I know you weren't attempting to list possible reason, just that jumped out to me.

orcam

mikemac2 wrote: »

I don't see falling asleep at the wheel there and I think there are fatalities every year because of it. The RSA have a campaign specifically about resting during your journey

I know you weren't attempting to list possible reason, just that jumped out to me.

Last time I checked jobs don't pay for you taking a rest. You get up at 5am, you travel to your job, you get there at 8am, you clock in, you leave at 5pm, you get home to put your kids to bed at 8pm, and you do this every week. Exactly who pays for you being late for work because you needed a rest?

Del2005

sandraiwhite@ya wrote: »

If they were in a taxi they would probably still be alive. The fact is you rarely read about young people in Dublin dying like this, because there are options to socialise safely. There really needs to be some outside-the-box thinking to help young people socialise and drive safely. Being the designated sober driver, driving home on small dark country lanes at 4am is no easy job either. Sure we can tax, punish and overcharge our young people for driving. But realistically, we need some options to allow them to socialise safely. Tax breaks for rural taxis? Incentives for pubs to run buses? I don't know, but it's a problem that needs a solution.

A taxi in Dublin does huge hours to make any money, and a lot aren't that good a driver as there is only a theory test for a taxi licence once they pass our basic motor test. A taxi in a rural area would be doing way more hours and they will be more dangerous than a sober driver.

The reason why young people in Dublin don't die on narrow country boreens is because people in Dublin don't live on narrow country boreens.

I remember a few years ago reading a detailed air incident report in several newspapers where a light aircraft could have hit a mountain in Kerry as it hadn't set something correctly, but they were flying in clear weather and didn't hit anything. We have very few air incidents yet the amount of detail in the press was huge, yet we loose a 737 on the roads every year and nothing is published. If a pilot who didn't hit a mountain can have the full details published all serious RTCs should have the same details published, especially since a fatality costs €3m.

Really Interested

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

There should be a website listing the full details of each crash where a fatality has occured, the condition of the driver(s), car, legal status of car and driver on the road and the weather on the day etc.

http://www.rsa.ie/Documents/Road%20Safety/Crash%20Stats/RSA%20Provisional%20Review%20of%20Fatalities%202016.pdf

http://www.cso.ie/px/pxeirestat/pssn/rsa/Database/RSA/Road%20Safety%20Statistics/Road%20Safety%20Statistics.asp

Plenty of stats online already.

Really Interested

NIMAN wrote: »

Agreed, we simply need to instill the idea that its not ok to drink and drive, or take drugs and drive. Or speed crazily.

But then again, we have been trying to do that for decades now, and its not working.

Perhaps if accidents were reported openly it might be a small deterrent?
OR would that be cruel on a family who just lost a son or daughter for the country to know their child was plastered at the wheel?

I know of a few deaths in recent times locally where you'd hear "what about that accident, wasn't it terrible", when information has come out that the person was really drunk. Is it time we stopped this sympathy for idiots who want to drink and drive and often kill innocent people?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_road_traffic_accidents_deaths_in_Republic_of_Ireland_by_year

1972 640 deaths on Irish roads 2012 160 deaths so we doing something right.

There are plenty of stats relating to deaths on the roads by year month and reasons.

mikemac2

orcam wrote: »

Last time I checked jobs don't pay for you taking a rest. You get up at 5am, you travel to your job, you get there at 8am, you clock in, you leave at 5pm, you get home to put your kids to bed at 8pm, and you do this every week. Exactly who pays for you being late for work because you needed a rest?

Bit of a narky reply

The OP lists reasons for fatalities, tiredness at the wheel is one and the RSA recognise this.

Really Interested

mikemac2 wrote: »

Bit of a narky reply

The OP lists reasons for fatalities, tiredness at the wheel is one and the RSA recognise this.

The RSA say 1 in 5 seats are due to it.

"It is estimated that driver fatigue is a contributory factor in as many as 1 in 5 driver deaths in Ireland every year."

http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Road-Safety/Campaigns/Current-road-safety-campaigns/Drunk-With-Tiredness/

corks finest

NIMAN wrote: »

It seems every couple of days there is another road death in the country.

Every one a tragedy, a family ruined for life, lives lost needlessly.

At this point, it feels like we are just paying lip service to the issue, and things don't seem to be getting any better.

Is it not time for us to be more honest and face up to what is causing these fatalities? They are reported for the day it happens, and then usually we move on to the next news story until another person dies.

Unless its a high profile crash, like the one that killed 8 up here in Donegal, we usually never hear any follow up. Perhaps it would be cruel to admit the cause for the grieving family? But is it achieving anything by us saying "those poor lads, so young, dying on that country road at 4am", instead of being told that those poor lads were 6 times over the limit to drive?

I think we could at least compromise and release annual figures to explain all the crashes. For example, if 100 die this year, perhaps have something like 33 caused by driver being drunk, 22 caused by suicide, 20 caused by excessive speed, 5 caused by defective car, 3 were unaccompanied L drivers etc?

Usually you tackle a problem by admitting whats wrong.

Thoughts?

My exact thought, each,and every time I hear about a tragic fatal accident,, mostly young, early hours etc,etc.

corks finest

Really Interested wrote: »

mikemac2 wrote: »

Bit of a narky reply

The OP lists reasons for fatalities, tiredness at the wheel is one and the RSA recognise this.

The RSA say 1 in 5 seats are due to it.

"It is estimated that driver fatigue is a contributory factor in as many as 1 in 5 driver deaths in Ireland every year."

http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Road-Safety/Campaigns/Current-road-safety-campaigns/Drunk-With-Tiredness/

Yes,and combine drink,drugs with tiredness ,and the disaster is waiting to catch you out.

eeguy

vicwatson wrote: »

Yes excessive speed, but due to what? being drunk, drugged, suicide?

Due to being a f*cking idiot.

Lad I know was killed in a crash. Excessive speed, no seatbelt. The passenger was grand as he was belted up.

Newspapers report accident, tragedy etc, Where's the lesson learned in that? It would be easily avoidable if he had his belt on and wasn't trying to show off.

Obviously they feel they can't speak ill of the dead, but you have to draw the line somewhere. You have to point the finger and say "That lad got himself killed, don't be like him".

Wibbs

NIMAN wrote: »

Agreed, we simply need to instill the idea that its not ok to drink and drive, or take drugs and drive. Or speed crazily.

But then again, we have been trying to do that for decades now, and its not working.

The number of cars, miles travelled and average speeds in Ireland have gone up massively in the last forty years, yet the accident and fatality rates have consistently dropped throughout that period. As Really Interested pointed out above the fatality stats have dropped to a quarter of what they were in the 1970's. So yeah it's working extremely well actually. We're quite simply and provably safer on the roads than we were. That doesn't mean we can't look to problems that still exist and try to solve them, but no need for hyperbole and unwarranted panic either.

As for drinking and driving, the attitude towards that has changed massively in the same time period. Even within the time period since I started driving in the 80's. It was far more acceptable then.

Fighting Tao

Using the word 'accident' is wrong too. It gives comfort to people...'ah sure he was just unfortunate that he was in an accident'. The cause is usually left out in that case.

Accidents just don't happen on the roads. There's a multitude of reasons for collisions. There is always a reason.

Comhrá

"...no other vehicle was involved..."

"...when his/her vehicle hit a tree/wall at 4am...."

"...when the vehicle left the road....." and so on.

These are the usual media reports following fatal crashes, and most people will deduce, rightly or wrongly, that the driver was speeding, had alcohol or drugs consumed, nodded off at the wheel or was texting on their phone - and thus being distracted or losing control - as being the cause of the fatal crash, but then these are not accidents, they are the result of neglect, or failure to drive with care & attention.

Notwithstanding the distress caused to families of the deceased on top of their grief and loss, the causes of these fatal crashes should be reported in full, as soon as the inquests are completed.

There is a culture of secrecy among authorities in Ireland unlike the openness found in countries like the US where road safely is concerned. More openness leads to more education & awareness and that might enlighten a few drivers and save a few lives at least.

marno21

RIP, a cyclist has been killed on the Ballincolliig bypass in Co. Cork. A 120km/h dual carraigeway.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/cyclist-dies-after-road-accident-in-co-cork-789633.html

Del2005

Comhra wrote: »

"...no other vehicle was involved..."

"...when his/her vehicle hit a tree/wall at 4am...."

"...when the vehicle left the road....." and so on.

These are the usual media reports following fatal crashes, and most people will deduce, rightly or wrongly, that the driver was speeding, had alcohol or drugs consumed, nodded off at the wheel or was texting on their phone - and thus being distracted or losing control - as being the cause of the fatal crash, but then these are not accidents, they are the result of neglect, or failure to drive with care & attention.

Notwithstanding the distress caused to families of the deceased on top of their grief and loss, the causes of these fatal crashes should be reported in full, as soon as the inquests are completed.

There is a culture of secrecy among authorities in Ireland unlike the openness found in countries like the US where road safely is concerned. More openness leads to more education & awareness and that might enlighten a few drivers and save a few lives at least.

The elephant in the room for a lot of the single vehicle fatalities is that they where planned and the DUI/excess speed was the Dutch courage and means to commit suicide, but to admit that would mean that our politicians would have to face the bigger problem in our society.

whoopsadoodles

Del2005 wrote: »

The elephant in the room for a lot of the single vehicle fatalities is that they where planned and the DUI/excess speed was the Dutch courage and means to commit suicide, but to admit that would mean that our politicians would have to face the bigger problem in our society.

There are also guidelines on how suicides should be reported in the media. And reporting how someone killed themselves is very much against those guidelines.

Del2005

whoopsadoodles wrote: »

There are also guidelines on how suicides should be reported in the media. And reporting how someone killed them is very much against those guidelines.

So if I kill some random stranger the media can post the full story, after the case, yet if I kill myself they can't post anything? Once the corners report is done it should be public knowledge. Burying our heads' in the sand isn't reducing suicide. Why is murder suicide allowed to be reported and not suicide?

whoopsadoodles

Del2005 wrote: »

So if I kill some random stranger the media can post the full story, after the case, yet if I kill myself they can't post anything? Once the corners report is done it should be public knowledge. Burying our heads' in the sand isn't reducing suicide. Why is murder suicide allowed to be reported and not suicide?

Don't shoot the messenger.

http://www.samaritans.org/your-community/samaritans-ireland-scotland-and-wales/samaritans-ireland/media-guidelines-ireland

Research shows that inappropriate reporting of suicide may lead to imitational behaviour.

Elemonator

There is too much beating around the bush when it comes to this topic in Ireland. We are all privately thinking it. You only have to visit Facebook pages belonging to the media to see some people calling it out for what it is only to get quietened by people who think its disrespectful to families. The blame in many of cases lies with drink driving, not wearing a seatbelt, and speeding. I know someone who was killed in these conditions.