farmers journal farm

Bellview

Just saw farmers journal have leased a farm. Will be interesting how this fits within its business and what is real objective

tanko

Are the suckler herds in Derrypatrick and Athenry still on the go?

Base price

Bellview wrote: »

Just saw farmers journal have leased a farm. Will be interesting how this fits within its business and what is real objective

What type of enterprise?

Farrell

Base price wrote: »

What type of enterprise?

It appears to be a demonstration farm with sucklers & sheep, where they will give a count of performance & show us how to run an efficient farm

ganmo

Sucklers and sheep.
Gonna be interesting whatever happens

charolais0153

tanko wrote: »

Are the suckler herds in Derrypatrick and Athenry still on the go?

Ya. Badly tho. Athenry had a massive bill for mastitis related issues and derrypatrick had a large empty rate at scanning

The part time boy

Not sure how I feel about this . Does not sit well but I dunno why .

Probably cause I don't like there imparablety when it comes to the ifa

charolais0153

Ya it'll be interesting to see how its managed with beef and sheep. Its fierce handy for lads to let out weanlings in Feb when the ewes haven't to be fed even though there's only a small proportion of ewes to cattle.

bonaparte2

Fair play to them for trying. I hope it succeeds .

Base price

Farrell wrote: »

It appears to be a demonstration farm with sucklers & sheep, where they will give a count of performance & show us how to run an efficient farm

Ah will ye stop pulling me leg sure the Farm Centre doesn't do comedy!

Bellview

charolais0153 wrote:

Ya. Badly tho. Athenry had a massive bill for mastitis related issues and derrypatrick had a large empty rate at scanning

Were derry Patrick using a lot of ai or was it just fertility

blue5000

Bellview wrote: »

Were derry Patrick using a lot of ai or was it just fertility

I think it was BVD. Don't hear as much about derrypatrick since Athenry got going.

Siamsa Sessions

I'm guessing it'll be covered in the paper itself this week, but I wonder if Teagasc has its nose out of joint with this new demo farm. Aren't they supposed to be the experts who report their results and tell farmers what to do?

Or are Teagasc "partners" in the venture? Along with others (Dawn, Kepak, etc.)???

If the Journal farm turns out to be independent, then it'll be good to have another voice out there (even if they are "on friendly terms" with the IFA).

As with everything, the devil will be in the detail; e.g. will they try to mimic existing farms (managing part-time, etc.) or will it be completely focused on output whatever the cost? Will they have advisors in place for farmers to access? Plenty questions to answer yet.

Muckit

Does anyone know the place? I don't, but I'm not convinced that the land is as they say, typical of that which most suckler farmers are working with!

I wonder will they have open days and if so, will there be an admission fee at the gate? Or perhaps admission with 10 IFJ newspaper header mastheads! :cool:

blue5000

I wonder did they get into GLAS on time?:D

Muckit

And the owners are keeping the BPS..........they can come use my cabbage patch as a demo farm here anytime!! They could call it 'the out farm' or whatever else they want for that matter!

larthehar

For anyone on snapchat, the IFJ story is about this farm.. getting some insight into it..

Bellview

blue5000 wrote:

I wonder did they get into GLAS on time?

Need the skates on for genomics too

Siamsa Sessions

More info here: http://www.farmersjournal.ie/tullamore-farm-a-new-venture-for-the-irish-farmers-journal-270667

TITANIUM.

Muckit wrote: »

Does anyone know the place? I don't, but I'm not convinced that the land is as they say, typical of that which most suckler farmers are working with!

It's next to the golf course up there according to the literature, So like yourself I'm not convinced either.

rangler1

TITANIUM. wrote: »

It's next to the golf course up there according to the literature, So like yourself I'm not convinced either.

It's very near the tullamore show ground and the ploughing site, Golf club wouldn't be great land.. it's peaty around there

lakill Farm

audited accounts by IFAC . That will hurt the bottom line :rolleyes:

annubis

video up on youtube of the place, no more than athenry the land looks very good to me compared to alot of west of ireland sucker farms

TITANIUM.

annubis wrote: »

video up on youtube of the place, no more than athenry the land looks very good to me compared to alot of west of ireland sucker farms

Ya just saw it there your right. It's 180 acres aswell so allot bigger than the average suckler farm. But they did say they needed it big enough to merit paying a full time manager in fairness.

All things considered tho I say fair play to them. It should be interesting, they didn't have to go out and do this. They claim that they are going to report on what they did wrong as well as right so it's hard to argue with that. Maybe we might learn something out of it.

Sheep breeder

Is this farm linked to the dealer column in the rag and brother of the recently retired senior inspector of the dept of ag for livestock inspections.

rangler1

TITANIUM. wrote: »

Ya just saw it there your right. It's 180 acres aswell so allot bigger than the average suckler farm. But they did say they needed it big enough to merit paying a full time manager in fairness.

All things considered tho I say fair play to them. It should be interesting, they didn't have to go out and do this. They claim that they are going to report on what they did wrong as well as right so it's hard to argue with that. Maybe we might learn something out of it.

IFJ give a lot back to farmers at events, etc, it was only a matter of time before they did something like this. Don't think there's any mixed grazing demonstration farm in the country, huge opportunity to cut costs on the 120 ewes on that farm while selling €20,000 worth of lambs
As you say they need a proper farm to justify a manager....the average suckler farm is now becoming only a hobby/parttime job and be stupid to use as a model

rangler1

Sheep breeder wrote: »

Is this farm linked to the dealer column in the rag and brother of the recently retired senior inspector of the dept of ag for livestock inspections.

If it is, they didn't get a great rent for it

Water John

Yeah rent is low enough. but as long as the family are happy.
Great to see the trust between all with the 60 cows landed on the farm, a month before the lease was agreed and signed.

I presume from the story detail that the family kept over 20 acres out of the lease.

rangler1

Water John wrote: »

Yeah rent is low enough. but as long as the family are happy.
Great to see the trust between all with the 60 cows landed on the farm, a month before the lease was agreed and signed.

I presume from the story detail that the family kept over 20 acres out of the lease.

To exercise the dogs.
Only signed the lease on my place today and the manure and stock on the farm over a mth

tractorporn

Muckit wrote:

Does anyone know the place? I don't, but I'm not convinced that the land is as they say, typical of that which most suckler farmers are working with!

rangler1 wrote:

It's very near the tullamore show ground and the ploughing site, Golf club wouldn't be great land.. it's peaty around there

No matter how peaty it is it will not be within an asses roar of the land that the majority of West of Ireland suckler farmers are on. If they wanted land that was typical of suckler farmers they should have went to Boyle or Drumshanbo and had to take a fragmented farm with land in 5/6 different spots.

Water John

Best wishes on you retirement Rangler.

rangler1

Water John wrote: »

Best wishes on you retirement Rangler.

Thanks
Only a third of the farm leased yet, still have to finish out this year,
Also going to keep 10 acres to exercise the dogs

Water John

A couple of Piebalds and Skewbalds to keep the grass down.

bogman_bass

tractorporn wrote: »

No matter how peaty it is it will not be within an asses roar of the land that the majority of West of Ireland suckler farmers are on. If they wanted land that was typical of suckler farmers they should have went to Boyle or Drumshanbo and had to take a fragmented farm with land in 5/6 different spots.

Remember that not all suckler farmers are west of the Shannon.

What's typical in your parish isn't typical in another

Cavanjack

Muckit wrote: »

And the owners are keeping the BPS..........they can come use my cabbage patch as a demo farm here anytime!! They could call it 'the out farm' or whatever else they want for that matter!

There is a review of cap in 2019 is there not. I wonder will this effect non active farmers. They have leased their land for 15 years. It would be some blow to loose a chunk of their BPS.

Who2

bogman_bass wrote: »

Remember that not all suckler farmers are west of the Shannon.

What's typical in your parish isn't typical in another

I often think people west of the Shannon think they are the only suckler farmers in ireland. I'd say it's a fair average when the rest of the country is included.

The part time boy

Cavanjack wrote: »

Muckit wrote: »

And the owners are keeping the BPS..........they can come use my cabbage patch as a demo farm here anytime!! They could call it 'the out farm' or whatever else they want for that matter!

There is a review of cap in 2019 is there not. I wonder will this effect non active farmers. They have leased their land for 15 years. It would be some blow to loose a chunk of their BPS.

Highly likely . And they locked In 140 acres until 2022.

This seems very foolish . They could loss bps in 2020 and only get 140 while the journal could get a new land based bps for been active farmer

rangler1

The part time boy wrote: »

Highly likely . And they locked In 140 acres until 2022.

This seems very foolish . They could loss bps in 2020 and only get 140 while the journal could get a new land based bps for been active farmer

Landlords shouldn't get BPS anyway, For a lease to be succesful there has to be some twist in it for both.
I'm in the same position myself, you can't bring it with you and if no one is interested you just do the best you can. The tax free rent plus 20000 contributory pension for a couple plus whatever other pension you paid into means you won't starve.
The BPS will be a bonus as long as it lasts

The part time boy

rangler1 wrote: »

The part time boy wrote: »

Highly likely . And they locked In 140 acres until 2022.

This seems very foolish . They could loss bps in 2020 and only get 140 while the journal could get a new land based bps for been active farmer

Landlords shouldn't get BPS anyway, For a lease to be succesful there has to be some twist in it for both.
I'm in the same position myself, you can't bring it with you and if no one is interested you just do the best you can. The tax free rent plus 20000 contributory pension for a couple plus whatever other pension you paid into means you won't starve.
The BPS will be a bonus as long as it lasts

That's fair enough and I actally agree with you . However 140 seems a small bit low where the tenant is getting no bps. It going to be very very low if it naked land in 2020.

If i was the landlord I would be having a rent review in 2020 not 2022

rangler1

The part time boy wrote: »

That's fair enough and I actally agree with you . However 140 seems a small bit low where the tenant is getting no bps. It going to be very very low if it naked land in 2020.

If i was the landlord I would be having a rent review in 2020 not 2022

He should've put it on the open market but the land will be minded, There's no doubt that the hope value of reference years set the high price of mine....if I can hold it there now for ten years it'll be a miracle but if the tenant gets my entitlements it'll sweeten it for him....he seems a good guy anyway

Muckit

The part time boy wrote: »

That's fair enough and I actally agree with you . However 140 seems a small bit low where the tenant is getting no bps. It going to be very very low if it naked land in 2020.

If i was the landlord I would be having a rent review in 2020 not 2022

They not foolish. I'm sure they've thought about selling the entitlements or leasing them to journal if that scenario plays out. I doubt they'll go wasted anyways!

Green farmer

rangler1 wrote: »

he seems a good guy anyway

Always makes it easier to have someone in that you can get along with.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Cavanjack wrote: »

There is a review of cap in 2019 is there not. I wonder will this effect non active farmers. They have leased their land for 15 years. It would be some blow to loose a chunk of their BPS.

There will be revisions in the ANC qualifying lands next year as well. It's looking like a lot of currently qualifying land will be locked out and some currently locked out may get in, depending on CAP funds post Brexit.

rangler1

Muckit wrote: »

They not foolish. I'm sure they've thought about selling the entitlements or leasing them to journal if that scenario plays out. I doubt they'll go wasted anyways!

Wonder how they apparently kept the entitlements while leasing the land to the farmers journal....where are they going to claim on now,...must look in to that trick when i find out what it is

TITANIUM.

rangler1 wrote: »

Wonder how they apparently kept the entitlements while leasing the land to the farmers journal....where are they going to claim on now,...must look in to that trick when i find out what it is

I'd expect that the animals or enough of them anyway are being transferred into there herd no. Or joint herd number.
I know it's happening that way in allot of places.

tractorporn

bogman_bass wrote:

Remember that not all suckler farmers are west of the Shannon.

bogman_bass wrote:

What's typical in your parish isn't typical in another

Not my parish but I just don't think that 180 acres of ex tillage land in one block is typical of most suckler farmers in the country.

I think it's a good idea, and wish them well it's about time we had someone else other than Teagasc doing some research.

The part time boy

Another popular way of it been done is the journal lease the land and entitlements and they hang over the bps money straight over .

If it's been done this way I still think it silly having a rent review in 2022 not 2020.

Land with entilments been kept by the landowner is making around 150 around here . I agree with ye that If its a good farmer taking it 140 is noproblem . In fact that's what I do .

Naked land around here can make from 250 to 300.

So if there doing it as a partnership then the land owner will probably keep a never version of bps as his still putting it through in his name .

Then review date make a sense . But if his name is not on the area aid form them more than likely to loss any future bps . So he could be lossing out on 160 euro . I don't care how good the tenant is . That a big discount

Bellview

Is this the farm that was mentioned by charolais society at their agm as option for their own testing. .will be interesting to watch

rangler1

The part time boy wrote: »

Another popular way of it been done is the journal lease the land and entitlements and they hang over the bps money straight over .

If it's been done this way I still think it silly having a rent review in 2022 not 2020.

Land with entilments been kept by the landowner is making around 150 around here . I agree with ye that If its a good farmer taking it 140 is noproblem . In fact that's what I do .

Naked land around here can make from 250 to 300.

So if there doing it as a partnership then the land owner will probably keep a never version of bps as his still putting it through in his name .

Then review date make a sense . But if his name is not on the area aid form them more than likely to loss any future bps . So he could be lossing out on 160 euro . I don't care how good the tenant is . That a big discount

Not much point in having your name on the BPS when there isn't tenants that'll tolerate the landlords claiming it,
With the numbers of farmers giving up and looking for tenants, taking the BPS from landlords might be the only way to keep young guys interested.
Maybe it's because all my friends are trying to retire with no takers (among them two with 600 acre each), but I see big problems coming down the track.
It's alright saying to keep the BPS away from the tenants until there is no tenants

GrasstoMilk

rangler1 wrote: »

Not much point in having your name on the BPS when there isn't tenants that'll tolerate the landlords claiming it,
With the numbers of farmers giving up and looking for tenants, taking the BPS from landlords might be the only way to keep young guys interested.
Maybe it's because all my friends are trying to retire with no takers (among them two with 600 acre each), but I see big problems coming down the track.
It's alright saying to keep the BPS away from the tenants until there is no tenants

Tbh at this stage Rangler I'd happily give back the SFP if I could even get land to lease around me.
Lot of land not utilised to its full potential around me and they get awful insulted if you ask would they lease any.
And these are lads well past there prime with no successors.

rangler1

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

Tbh at this stage Rangler I'd happily give back the SFP if I could even get land to lease around me.
Lot of land not utilised to its full potential around me and they get awful insulted if you ask would they lease any.
And these are lads well past there prime with no successors.

I'd say a few years will solve a lot of your problems, There's a lot of farms with no successors. Hope my tenant is hungry for more land next year,
I'm farming 45 years now and I won't be looking to be involved from now on in order to keep my name on the BPS form....