Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Renting in RPZ - landlord has decided to refurb so he can increase rent

  • 04-04-2017 11:43am
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,967 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    So just to share my experience and anger...
    We've been renting for 6 years. Were actually planning on buying towards the end of the year. Rent was reasonable as the property was bottom end. The landlord notified us of a rent increase a few months ago in line with the 4%, but in the meantime has done the maths and figured out that a refurb and tenant change would be worth it, so has notified us of this.

    I now have to find a place for a family of 4 with a dog in September. While my daughter starts school in September. While I try to get mortgage approval in December to buy sometime in the new year.

    So yeah, thank you for meddling. Your ill conceived populist 4% has put my family on the street. It's going to be awesome craic trying to rent a place in the area with 2 kids and a dog. And IF I manage to get a place, I'll be annoying the landlord by exiting the lease early.

    So realistically, my only option is to serve notice on my tenants who've done nothing to me only being great tenants. I hate to do it, but what choice do I have. I evict them, and I save myself in the region of €1800 per month. We squeeze into the two bed for a handful of months. And then re rent.

    So fair play again to the government. Great job.
    .


«1

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,836 ✭✭✭Gloomtastic!


    ^ The reason why socialists, or any flavour thereof, should never be let near government ever!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,144 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    ^ The reason why socialists, or any flavour thereof, should never be let near government ever!
    Fine Gael are a flavour of socialist now?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,780 ✭✭✭sentient_6


    You are also a landlord yourself? Your rant is confusing.

    Are you serious raving about the government putting you on the street while you actually own property you are renting to someone else?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19 estee11


    his post is 100% clear.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,100 ✭✭✭Browney7


    And government action and inaction in equal measure has realistically helped to increase the value of the apartment you own albeit probably still in negative equity...


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,967 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    sentient_6 wrote: »
    You are also a landlord yourself? Your rant is confusing.
    "Accidental" landlord.
    Are you serious raving about the government putting you on the street while you actually own property you are renting to someone else?
    Yes I am. I'm going to have to boot out my tenants. They are also going to be -vely impacted. And good luck to them renting a 2 bed city centre apartment.
    This is because the Government meddled. Hed they not, I wouldn't be leaving my property, and I wouldn't be evicting my tenants.

    Can you seriously not see the impact and problems this all causes?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,608 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    estee11 wrote: »
    his post is 100% clear.

    It's anything but.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,836 ✭✭✭Gloomtastic!


    Fine Gael are a flavour of socialist now?

    The measure was introduced by Alan Kelly/Labour in the last government and continued as populist nonsense by the current clowns......


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,548 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    It seems it is the o/p's tenants who are really being shafted, not the o/p. I wonder why they are not having a rant.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 855 ✭✭✭mickoneill31


    I don't know if it's incompetence or maliciousness on the government's part. When Alan Kelly introduced his rent caps a couple of years ago anybody could see that rents would fly up. Then the first time buyers assistance this year sounds like a great idea. Except we've no supply so anybody could see what that would do for property in Ireland.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,548 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    The whole thing is being driven by the need to be seen to "do something". The numerous easy things which could be done are not being done. It is just headline grabbing antics which are happening.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,643 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    It seems it is the o/p's tenants who are really being shafted, not the o/p. I wonder why they are not having a rant.

    It is probably reasonable to suggest nobody is doing well in this scenario.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,599 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Zulu wrote: »
    So just to share my experience and anger...
    We've been renting for 6 years. Were actually planning on buying towards the end of the year. Rent was reasonable as the property was bottom end. The landlord notified us of a rent increase a few months ago in line with the 4%, but in the meantime has done the maths and figured out that a refurb and tenant change would be worth it, so has notified us of this.

    Why not offer to say screw the 4%, pay a little extra and keep your current tenancy till the end of the year. Remember of course that had the 4% not come in you would probably have gotten a bigger price rise at the last rent review.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 454 ✭✭KindOfIrish


    Zulu wrote: »
    So just to share my experience and anger...
    We've been renting for 6 years. Were actually planning on buying towards the end of the year. Rent was reasonable as the property was bottom end. The landlord notified us of a rent increase a few months ago in line with the 4%, but in the meantime has done the maths and figured out that a refurb and tenant change would be worth it, so has notified us of this.

    I now have to find a place for a family of 4 with a dog in September. While my daughter starts school in September. While I try to get mortgage approval in December to buy sometime in the new year.

    So yeah, thank you you fucking cretins for meddling. Your ill conceived populist 4% bullshit has put my family on the street. It's going to be awesome fucking craic trying to rent a place in the area with 2 kids and a dog. And IF I manage to get a place, I'll be pissing off the landlord by exiting the lease early.

    So realistically, my only option is to serve notice on my tenants who've done nothing to me only being great tenants. I hate to do it, but what choice do I have. I evict them, and I save myself in the region of €1800 per month. We squeeze into the two bed for a handful of months. And then re rent.

    So fair play again to the government. Great job.
    Morons.

    Just make an offer to your landlord to pay current market rent before you buy your own place. I don't think it's a crime to ignore the 4% cap.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,627 ✭✭✭Fol20


    Why not offer to say screw the 4%, pay a little extra and keep your current tenancy till the end of the year. Remember of course that had the 4% not come in you would probably have gotten a bigger price rise at the last rent review.

    Maybe not. Personally I haven't really increased rent for a good few years for my tenants. But now with new rules, to protect myself. I will try and keep rents as close to market rent as possible


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 465 ✭✭76544567


    Why not offer to say screw the 4%, pay a little extra and keep your current tenancy till the end of the year. Remember of course that had the 4% not come in you would probably have gotten a bigger price rise at the last rent review.

    A LL cannot do this as then if the tenant ever falls out with him the RTB will punish him severely. You just can't take the risk.

    Op i hear ya. I had several properties let at way below market rates and the new rules have seriously undermined me. I tried to find ways to stay in the business but it's easier to get out from under the RTB. So i have to say goodbye to 3 sets of tenants this year who i was happy to let at below market rates the last few years. But the future is so bleak for landlords i just had to get out.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Serious question;

    If your landlord was willing to boot out perfectly good tenants and refurb the property to get more than 4%, do you think he wouldn't have done that if he had free reign to increase the rent? Do you think he's only looking for 5 or 8% increase? What would you have done if he asked for a 15% increase and you refused?

    You're right in that the government has just been polishing a turd and the rental sector won't work for anyone until the supply issues in the private sector catch up. But I think you're definitely barking up the wrong tree if you think you'd be in a much better situation without the caps.

    Realistically if you're going for mortgage approval this is all going in your favour in the long run because your rent isn't going up by an insane amount and eating into your ability to save.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,643 ✭✭✭dubrov


    Landlord rents below market rate and decides to up to market rate.
    I don't see how the new 4% rules have anything to do with it.
    Without it, he could just up the rent and not have to do a refurb.

    If you are on good terms with your landlord, explain your situation and I am sure you can come to some arrangement.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,643 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    dubrov wrote: »
    Without it, he could just up the rent and not have to do a refurb.

    That may suit some tenants in specific circumstances like the OP.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 114 ✭✭nikkisclearout


    Be thankful you have a "2 bed" to "squeeze into". Many people would be delighted to have that and you have another property purchase in the pipe line.


  • Advertisement
  • Posts: 0 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Troy Unimportant Hockey


    I don't understand how it is worth it since a 4% cap applies to new tenants as well anyway? He can't just start from whatever he wants? I'm not up to date in the rules but I thought that was the case


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,643 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    bluewolf wrote: »
    I don't understand how it is worth it since a 4% cap applies to new tenants as well anyway? He can't just start from whatever he wants? I'm not up to date in the rules but I thought that was the case

    Not if the property has been substantially refurbished/upgraded.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,643 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Be thankful you have a "2 bed" to "squeeze into". Many people would be delighted to have that and you have another property purchase in the pipe line.

    What should the OPs tenants currently living in the 2 bed be thankful for?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,005 ✭✭✭pilly


    bluewolf wrote: »
    I don't understand how it is worth it since a 4% cap applies to new tenants as well anyway? He can't just start from whatever he wants? I'm not up to date in the rules but I thought that was the case

    You can charge market rate after a substantial refurbishment.


  • Posts: 0 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Troy Unimportant Hockey


    Thanks guys that clears it up


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 114 ✭✭nikkisclearout


    Graham wrote: »
    What should the OPs tenants currently living in the 2 bed be thankful for?

    Its pretty clear from my post that i am addressing the OP not his tenants


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,337 ✭✭✭Bandana boy


    Have a chat with your current landlord , and do a deal to extend till January .


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,967 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    It seems it is the o/p's tenants who are really being shafted, not the o/p. I wonder why they are not having a rant.
    Well we're both being shafted. They are not having a rant because they dont know this yet.
    Why not offer to say screw the 4%, pay a little extra and keep your current tenancy till the end of the year.
    We've suggested this. They are having a think about it, but have officially still served the notice. In all likelihood I don't see them going for it, as it would potentially put them in a precarious position with the RTB if we decided not to move out.
    Remember of course that had the 4% not come in you would probably have gotten a bigger price rise at the last rent review.
    True, which we could have negotiated, and managed, and not be forced to move out.
    seamus wrote: »
    Serious question;

    If your landlord was willing to boot out perfectly good tenants and refurb the property to get more than 4%, do you think he wouldn't have done that if he had free reign to increase the rent?
    If you are asking me? He wouldn't have booted us out. We've had rent increases over the past years. And we've managed to always meet an arrangement.
    Do you think he's only looking for 5 or 8% increase? What would you have done if he asked for a 15% increase and you refused?
    They would have been looking to get the rent up 30% - 50% I reckon. We would have negotiated. And we probably would have gotten a 35/40% increase. We would have taken this and managed it.
    But I think you're definitely barking up the wrong tree if you think you'd be in a much better situation without the caps.
    Well, I'd have the opportunity to claw back a margin of this against the rental income I get (albeit not that much considering tax due)
    Realistically if you're going for mortgage approval this is all going in your favour in the long run because your rent isn't going up by an insane amount and eating into your ability to save.
    I assure you this isn't in my favour. The last thing I want to be doing now is either evicting good tenant or moving from an unfurnished 3 bed to a furnished 2 bed!

    And the banks have advised that they consider rent paid in the ability to repay, but either way we could have covered it for a year.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,085 ✭✭✭Grumpypants


    I've said it time and time again, all they need to do to fix the rental market is make the tax rate on rental income under 10K 0% (similar to the 14K limit for Rent a room). If you earn 10,001 you pay the 60ish% on it all.

    Overnight rents would drop to €833 a month across the board.
    Most renters would get a discount from what they currently pay, so they would be happy and have more to spend/save.
    Most landlords would take home more money, so they would be happy.
    It would increase the amount of houses on the market as the accidental landlords who have left the market because they can't break even would flood back.

    But no we get dumb 4% caps that screw everyone.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,005 ✭✭✭pilly


    I've said it time and time again, all they need to do to fix the rental market is make the tax rate on rental income under 10K 0% (similar to the 14K limit for Rent a room). If you earn 10,001 you pay the 60ish% on it all.

    Overnight rents would drop to €833 a month across the board.
    Most renters would get a discount from what they currently pay, so they would be happy and have more to spend/save.
    Most landlords would take home more money, so they would be happy.
    It would increase the amount of houses on the market as the accidental landlords who have left the market because they can't break even would flood back.

    But no we get dumb 4% caps that screw everyone.

    It's actually a brilliant idea.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,006 ✭✭✭bmwguy


    I've said it time and time again, all they need to do to fix the rental market is make the tax rate on rental income under 10K 0% (similar to the 14K limit for Rent a room). If you earn 10,001 you pay the 60ish% on it all.

    Overnight rents would drop to €833 a month across the board.
    Most renters would get a discount from what they currently pay, so they would be happy and have more to spend/save.
    Most landlords would take home more money, so they would be happy.
    It would increase the amount of houses on the market as the accidental landlords who have left the market because they can't break even would flood back.

    But no we get dumb 4% caps that screw everyone.

    Yes but there would be no taxation income. That's why it won't happen. But a good idea if they prioritised housing over taxation (which they don't)
    Although that said, they allow it for rent a room scheme but that's for people to help them pay mortgage on primary residence, not investments.
    It would push up house prices too if investors could get tax free returns.
    So it's not going to happen or even should happen.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,005 ✭✭✭pilly


    bmwguy wrote: »
    Yes but there would be no taxation income. That's why it won't happen. But a good idea if they prioritised housing over taxation (which they don't)

    Agree, but it's an extremely unfair situation where an accidental LL is taxed over 50% and a corporation 12%.

    And remember 70% of LL's in Ireland have only 1 or 2 properties.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,140 ✭✭✭✭TheDoc


    Zulu wrote: »
    "Accidental" landlord.

    Yes I am. I'm going to have to boot out my tenants. They are also going to be -vely impacted. And good luck to them renting a 2 bed city centre apartment.
    This is because the Government meddled. Hed they not, I wouldn't be leaving my property, and I wouldn't be evicting my tenants.

    Can you seriously not see the impact and problems this all causes?

    These are the sort of issues that on the surface I'd react with "what are you complaining about" but at the same time appreciate there is probably complexities we all wont be privy too.

    At the same time, claiming you will be made homeless is a bit of a stretch considering you have an asset worth six figures, in your possession. And yes it's unfortunate there is a knock on effect to your current tenants, but they are hardly up **** creek if they are two people looking for accomodation.

    If your plan was getting a mortgage this year, NOT INCLUDING your current asset, sorry but you really arn't anywhere near the pits like some of us.

    I'm supporting a family of three on a single income, had a proper full on breakdown in JAnuary due to the stress of the situation with having my home ownership prospects wiped out overnight by the Central bank. I was getting mortgage approval beforehand on my own, with no issues. Repayments lower then any rent I would pay. I decided to hold off and be financially prudent. Then overnight, gonzo.

    I've been absolutely blessed, that my grandfather has asked me to take his house so he can move into a home with my grandmother, and would love for me to have my family there. He's a shrewd man for being in his 90's, and knows this is an incredible change for me, all of a sudden I can save money, I can have the prospect of home onwership again, have a life and lose the crushing stress of financial burden.

    So while I'm not disregarding your situation, and I have serious beef with how the government have attempted to address the rent issues and address house pricing, I think you are just venting a frustrating situation you are having, but trying to paint it to be more dramatic as it is.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,085 ✭✭✭Grumpypants


    bmwguy wrote: »
    Yes but there would be no taxation income. That's why it won't happen. But a good idea if they prioritised housing over taxation (which they don't)
    Although that said, they allow it for rent a room scheme but that's for people to help them pay mortgage on primary residence, not investments.
    It would push up house prices too if investors could get tax free returns.
    So it's not going to happen or even should happen.

    I forgot the bit that this would only be for one rental property. So mainly for accidental/small time landlords. If you had two or more properties the second house + would be taxed at the normal rate. Even those with two houses would see a benefit from the saving on the first house.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,684 ✭✭✭✭Samuel T. Cogley


    I wouldn't mind if the government had tried to fix anything, they haven't - it's a cynical populist vote grabbing exercise. If they were serious about getting the situation under control they'd do something about LLs tax or reintoruce some for of tax reflief for tenants.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,967 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    TheDoc wrote: »
    These are the sort of issues that on the surface I'd react with "what are you complaining about" but at the same time appreciate there is probably complexities we all wont be privy too.

    At the same time, claiming you will be made homeless is a bit of a stretch considering you have an asset worth six figures, in your possession. And yes it's unfortunate there is a knock on effect to your current tenants, but they are hardly up **** creek if they are two people looking for accomodation.

    If your plan was getting a mortgage this year, NOT INCLUDING your current asset, sorry but you really arn't anywhere near the pits like some of us.
    There will always be people worse off, that's not the point. I'm not trying to win the sympathy olympics.
    The point is that because of this ill conceived meddling by the government, two families are facing upheaval. That's the issue.
    I'm supporting a family of three on a single income, had a proper full on breakdown in JAnuary due to the stress...
    I too am supporting a family on a single salary. Look as I said, I'm not baying for sympathy. In the grand scheme, I'm alright Jack! But I work hard to be where I am. I was playing by the rules. Then the simpletons changed the rules, and have shafted us.

    True, we're not going to be in a hotel or a car or a doorway, but presently, unless I evict a family, we don't have a place to live in September caused directly by an interference that is suppose to protect tenants.
    I think you are just venting a frustrating situation you are having, but trying to paint it to be more dramatic as it is.
    Well yes, I am venting; as I set out at the start
    Zulu wrote:
    "...just to share my experience and anger..."


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,825 ✭✭✭LirW


    Very stupid but genuine question: Would it make that much of a difference if you apply for a mortgage at the end of the year or could you do it now?
    I'm just pointing out even if you apply for a mortgage at the end of the year, realistically it's going to take a good few months until you're holding the key to your new home.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,196 ✭✭✭Fian


    I've said it time and time again, all they need to do to fix the rental market is make the tax rate on rental income under 10K 0% (similar to the 14K limit for Rent a room). If you earn 10,001 you pay the 60ish% on it all.

    Overnight rents would drop to €833 a month across the board.
    Most renters would get a discount from what they currently pay, so they would be happy and have more to spend/save.
    Most landlords would take home more money, so they would be happy.
    It would increase the amount of houses on the market as the accidental landlords who have left the market because they can't break even would flood back.

    But no we get dumb 4% caps that screw everyone.

    Would distort the market though, crappy apartments in a bad location would be renting for exactly the same price as nice ones in prime locations.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,085 ✭✭✭Grumpypants


    Fian wrote: »
    Would distort the market though, crappy apartments in a bad location would be renting for exactly the same price as nice ones in prime locations.

    Would that not be a good thing? That you could rent a nice apartment for the price of a crappy one? Rather than renting a crappy one for the price of a nice one, which is what we currently have.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,967 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    LirW wrote: »
    Very stupid but genuine question: Would it make that much of a difference if you apply for a mortgage at the end of the year or could you do it now?
    Not stupid at all. I'm self employed, so I need a minimum of 2 years accounts. Which I won't have until the end of the year. Some banks have suggested making an exception, but only towards the end of the year (hence around October).


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,643 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    I've said it time and time again, all they need to do to fix the rental market is make the tax rate on rental income under 10K 0% (similar to the 14K limit for Rent a room). If you earn 10,001 you pay the 60ish% on it all.

    Side-effect of this would be a large gap in standards between apartments that rent for 10k p.a. and 25k (ish) p.a.

    No incentive for landlords under 10k to spend a penny on the property, pushing standards down. Disincentives for rentals in the 10k - 22k region.

    Major incentives to split family houses into smaller and smaller 1 bed flats.

    It's the sort of fiddling in the market that has all sorts of other knock-on effects that people don't consider.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,599 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Would that not be a good thing? That you could rent a nice apartment for the price of a crappy one? Rather than renting a crappy one for the price of a nice one, which is what we currently have.

    The thing is the quality of the nice apartments would decline since there is no reason to maintain them.

    Also it would be a crap shoot. 10,000 places available for 833 and luck decides if you get a good one or a bad one.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,548 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    I forgot the bit that this would only be for one rental property. So mainly for accidental/small time landlords. If you had two or more properties the second house + would be taxed at the normal rate. Even those with two houses would see a benefit from the saving on the first house.

    Sure, and the clever dicks would soon transfer the second property to their college going children and so the tax is avoided. What is needed is to increase supply in the short and long term. Short term means getting better use of existing buildings, temporary buildings and encouragement to more efficient use of existing buildings. Allowing rent received to be netted against rent paid for tax purposesn would encourage downsizers, without forcing empty nesters to dispose of an asset and endure the hassle of househunting.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,758 ✭✭✭Pelvis


    Being forced to move out of your rented property, into your own property, while you save to buy another property.

    I will pray for you.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,348 ✭✭✭GhostyMcGhost


    The thing is the quality of the nice apartments would decline since there is no reason to maintain them.

    Also it would be a crap shoot. 10,000 places available for 833 and luck decides if you get a good one or a bad one.

    Plus I think accidental landlords leaving the market long term is only a positive thing

    There are too many that don't know the rules and also either need to charge high rents to make a profit or are pure chancers. It's upward pressure on rents


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,967 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    Pelvis wrote: »
    I will pray for you.
    Thanks I appreciate it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,508 ✭✭✭Manion


    Wont this significantly save you money in the short term? The rental income you had from your own apartment is taxable. Ignoring deductibles you'd have wanted to be paying less than 900 euro for your current property. It's a tough situations no doubt. Those apartments aren't great for families, but people make all sorts of sacrifices to be able to afford to buy property. It could be this is a good move? You've also got a fairly long period to find alternative accommodation.

    Anyway, this is exactly the type of thing the government wants for this policy. Before the policy the landlord would have simply increased the rent without an investment in the property. Now he has to refurbish to property. Society as a whole is better off even if the outcome for individuals is worse.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 181 ✭✭trobbin


    The polices introduced by government over the last few years regarding property is baffling to a logical mind. All these polices have been designed to drive up the price of property and increase household debt.

    As properties have increased in value the balance sheets of the banks are looking a lot better. You'd think the government owed the banks or something! Oh wait:)

    So could it be when these balance sheets are looking great again the government will sell them to private investors once again? No way. I wonder if when these private investors acquire the Irish banks they'll start to increase rates? Surely not.

    Not to worry people. Keep outbidding, I'll have the violin ready.


  • Advertisement
This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement