Should Ireland Re-Introduce the wolf?

JupiterKid

I know it won't be popular with a lot of people, but wolves used to be native to Ireland until the last wolf was killed in the 17th century. Apparently in the wild, fox numbers are out of control and wolves would prey on foxes and keep their numbers in check. But I'm sure many farmers would be against reintroducing wolves as they could prey on sheep and calves.

So do you think wolves should be reintroduced here? Could it be successfully managed?

Link:
https://www.irelandswildlife.com/grey-wolf-re-introduction-ireland/

And what of other megafauna? Some ecologists have suggested introducing predators such as Lions, Rhinos and the like to North America. Would you think lions and bears in the Irish countryside would be madness? Discuss...

Collie D

Whatever about wolves and it is worth discussing the pros and cons, rhinos and lions is a ridiculous idea.

I'm all for the reintroduction or preservation of native species but after 3-400 years can we still say the wolf is indigenous to Ireland?

Your Face

After the carnage one Wolf did on Gladiators, I don't think we should introduce his kind in this country.

It is generally accepted that, unfortunately, there is nowhere in Ireland with a sufficient acerage of wilderness to support a wolf population. Its a non starter and would be against good welfare in wolves to place them anywhere here.

stimpson

I think he only does car insurance ads now.

It sounds kinda nice and wild and dangerous and we're all down with nature programmes now so we think we know about wolves.

It's really a non starter.

osarusan

That's 30 minutes away. I'll be there in 10.

JupiterKid

Well, there used to be bears in Ireland. If we introduced the brown bear, we'd merely be re-introducing the animal. But alas I don't think it would work.

Research indicates that Arctic polar bears may have actually descended from the Irish bear.

Link:
https://www.irelandswildlife.com/polar-bears-of-irish-descent/

casscass4444

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It is generally accepted that, unfortunately, there is nowhere in Ireland with a sufficient acerage of wilderness to support a wolf population. Its a non starter and would be against good welfare in wolves to place them anywhere here.

Plenty of space in Connemara for a load of wolves.tag a few on gps and use them as a tourist attraction.theres national park there too with plenty of deer

JupiterKid

JupiterKid wrote: »

Well, there used to be bears in Ireland. If we introduced the brown bear, we'd merely be re-introducing the animal. But alas I don't think it would work.

Research indicates that Arctic polar bears may have actually descended from the Irish bear.

Link:
https://www.irelandswildlife.com/polar-bears-of-irish-descent/

Bears? Seriously...where?

Chancer3001

casscass4444 wrote: »

Plenty of space in Connemara for a load of wolves.tag a few on gps and use them as a tourist attraction.theres national park there too with plenty of deer

And what are they going to eat in conamara apart from farmers sheep?

casscass4444

casscass4444 wrote: »

Plenty of space in Connemara for a load of wolves.

Plenty of private property.

Less than 3,000 hectares of public park.

It's like saying "I have a fish tank in the sitting room, I'd like to keep a shark..."

Working class heroes

http://wicklownews.net/2015/04/wolves-to-be-introduced-into-the-wicklow-mountains/

Working class heroes

Working class heroes wrote: »

http://wicklownews.net/2015/04/wolves-to-be-introduced-into-the-wicklow-mountains/

Check that date out.

Working class heroes

Dónal wrote: »

Check that date out.

I know:D
Caused a ****storm at the time, great crack it was!

76544567

Chancer3001 wrote: »

And what are they going to eat in conamara apart from farmers sheep?

Children.

tupenny

Deleted User wrote: »

Bears? Seriously...where?

Yep. I rem watching a documentary where they discovered remains of a bear up in some cave in Leitrim.

Erik Shin

Farmers are poisoning eagles that were reintroduced into Ireland...Imagine what they'd do to wolves!?

Lovely Bloke

The Wolf Pack in the Zoo is amazing, if you get there just after opening time and head straight over there you'll usually see them congregated near the viewing place just up the steps, all howling in unison, it's beautifully creepy.

jimmy blevins

The Irish elk is a possible candidate for de extinction. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_elk

snowflaker

People could get t shirts!

JupiterKid

JupiterKid wrote: »

Well, there used to be bears in Ireland. If we introduced the brown bear, we'd merely be re-introducing the animal. But alas I don't think it would work.

Research indicates that Arctic polar bears may have actually descended from the Irish bear.

Link:
https://www.irelandswildlife.com/polar-bears-of-irish-descent/

Which bear is best?

Lovely Bloke

Deleted User wrote: »

Which bear is best?

Russian Bear is best bear.

gramar

Gummi bears.

fizzypish

For the purpose of conversation good post OP and what I'm about to write is not aimed at you but the idea: **** no thats a terrible idea. The areas they did it in the states were remote to some degree. Theres no spot in Ireland bar the top of a mountain where your not a quarter day from someone. No matter where you put them they would interfere with farmland. They already have problems re introducing large birds of prey due to farmers shooting them. Wolves are so ****ing dangerous that during WW2, the Russians and Germans had a cease fire to kill the wolf population due to predation on the soldiers. If you argue the wolves were starving in that situation then I say that the introduced wolves to Ireland will only be a problem if they get hungry enough?!?! As a people we have forgotten but we exterminated the population for a reason. Wolves would control the deer population and foxes and all that stuff BUT we'd have to control the wolf population. Lets all be thankful that the most dangerous **** we deal with is an Irate badger or a thicket of nettles.

Shenshen

There's virtually no large game for them to prey on. They would definitely turn to prey on livestock, and that's neither a natural situation nor desireable for anyone.

Wolfs and bears are slowly migrating back into Western Europe since the fall of the iron curtain, and while some are settling in ok in remote areas of the alps and largely unpopulated areas in Northeastern Germany as well as some national parks (Bayerischer Wald, for example), there have been some rather unfortunate run-ins with livestock, pets and humans already. And we're talking about areas where they can hunt various kinds of deer, wild boar, wild goats, etc.

There's jut nowhere near enough "unused" land in Ireland, and not enough large wildlife to sustain them.

Mr McBoatface

Wild Boar have been reintroduced either by accident or on purpose. Having "Escaped" from special farm's or released by hunters.

They've bred either with their own kind or refal pigs and numbers are growing.

http://m.independent.ie/irish-news/wild-boar-strikes-fear-into-the-hearts-of-walkers-29966566.html

Richard Hillman

It is appalling that we have no wild land in this country. Everywhere regulated, zoned or sold

Wibbs

fizzypish wrote: »

Wolves are so ****ing dangerous that during WW2, the Russians and Germans had a cease fire to kill the wolf population due to predation on the soldiers.

It was WW1. Wolves are not particularly dangerous and attacks on people are rare and localised. Interestingly Irish wolves were quite bold and aggressive and were far more likely to attack people and adults with it(most attacks are on children). The early Christian annals report wolf attacks on a fairly regular basis. On the other hand they were popular enough as pets. I would agree though that re-introducing them into Ireland would be daft.

Shenshen wrote: »

There's jut nowhere near enough "unused" land in Ireland, and not enough large wildlife to sustain them.

Exactly. Though we have a low population density, we're very spread out with no real wild areas left. Certainly none that could sustain a large and mobile apex predator. That Ireland is long gone.

jester77

I would be all for it, they did this in Yellowstone National Park and the results are astounding

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysa5OBhXz-Q

andekwarhola

Of all the ideas punted in AH down the years, introducing bears, lions, rhinos and wolves to a country like Ireland must be right up there.

Wibbs

jester77 wrote: »

I would be all for it, they did this in Yellowstone National Park and the results are astounding

In Yellowstone National Park, an area that covers more than three thousand square miles. That's a wilderness area about a third larger than the county of Cork. Even there they have had issues with wolves moving beyond the confines of the park into surrounding farmland.

Lovely Bloke

Pesky wolves not respecting private land rights, or reading signs.

Feisar

Richard Hillman wrote: »

It is appalling that we have no wild land in this country. Everywhere regulated, zoned or sold

It's more of a space thing, sure we aren't in a densely populated country however one is never too far from habitation.

For reference Yellowstone National Park is 20% bigger than Cork.

unkel

If there are too many deer in the Wicklow mountains, let's cull them and eat them. Delicious!

OldGoat

Deleted User wrote: »

Bears? Seriously...where?

The Aillwee cave in the Burren has preserved bear habitats (a bit of a hardened mud circle in the ground) available to the public for viewing. The caves are worth walking through, about half an hour underground. A tourist trap perhaps but not as twee as most.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aillwee_Cave

Feisar

Wibbs wrote: »

In Yellowstone National Park, an area that covers more than three thousand square miles. That's a wilderness area about a third larger than the county of Cork. Even there they have had issues with wolves moving beyond the confines of the park into surrounding farmland.

Sorry, I didn't see your post!

Feisar

unkel wrote: »

If there are too many deer in the Wicklow mountains, let's cull them and eat them. Delicious!

Not as tasty as a good beef steak though.

Also for venison sausages and burgers butchers often add pig lard bits for taste. I don't know this as fact however the butcher we use to make them had to be specifically requested not to.

Jack the Stripper

Would they eat a few Healy Raes?

Parchment

The latent goth in me loves the idea. Wolves are stunning but would it not upset the ecosystem/animal "chain of command" at this point?

cruizer101

There is part of me that likes the idea but as others have said we don't really have proper wilderness in Ireland anymore, your never more than an hours or twos walk from a house. Any national parks we have aren't really that big.

I did see a documentary a number of years ago about a guy in Scotland who was trying to re-introduce them, and there could be an argument for that, deer population is very high and they have proper wilderness.

Dr Crayfish

We have no wilderness, so it's impossible, Wolves cover a lot of ground.
Rewilding is something that can do wonders for an environment though, George Monbiot did a piece on Wolves being introduced to Yellowstone Park and the positive impact they had, worth looking it up.

gramar

Lovely Bloke wrote: »

The Wolf Pack in the Zoo is amazing, if you get there just after opening time and head straight over there you'll usually see them congregated near the viewing place just up the steps, all howling in unison, it's beautifully creepy.

So kind of like wolfe tones then?

Carlos Orange

Wibbs wrote: »

In Yellowstone National Park, an area that covers more than three thousand square miles. That's a wilderness area about a third larger than the county of Cork. Even there they have had issues with wolves moving beyond the confines of the park into surrounding farmland.

For context there are < 100 wolves in Yellowstone. It isn't like we could scale the program down to whatever space we have available.

Dr Crayfish

psinno wrote: »

For context there are < 100 wolves in Yellowstone. It isn't like we could scale the program down to whatever space we have available.

We have no space available

There are rewilding projects happening in Britain.

http://www.rewildingbritain.org.uk/rewilding/reintroductions/

I don't think we have the space for wolves but there are plenty of other things that could be done.

arctictree

They would need to be fenced in, and that fence maintained.

As a sheep farmer, there would only be one result if a wolf was caught in a field with my flock.

arctictree

arctictree wrote: »

They would need to be fenced in, and that fence maintained.

A zoo by another name.

Inroducing wolves is a non starter. It would only be done for our pleasure; it would be of no advantage to the poor wolves put to live there.

How did this get to 4 pages?

It can't happen, and it won't happen. Ever. Go to one of our National Parks, hike around Killarney, around the Reeks (where dogs are now banned, because we can't even manage to control poodles). Fantasy stuff, too much Game of Thrones on telly.

JupiterKid

Ok - so reintroducing the wolf may be a non runner. But what about wild boar and beavers?

Obviously introducing lions and bears may have some negative side effects...

Agricola

Deleted User wrote: »

How did this get to 4 pages?

It can't happen, and it won't happen. Ever. Go to one of our National Parks, hike around Killarney, around the Reeks (where dogs are now banned, because we can't even manage to control poodles). Fantasy stuff, too much Game of Thrones on telly.

Exactly.

Pure madness. We haven't anything remotely like the size of wilderness needed to sustain them or even any natural prey for them to hunt.

And even if we did, considering what went on with eagles and how much certain sectors of society like curious pursuits such as "lamping" etc, I'd hazard a guess that most of them would be poisoned, shot, or captured in short order!