empty bvd samples

mcgyvor

Anybody else having problems with the bvd samples this year.about 10% coming back empty every time have to retest then delaying selling never had any before this year.mullinahone tags and enfer testing.

whelan2

Do you close in the sample as soon as you take it. Hold taggers up after taking sample so it doesn't fall out. Touch wood no empty samples here in a couple of years

kerry cow

Never had much problem with mullinahone tags but changed to cormac this year and it's a complete disaster .The bvd vial is a mess and so many empties

Bellview

Using mullinahone also. No problems in a few years. About 4 years ago I had issues..but it was my fault not tag

jaymla627

kerry cow wrote: »

Never had much problem with mullinahone tags but changed to cormac this year and it's a complete disaster .The bvd vial is a mess and so many empties

id reckon your losing the steel tip of the top of the bvd tag that seals the sample vial happened us here with two samples aswell, its a piss poor design as the steel tip can fall out when your tagging really shouldn't be secured so loosely

Wildsurfer

mcgyvor wrote: »

Anybody else having problems with the bvd samples this year.about 10% coming back empty every time have to retest then delaying selling never had any before this year.mullinahone tags and enfer testing.

Yep same problem here. Had same problem last year. Defo not anything I'm doing wrong as I couldn't be more careful as its a pain waiting for retest. I close properly, hold the tagged afterwards that sample can't fall out and straight into vial. Could it be some fault with tagger? I'd think more a Mullinahone or tagger problem than enfer.

Pidae.m

Ya I'm the same, it just took me a while to get the hang of the new tagger.

mcgyvor wrote: »

Anybody else having problems with the bvd samples this year.about 10% coming back empty every time have to retest then delaying selling never had any before this year.mullinahone tags and enfer testing.

Sam Kade

whelan2 wrote: »

Do you close in the sample as soon as you take it. Hold taggers up after taking sample so it doesn't fall out. Touch wood no empty samples here in a couple of years

Same here, I always keep the tagger with the pin facing up and put the vial over it, no empty since the start of bvd testing. Sometimes the green plug doesn't go into the sample so the sample could easily be lost if the tagger is turned.

Lady Haywire

I've never had any turn up empty yet and i tag for our own place and three other farms! I don't even know what way I hold it but I usually look into the pin to make sure the sample is there so it prob has to be facing up for that!

freedominacup

The system is wrong. The first any farmer should know about an empty sample is when the bud tag arrives by return of post with a letter of apology from the lab and the tag supplier for the inconvenience and a stamped addressed envelope for returning the sample to testing lab. This "hey listen gob****e wtf are you doing" text telling you that the sample is wrong is nothing more than everyone else shifting the blame into us for their sh1tty system.

whelan2

freedominacup wrote: »

The system is wrong. The first any farmer should know about an empty sample is when the bud tag arrives by return of post with a letter of apology from the lab and the tag supplier for the inconvenience and a stamped addressed envelope for returning the sample to testing lab. This "hey listen gob****e wtf are you doing" text telling you that the sample is wrong is nothing more than everyone else shifting the blame into us for their sh1tty system.

If you go into ahi on the icbf site.You can see you bvd results almost a day before you get the text. Very handy for doing movements. It's also updated sooner than the enfer website for some reason

Wildsurfer

freedominacup wrote: »

The system is wrong. The first any farmer should know about an empty sample is when the bud tag arrives by return of post with a letter of apology from the lab and the tag supplier for the inconvenience and a stamped addressed envelope for returning the sample to testing lab. This "hey listen gob****e wtf are you doing" text telling you that the sample is wrong is nothing more than everyone else shifting the blame into us for their sh1tty system.

+1000 There should defo be a system in place that automatically orders re test tag to speed the whole process up. But still can't get my head around how some people never get empties and some get them regularly.

Who2

I've had one in the last five years and tag a fair few every year. I don't do anything special, if anything I'm probably a bit disorganised. I could be onto the next calf and only then realise I haven't put the sample in the vial

Sam Kade

It was only to last 3 years, first year voluntary. I guess they saw what a nice little money spinner it was and kept it going. Are farmers still allowed to hold onto positives if yes it defies the whole thing.

Wildsurfer

Still no legal obligation to dispose of positives but I think now it has to be displayed on board at marts if animal is PI.

J.O. Farmer

Wildsurfer wrote: »

Still no legal obligation to dispose of positives but I think now it has to be displayed on board at marts if animal is PI.

That can't be right. I don't think you can sell a PI.
Maybe it's if there's a PI retained on the farm.

Wildsurfer

Yeah you're right, no movement cert allowed for PIs except to knackery. What was that I read so that was saying they would display on mart boards.. Maybe date of test?

greysides

If you retain a PI longer than 5 weeks the herd is locked up. That should help to reduce TI spread.
http://animalhealthireland.ie/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/BVD-Key-Points-2017-FINAL.pdf

valtraman

No problem herenow but does your mullinahone tagger close properly ,click the sample into the vial , I had to file the tagger to allow it to close more closely as the samples would not click in ,if so the samples might not be pushed up the tube while tagging

Winston Wolf

kerry cow wrote: »

Never had much problem with mullinahone tags but changed to cormac this year and it's a complete disaster .The bvd vial is a mess and so many empties

I had empty but it was cos I think I knocked the little cutting thing off the tag and it tagged alright but I could see that the sample bottle was different than the others. I rang up Cormacs and they sent me out a button tag for free! But I had to send off the sample myself separately. I know Mullinahone don't post it for you but I never had an empty with them. They told me that they were sending out spare cutting things with tags which was in my box. I like the system but I think that their could be a bit better explanation of the importance of having the cutting yoke attached before using the tag. I wonder is there a limit on their free replacement guarantee!

Pidae.m

That's exactly what happened me too. I'm fairly clumsy the best of times.

Winston Wolf wrote: »

I had empty but it was cos I think I knocked the little cutting thing off the tag and it tagged alright but I could see that the sample bottle was different than the others. I rang up Cormacs and they sent me out a button tag for free! But I had to send off the sample myself separately. I know Mullinahone don't post it for you but I never had an empty with them. They told me that they were sending out spare cutting things with tags which was in my box. I like the system but I think that their could be a bit better explanation of the importance of having the cutting yoke attached before using the tag. I wonder is there a limit on their free replacement guarantee!

Englebert Humperdink

Was with Mullinahone for years and never had a problem. Switched to Cormac this year and had my first empty. Rang them and they sent me a button tag for free. Reason I switched was the Mullinahone tags were falling off at a ridiculous rate. Cormac said they would send out replacement tags for free.

whelan2

See on pg 16 of the journal that empty bvd samples are double what they were this time last year.

pedigree 6

whelan2 wrote: »

See on pg 16 of the journal that empty bvd samples are double what they were this time last year.

I wonder what changed?

We've never had an empty here.
As others have said and best practice.
The sample is held upwards until put and clicked into sample bottle. Then when in the shed we put the bottles into a mug with tissue paper in the bottom of it to dampen the shock of when the bottle hits the bottom of the mug.
Might be a bit extreme but that's what we do.

whelan2

The article also says there have been 30,000 less samples sampled so far this year compared to last year. 741 positives so far this year 278 of which are now recorded as dead.

whelan2

I jinxed it, got an empty sample text today

Wildsurfer

whelan2 wrote: »

I jinxed it, got an empty sample text today

Nobody is perfect:o

whelan2

Wildsurfer wrote: »

Nobody is perfect:o

I was able to see the empty tag report on icbf at dinner time today, didnt get text until 5pm, was able to order replacement tag today as I knew earlier than the text

kerry cow

In fairness I think the cormac tags empty rate is reckless .I am going back to mullinahone next year

Keepgrowing

kerry cow wrote: »

In fairness I think the cormac tags empty rate is reckless .I am going back to mullinahone next year

Have had high empty rates here up to 10% but it was human error in the main.

A small bit more care and its 1% this year.

How are the Cormac tags otherwise, bit early to say yet I suppose

Calfscour

Keepgrowing wrote: »

Have had high empty rates here up to 10% but it was human error in the main.

A small bit more care and its 1% this year.

How are the Cormac tags otherwise, bit early to say yet I suppose

Used them this year not one empty sample. This thing to seal the bottles on top of the tag are flimsy alright and would fall off if not careful, they should send a few spares of these. Otherwise very happy and never going back to mullinahone.

Calfscour

Oh and the sample bottles are half the size so you can send off around 50 in the one envelope

Wildsurfer

Calfscour, You really should think of a new username. I don't want to hear that word again for rest of year! No offence to you personally:)

Midfield9

We haven't had an empty in years and I'm not overly careful about anything. Using cormac this year and no empty. We did get spare cutting edges with the cormacs but haven't had to use them yet.

patsy_mccabe

Tagged a calf this morning and the DVD Tag came apart. The small metal tube stayed on the tag on the calf. Had to pull it out with a pliers. Put it together and sent away but I think it might be empty.
What happens if it is empty? Do they send me a small button tissue test tag or do I have to order it myself?

whelan2

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Tagged a calf this morning and the DVD Tag came apart. The small metal tube stayed on the tag on the calf. Had to pull it out with a pliers. Put it together and sent away but I think it might be empty.
What happens if it is empty? Do they send me a small button tissue test tag or do I have to order it myself?

You have to order it. You will get a text to say if it's empty

kollegeknight

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Tagged a calf this morning and the DVD Tag came apart. The small metal tube stayed on the tag on the calf. Had to pull it out with a pliers. Put it together and sent away but I think it might be empty.
What happens if it is empty? Do they send me a small button tissue test tag or do I have to order it myself?

Happened to me three times out of 14 this year and I had to do exactly that with a pliers. There must be some change in the tag. I meant to email mullinahone to just report it.

None of the samples were empty so you should be ok.

Dunedin

kollegeknight wrote: »

Happened to me three times out of 14 this year and I had to do exactly that with a pliers. There must be some change in the tag. I meant to email mullinahone to just report it.

None of the samples were empty so you should be ok.

You have to order button tag yourself and resend in sample. Pain in the hole as had one empty this year too.

patsy_mccabe

Tag not empty......Well that takes beating. Just got a text there now. Virus negative.

Keepgrowing

freedominacup wrote: »

The system is wrong. The first any farmer should know about an empty sample is when the bud tag arrives by return of post with a letter of apology from the lab and the tag supplier for the inconvenience and a stamped addressed envelope for returning the sample to testing lab. This "hey listen gob****e wtf are you doing" text telling you that the sample is wrong is nothing more than everyone else shifting the blame into us for their sh1tty system.

Spot on. We changed tag suppliers and got a higher % of empties. Enfer saying empty despite us visually checking presence of sample at tagging. I called tag supplier told them our experience and no empty/non viable since. If it’s not gift wrapped for Enfer they call “empty”

Tag should arrive FOC with envelope, proper order

edward901

I got 5 empty samples yesterday notified by text.5 empties out of a total of 17 sent to Enfer.Very disappointing.I am wondering is it the tagger at fault.I find it very hard to close the sample bottle lid when I squeeze the tagger closed.Mullinahone tags being used.I have just ordered a new tagger for the job.

tanko

edward901 wrote: »

I got 5 empty samples yesterday notified by text.5 empties out of a total of 17 sent to Enfer.Very disappointing.I am wondering is it the tagger at fault.I find it very hard to close the sample bottle lid when I squeeze the tagger closed.Mullinahone tags being used.I have just ordered a new tagger for the job.

You could always take a second sample by punching another hole in the calfs ear after you put the tag in its ear.

alps

Cormac are foolproof

patsy_mccabe

edward901 wrote: »

....I find it very hard to close the sample bottle lid when I squeeze the tagger closed.Mullinahone tags being used.....

I squeeze the pliers on both ends to close the sample bottle.

hopeso

edward901 wrote: »

I got 5 empty samples yesterday notified by text.5 empties out of a total of 17 sent to Enfer.Very disappointing.I am wondering is it the tagger at fault.I find it very hard to close the sample bottle lid when I squeeze the tagger closed.Mullinahone tags being used.I have just ordered a new tagger for the job.

I never got one to close with the tagger. Gave up trying to years ago. I always snap them closed with my thumb after I remove it from the tagger.....

bogman_bass

edward901 wrote: »

I got 5 empty samples yesterday notified by text.5 empties out of a total of 17 sent to Enfer.Very disappointing.I am wondering is it the tagger at fault.I find it very hard to close the sample bottle lid when I squeeze the tagger closed.Mullinahone tags being used.I have just ordered a new tagger for the job.

I tap the bottom of the tagged against the wall when closing. Very hard to get the seal otherwise

Lady Haywire

^ As above, I just hold the tube between top & bottom of taggers & snap it shut by squeezing it with my left hand. Impossible to do it otherwise.
I've only ever had one empty sample, must be lucky!

Buford T. Justice XIX

alps wrote: »

Cormac are foolproof

You haven't met me so:D

Only one empty tag with Mullinahone in all the years I was with them but had about 10 last year and one so far this year with Cormac. One animal was tagged 4 times and all empty, eventually got the vet to sample her.

whelan2

Keep the sample facing upwards until you get the cover on it

Parishlad

whelan2 wrote: »

Keep the sample facing upwards until you get the cover on it

+1 on this. Then, when you put the cover on the sample hold the end of the cover out towards the end of the tagger, so that it's not directly over the hole on the tagger. Close the tagger firmly and the cover will slide in to the hole but it should click closed as it does.

For ages I was always just lining the cover up with the hole on the opposite side of the tagger and could rarely get it to close that way. Accidentally did it the way I described above one day and it worked like a dream ever since.

Sacrolyte

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

You haven't met me so:D

Only one empty tag with Mullinahone in all the years I was with them but had about 10 last year and one so far this year with Cormac. One animal was tagged 4 times and all empty, eventually got the vet to sample her.

You must be doing something wrong there chief. Since I changed to Cormac about 3 years ago I’ve had no empty’s.