Garda cars outrun

josip

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/suspected-burglary-gang-flee-dublin-mountains-after-seven-car-garda-chase-35511851.html

Some things in this I don't understand.

What's the point in sending 7 cars in pursuit if they're only 1.7l Hyundai's and they know they can't catch them?

Why didn't they call in a motorbike? I thought they've got some fairly powerful bikes for pursuit?

Where was the Garda helicopter?

FortySeven

Didn't they just spend a small fortune on a bunch of new high powered toys?

whoopsadoodles

Who would "the source" be?

A garda?

josip

whoopsadoodles wrote: »

Who would "the source" be?

A garda?

Unlikely to be the owner of a black S3

ThisRegard

josip wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/suspected-burglary-gang-flee-dublin-mountains-after-seven-car-garda-chase-35511851.html

Some things in this I don't understand.

What's the point in sending 7 cars in pursuit if they're only 1.7l Hyundai's and they know they can't catch them?

Why didn't they call in a motorbike? I thought they've got some fairly powerful bikes for pursuit?

Where was the Garda helicopter?

And the same dumb paper yesterday was reporting that these criminals were no longer using high powered cars.

Teddington Cuddlesworth

"Wicklow Gardai are now involved in the search"

If we couldn't them with our newish Hyundais, there's not a chance they'll catch them with our cast offs.

gifted

Hyundai have a 7 year warranty....saving us s fortune ..lol lol

Water John

With the OP's headline, I thought it was about, feet propelled vehicles, a la Fred Flinstone.

Del2005

josip wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/suspected-burglary-gang-flee-dublin-mountains-after-seven-car-garda-chase-35511851.html

Some things in this I don't understand.

What's the point in sending 7 cars in pursuit if they're only 1.7l Hyundai's and they know they can't catch them?

Why didn't they call in a motorbike? I thought they've got some fairly powerful bikes for pursuit?

Where was the Garda helicopter?

The article doesn't say that the 7 vehicles were in the pursuit. There could have been 1 in pursuit and 6 deployed ahead to try and stop it, plenty of side roads that can be taken. The scumbags would probably run a Garda bike off the road.

Gatling

The Garda should have military spec surveillance drones to cover situations like this when the Garda helicopter isn't available ,
Along with proper built out pursuit cars mad to think in this day and age the garda have no real pursuit capabilities

josip

Water John wrote: »

With the OP's headline, I thought it was about, feet propelled vehicles, a la Fred Flinstone.

Apologies but I genuinely tried to avoid a clickbait title so I didn't use terms like 'Keystone'

CaptainR

I'd imagine the amount of guys who have the car and skills to outrun a garda is so small that investing a tonne of money in faster cars isn't cost effective in the eyes of senior management.

How many times have we heard of criminals speeding away from a crime and immediately crashing and being arrested?

The average burglar or the like just hasn't the training or experience to drive a car quickly enough to really lose them. I've seen it on road wars where a lad being chased on a full on Sports bike capable of 170mph+ can't get away from a copper on a BMW tourer that would be a much less sporty bike.

Jack the Stripper

Gives them time to eat a few donuts, drink the costa coffee. It's as good as playing GTA as when they are back in the station doing office work.

whoopsadoodles

josip wrote: »

Unlikely to be the owner of a black S3

With that "news" site it wouldn't surprise me if the journalist was driving the getaway car!

GavRedKing

Also, no current or previous S3 came in a 2.7 litre twin turbo engine, so I've no idea where theyre getting that info.

stimpson

CaptainR wrote: »

I'd imagine the amount of guys who have the car and skills to outrun a garda is so small that investing a tonne of money in faster cars isn't cost effective in the eyes of senior management.

How many times have we heard of criminals speeding away from a crime and immediately crashing and being arrested?

The average burglar or the like just hasn't the training or experience to drive a car quickly enough to really lose them. I've seen it on road wars where a lad being chased on a full on Sports bike capable of 170mph+ can't get away from a copper on a BMW tourer that would be a much less sporty bike.

Police in the UK are specially trained. That's not the case here. A scummer with few weekends practice in Mondello and a modified civic would leave them for dust.

Gatling

Tiptoptoe86 wrote: »

Helicopters could have been on another job!

More likely it's down for maintenance ,

Tenzor07

7 Garda cars could not catch like 4 s'bags in 1 car on small narrow twisty roads where the speeds would have been limited?

There's only so many roads in and out of that area, surely they could have coordinated the pursuit to block off any of the escape roads or did this car have warp drive and disappeared into a blackhole?

"The guards are driving 1.7 litre Hyundais and don't have a hope against a car like that" - -- 7 Micra's could have caught one car, there radio's are faster than any car...

whiskeyman

Similarly the way wiki have removed the Daily Mail from source articles, any chance we can remove the Indo from boards.ie?
The quality of reporting and 'sources' is just dire these days.

jimgoose

Outlaw Pete

I knew Trespass Against Us would give a few skangers the goo for a chase when they'd seen it.

Ban all movies I says.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

You don't need powerful cars to outrun the guards if the guards don't know the roads. The guards have the rest of the public to think about too, 8 cars doing 170km on a road to a mountain? It's not worth the risk to life

Dravokivich

Gatling wrote: »

The Garda should have military spec surveillance drones to cover situations like this when the Garda helicopter isn't available ,
Along with proper built out pursuit cars mad to think in this day and age the garda have no real pursuit capabilities

They don't need it.

I'd generally expect them to be able to radio ahead so someone can close out a road to trap'em. This would be difficult to achieve in the mountains with so many off roads and the helicopter not available to track the car.

Del2005

Tenzor07 wrote: »

7 Garda cars could not catch like 4 s'bags in 1 car on small narrow twisty roads where the speeds would have been limited?

There's only so many roads in and out of that area, surely they could have coordinated the pursuit to block off any of the escape roads or did this car have warp drive and disappeared into a blackhole?

"The guards are driving 1.7 litre Hyundais and don't have a hope against a car like that" - -- 7 Micra's could have caught one car, there radio's are faster than any car...

There's loads of roads around the area that interlink with each other and I don't think that the Garda radios have good coverage there. Watching UK police shows the scumbags still manage to escape from pursuit with multiple vehicles, they know that the more reckless they drive means that the pursuit has to be called off.

Tenzor07

They said: "The last sighting of the vehicle was on the Blessington Road heading out bound towards [the town], but was chased towards the mountains and lost."

There's one road back up to Sally Gap and one over towards Ballinascorney..

I just think there's too much blame on the fact the Gards drive family cars and not hot hatches for the reason they lost contact...

ED E

Remember AGS are trying not to kill any members of the public, these scrotes dont care.

I'd much rather they get away than a pursuit car Tbones a people carrier and wipes out a family.

Cienciano

CaptainR wrote: »

I'd imagine the amount of guys who have the car and skills to outrun a garda is so small that investing a tonne of money in faster cars isn't cost effective in the eyes of senior management.

How many times have we heard of criminals speeding away from a crime and immediately crashing and being arrested?

The average burglar or the like just hasn't the training or experience to drive a car quickly enough to really lose them. I've seen it on road wars where a lad being chased on a full on Sports bike capable of 170mph+ can't get away from a copper on a BMW tourer that would be a much less sporty bike.

I'd disagree. Plenty get away from police, it's not that hard unless the helicopter is there. Road wars aren't going to show loads of footage of people getting away. And if you take a trip up the Dublin mountains, evidence suggests the average scummer has plenty of practice on those roads, far more than the local gardai

josip

Just about the bikes, I thought that the bikes would just track and keep up with the S3 to provide the location to cars/helicopter?
Like this guy.
(The bike at the start of that chase is the police bike and he only catches the target bike around the 1 minute mark)

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

ED E wrote: »

Remember AGS are trying not to kill any members of the public, these scrotes dont care.

I'd much rather they get away than a pursuit car Tbones a people carrier and wipes out a family.

Or lose some control of their car and kills themselves. Every driver of each of those 7 cars in the chase would have a family. I certainly wouldn't expect anyone to lay their life out in pursuit of property.

PARlance

whoopsadoodles wrote: »

Who would "the source" be?

A garda?

Quite possibly, or someone close to one.

The tools they have to do their job aren't what they once were and there's a good case to say that they're not fit for purpose. A lot of them are p1ssed off about that... which is good to see.

Tenzor07

PARlance wrote: »

The tools they have to do their job aren't what they once were and there's a good case to say that they're not fit for purpose. A lot of them are p1ssed off about that... which is good to see.

Why give them faster/more powerful cars as the previous poster has said:

I certainly wouldn't expect anyone to lay their life out in pursuit of property.

Teddington Cuddlesworth

I spent my younger years driving the Dublin hills/Wicklow mountains and I'd be fairly confident taking on several members of the AGS from the country that aren't as familiar with the roads as I am. Even with the same cars.

If the scangers know the area, and most of them from south/west Dublin do, then the AGS hadn't a hope without the helicopter.

Your Face

From the thread title, I was hoping someone remade the classic arcade game Outrun with added Garda cars.
Needless to say, the story was an enormous let-down.

Potential-Monke

Yeah, people are forgetting that the Gardaí aren't just chasing the car, they have everything else to think about, road safety, pedestrians, built up areas. And the fact that the Gardaí are in Hyundai i30's (1.6L Diesel), which are the same as the ones you can walk in and buy, so they've standard suspension, tyres, etc, meanwhile an S3 is built for speed and handling, so would easily outrun and/or out-corner them. I was involved in a chase with a Lexus is220, and while i was in a 2.0L Diesel Avensis, you could tell that with any bit of skill i should have been left for dust. It was a 40 minute chase through the city and country, and there were at least 8 Garda cars involved, but only 3 really "chasing". The rest were at strategic points with the hope of stopping the driver, but that rarely happens. Stingers are great, but you have to be very careful about where you use them. The helicoptor is based in Dublin and would probably have been negatively cost effective to send it out, ie: cost vs likelihood of it getting there in time. And, as someone said, the scumbags want to get away, the Gardaí want to get home safe, and if you've ever driven an i30 flat out, you too would be tentative about going flat out...

Del2005

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Yeah, people are forgetting that the Gardaí aren't just chasing the car, they have everything else to think about, road safety, pedestrians, built up areas. And the fact that the Gardaí are in Hyundai i30's (1.6L Diesel), which are the same as the ones you can walk in and buy, so they've standard suspension, tyres, etc, meanwhile an S3 is built for speed and handling, so would easily outrun and/or out-corner them. I was involved in a chase with a Lexus is220, and while i was in a 2.0L Diesel Avensis, you could tell that with any bit of skill i should have been left for dust. It was a 40 minute chase through the city and country, and there were at least 8 Garda cars involved, but only 3 really "chasing". The rest were at strategic points with the hope of stopping the driver, but that rarely happens. Stingers are great, but you have to be very careful about where you use them. The helicoptor is based in Dublin and would probably have been negatively cost effective to send it out, ie: cost vs likelihood of it getting there in time. And, as someone said, the scumbags want to get away, the Gardaí want to get home safe, and if you've ever driven an i30 flat out, you too would be tentative about going flat out...

If the helicopter took off it would have seen the chase, Casement is only a few km from the Blessington road.

Widdershins

There are regular chases in Limerick City. In at least one, the car being chased went off the road, over an overpass type bridge, I think. These chases happen on busy parts of the city. It's more dangerous to the public, than leaving them go and trying to intercept them ahead. Chasing them only makes them go faster.

Potential-Monke

Del2005 wrote: »

If the helicopter took off it would have seen the chase, Casement is only a few km from the Blessington road.

See, i wouldn't know that. Anything above Tipperary and i have very little knowledge of it! More than likely so it was broke, or management decided it would cost too much for a "simple" chase.

scamalert

thats a stupid issue to put on cover,like garda got outrun by performance car.

given area and time,its total risk to pull stunts,only way could been to block off roads and call in helicopter,since garda will never risk or pursue someone to endanger public.Even countries like US has plenty of footage where chases on motorways etc,result in backing off and using surveillance from helicopter to do the work.thus stupid mentality that it was performance that resulted in failure is nonsense.

car being able to pull 200km/h wont do any good if slightest mistake could result in multiple fatalities.

4068ac1elhodqr

Best solution would be a roof mounted drone like this one, it's slow but with HD thermal cameras all it has to do is head straight up to 3,000ft and track vehicle with thermal cameras for up to 20mins. Just 'slightly' cheaper than a helicopter, pilots and maintenance team.

PARlance

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Why give them faster/more powerful cars as the previous poster has said:

Because faster, more powerful cars can be driven safer at higher speeds. A Merc is going to handle a lot better than a Micra at 160km/h.

Also, having a well equipped fleet acts as a deterrent. We could replace all cars with bicycles as it's safer but I'm sure a lot more scrotes would fancy their chances.

Gatling

Wilder Slow Earache wrote: »

Best solution would be a roof mounted drone like this one, it's slow but with HD thermal cameras all it has to do is head straight up to 3,000ft and track vehicle with thermal cameras for up to 20mins. Just 'slightly' cheaper than a helicopter, pilots and maintenance team.

20 mins would be no good and can only be flown in certain weather conditions ,
You would need a proper fixed wing drone or rotorary with a a proper engine to be any use in a chase situation that can fly for several hours

Hellrazer

In the 90s the Garda had sierra cosworths.
They gave them up for being "too powerful "
It's not about the car.Its about whether the driver has the right training for high speed pursuits.
A basic i40 flat out will do 190 kmph.
The Garda ones are the higher powered engine.

Damien360

Tiptoptoe86 wrote: »

Why aren't they using the SRI and other high performance non descript seized rockets?
I know the X5 and land cruiser are been used by ERU

But also dublin guards would seem to be under resourced, boots wise and with equipment because of the gangland stuff which they've got a hold of at the moment.

The Q7's and X5's etc are used by the armed reposted units. They are not Garda traffic corp or regular Garda cars who were more than likely the guys doing this chase.

As for resourcing. It is the same all over the country. They need to bring the percentage of Gardai per head of population up and the number of cars they have has to rise with those extra Gardai. Higher crime areas need to go over the average Garda per population. But, no garda wants to work in those areas and do everything in their power to get out.

cajonlardo

LexieOnRale wrote: »

The guards have the rest of the public to think about too, 8 cars doing 170km on a road to a mountain? It's not worth the risk to life

Was just thinking that.

I've been hit full on while cycling by a stolen car that was being pursued.

It is quite an experience ......

Temptamperu

Imagine if we legalised weed and psychedelics. We could buy the coppers faster cars and a few more helicopters.



No you cant! think of the children wah! wah! wah!

scamalert

Temptamperu wrote: »

Imagine if we legalised weed and psychedelics. We could buy the coppers faster cars and a few more helicopters.



No you cant! think of the children wah! wah! wah!

discussion for another topic while this would bring in a lot of revenue,this case was more of point that guards need better communications and stuff like being able to call helicopter when needed,thus garda have more then suitable cars for everyday work,but if its to expensive to get helicopter which could do job of whole fleet that was out thats an issue.

Temptamperu

Fine we'll leave the gangsters out provision the state then.

James Bond Junior

A scumbag came flying through my estate in a jaguar x type an hour ago with an i40 in hot pursuit, flew up a one way with cops keeping up nicely. Nearly ran my better half off the road and actually did run the car in front of us into the kerb. To be fair, the Hyundai aren't exactly the most suitable but the lads in the jag weren't losing the Gardai too easily.

4068ac1elhodqr

Komputer says it's between 10.3 - 12.6 seconds for an Hyundai i40 to get to 62mph, that's big van and caravan territory.
Surely there's a turbo, high-octane fuel or at very least go-faster red stripes added to these base models?

4068ac1elhodqr

Gatling wrote: »

20 mins would be no good and can only be flown in certain weather conditions ,
You would need a proper fixed wing drone or rotorary with a a proper engine to be any use in a chase situation that can fly for several hours

It would be using similar HD i-Red cameras to a chopper, surely there are some drones that are able to fly in the rain. It also has immediate dispatch and another model could take over after 20mins. Budget wise guesstimate it's <0.01% the cost of aircrew and support team per device.

dublinman1990

Hard luck to the Gardai for not catching the scummy cúnts in time. You will somehow get your intentions for justice someday.

On the other hand; it is a kick in the teeth that the chased scumbags would not get a whiff of a hard sentence in a country like Ireland. It really is sickening to see injustice happen to these lowlifes on a daily basis in this country.