eir Voice-over-Broadband (VOB) service to launch later this year

The Cush

There's been some discussion recently about the future of voice over the copper network.

Openeir is prevented for switching off the copper network due to EU Access Regulations and also because they lack a VOIP product.

In a recent Comreg publication eir indicated they are in the process of developing a Voice over Broadband (VOB) product which will launch later this year.


https://www.comreg.ie/publication-download/retirement-legacy-networks-services

murphaph

The Cush wrote: »

Openeir is prevented for switching off the copper network due to EU Access Regulations and also because they lack a VOIP product.

Is VOB == VoIP?

I ask because Deutsche Telekom will have moved to "All-IP" by next year, but they will still obliged (USO) to provide a POTS connection if you request one. In the exchanges and street cabinets they are fitting MSAN-POTS cards, which act as an interface between the digital (IP based digital that is) world and the analogue one that a standard land line telephone can be plugged into if you do not have DSL.

Telekom is not being relieved of its obligation to provide copper lines because of their conversion to all-IP based services (but if you have DSL you will be forced to use VoIP for telephony-the splitter will be gone for all DSL users).

Is VoB something different that would really allow you to plug a phone into your FTTH (without internet service) somehow fulfilling the USO but without copper lines?

ED E

The name used would suggest its still over the top.

It would be very easy for OE to provide IP traffic to all end users and just VLAN voice only traffic into a limited VOIP node only that ATAs could lease from, or moreover a handover to the OLOs VOIP node.

The Cush

siliconrepublic.com interview with eir CEO Richard Moat - https://www.siliconrepublic.com/companies/eir-broadband

Moat said that plans are afoot to launch new broadband-based products in 2017.

“Our vision for our customers is a converged future, providing seamless access to fixed and mobile services. This will be brought to life this year with the launch of new innovative products such as voice over broadband, voice over wi-fi and voice over LTE services.”

ED E

Maybe if Meteor deploy VOLTE then Three will finally bother :rolleyes:

The Cush

This is probably related to the launch of eir's VOB service later this year, from July, open-eir are to launch a 6 month wholesale promotion for service providers to migrate subscribers from copper to NGA/CGA/NGB VUA products according to a revised OE Bitstream Price List proposal document.

The credit value of the promotion is €100 plus the relevant connection/migration fee that is applicable at the time of the order for each line migrated.

ULMP (Unbundled Local Metallic Path) migration to Current Generation Access (‘CGA’) and Next Generation Broadband Access (‘NGA’) Bitstream promotion, page 63

notahappycamper

I declined Vodafone's offer of moving last July. Are they going to try and get us to move again?

Can they force us?

kmurph

notahappycamper wrote: »

I declined Vodafone's offer of moving last July. Are they going to try and get us to move again?

Can they force us?

If you want to upgrade to Lightspeed, you are pretty much forced to. I found this out when I booked my upgrade. Not entirely happy about it, but the only other option to keep the land line and upgrade to Lightspeed is to have a totally separate subscription just for the land line.

This isn't really mentioned anywhere in the marketing for it. Only if you go searching on the support site is it mentioned.

notahappycamper

The Cush wrote: »

This is probably related to the launch of eir's VOB service later this year, from July, open-eir are to launch a 6 month wholesale promotion for service providers to migrate subscribers from copper to NGA/CGA/NGB VUA products according to a revised OE Bitstream Price List proposal document.

The credit value of the promotion is €100 plus the relevant connection/migration fee that is applicable at the time of the order for each line migrated.

ULMP (Unbundled Local Metallic Path) migration to Current Generation Access (‘CGA’) and Next Generation Broadband Access (‘NGA’) Bitstream promotion, page 63

Has this happened already as my alarm dialler through HKC Securetext is no longer working? Think I was moved even though I opted out of it?

The Cush

notahappycamper wrote: »

Has this happened already as my alarm dialler through HKC Securetext is no longer working? Think I was moved even though I opted out of it?

Text via landline? I thought that option had been ended a while ago?

ED E

Yep, that function was shut down circa 2yrs ago.

If you've had it texting you since then its been GSM upgraded.

notahappycamper

The Cush wrote: »

Text via landline? I thought that option had been ended a while ago?

No, HKC Security has been providing it for €3 per month since Eir stopped it 2 years ago.

Has there been some switch in the past few weeks in the lines from analogue to digital at Vodafone/Eir?

The Cush

notahappycamper wrote: »

Has there been some switch in the past few weeks in the lines from analogue to digital at Vodafone/Eir?

Vodafone are the only company that I know of moving people over to VOIP but they won't do it without informing you. Is your phoneline active via the standard wall socket? Has your alarm company suspended the service or is there a fault?

Packet

I asked to be put on eir "targeted trial" of VoBB and my 01- number mas moved to it a couple of weeks ago. They ask if are you using the copper line for any other service besides POTS or broadband? Such as a monitored alarm that doesn't work OTT of the Internet.

It is VoIP. There are "eir Talk" SIP clients for Android, iOS, Windows, and macOS. The landline number can also be used from anywhere with an Internet connection. The F2000 modem also has its SIP client activated so the old POTS phone can be plugged into it. When the number rings the POTS phone and all the online clients also ring and the first to pick up answers. You can ring your own number to talk to other members of your household with the App on their devices.

notahappycamper

The Cush wrote: »

Vodafone are the only company that I know of moving people over to VOIP but they won't do it without informing you. Is your phoneline active via the standard wall socket? Has your alarm company suspended the service or is there a fault?

I opted out of moving to VOIP last year. No fault in the alarm. Others are affected too. It appears (according to HKC - alarm company) that if you use their "Securetext " service and are not with Eir for fixed line services you won't get a text message when your alarm goes off. The "Securetext" service was a solution provided by HKC when Eir pulled the ability to send text over land lines. The issue started the May bank holiday weekend according to HKC. So if you know anyone using this service and are not with Eir let them know as HKC have not sent a mail shot advising people and are working on the issue. They've written to Comreg also.

The Cush

Updated "eir Multi Product Bundles" pricing document published on the eir website today. Now includes pricing for VoBB bundles.

https://www.eir.ie/opencms/export/sites/default/.content/pdf/pricing/pt4.1.10.pdf

In order for the eir Broadband Talk Service to work, the eir Fibre Broadband service to which it is connected must be fully operational. The customer will not be able to utilise the eir Broadband Talk service if the eir Fibre Broadband service is not operational for any reason. The eir Fibre Broadband service and the eir Broadband Talk Service are dependent upon electrical power supply.

Johnboy1951

I think I will use my own provider for VOIP rather than eir (IF I ever get my fibre connection!)

I presently use my own provider over the 'landline broadband' anyway.
The eir 'line' is used for incoming calls only.
Outgoing are all through VOIP.

Shyboy

So, if u already have FTTH, how do u switch over to VOBB? Would this happen automatically or would be a case of changing package/upgrading to it?

Also, would there be any benefit as opposed to the regular phone line?

The Cush

Shyboy wrote: »

Also, would there be any benefit as opposed to the regular phone line?

Long term advantage might be the removal of the copper line to the house. Short term disadvantage, if your fibre connection goes down or there's a power cut you lose your phoneline.

Johnboy1951

The Cush wrote: »

Long term advantage might be the removal of the copper line to the house. Short term disadvantage, if your fibre connection goes down or there's a power cut you lose your phoneline.

...... unless you have a small UPS in place.

I read that in other locales the provider is supplying a UPS for their device when a phone connection is to be used.

The Cush

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

...... unless you have a small UPS in place.

I read that in other locales the provider is supplying a UPS for their device when a phone connection is to be used.

Comreg published a consultation on this last year with different options for consultation - https://www.comreg.ie/publication/battery-back-consultation/.

Awaiting Comreg's response and decision.

The Cush

Shyboy wrote: »

So, if u already have FTTH, how do u switch over to VOBB? Would this happen automatically or would be a case of changing package/upgrading to it?

If you currently have a copper landline they won't automatically switch you over. According to posts here Vodafone ask their landline customers if they want switch over, optional, not mandatory. I assume in these cases there is no contract change and on the wholesale side it works out cheaper for Vodafone as they won't be paying open-eir for the copper line.

New customers without an existing landline may have to go VoBB as the USO rules changed in recent times where open-eir are no longer required to provide a copper line if there is an alternative service available.

The current USO requirement for the provision of a telephone service by eir does not apply if

- At premises where affordable voice services are provided on a commercial basis over an alternative wired network, the USO does not apply.
- At premises where affordable mobile voice services are provided with good indoor coverage, the cost threshold for the USO is reduced from €7,000 to €1,000.
- At premises where wholesale broadband connections are available over an alternative network, but affordable voice service is not provided on a commercial basis, the USP need not invest in its own connections but is free to procure a wholesale connection and use voice over internet protocol (“VoIP”) to provide the required voice service.

https://www.comreg.ie/media/dlm_uploads/2016/07/ComReg-1665.pdf

Coincidental to eir's proposal to launch VoBB, back in April open-eir published a proposal to launch a 6 month wholesale promotion for service providers to migrate subscribers from copper to NGA/CGA/NGB VUA products according to an OE Bitstream Price List proposal document (sec 5.36)

The credit value of the promotion was €100 plus the relevant connection/migration fee that is applicable at the time of the order for each line migrated.

Just recently v8.0 of the Bitstream Price List document was published on open-eir's website but minus the promotion, I wonder if there was any objection to the proposal?

pg17

Can somebody please describe how VoBB will work in terms of equipment and internal house wiring ?

For example

• will we be able to connect traditional analog type phones to one of the RJ11 sockets on the F2000 router or will we need different phones ?
• will we be able to run copper pairs as we did for the analog phone service with a master socket ?

If we will use different phones, will they work on copper or on WiFi?

Thanks.

The Cush

pg17 wrote: »

Can somebody please describe how VoBB will work in terms of equipment and internal house wiring ?

For example

• will we be able to connect traditional analog type phones to one of the RJ11 sockets on the F2000 router or will we need different phones ?
• will we be able to run copper pairs as we did for the analog phone service with a master socket ?

If we will use different phones, will they work on copper or on WiFi?

Standard analogue phone to the analogue phone socket on the router or the connect the router's phone socket to the house network via the master socket or DECT phone to router's phone socket.

The Cush

The Cush wrote: »

This is probably related to the launch of eir's VOB service later this year, from July, open-eir are to launch a 6 month wholesale promotion for service providers to migrate subscribers from copper to NGA/CGA/NGB VUA products according to a revised OE Bitstream Price List proposal document.

The credit value of the promotion is €100 plus the relevant connection/migration fee that is applicable at the time of the order for each line migrated.

ULMP (Unbundled Local Metallic Path) migration to Current Generation Access (‘CGA’) and Next Generation Broadband Access (‘NGA’) Bitstream promotion, page 63

Had a look at the open-eir site earlier, the above wholesale promotion has been in effect since July 1st for a period of 6 months. Each existing customer that a retailer migrates over to VoIP/VoBB is worth €100 wholesale credit plus the relevant connection/migration fee that is applicable at the time of the order for each line migrated.

I wonder if we'll see a push from retailers to migrate existing FTTC/FTTH copper line telephone subscribers over to VoIP/VoBB?

ULMP migration to NGA / CGA Bitstream and NGA VUA promotion (inclusive).

The period for the Promotion is 1st July until 31st December 2017 . The Promotion applies to migration orders from ULMP to NGA or CGA Bitstream or NGA VUA products for orders completed within the period 1st July 2017 to 31st December 2017.

The credit amount will apply per line that is migrated is €100 plus the relevant connection/migration fee that is applicable at the time of the order:

The Orders must be completed during the Promotional Period

The Conditions Applicable to the Promotion are outlined below;

To be eligible for the ULMP migration to NGA / CGA Bitstream or NGA VUA Promotion each telephone number/CLI must meet each of the following criteria:

(1) The Promotion shall apply only to all eligible migration orders from ULMP to NGA or CGA or NGA VUA Bitstream.

(2) Eligible Subscriber orders must be a migration orders only, as outlined in point 1 above, during the promotional period for ULMP migration Promotion. The promotional period is from 1st July 2017 to 31st December 2017 inclusive for migration orders. eircom reserves the right to withdraw this promotion at any time prior to that date.

(3) An Access Seeker will be eligible to receive this promotion for any Subscriber's number/CLI irrespective of whether a promotion has previously been applied to that telephone number/CLI for any of the Bitstream promotions since 1st of June 2004; subject to all other terms and conditions of this promotion being met.

(4) It is the responsibility of the Access Seeker to determine whether a potential Subscriber has not met any of the eligibility criteria set out here, as these Subscribers will not be eligible for the Promotion.

(5) The Access Seeker will be charged rental and other applicable charges for each Subscriber as published in the current Bitstream Service Price List. All charges must be paid in full according to standard Billing terms defined in the Standard Agreement for the Provision of the ADSL Bitstream Service.

[6] The credits will be applied to all eligible orders in February 2018

p.63 Bitstream Price List

Anyone know when eir are planning to launch this service (VOIP/VoBB or whatever they're going to call it) on the FTTH network?

The Cush

Deleted User wrote: »

Anyone know when eir are planning to launch this service (VOIP/VoBB or whatever they're going to call it) on the FTTH network?

It appears they have soft launched it, without any promotion. According to posts over on the FTTH thread some have been transitioned over to VOIP/VoBB at FTTH install and others IIRC got it as new subscribers.

Pricing for the service have been included in their regulated pricing document since Jun 23rd, post #16 above.

Pangea

I have Ftth, If I upgrade to VOB with Eir will it cost extra? Will an installer have to do work at my house or how does it work?

iioklo

Pangea wrote: »

I have Ftth, If I upgrade to VOB with Eir will it cost extra? Will an installer have to do work at my house or how does it work?

Your phone or your home's internal phone lines just have to be plugged into one of the rj11 phone sockets on the back of the router. Not sure if they will send someone out to do this, should cost the same as your current package.

iioklo

iioklo wrote: »

Your phone or your home's internal phone lines just have to be plugged into one of the rj11 phone sockets on the back of the router. Not sure if they will send someone out to do this, should cost the same as your current package.

I suppose that would be dependent on where the phone is relative to the router. If the router is next to the Eir master socket and there are no hardwired extensions, then it's a simple case of moving the phone RJ11 from one to the other.

If the house has hardwired extensions or the router is located in a different part of the house, then more work is needed.

I don't know if Eir would do that work or not.

Pangea

The Cush wrote: »

Had a look at the open-eir site earlier, the above wholesale promotion has been in effect since July 1st for a period of 6 months. Each existing customer that a retailer migrates over to VoIP/VoBB is worth €100 wholesale credit plus the relevant connection/migration fee that is applicable at the time of the order for each line migrated.

Will the consumer benefit from this €100 or are there any discounts for migrating to VOB ?

The Cush

Pangea wrote: »

Will the consumer benefit from this €100 or are there any discounts for migrating to VOB ?

Wholesale only discounts in this case.

Pangea

I asked about getting Eirs VOB today, the woman said at the present moment they can't port over an existing telephone line which means if you order VOB you will get a new telephone number. In the future they will be able to so she said to ring back in a few months.

Pangea

Pangea wrote: »

I asked about getting Eirs VOB today, the woman said at the present moment they can't port over an existing telephone line which means if you order VOB you will get a new telephone number. In the future they will be able to so she said to ring back in a few months.

That sounds very much like the answer I got when I asked a few months ago, about April or May time.
But I wasn't offered a new number.

mpok

Anyone know if VOBB actually works on an F1000? Or do I have to replace it with an F2000?

Pangea

My ffth had to be reordered and in the email I got contained this new information regarding vob https://www.eir.ie/eirbroadbandtalk/