Cycle protest in dublin city centre

R.D. aka MR.D

Until there is better enforcement and the money to pay people to enforce existing laws then there is not going to be a solution that keeps everyone happy.

My husband commutes every single day by bike and he and others like him generally aren't the problem. It's the bastards who are cycling on footpaths and ignoring basic rules of the road that are creating problems.

Another issue that causes problems is the lack of proper consideration of pedestrians and giving motorists the priority. I live next to a fairly main road in the city centre. It takes about 5 mins for the one pedestrian crossing light to change. The result? People crossing the road when ever and where ever they want and I honestly don't blame them. In other countries, there are pedestrian bridges etc to prevent this but I'd imagine one reason these aren't common in the city centre is anti-social behaviour and lo and behold we come back to enforcement.

What we all need to do as pedestrians, cyclists and motorists is to demand more resources for the Gards. Of course other things would need to be done in tandem such as better planning and education for people who even want to touch a Dublin bike.

RasTa

kbannon wrote: »

What makes a taxi wandering around the city less congestive than a regular motorist?

think about how stupid that question is

suicide_circus

I wonder do the cycle couriers in Dublin city ever get stopped by the gardai? Their behaviour is generally outrageous.

Dr Crayfish

R.D. aka MR.D wrote: »

Until there is better enforcement and the money to pay people to enforce existing laws then there is not going to be a solution that keeps everyone happy.

My husband commutes every single day by bike and he and others like him generally aren't the problem. It's the bastards who are cycling on footpaths and ignoring basic rules of the road that are creating problems.

Another issue that causes problems is the lack of proper consideration of pedestrians and giving motorists the priority. I live next to a fairly main road in the city centre. It takes about 5 mins for the one pedestrian crossing light to change. The result? People crossing the road when ever and where ever they want and I honestly don't blame them. In other countries, there are pedestrian bridges etc to prevent this but I'd imagine one reason these aren't common in the city centre is anti-social behaviour and lo and behold we come back to enforcement.

What we all need to do as pedestrians, cyclists and motorists is to demand more resources for the Gards. Of course other things would need to be done in tandem such as better planning and education for people who even want to touch a Dublin bike.

So you break the rules on a bike you're a bastard, but break the rules as a pedestrian and you honestly don't blame them? I can't understand why cyclists annoy people so much, I kind of like it though as a cyclist!

weldoninhio

The setup of Dublin City Centre is not conducive to cycling. The streets are narrow and there isn't enough room for cycle lanes on them. It's a hard fact that cyclists need to get into their heads. Unless we start knocking down buildings and moving them back 5 foot on either side of the road it'll never be a cycling city.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

KungPao

Kill them all and let god sort them out.

amcalester

weldoninhio wrote: »

The setup of Dublin City Centre is not conducive to cycling. The streets are narrow and there isn't enough room for cycle lanes on them. It's a hard fact that cyclists need to get into their heads. Unless we start knocking down buildings and moving them back 5 foot on either side of the road it'll never be a cycling city.

No reason not to have cycle superhighway like they do in London.

Proper well maintained routes along roads like the N11, Navan Road, along the canals etc would make a huge difference to both motorists and cyclists.

Seth Brundle

RasTa wrote: »

kbannon wrote: »

What makes a taxi wandering around the city less congestive than a regular motorist?

think about how stupid that question is

Enlighten me please rather than give an insulting response

Graces7

Demos, marches, protests are the new Irish hobby. What they do at the weekend...

WHat I am asking is what the protocol is when in a city you have to drive across a cycle lane to get to the shopping centre ...

R.D. aka MR.D

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

So you break the rules on a bike you're a bastard, but break the rules as a pedestrian and you honestly don't blame them? I can't understand why cyclists annoy people so much, I kind of like it though as a cyclist!

I don't blame cyclists for breaking red lights especially when motorists are aggressive a lot of the time and don't give you time to get going when the light changes. I do blame cyclists when they are cycling on the footpath when there is a perfectly good road right beside it and there are two other cyclists using that road properly clearly in view.

I don't blame pedestrians for crossing the road when they have to walk 5 mins out of there way to get to the lights and wait another 5 mins for them to change. I do blame pedestrians when they wander out in the road for no reason or cross when they see a cyclist and expect them to stop.

As I said, my husband cycles 30km a day commuting so have no problem with cyclists but even he complains about the cyclists acting like idiots.
Just like when I'm driving, I wish there was somebody out there enforcing the rules that already exist. It's very frustrating to follow the rules and be endangered by idiots.

amcalester

Patww79 wrote: »

No. Make space for the cars.

How exactly? Dublin isn't exactly full of derelict sites to be used as roads/car parks.

Stupid suggestion.

KingBrian2

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

But will I still be allowed cycle around city centre??

It is too dangerous to cycle around the city centre with all the construction on the Luas work going on.

Dr Crayfish

R.D. aka MR.D wrote: »

I don't blame cyclists for breaking red lights especially when motorists are aggressive a lot of the time and don't give you time to get going when the light changes. I do blame cyclists when they are cycling on the footpath when there is a perfectly good road right beside it and there are two other cyclists using that road properly clearly in view.

I don't blame pedestrians for crossing the road when they have to walk 5 mins out of there way to get to the lights and wait another 5 mins for them to change. I do blame pedestrians when they wander out in the road for no reason or cross when they see a cyclist and expect them to stop.

As I said, my husband cycles 30km a day commuting so have no problem with cyclists but even he complains about the cyclists acting like idiots.

Ok, I don't really go up on paths much, sometimes you have no choice like opposite pearse st garda station. There is simply no room for bikes.
For the most part cyclists are grand though, I just think they bear the brunt of the ire of motorists a lot, probably because it's uncomfortable driving near cyclists, I say that as a sometimes motorist myself. Hard to overtake, unsure what to do, is how I feel around them. The roads here are terrible for cycling, but I still enjoy cycling in and out tbh.

Dr Crayfish

KingBrian2 wrote: »

It is too dangerous to cycle around the city centre with all the construction on the Luas work going on.

Not really, I have to go around pearse st, trinity, nassau st every day, and even with the works, it's nowhere near the worst part of the city for cycling. Going north out of town on Amiens st seems to be a hot bed for trouble, around busarus etc. The roads are very tight there and rammed with cars and busses.

Deagol

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Did it occur to you where these banned cyclists would go to? Would they stop going to work etc? No, they'd just end up in cars or there would need to be more buses etc to handle them therefore clogging up the streets. Would that really be the solution you think?

Andrewf20

I cycle regularly into the city and I honesty dont see what the is fuss about. I do a bit of mountain biking also so im guessing I have it in my psyche to watch out for dangers. You do need your wits about you.

Ive done a fair amount of travelling around the world and havent come across other citys that much better. Most are for the most part rammed with people, parks cars and traffic with a spinkle of bike lanes (like Dublin) where space is available for them.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Stop talking rubbish please.

The amount of cars with only one occupant going into the city is a disgrace.2 cars carry 2 people take up the same amount of space as a double decker bus that can carry around 80 passengers. It's a criminal waste of road space and every city in the country should be getting round to the idea of better public transport and less cars allowed into the city.It would be beneficial for everyone.Considering the damage to the environment cars cause we should be trying to reduce the amount of them on the roads.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

lightspeed wrote: »

Among the worst things about driving in city centre dublin is the cyclists. I f**king hate cyclists.

Im not sure what good could come from this protest?

is it even possible to make city centre more accessible for cyclists than it currently is ?

The point of the protest is in the article. More budget for cycling infrastructure.

Stars and Stripes wrote: »

Maybe pedestrians, car drivers, van drivers, lorry's, bus's or anyone else should be holding a counter demo to make Dublin city center a safe place FROM CYCLISTS from riding on the foot path, going up the wrong way on a one way street, ignore the lights as pedestrians have the green to cross, going up on the inside regardless as a bus or lorry is turning. IMBECILES :mad:

Not sure when the last time a cyclist crashed into a car killing everybody in the vehicle? There's also sufficient infrastructure for the road users you mentioned in your post. I would be in favor of moving a lot more budget towards public transport and very very little for private automobiles.

The op posted a protest which aims to improve infrastructure. In turn this should help alleviate the anger many motorists show towards cyclists.

RasTa

kbannon wrote: »

Enlighten me please rather than give an insulting response

I've no time for stupidity when it comes to this issue. Simply there are more car's than Taxi's. Sometimes a taxi will just sit at a rank.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

These replies really highlight the ignorance surrounding transport.

What purpose do motorists serve?

Where are you going to come up with the space for the wider roads?

What are you going to suggest when the new, wider roads are full?

Seth Brundle

RasTa wrote: »

I've no time for stupidity when it comes to this issue. Simply there are more car's than Taxi's. Sometimes a taxi will just sit at a rank.

...and when they're not sitting at a taxi rank they're frequently driving around with only the driver in it.
The proposal a few years ago from Dublin City Council and the National Transport Authority to ban all cars including taxis from the city centre has plenty of merit.

However apologies for interrupting your obviously busy schedule on Boards with a point of view that you disagree with.

RasTa

kbannon wrote: »

...and when they're not sitting at a taxi rank they're frequently driving around with only the driver in it.
The proposal a few years ago from Dublin City Council and the National Transport Authority to ban all cars including taxis from the city centre has plenty of merit.

However apologies for interrupting your obviously busy schedule on Boards with a point of view that you disagree with.

No problem, just think a bit more next time please.

lightspeed

Mylah Melodic Munitions wrote: »

The point of the protest is in the article. More budget for cycling infrastructure.



Not sure when the last time a cyclist crashed into a car killing everybody in the vehicle? There's also sufficient infrastructure for the road users you mentioned in your post. I would be in favor of moving a lot more budget towards public transport and very very little for private automobiles.

The op posted a protest which aims to improve infrastructure. In turn this should help alleviate the anger many motorists show towards cyclists.

what does improving cycling infrastructure mean? It sounds just like typical fancy tagline from people who have not thought anything about its implementation or consequences or cost.

Are we going to reduce lanes for cars to make cycle lanes for cyclists making it more difficult to drive through city centre than it is already??

How will this be funded?

I hate the lack of logic when it comes to finances in this country.
In this country, people have been crying about healthcare yet politicians across all parties want USC reduced.

Im at a lost how we can pay huge increases in spending for healthcare, education, transport, water and now you would like us to spend more on roads for cyclists?

How can we expect to have massive increases in spending with massive decreases in tax?

How many cyclists who support this improvement to cyclist infrastructure would be willing to pay a tax for using a bike?

Only recently i heard of an guy on newstalk from UK talking about how congestion and pollution is worse in London as a result of accommodating cyclists by building more cycle lanes as now there as less lanes for cars so more congestion and more cars stuck in traffic polluting the air.

Here is a link to an article referring to congestion problems in London as result of more road being given up for cyclists.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3822518/Cycle-lanes-lunacy-built-Britain-causing-gridlock-pollution-maddest-thing-empty.html

"Partly as a result, the capital is said to be the world’s most congested city, with the average driver spending 101 hours in traffic last year, according to transport experts INRIX.
Traffic delays are up, while average vehicle speeds in Central London have fallen to 7.4mph — slower than a horse-drawn carriage in the 18th century."

KingBrian2

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Not really, I have to go around pearse st, trinity, nassau st every day, and even with the works, it's nowhere near the worst part of the city for cycling. Going north out of town on Amiens st seems to be a hot bed for trouble, around busarus etc. The roads are very tight there and rammed with cars and busses.

The problem with the city for me and i why i refuse to cycle there for leisure is the competition with the Buses. Not worth putting you life at risk especially at busiest part of the city, Dame St to Westmoreland St before crossing the O' Connell Bridge. Take care of yourself.

Grayson

kbannon wrote: »

What makes a taxi wandering around the city less congestive than a regular motorist?

There's less of them and anyone can use them? I'd like to see the look on a motorists face if I hopped in their car.


Here's an interesting article about how Groningen transformed into a cycling city.

https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2015/jul/29/how-groningen-invented-a-cycling-template-for-cities-all-over-the-world

“Many people who lived in the old neighbourhoods were enthusiastic about our ideas. They saw we were changing things on a great scale. But there was also fierce opposition, especially from businessmen and shopkeepers who were convinced it would mean the end of their business if cars could no longer cross the centre. We tried to explain that we wanted to create a pleasant urban environment that eventually would attract more people to the centre and to their shops. But they were convinced they would go bankrupt if customers would not be able reach their shop by car,” says Van den Berg. “In the end, it turned out they were wrong.”

Angry shopkeepers painted slogans on their store windows, collected signatures and demonstrated at the city hall – to no avail. In 1977, the traffic circulation plan was implemented over a single night. Hundreds of new signs were put up to create one-way streets or change their direction. Overnight, the centre of Groningen became impenetrable for cars. The next morning, hostesses greeted confused motorists with flowers and leaflets that explained the new situation.

“We were simply ahead of our time,” says Jacques Wallage who, as the local politician who took over the traffic portfolio from Van den Berg, was responsible for implementing the controversial traffic plan. “In the 70s, the general idea in the Netherlands was that cities needed to adjust to the car. What we wanted was to adjust the car to the city. It was a tough fight. The shopkeepers were livid. I, personally, received threats. People said: ‘We know were you live.’” he adds. “I’ve had a long career in politics – I have been a minister with a politically sensitive portfolio – but [that was] the only time I have needed police protection.’’

After the traffic plan was implemented, new cycle paths were constructed and trees were planted in the centre. The Vismarkt, a central square – which for years had been a huge parking place – regained its historical function as a market. And the much-feared commercial disaster simply didn’t take place. The majority of the shopkeepers survived and some of them even thrived.

Of course, it took some time before motorists got used to the situation and those who don’t know the city still stand a fair chance of getting frustrated. But Groningen now boasts the cleanest air of all big Dutch cities and many streets in the centre are amazingly quiet.

lightspeed

kbannon wrote: »

The proposal a few years ago from Dublin City Council and the National Transport Authority to ban all cars including taxis from the city centre has plenty of merit.

No it doesnt given our state of monopolistic public transport in this country.

People drive cause public transport isnt efficient or cost effective. Look how Bus Eireann, Iarnrod Eireann, Luas all threaten strike action for more money despite the fact they are all well above other EU countries even when factoring cost of living in Ireland.

Many people cant afford rent somewhere closer to city centre nor should they have to so wont be able to travel to and from work by cycling alone.

So when we ban all cars/taxis so 100% of such people are reliant on public transport, are you thinking that Bus Eireann, Iarnrod Eireann, Luas etc wont try to extort even more money from their monopolistic position because they will be sound like that?

R.D. aka MR.D

lightspeed wrote: »

How many cyclists who support this improvement to cyclist infrastructure would be willing to pay a tax for using a bike?

I think a bike tax is a good idea. In Japan, there is a system where every bike must be registered and there is a fine if you are caught with an unregistered bike. They can also take the bike off you if it's registered to somebody else. We could introduce this system and charge a tax at that time. Any fines from non-registration could also go towards improved infrastructure. It would also help with the bike theft problem!

Dr Crayfish

R.D. aka MR.D wrote: »

I think a bike tax is a good idea. In Japan, there is a system where every bike must be registered and there is a fine if you are caught with an unregistered bike. They can also take the bike off you if it's registered to somebody else. We could introduce this system and charge a tax at that time. Any fines from non-registration could also go towards improved infrastructure. It would also help with the bike theft problem!

This is a ridiculous suggestion. We should be encouraging cycling not discouraging. No way am I taxing my €50 bike. Are you really naive enough to think fines and more tax would improve anything?

Dirty Dingus McGee

lightspeed wrote: »

No it doesnt given our state of monopolistic public transport in this country.

People drive cause public transport isnt efficient or cost effective. Look how Bus Eireann, Iarnrod Eireann, Luas all threaten strike action for more money despite the fact they are all well above other EU countries even when factoring cost of living in Ireland.

Many people cant afford rent somewhere closer to city centre nor should they have to so wont be able to travel to and from work by cycling alone.

So when we ban all cars/taxis so 100% of such people are reliant on public transport, are you thinking that Bus Eireann, Iarnrod Eireann, Luas etc wont try to extort even more money from their monopolistic position because they will be sound like that?

If more and more people used public transport though the likelihood would be that more of these companies would be profitable.