Zebra Is For Pedestrians and ...

rolion

...for chatting on the phone,cycling the zebra and just taking the fcuking piss of the drivers !
And is not the only one that i have on my dashcam, just the one that actually behaved like is been offended by my driving style !

Guys ... a friendly note / warning : i drive a fcuking heavy machinery that cannot protect YOU when YOU behave stupid and your mum and dad waiting at home !!!


LE:
I am not going to comment on my driving style OR speed OR going on/off.
In the case that the other guy will have hit my car on the road,i will be here typing on the keyboard and his mum crying loud !
SO, irrespective of the speed, careless, horses, offroad to avoid the bike, PLEASE pay attention as not all clashes can end up like this one,not all the drivers have the crystal ball beside them to guess/anticipate what a cycle will do on the side of the road.
I'm putting the clip here as a warning and not as a rant over the cyclists that sometimes are drivers too,me inclusive.
AND not lastly... a pedestrian crossing does not give you / involve that you have priority aka jumping in the front of the moving car but rather a meaning that you, as a civilised person can cross the road safely in relation to other traffic participants that,unfrotunately ,that day left the crystal zebra ball in the back if his car !

Be good, cycle / drive safely !

All My Stars Aligned

This thread is going to end well

_Brian

From that clip the driver wasn't paying enough attention to someone approaching the pedestrian crossing.

Now they're not for cyclists but does that allow an idiot driver to mow them down - no it doesn't.

The type of aggressive driving displayed here is a potential "dangerous driving" from what
I can see. The cyclist and vehicle driver are being equally inconsiderate and dickish on their behaviour.

kaef

Holy mother of God! What a gob****e on a bicycle! Some people really have no idea how easy it is to get injured on a bicycle.

Unknown Soldier

rolion wrote: »

...for chatting on the phone,cycling the zebra and just taking the fcuking piss of the drivers !
And is not the only one that i have on my dashcam, just the one that actually behaved like is been offended by my driving style !

Guys ... a friendly note / warning : i drive a fcuking heavy machinery that cannot protect YOU when YOU behave stupid and your mum and dad waiting at home !!!

Zebra crossings, real ones are for crossing the road, regardless.
People in wheelchairs can use the too FYI. So can people on horses.

Barry Badrinath

Awful awful driving....even went off the road.

tomasrojo

Yeah, very careless on the part of the person on the bike, but the driving is terrible too. Despite the flashing beacons, approached a zebra crossing at speed and then was surprised when someone started to cross, despite the fact that's exactly what you should expect at a zebra crossing. Poor anticipation, and what looks like ingrained bad habits.

Thanks for posting this public service film.

_Brian

I'd wager the driver in the video is onewith a chip on their shoulder looking for cyclists to frighten, no one can defend what the cyclist did but intentionally approaching them on such an aggressive manner with a car is just insaine.

magicbastarder

the sheer head smashing irony of the OP.
you're putting the clip there as a warning; to stay off the roads when you're around?

ted1

The driver should have adjusted his speed when he saw the flashing pelicans. I also would hazard a guess he is exceeding the limit.

Under the rules of the road the driver must stop and let people cross. So in contradiction to the op they do give people the right.

But when it comes to self preservation, rules go out the window and the cyclist should have taken due care, I don't know the section of road but it's quite possible that's it's a mixed use crossing.

* http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1964/si/294/made/en/print
Last rule 38.2 in this instance would state the person crossing is clearly in the wrong

tomasrojo

ted1 wrote: »

* http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1964/si/294/made/en/print
Last rule 38.2 in this instance would state the person crossing is clearly in the wrong

When a vehicle is approaching a zebra crossing a pedestrian shall not step on to that crossing if his action is likely to cause the driver either to brake suddenly or to swerve

Set against that is:

A driver approaching a zebra crossing shall yield the right of way to a pedestrian on the crossing.

You can of course say that the person on the bike isn't a pedestrian, per se, but a decent driver would have seen the person on the bike and anticipated that they might start to cross.

(The person on the bike is clearly in the wrong. I don't think anyone is disputing that.)

rushfan

Am I alone in thinking that the text in the OP simply doesn't make actual sense ????

ted1

tomasrojo wrote: »

Set against that is:


You can of course say that the person on the bike isn't a pedestrian, per se, but a decent driver would have seen the person on the bike and anticipated that they might start to cross.

(The person on the bike is clearly in the wrong. I don't think anyone is disputing that.)

Did you read the link?

(b) shall not step on to a zebra crossing if his action is likely to cause the driver of an approaching vehicle to brake suddenly or to swerve.

crosstownk

Another dashcam thread with a solitary incident that appears to imply that all of us should take more care and not do stupid things.

There's plenty of this stuff on YouTube. No need to post it here, imo.

This thread will eventually degenerate like so many similar threads have done in the past. Tiresome stuff.

Nothing to see here. Move along. There are twits everywhere - it's a fact of life.

tomasrojo

ted1 wrote: »

Did you read the link?

Yes, I did and I helpfully posted the text too, and said that cyclist was clearly in the wrong.

You still can't drive pell mell straight at a zebra crossing and be exempted from all culpability because the pedestrian or cyclist was careless.

C3PO

Just goes to show .... you can get gobsh*tes in cars and gobsh*tes on bikes!! The problems start when they come together ...

Fighting Tao

I hope you went to the guards with that video. Maybe they'd like to enforce the laws on both you and the cyclist.

CramCycle

MOD VOICE: Go to the Gardai with the footage, see how well it works out. Thread Closed. Also pay attention to the bike path that is there. I'd blame the council planning before anything else. If you think this thread should reopen please PM me to discuss.

CramCycle

MOD VOICE: I recieved a few PMs and against my own judgement I am reopening the thread but under a watchful eye. Read the forum charter before posting, it may be Friday but I have been up since 3am and I don't have time for BS, breach of the forum charter will result in swift banning.

I can't think of anyway this ends well but the first person to generalise cyclists, motorists or any group that have nothing in common bar their mode of transport will get a Permaban. You can criticise the individuals in the video at will, do not attempt to identify them though, this is also a Permaban.

CramCycle

Council: A cyclepath that seems to disappear into thin air, no clear indication of where to go. Common sense would imply that this is one of their proposed shared space plans but no signs, unfortunately until a larger number of people put manners and safety as a priority, we still have to design the place as if everyone is a moron. I am not sure I fully blame them though as the engineer may have made the error that there is a modicum of decency among most road and path users, this unfortunately is a huge leap of faith at this moment in timeGuilty of a lack of foresight
Cyclist: Technically in the wrong but the poor layout of the cyclepath and the indicative layout implying shared space, I can see how the error is made. Still should have looked left because despite how zebra crossings should be treated, in Ireland you often have to wait as a pedestrian because a few people do not stop for them. I don't know any other country you have to be as cautious at a zebra crossing. Guilty of complacency
Motorist: Speeding, not paying attention. He may be right about the cyclist breaking the rules but in no way does this excuse the really poor driving. The driver was not paying attention and driving dangerously. Blaming the cyclist for something that would have gotten him arrested and lambasted had it been a pedestrian is just making excuses. Guilty of dangerous driving, or driving without due care and attention

secman

CramCycle wrote: »

Council: A cyclepath that seems to disappear into thin air, no clear indication of where to go. Common sense would imply that this is one of their proposed shared space plans but no signs, unfortunately until a larger number of people put manners and safety as a priority, we still have to design the place as if everyone is a moron. I am not sure I fully blame them though as the engineer may have made the error that there is a modicum of decency among most road and path users, this unfortunately is a huge leap of faith at this moment in timeGuilty of a lack of foresight
Cyclist: Technically in the wrong but the poor layout of the cyclepath and the indicative layout implying shared space, I can see how the error is made. Still should have looked left because despite how zebra crossings should be treated, in Ireland you often have to wait as a pedestrian because a few people do not stop for them. I don't know any other country you have to be as cautious at a zebra crossing. Guilty of complacency
Motorist: Speeding, not paying attention. He may be right about the cyclist breaking the rules but in no way does this excuse the really poor driving. The driver was not paying attention and driving dangerously. Blaming the cyclist for something that would have gotten him arrested and lambasted had it been a pedestrian is just making excuses. Guilty of dangerous driving, or driving without due care and attention

And the moral of the story is " 3 wrongs don't make a right "

average_runner

_Brian wrote: »

From that clip the driver wasn't paying enough attention to someone approaching the pedestrian crossing.

Now they're not for cyclists but does that allow an idiot driver to mow them down - no it doesn't.

The type of aggressive driving displayed here is a potential "dangerous driving" from what
I can see. The cyclist and vehicle driver are being equally inconsiderate and dickish on their behaviour.

Sorry but there is a law here. You cannot just go.straight out on the crossing, you got to ensure there is no car within 20m of the crossing. Don't see the issue with it been a cyclist using it, he/she just didn't look

Chuchote

Classic example of "there's a pair of them in it"!

OP: I've noticed that many drivers fail to take their foot off the accelerator when coming up to a place where they may expect hazards - junctions, pedestrian crossings, schools…

I've also noticed that many drivers who see me turning right on the bike as they're coming towards me speed up rather than slowing down.

You don't want to be the one waking up at three in the morning with someone's death replaying itself in your head…

CramCycle

average_runner wrote: »

Sorry but there is a law here. You cannot just go.straight out on the crossing, you got to ensure there is no car within 20m of the crossing. Don't see the issue with it been a cyclist using it, he/she just didn't look

Just because you could argue the car had right of way (although you would fail a test based on that driving), the car is approaching a hazard and should be preparing to stop, just in case. Much the same way when a light has been green on approach, you don't keep gunning it as if it will stay green, you prepare yourself that it may change.

Chuchote wrote: »

Classic example of "there's a pair of them in it"!

+1

ted1

average_runner wrote: »

Sorry but there is a law here. You cannot just go.straight out on the crossing, you got to ensure there is no car within 20m of the crossing. Don't see the issue with it been a cyclist using it, he/she just didn't look

20m I didn't see that in the SI. Don't post opinions as facts.

mcgratheoin

CramCycle wrote: »

Just because you could argue the car had right of way (although you would fail a test based on that driving), the car is approaching a hazard and should be preparing to stop, just in case. Much the same way when a light has been green on approach, you don't keep gunning it as if it will stay green, you prepare yourself that it may change.

Yep - I'd say that a collision in this situation would probably be similar to the car/bike on the footpath court case here. There will be some proportion of liability attached to both parties.

average_runner

ted1 wrote: »

20m I didn't see that in the SI. Don't post opinions as facts.

(2) When a vehicle is approaching a zebra crossing a pedestrian shall not step on to that crossing if his action is likely to cause the driver either to brake suddenly or to swerve.

From
Road Traffic General Bye-Laws

average_runner

CramCycle wrote: »

Just because you could argue the car had right of way (although you would fail a test based on that driving), the car is approaching a hazard and should be preparing to stop, just in case. Much the same way when a light has been green on approach, you don't keep gunning it as if it will stay green, you prepare yourself that it may change.

+1

Never supported the driver, I just quoted how to use a zebra crossing, something alot of people cant do in Ireland.

If a driver can't do an emergency stop he/she is obviously going too fast for that section of the road.

average_runner

Weepsie wrote: »

That's not what you said. Plus if a driver with 20metres has to suddenly brake, they're driving too fast or not paying attention

I never defended the driver. Relax

Also its more than likely a 50k speed limit, reaction and braking time in that zone is close to 30m, looking at the video he stopped with 5-8m so was probably doing 30K.

Yes he should of paid more attention, but he/she didnt expect someone to go out in front of them without checking.

We just need to be careful at zebra crossings and not just walk out on them which happens alot.

ted1

average_runner wrote: »

(2) When a vehicle is approaching a zebra crossing a pedestrian shall not step on to that crossing if his action is likely to cause the driver either to brake suddenly or to swerve.

From
Road Traffic General Bye-Laws

No mention of 20m. You made a statement as if it was fact , when infact it is fiction.

CramCycle

average_runner wrote: »

Never supported the driver, I just quoted how to use a zebra crossing, something alot of people cant do in Ireland.

If a driver can't do an emergency stop he/she is obviously going too fast for that section of the road.

I didn't say you did, I understood your point about not stepping out in front of moving traffic. My point was that if the driver had been paying attention and driving reasonably that would have been a non event. He approached to fast, if driving at a normal speed and paying attention, there was more than enough time to break once the bike turned to go across. In fact, even at the speed he was driving, he should have been able to stop in time if he was in anyway awake.
Does this excuse the stupidity of the cyclist not looking or paying attention (could have been an emergency vehicle or something else). Not at all.
I always treat Zebra crossings as they were intended, if someone is clearly going for it or can make it onto it before you cross, you approach with an aim to stop and in nearly all cases, stop until you are certain it is safe to proceed. In all scenarios you approach them with caution. No matter what the rule book says, you'd fail your test here for acting in any other fashion.

average_runner

ted1 wrote: »

No mention of 20m. You made a statement as if it was fact , when infact it is fiction.

Very true, its actually a longer distance.

"cause the driver either to brake suddenly or to swerve"

So in a 50k zone its 30 meters!!!

In a 30k zone it be close to 20m or a bit less.

The people that wrote the document were smart enough to know depending on the speed limit the braking distance changes.

rolion

rolion wrote: »

...for chatting on the phone,cycling the zebra and just taking the fcuking piss of the drivers !
And is not the only one that i have on my dashcam, just the one that actually behaved like is been offended by my driving style !

Guys ... a friendly note / warning : i drive a fcuking heavy machinery that cannot protect YOU when YOU behave stupid and your mum and dad waiting at home !!!


LE:
I am not going to comment on my driving style OR speed OR going on/off.
In the case that the other guy will have hit my car on the road,i will be here typing on the keyboard and his mum crying loud !
...
I'm putting the clip here as a warning and not as a rant over the cyclists that sometimes are drivers too,me inclusive.
AND not lastly... a pedestrian crossing does not give you / involve that you have priority aka jumping in the front of the moving car but rather a meaning that you, as a civilised person can cross the road safely in relation to other traffic participants that,unfrotunately ,that day left the crystal zebra ball in the back if his car !

Be good, cycle / drive safely !

Textbook concern trolling

ted1

average_runner wrote: »

Very true, its actually a longer distance.

"cause the driver either to brake suddenly or to swerve"

So in a 50k zone its 30 meters!!!

In a 30k zone it be close to 20m or a bit less.

The people that wrote the document were smart enough to know depending on the speed limit the braking distance changes.

Stop digging and just admit your making up fake facts.

josip

OP, was this also you driving in this?

It's from the same YouTube account.

CramCycle

josip wrote: »

OP, was this also you driving in this?

It's from the same YouTube account.

MOD VOICE: We are only discussing the video and related subject area of the original post. Any other posts on that account are irrelevant to the thread.

ted1

CramCycle wrote: »

MOD VOICE: We are only discussing the video and related subject area of the original post. Any other posts on that account are irrelevant to the thread.

I think it's very relevant as it displays a pattern with the OP driving style which is quite concerning.

It's also the only video he has uploaded where he stripped off the speed from the bottom.

CramCycle

MOD VOICE: Take it to PM, as per forum rules.

Imnotthehulk

That video was a little bit terrifying.

I ain't saying the driver shouldn't have slowed down ... and my initial instinct was to give out about the motorist... but that cyclist was a moron and lucky not to get himself killed. No matter what type of crossing you're at you don't blindly go across a road without checking that it's safe.

magicbastarder

average_runner wrote: »

Never supported the driver, I just quoted how to use a zebra crossing, something alot of people cant do in Ireland.

i once got a reply from the council about a suggestion to put a zebra crossing at castle market, which said they were not going to due to the ambiguity (i think that was the word used) it would create.

i think a lot of the issue here is that we don't use zebra crossings enough in road design, so many drivers are not familiar with them - which is then given as a reason for not using them more...

Tombo2001

Imnotthehulk wrote: »

That video was a little bit terrifying.

I ain't saying the driver shouldn't have slowed down ... and my initial instinct was to give out about the motorist... but that cyclist was a moron and lucky not to get himself killed. No matter what type of crossing you're at you don't blindly go across a road without checking that it's safe.

Its terrifying (I) because the driver made no effort to slowdown approaching a zebra crossing with flashing lights and (ii) because the driver doesn't seem to see it as a consideration that he should have been slowing down... judging by the OP. He is moaning because a cyclist popped out, but the reality is it could have been a child that popped out and he would have been approaching just as quick.

Typical driver attitude - we own the road, everyone else back off.

Tombo2001

magicbastarder wrote: »

i once got a reply from the council about a suggestion to put a zebra crossing at castle market, which said they were not going to due to the ambiguity (i think that was the word used) it would create.

i think a lot of the issue here is that we don't use zebra crossings enough in road design, so many drivers are not familiar with them - which is then given as a reason for not using them more...

I would disagree with that.

Every driver in the country knows what a pedestrian crossing with flashing lights mean.

Many of them choose to 'assume' no one is there......

FizzleSticks

This post has been deleted.

kingtut

Driver is 100% reckless and makes no attempt to slow down for the zebra crossing!! I don't see any fault with the cyclist in this case.

mrcheez

The OP's post is just an attempt to bash cyclists as per usual.. it could just as easily have been a pedestrian walking out and he wouldn't have bothered posting.

If the cyclist had decided to walk his bike over the zebra crossing would he be posting here?

Imnotthehulk

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Its terrifying (I) because the driver made no effort to slowdown approaching a zebra crossing with flashing lights and (ii) because the driver doesn't seem to see it as a consideration that he should have been slowing down... judging by the OP. He is moaning because a cyclist popped out, but the reality is it could have been a child that popped out and he would have been approaching just as quick.

Typical driver attitude - we own the road, everyone else back off.

I don't disagree with you, the driver should have slowed down. But the cyclist shouldn't have crossed without checking if was safe. It's basic road safety.

kingtut wrote: »

Driver is 100% reckless and makes no attempt to slow down for the zebra crossing!! I don't see any fault with the cyclist in this case.

No fault with the cyclist? He turned onto the road without checking to see if it was safe. We all have a responsibility to take care of ourselves.

Stephenc66

kingtut wrote: »

Driver is 100% reckless and makes no attempt to slow down for the zebra crossing!! I don't see any fault with the cyclist in this case.

I agree that the driver was reckless, he even appears to speed up after he slows for the brake lights of the car in front. Taking no notice of the cyclist or the crossing.

The cyclist was also reckless. He appears to be on the phone (in his left hand), does not look to his right and check it is safe to go on to the crossing, does not follow the guidelines for using a pedestrian crossing. Had he done so he would not have gone out in front of the car going to fast.

Both 100% reckless

ThisRegard

mrcheez wrote: »

The OP's post is just an attempt to bash cyclists as per usual.. it could just as easily have been a pedestrian walking out and he wouldn't have bothered posting.

He posted it on the Motors forum and the rabble told him to post it over here.

Anyway, the 2 were as bad as each other.

Tenzor07

Bicycle user could have been from mainland Europe where motor vehicles slow down and stop for pedestrian crossings...

kingtut

Imnotthehulk wrote: »

No fault with the cyclist? He turned onto the road without checking to see if it was safe. We all have a responsibility to take care of ourselves.

Stephenc66 wrote: »

The cyclist was also reckless. He appears to be on the phone (in his left hand), does not look to his right and check it is safe to go on to the crossing, does not follow the guidelines for using a pedestrian crossing. Had he done so he would not have gone out in front of the car going to fast.

Both 100% reckless

Having viewed the video again yes you are both 100% correct. Cyclist should have come to a complete stop and then proceeded provided it was safe to do so.

josip

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Bicycle user could have been from mainland Europe where motor vehicles slow down and stop for pedestrian crossings...

I think that depends which country you're referring to on the mainland.
In some of them (I have the Balkans in mind), the only way someone can cross at a pedestrian crossing is to look away from the traffic, while stepping onto the crossing.
They think you haven't seen them and will brake.
If they see you looking in their direction, they won't bother to slow down.
It's a classic game of chicken.
Nevertheless, you have to keep an eye on them with your peripheral vision because about 70% of them are on the phone and some sail through oblivious.