Love/Hate

Kevinmarkham

Here are seven courses which, from what I can tell, cause the greatest debate when it comes to their merits. Some people love them... some people don't.

If anyone wants to add a constructive comment on why they think any one of the following courses is good... or over-rated (please, no bad-mouthing just for the sake of it, and yes, green fees are high!) it would be interesting to see how the for/against debate works out.

1. Old Head

2. The European

3. Portmarnock (Old)

4. Carton House Montgomerie

5. Carlow

6. K Club (Palmer)

7. Royal County Down


Have I missed any courses which cause heated debates?

thewobbler

Those that I know:

---

Monty is an extraordinary achievement in itself and set a benchmark for what can be created on the dullest of landscapes.

Monty is just not as much fun to play as at least 20 courses within an hour's drive, because no matter how hard you try, it's not possible for a course on an unsuitable plot to compete with a good course on a suitable plot.

In summary, Kildare isn't a desert. So while Monty is something of a miracle, it's not one that will ever be appreciated where it is.

----

As first impressions go, RCD is the single most mind blowing course I've stood on. So unusual, so well maintained, so much fun. Just mesmerising.

But unlike many other courses, it's star wains a little on each subsequent visit. Partly because it's so difficult, partly because you cannot play well there without luck on your side, and partly because when you start applying a more open mind, the closing sequence of holes is neither memorable nor enjoyable.

In summary, RCD is fantastic, but if it's really the number one course on the world, then the lessons that architects should learn are that people demand golf to be penal, and will absolutely forgive a dreadful finish.

---

The course I've seen most split opinion on here is Druids Heath. I despise it.

Greenore is another one that tends to inspire adulation and hatred. I don't give it either. It's just an okay course in a nice location.

Whilst I don't think there's even their most committed club member thinks as highly of Scrabo as you do!

Dtoffee

The European Club .... meh, I cant really say I get the hype tbh. Played it 5/6 times and it can be tough, but what kills it for me is that you can get the right bump and be lucky or unlucky (such is links golf I know).

billy3sheets

Corballis causes far more love/hate debates than any of these courses.

billy3sheets

Corballis causes far more love/hate debates than any of these courses.

Kevinmarkham

billy3sheets wrote: »

Corballis causes far more love/hate debates than any of these courses.

Okayyyyyyyyyyyy... are you going to let us know why?

billy3sheets

Well I live in the area and was a member there for 3 years myself. It's a great value links course but like many links it can be extremely difficult especially on breezy days.
The rough tended to be very thick in places and a lot of time spent looking for lost balls.
For many mid to high handicappers it was a nightmare and I know some that would refuse to play there.
On the other hand it can be a beautiful spot especially the holes by the sea. It is a short course with 7 par 3s and lots of opportunities for 2s.

morrga

I know Kev most aren't a fan of the Smurfit course at the. K Club. I think it gets an unfair rap tbh. It's reknowned for its closing 6 holes but I think holes 1, 3, 4, 7 and 9 are equally strong golf holes. Scoring doesn't come easy on a visit there and on greens that are more than fair putting wise.

FixdePitchmark

Kevinmarkham wrote: »

Here are seven courses which, from what I can tell, cause the greatest debate when it comes to their merits. Some people love them... some people don't.

If anyone wants to add a constructive comment on why they think any one of the following courses is good... or over-rated (please, no bad-mouthing just for the sake of it, and yes, green fees are high!) it would be interesting to see how the for/against debate works out.

1. Old Head

2. The European

3. Portmarnock (Old)

4. Carton House Montgomerie

5. Carlow

6. K Club (Palmer)

7. Royal County Down


Have I missed any courses which cause heated debates?

If your a Dub - Corballis and Deer Park.

But that is very local.

1. Old Head

Love
Stunning course with incredible views - first time out, you can not but be impressed - noting like it, from a spectacular point of view.

Hate
It is basically a secret society of the golf elite and a nonsense from a golfing perspective - in Ireland, if you create something for outsiders or you are a wall builder - it actually misses the point of Irish golf.

2. The European

Love
Incredible that a man could do that out of his own imagination and confidence. The test of golf is stunning and the isolation is bizarre and perfect.

Hate
It is not as good as the self hype - Pat is an amazing person - but there are 2 better links in Sligo and I think Sligo only has 3 - you may wax lyrical all you want about bunkers - but sleepers are a solid object - not an obstacle you can work around with skill. It takes the skill out of golf - you could say the European is the negation of skill and the embracement of luck.

3. Portmarnock (Old)

Love

They do not give a s**t about anybody outside of their world.
They keep it for themselves and nobody else.

Hate
The overestimation of it as a course - the east coast is flat - you are miles behind the worst course on the west and you couldn't wash the shoes of The Island - or the open and progressive attitude of the people there and the superior players from there too.

And after all that - you are mean with no openness to local GUI players.

Yes, you are Portmarnock - but it is not as good a course as you think and we have to accept openly in our clubs the women you refuse :eek:

4. Carton House Montgomerie

Love

The fantastic OTT of it all - a reminder of a time in Ireland that imagination was only limited by imagination. The best manufactured inland course in the country - well that is probably - naturally, The Curragh - but another days debate.

Hate

Way OTT - and you walk it going
a) what were they thinking
b) How many guys can play golf this well
c) What hole do I own


5. Carlow

Love

What an amazing course that is years ahead of its time. So natural , so perfectly laid out and a hidden top gem .

Hate

Just too hard - Carlow people are fantastic and you never think of going there.

6. K Club (Palmer)

Love

How it pulled off being the centre of Irish golf for 20 years.

Hate

Basically - being a tax exile is something of the past - totally and utterly unacceptable, that a swamp parkland, is part of the focus of Irish golf - basically the TrumpVille of Ireland


7. Royal County Down

Love

Is the best course you ever play - till you play another course.
Is so natural
stunning location with an atmosphere unique to itself
It reminds you that golf is an old sport and you are only a blip in the pasing of the history of the place.
All best clubs in the world look at improving every year.
Breaking 80 - is very very hard - and even at 15 - that can end up at 85.
It is in another country and you do not know where you stand.
The bunkers - the daft yanks - the tee boxes - the speed of the surfaces.


Hate

They just dont want you there.

The course is too hard and you could play the same and have a 79 or 89.
They love Americans taking 6 hours, but can hardly tolerate people from their own union.

You are playing from tees - that are not the course, it is the McDonalds of top golf - in , out - you have done RCD.

Arrogance.

Look you are in Northern Ireland - don't talk to me like I'm a cave man from The South.

I'm from a modern, integrated, cosmopolitan city, who voted for marriage equality and think Brexit is out there.

You have a first minister - who let empty cow sheds be heated for a grant.

You have no - intellectual , political, ethical or social superiority over me - so can we get over that please.


So that is it.

Love - hate , subjective.

Kevinmarkham

thewobbler wrote: »

Those that I know:


Whilst I don't think there's even their most committed club member thinks as highly of Scrabo as you do!

Thanks Wobbler - nice detail.
Not a word against Scrabo... Not. A. Word!

billy3sheets wrote: »

Well I live in the area and was a member there for 3 years myself. It's a great value links course but like many links it can be extremely difficult especially on breezy days.
The rough tended to be very thick in places and a lot of time spent looking for lost balls.
For many mid to high handicappers it was a nightmare and I know some that would refuse to play there.
On the other hand it can be a beautiful spot especially the holes by the sea. It is a short course with 7 par 3s and lots of opportunities for 2s.

Question for you Billy: do you think those mid to high handicappers would play any links course if they find Corballis so tough? No links course is 'easy' but I would have thought with its short length, Corballis is a gentle introduction.

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

.

Fix, I've told you before... no drinking before posting on Boards;)

But seriously, tell us how you really feel.

As you say... it's subjective and based on experiences.


Thanks for the input so far, guys - keep it coming

thewobbler

Lol Fixed.

There are enclaves of up-your-own-arsers in every region in every country of the world. You just happened to find yourself in one of Northern Ireland's. That's a pretty unnecessary diatribe against the wee six.

From my own perspective, I don't think of RCD as that stuck up at all. There is an old money air around the place, but the staff have been genuinely friendly and helpful on my every visit. That can't just be because of my Nordie accent, surely.

charlieIRL

I played Corballis for the first time there before Christmas and really enjoyed it, tough course with some great holes but then there are 2 or 3 holes that cross over each other which are downright daft. I play off 18 and had a good day that day but I can see how someone could have a nightmare there.

Played Carlow a few years ago and didn't like it at all - too tough for a high handicap player. Great condition but just too tough.

The Monty
I actually like the Monty, its tough off the middle tees (forwards are too far forward if you can get a drive away as you'll hit past the bunkers) but the rough isn't too thick so any wayward shots are not punished too much. I think its a course all level of handicap players can enjoy - if you keep out of the bunkers!!! They are cruel!!!

mike12

Always laugh when I hear the holes in Corballis that share fairways are daft and dangerous.
It's OK in St Andrews though?

European RCD portmarnock are just superb courses on the flatter east coast.

Not a fan of the Monty not even sure why just doesn't do anything for me.

charlieIRL

mike12 wrote: »

Always laugh when I hear the holes in Corballis that share fairways are daft and dangerous.
It's OK in St Andrews though?

I don't think its ok anywhere, just too dangerous.
For example in Corballis, as I've never played there before my playing parter was helping me out and telling me directions to hit, we were on the tee box on the 15th. I ask what's my line? "see the 3 lads walking towards you down the fairway....aim that way" Or there's one green you walk off towards a par 3 (can't remember which hole) and you have to cross over the Par 5 where lads are teeing off??

Anyway, I like Corballis and was supposed to play there this morning with Seveob but got called into work. :mad:
Another day.

AnneFrank

billy3sheets wrote: »

Corballis causes far more love/hate debates than any of these courses.

Corballis is the biggest kip i have ever played, run by amateurs !

slingerz

Kevinmarkham wrote: »

Here are seven courses which, from what I can tell, cause the greatest debate when it comes to their merits. Some people love them... some people don't.

If anyone wants to add a constructive comment on why they think any one of the following courses is good... or over-rated (please, no bad-mouthing just for the sake of it, and yes, green fees are high!) it would be interesting to see how the for/against debate works out.

1. Old Head

2. The European

3. Portmarnock (Old)

4. Carton House Montgomerie

5. Carlow

6. K Club (Palmer)

7. Royal County Down


Have I missed any courses which cause heated debates?

Think its a very personal choice.

i cant say i hate any course, simply because i like getting out and playing the game. There are courses i feel are overrated by others.

For example, i dont get the hoopla around Cork Golf Club, Fota or Tralee

AnneFrank

I love Parkland courses, Beechpark is a great track

FixdePitchmark

Sorry Kevin

Seen Love / Hate was thinking it was tv show and did a Nidgy / Fran on it.

Don't see how Carlow fits in.

Other ones you can see the split.


Most are resort / once off experiences. Not courses for real club - day to day golf.

Johnny_Fontane

Great post OP.

Im a huge fan of Old Head. Played it 4/5 times and its truly jaw dropping. Sure its up its own arse, but the challenge is amazing. I was once a little late and when I parked my car, there was a guy in a buggy, ready to take me to the clubhouse and my clubs to the first tee. Drinks/snacks calmly organised. It was mega.

Also a huge fan of the Monty. Sure its sculpted, but its really enjoyably tough, particularly off the tee. but isnt that the point? Why shouldnt most drives on a top course be tough. It used to be far tougher too.

All the courses you mentioned are brilliant. I havent a negative thing to say about any of them!

Kevinmarkham

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Sorry Kevin
Seen Love / Hate was thinking it was tv show and did a Nidgy / Fran on it.
Don't see how Carlow fits in.
Other ones you can see the split.
Most are resort / once off experiences. Not courses for real club - day to day golf.

No sweat, Fix, always good to let people have their say!
Carlow is included because so many people say 'I don't get what all the fuss is about'... 'Why's it rated so highly in the rankings?' I love it for different reasons but its subtlety is one of its greatest strengths... whereas many golfers today expect the brasher experience (the K Club is a perfect example) where the design effort is displayed so clearly.

Johnny_Fontane wrote: »

Great post OP.

Im a huge fan of Old Head. Played it 4/5 times and its truly jaw dropping. Sure its up its own arse, but the challenge is amazing. I was once a little late and when I parked my car, there was a guy in a buggy, ready to take me to the clubhouse and my clubs to the first tee. Drinks/snacks calmly organised. It was mega.

Also a huge fan of the Monty. Sure its sculpted, but its really enjoyably tough, particularly off the tee. but isnt that the point? Why shouldnt most drives on a top course be tough. It used to be far tougher too.

All the courses you mentioned are brilliant. I havent a negative thing to say about any of them!

Good lad. Great response.

slingerz wrote: »

Think its a very personal choice.

i cant say i hate any course, simply because i like getting out and playing the game. There are courses i feel are overrated by others.

For example, i dont get the hoopla around Cork Golf Club, Fota or Tralee

Interesting to see Tralee mentioned. Four weak holes (IMO) but the rest are fabulous.

And yes, I agree, 'hate' is too strong a word... although I could list a couple!

Seve OB

charlieIRL wrote: »

I should have played Corballis for the second first time there before Christmas today !!!

FYP

Seve OB

mike12 wrote: »

Always laugh when I hear the holes in Corballis that share fairways are daft and dangerous.
It's OK in St Andrews though?

Have you ever played St. Andrews?
There is a world of difference.

searay

1. Old Head - Haven't played but the photos I've seen make me want to.

2. The European - I played it once as part of a four man scramble and I thought we had a good team until we walked off the second with a total of 1 points for the 2 holes. The railway sleepers in the bunkers are very daunting when you aren't used them.

Would gladly play it again.

3. Portmarnock (Old) - Watched Sevey in the Irish Open years ago hitting balls on the range which his caddy caught in a baseball glove. I don't think it's the hardest links course but it's a great test and I'd love to play it again.


4. Carton House Montgomerie - I think it was a very tough challenge when they let the rough grow wild but when I last played it you could hit the ball into the rough and avoid the bunkers making it very playable. It lacks the scenery of a true links and in it's current state it doesn't stand out.


5. Carlow - I was a member for years and would still be if I hadn't moved away. The course is probably similar to a British heath style course like Walton Heath with excellent drainage and is really well maintained. The negative to the course is that the greens are small old style greens and if when the course is dry, you land the ball short, there's a good chance of being over the green and having a tough chip back.

They used to let the rough grow wild and you could bounce short and end up lost in rough 3/5 yards behind the green. I had plenty of moments when I hated that aspect of the course.

6. K Club (Palmer)

Love it. It's a great challenge and like the Belfry, it'll always have the memories of the 2006 Ryder Cup and McIlroy's great Irish Open finish.

I want to try and hit McIlroy's 5 wood into the green on 18, but I'll need to be about 100 yards forward of where he hit from.

7. Royal County Down

I played it with three friends and none of us had played it before. I think we missed out by not having a local caddy given the amount of blind shots and there is no margin for error. One of our fourball is a member of Ballybunion and his comment "They only cut about half as much grass as they do in Ballybunion" said an awful lot about it.

I really would love another crack at it and for the first time ever in Ireland would get a caddy.

You mentioned Tralee in another post and said it has 4 weak holes. I think the weak holes are really the holes bringing you in and out of the clubhouse to the real course and should be considered in that context. 2 to 8 are fantastic with great scenery and from 12 to 17 it's fabulous. I think those holes would fit in with Pebble Beach.

I would happily drive 4 hours there and the same back to play it as long as you are paying!

Kevinmarkham

searay wrote: »

You mentioned Tralee in another post and said it has 4 weak holes. I think the weak holes are really the holes bringing you in and out of the clubhouse to the real course and should be considered in that context. 2 to 8 are fantastic with great scenery and from 12 to 17 it's fabulous. I think those holes would fit in with Pebble Beach.

Interesting - weak holes for me are 4, 5, 9 and 11. I like 18 and the opening hole from that high tee is a thrilling way to start. As for Pebble Beach, never played it - but been told that it's all about those holes on the water's edge. Other than that it's tame.

searay wrote: »

I would happily drive 4 hours there and the same back to play it as long as you are paying!

Yep, did that last year. And yep, I was paying!

titlebearer

I love these types of posts. Even though they are very subjective and each person has their own thoughts and opinions, I think the discussion is good.

I have played most of these courses with the exception of RCD and I actually like each of them.

I could add Knightsbrook to this list but every time I actually played it, it rained hard, placing everywhere and the wind was howling. I didn't have a great experience to the point I was avoiding it with my society! Then again I know lads who actually enjoy playing it.

Also can I add in Cork golf club. Before I ever played it I heard it was the best course in Cork. But when I came off the course I wasn't convinced.. Now don't get me wrong, it has some amazing holes. 4,5,6,7 but I thought some of the crossing holes were bad. Maybe because of the A. MacKenzie and Augusta link it has something, but for me, I'm not its biggest fan.

Hoof Hearted2

Kevinmarkham wrote: »

Interesting - weak holes for me are 4, 5, 9 and 11. I like 18 and the opening hole from that high tee is a thrilling way to start. As for Pebble Beach, never played it - but been told that it's all about those holes on the water's edge. Other than that it's tame.



Yep, did that last year. And yep, I was paying!

Interesting take on Tralee, I agree there are some poor holes but for me there are only 2 poor holes, the 6th and the 11th, and another negative outside of those two holes is the closeness of the 7th green to 6th, giving that area of the course a cramped feel and lacking in individuality.

The negative for the 9th for me is the horizon is too busy, i.e too many flag poles and the car park is in full view making it difficult at times to see the flag on the 9th green when playing your 2nd/3rd shot, it's an easy problem to solve and I'm surprised that when the 9th was redone that the designer didn't take the opportunity to put a mound behind the green to screen the car park from view when playing the hole.

d2ww

Surprised Druid's Heath hasn't been mentioned yet, personally I like it for the occasional round, with the exception of the 12th hole.

fred funk }{

d2ww wrote: »

Surprised Druid's Heath hasn't been mentioned yet, personally I like it for the occasional round, with the exception of the 12th hole.

In fairness, it's not in the same league as the above mentioned courses.

FixdePitchmark

fred funk }{ wrote: »

In fairness, it's not in the same league as the above mentioned courses.

But would agree it is a love hate.

Maybe one of the few that is more hate than the ones mentioned.

Would agree with a few posts saying they would love to play any of the courses.

Not sure they would want me to play them

Anatom

Kevinmarkham wrote: »

1. Old Head

2. The European

3. Portmarnock (Old)

4. Carton House Montgomerie

5. Carlow

6. K Club (Palmer)

7. Royal County Down


Have I missed any courses which cause heated debates?

1. Old Head
I have never played it, but it is on my "bucket list" for when I have so much money, I'll feel like giving it away for free. That, or for when I am being wooed by a large American multinational to come and work for them... It looks like an absolutely fabulous location, and if you're going for a walk along a picturesque cliff-top, you may as well have a four-iron in your hand doing so.


2. The European
Again, I have never played it, so I cannot comment.

3. Portmarnock (Old)
I love it. I have played it twice and I'm just not a good enough golfer to master it. I am happy to come away with a scattering of pars and maybe one or two birdies on the longer, downwind holes. I couldn't help being distracted by the proximity of large airliners coming in to land in Dublin airport - one reason why I probably wouldn't join (that, of course and the money. Unless I am in a situation like 1. above). Its a beautiful place, each hole presents a massive challenge and I look forward to playing there again next summer.

Unlike a Dooks or a Waterville, there's no view of the sea which I think is a minus, especially seeing as its a links course (and I am a massive fan of those two), and there is an air sometimes of not feeling that I belong there. That could just be my natural inferiority complex though, and possibly related to the money situation (see 1. again).

4. Carton House Montgomerie
I've been around this a couple of times and I have loved it each time. A great layout, some serious bunkers and even though its incredibly tough, when I've played badly it hasn't been something I can blame the course for. Its been just my own stupidity. Beautifully maintained, it oozes quality the whole way around, possibly more than Portmarnock (which feels more natural by comparison). However, as Fixde (I think) said above, the Curragh, my former club, is miles ahead of it in terms of natural layout and enjoyment (but I may be biased).

5. Carlow
Played it for the first time last year. A gem. Yes, its very tough as well (aren't they all?), but I was able play to my handicap and I look forward to a second spin at some stage in the not-too-distant future when I'll, hopefully, know where I'm going. Almost all of the holes are interesting in their turn, with only one or two I wouldn't be thrilled about (that first par 3 for instance). Blind shots, up and downs, left-hand doglegs, it has it all. Plus, the trees! I love it. The welcome we received was also second-to-none. The captain happened to see us coming off the 18th as he was finishing on the 9th green and came over to us, shook our hands and apologised for not being there to welcome us when we'd arrived. The staff were brilliant and the food was excellent - only adding to the occasion. Great value for money.

6. K Club (Palmer)
Ah, the K Club. My local star. Having the Ryder Cup, European Opens, Irish Opens, etc. really bumped up the hype over this place. Whether its the Smurfit or the Palmer, I have enjoyed, and been disappointed by, both. Facilities are boom-chic, although looking ever so slightly shabby the last time I was there. Yes, the Palmer is very, very hard. I fact I think it is too hard - for me anyway. Perhaps I was overawed by the RC/EO thing, or the expense, or my expectations were too high, but its BIG. I admire it, but it makes me uncomfortable. I can play it, but I think I prefer next door...


7. Royal County Down
I've never played it. In fact, I have avoided going up on three occasions now, and this summer's invitation will almost certainly go unused again. Its too far, I've heard too many negative things, and unless I'm in the Old Head (see 1. again) position, I won't be going.

Johnny_Fontane

Anatom wrote: »

4. Carton House Montgomerie
However, as Fixde (I think) said above, the Curragh, my former club, is miles ahead of it in terms of natural layout and enjoyment (but I may be biased).

Sorry, but I'm not having this at all. I like the curragh, but you cannot put it in the sort of company of the Monty.

Anatom

I did say I might be biased! Curragh is pretty much untouched. Carton isn't, its entirely manufactured from farmland/parkland (I remember being on that land long before the courses were).

mike12

Seve OB wrote: »

Have you ever played St. Andrews?
There is a world of difference.

I have and I'm not comparing the courses but it has shared fairways and greens and you have to cross holes at some stage.
There are people walking across the fairways in both.

Seve OB

mike12 wrote: »

I have and I'm not comparing the courses but it has shared fairways and greens and you have to cross holes at some stage.
There are people walking across the fairways in both.

well then you know there is big difference between a shared fairway that is 100+yards wide and the likes of Corballis that has a shared fairway where you are basically hitting straight at the guys coming down towards you.

Corballis is a dangerous place. St Andrews not so much, but in fairness I've only played it the once so might have a better take on it if I played it again.

doenahs

I'd like to add Baltray to the list.

Played it a few years ago expecting great things for a top 10 rated course and wasn't impressed. Think the course was discussed on an earlier thread by Kevin and a few other people thought the same.

There are a lot better courses such as Carne, the Island or Enniscrone that are a lot better than County Louth.

It does not justify its high ranking or high green fee!

AnneFrank

d2ww wrote: »

Surprised Druid's Heath hasn't been mentioned yet, personally I like it for the occasional round, with the exception of the 12th hole.

this is a weird course ! I actually liked the front nine but some of the holes on the back are just plain strange.

Dtoffee

AnneFrank wrote: »

this is a weird course ! I actually liked the front nine but some of the holes on the back are just plain strange.

I played it for the first time last week and agree with you .... it looks like they were trying to squeeze in holes up and down around the back 9.

whizbang

Only played Monty of all listed..

Druids Heath and Monty for me are a pair of twins, very similar in feel, but the Heath has so much more interest.

Louth and Seapoint are both only hate category, no interest in going back to either. Overrated and expensive.

Corballis 1st and Tara 2nd, has to be the most Love/Hate of all for me.

will let you know about Carlow, but I'm already biased (€15 special)

Kevinmarkham

If anyone's interested, here's a link to today's Examiner article on the six courses that spark the greatest debate. No Druid's Heath, no Cork, no Doonbeg.

Thanks for the feedback - all useful stuff.

Anatom

Good article Kevin!

fred funk }{

Good article. Makes me want to play them all.

AhHaor

Dtoffee wrote: »

I played it for the first time last week and agree with you .... it looks like they were trying to squeeze in holes up and down around the back 9.

The 12th is a pig off the whites or worse, off the greens just smash a driver over and about 150 left.

The Heath has been sanitised hugely in the last 2 years. Off the green tees and no wind it's not really that much of a challenge, the problem comes when
a) white tees come in
b) speed of greens gets up
c) bit of wind
d) tricked up pins on slopes

equals nobody in 4 years beating their handicap in a medal and not winning it!!!!

Dtoffee

AhHaor wrote: »

The 12th is a pig off the whites or worse, off the greens just smash a driver over and about 150 left.

The Heath has been sanitised hugely in the last 2 years. Off the green tees and no wind it's not really that much of a challenge, the problem comes when
a) white tees come in
b) speed of greens gets up
c) bit of wind
d) tricked up pins on slopes

equals nobody in 4 years beating their handicap in a medal and not winning it!!!!

Good point, I am a firm believer that golf should be challenging BUT not impossible for it to attract an active playing base. Over the last 30 years, many new courses have been developed that are set to Professional standards in terms of length and difficulty and as such, they are taking a high number of golfers out of the picture.

Golfgraffix

Kevinmarkham wrote: »

If anyone's interested, here's a link to today's Examiner article on the six courses that spark the greatest debate. No Druid's Heath, no Cork, no Doonbeg.

Thanks for the feedback - all useful stuff.

Really enjoyed the read Kevin, having played most of them I couldn't really disagree with any of the fors or against.

The article has really made me try and get out to the European, I have still yet to play it. Is it really that hard?

J

Kevinmarkham

Golfgraffix wrote: »

Is it really that hard?

Even on a still day you'll need to navigate your way around with considerable care. One loose shot and the bunkers or the rough will swallow you up. There are some really tough holes and you rarely get the chance to breathe/relax before faced with another testing shot. Now add wind and start again!

The best round I ever played here was when I hit 3 iron off the tee and found almost every fairway. I was getting 230/250 yards with the run. No wind.