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Should TG4 have english audio for sports?

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  • 08-01-2017 3:37pm
    #1
    zeebre12
    Registered Users Posts: 537 ✭✭✭


    Should people have the option of english commentary for sports on TG4, make like a red button option like they had for the other rugby game they were shoeing a few months ago? I think they should, I know its our native language and all but it seems stupid that most people watching dont know what the commentators are saying. Like last night the rugby match was on TG4 and my family have 0 Irish and never will so it seems stupid we like most people watching in the country have to listen to it in Irish. At least give an option.


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    #2
    artanevilla
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,359 Mod ✭✭✭✭artanevilla


    It's an Irish channel though. That's the whole point of the station.

    The only use I ever got out of the red button in sports anyway was to turn the commentary off completely.


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    #3
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,499 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    I always assumed that one of the reasons that TG4 can get access to the live sports is that the price they pay must be significantly lower of the potential audience is much smaller.

    Would that be right or just my silly notion?

    Also, I watch the tour de France on it and over a few days you do get to pick up some of meanings and the type of sayings. SO much of it is lost on me but even on that small bit it adds to my knowledge


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    #4
    Elmo
    Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    zeebre12 wrote: »
    Should people have the option of english commentary for sports on TG4, make like a red button option like they had for the other rugby game they were shoeing a few months ago? I think they should, I know its our native language and all but it seems stupid that most people watching dont know what the commentators are saying. Like last night the rugby match was on TG4 and my family have 0 Irish and never will so it seems stupid we like most people watching in the country have to listen to it in Irish. At least give an option.

    No TG4 was set up to promote the language, the should use on screen graphic to help those with limited Irish or no Irish. Why you need a commentator to explain scores doesn't make much sense.

    I don't know if you where thought Irish in school or not.


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    #5
    Elmo
    Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    I always assumed that one of the reasons that TG4 can get access to the live sports is that the price they pay must be significantly lower of the potential audience is much smaller.

    Would that be right or just my silly notion?

    Only for RWC 2011 when they won deferred rights in Irish only. But Sport brings in large audiences to TG4 regardless of the language barrier, the only exception was soccer.


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    #6
    dudara
    Registered Users Posts: 33,519 ✭✭✭✭dudara


    Broadcasting in Irish is their mandate, so no, I don't believe they should provide English commentary.

    I actually enjoy listening to the commentators who are clearly not native speakers, but are making a decent effort at it. It's encouraging to see rugby being used to improve Irish


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    #7
    zeebre12
    Registered Users Posts: 537 ✭✭✭zeebre12


    Elmo wrote: »
    No TG4 was set up to promote the language, the should use on screen graphic to help those with limited Irish or no Irish. Why you need a commentator to explain scores doesn't make much sense.

    I don't know if you where thought Irish in school or not.
    But most people dont know what they are saying they might as well be speaking Latin. Irish shouldnt be forced on someone so you should be given the option, especially for big sporting events like rugby matches with mass appeal (it should serve the people). Then if you want to listen in Irish you can.
    And you do need commentators to explain things particularly in rugby when there are stops every 2 minutes.


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    #8
    dudara
    Registered Users Posts: 33,519 ✭✭✭✭dudara


    Irish is not being forced on you, you don't have to watch it. This is not mandatory Irish classes in school


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    #9
    Zaph
    Registered Users, Subscribers Posts: 47,282 ✭✭✭✭Zaph


    Well in that case should RTE be forced to have an Irish audio option for people when they're showing Ireland soccer matches? TG4 was set up with a particular remit and it performs it well. The fact that they have the rights to the rugby is incidental, would you be as concerned about the Irish commentary if they were showing a sport you had no interest in?


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    #10
    reubenreuben
    Registered Users Posts: 1,050 ✭✭✭reubenreuben


    dudara wrote: »
    Broadcasting in Irish is their mandate, so no, I don't believe they should provide English commentary.

    I actually enjoy listening to the commentators who are clearly not native speakers, but are making a decent effort at it. It's encouraging to see rugby being used to improve Irish

    If broadcasting in irish is in their mandate then what about commercials and programs originally in english? Should they not be dubbed to irish?


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    #11
    moleyv
    Registered Users Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭moleyv


    S4C give the option of Welsh or English for rugby matches.

    Doesn't bother me TG4 broadcasting in Irish only, I know enough and know what I'm watching.

    Put the game on mute and use the audio from radio if you need to.


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    #12
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    No, it's an Irish channel. It would be nice to have, but it's not a case of it should have, it's there to promote Irish, not give people a way out of hearing it.
    Elmo wrote: »
    No TG4 was set up to promote the language, the should use on screen graphic to help those with limited Irish or no Irish

    They did that for a while with the rugby.
    zeebre12 wrote: »
    But most people dont know what they are saying they might as well be speaking Latin. Irish shouldnt be forced on someone...

    You have the option of not watching or listening, and on occasions watching on another channel. You're not forced to watch or listen.


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    #13
    icdg
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 11,529 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    Okay before this thread goes forward, the obligatory warning.

    The scope of this forum extends to Broadcasting only. This is NOT the place to debate linguistics, language policy, the education system or anything to do with the Irish language.

    As a general rule read your post before you hit reply. If the word "TG4" and "Sports" aren't both in it, it's probably off topic. If I see any more than three off topic posts after I post this warning, the thread gets closed.


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    #14
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Yes they should give the option. I don't speak Welsh but I tuned I to th Welsh stations SC4 and BBC Wales to watch the rugby. Native speakers have the default option so it would make sense to give people an option they actually understand

    Should the ads be in Irish too?


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    #15
    errlloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 12,601 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    I watch games on TG4 all the time and I've no Irish. I'm just glad they're getting broadcast tbh. The fact it's broadcast in HD is even better. Whenever anyone in my family complains I remind them we wouldn't be seeing the game otherwise.

    My one issue is that I think it prevents the sport reaching new non Irish speaking fans. I know what is going on, commentary is unimportant to me. From that point of view I am somewhat surprised the league selling the rights hasn't forced TG4 into some sort of arrangement for English.


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    #16
    Elmo
    Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    reubenreuben wrote: »
    If broadcasting in irish is in their mandate then what about commercials and programs originally in english? Should they not be dubbed to irish?

    TG4 like most Irish TV channels cannot afford a full service of home produced programmes thus they buy in a few international titles for adult audiences.

    By introducing either irish language dubbing on English live action TV/Film or providing English language commentary on sport... even news and documentary would reduce its funding to produce programming.

    As pointed your not being force to watch TG4 for sport, imagine TV3 just launched Racing on its service with no Irish commentators or providing a job to Irish people for its ITV coverage. It took similar generic coverage for some RWC Matches.


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    #17
    mjp
    Registered Users Posts: 968 ✭✭✭mjp


    Its an IRISH language TV station. You can watch it and listen to the commentary in Irish or else switch to one of the soaps on something else on the other TV stations. Your choice !!! Nobody is forcing you to watch it.

    The station was setup originally to give a platform for the Irish language and for people who have an interest in the language and help them improve their command of the language.


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    #18
    zeebre12
    Registered Users Posts: 537 ✭✭✭zeebre12


    reubenreuben wrote: »
    If broadcasting in irish is in their mandate then what about commercials and programs originally in english? Should they not be dubbed to irish?
    Exactly. Then they shouldnt be allowed to pick and choose. Ye are all going on about their mandate, they why are adds in English and some programs. How does this help the Irish language? They pick and choose as it is, so big sporting events with mass appeal should be in in English and Irish.


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    #19
    snubbleste
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 31,117 ✭✭✭✭snubbleste


    No.


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    #20
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,061 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

    Should the ads be in Irish too?

    Ah now down with this sort of consistency


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    #21
    zeebre12
    Registered Users Posts: 537 ✭✭✭zeebre12


    mjp wrote: »
    Its an IRISH language TV station. You can watch it and listen to the commentary in Irish or else switch to one of the soaps on something else on the other TV stations. Your choice !!! Nobody is forcing you to watch it.

    The station was setup originally to give a platform for the Irish language and for people who have an interest in the language and help them improve their command of the language.
    But what if you have no interest in Irish and dont want to improve your irish. Big sporting events like these shouldnt be solely in Irish. It shouldnt be allowed. Why does S4C then have an option for English commentary. Would anyone then mind if the Euros last summer were only on TG4 in Irish?


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    #22
    Elmo
    Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    zeebre12 wrote: »
    But what if you have no interest in Irish and dont want to improve your irish. Big sporting events like these shouldnt be solely in Irish. It shouldnt be allowed. Why does S4C then have an option for English commentary. Would anyone then mind if the Euros last summer were only on TG4 in Irish?

    Firstly they aren't big sporting events that's why they are on TG4. Secondly a language shouldn't upset you so much when it comes to sport. (Kind of in general).

    S4C has over €100m in funding.

    IMO ads should be as gealige particularly when most ads carry on screen graphics in English, but again costs associated with dubbing.


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    #23
    zeebre12
    Registered Users Posts: 537 ✭✭✭zeebre12


    Elmo wrote: »
    Firstly they aren't big sporting events that's why they are on TG4. Secondly a language shouldn't upset you so much when it comes to sport. (Kind of in general).

    S4C has over €100m in funding.

    IMO ads should be as gealige particularly when most ads carry on screen graphics in English, but again costs associated with dubbing.
    Rugby games involving Irish teams are big sporting fixtures. They are not niche like netball games. Even the casual sports person would watch them. They are big fixtures and appeal to a lot of people therefore they should be in English for people who dont speak Irish (most of the country) and if possible like the GAA are doing now with an option for games in Irish. Im not saying we should not have Irish or Irish shouldnt be promoted but as these games attract a large audience who speak predominantly English, they should at least be given an option.


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    #24
    Elmo
    Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    zeebre12 wrote: »
    Rugby games involving Irish teams are big sporting fixtures. They are not niche like netball games. Even the casual sports person would watch them. They are big fixtures and appeal to a lot of people therefore they should be in English for people who dont speak Irish (most of the country) and if possible like the GAA are doing now with an option for games in Irish. Im not saying we should not have Irish or Irish shouldnt be promoted but as these games attract a large audience who speak predominantly English, they should at least be given an option.

    If they are such big games then both TV3 and RTE need to give them as much coverage as TG4. Setanta did for a while and the amount of complaints from people without access to Setanta and the problems caused when it left terrestrial TV. RTE also took them for a while.

    AFAIK RTE take their commentary from RTÉ RnaG. And RTÉ have only started providing that feature on a very few select games, why not get the option across all sport on RTÉ?


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    #25
    An Ciarraioch
    Registered Users Posts: 5,803 ✭✭✭An Ciarraioch


    zeebre12 wrote: »
    Exactly. Then they shouldnt be allowed to pick and choose. Ye are all going on about their mandate, they why are adds in English and some programs. How does this help the Irish language? They pick and choose as it is, so big sporting events with mass appeal should be in in English and Irish.

    In the TnaG era, all the ads were in Irish, but presumably only a limited number of companies were prepared to do so.


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    #26
    Elmo
    Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    An Ciarraioch wrote: »
    In the TnaG era, all the ads were in Irish, but presumably only a limited number of companies were prepared to do so.
    A few ads were in Irish not all half the channel was QVC at that point


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    #27
    lertsnim
    Registered Users Posts: 9,721 ✭✭✭lertsnim


    It would be nice if they offered an alternative commentary track but I'd rather they sorted out HD on Saorview first.


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    #28
    Earthhorse
    Registered Users Posts: 14,714 ✭✭✭✭Earthhorse


    Can you get subtitles for live events? You'd need to be typing fast.

    But it might be a missed opportunity to help people learn the language if it were possible.


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    #29
    ArmaniJeanss
    Registered Users Posts: 13,313 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    Earthhorse wrote: »
    Can you get subtitles for live events? You'd need to be typing fast.

    BBC try to do it anyway, but it's really tricky. You should switch it on the next time they have an FA Cup tie.
    It understandably tends to get way behind, then you can see that the typist has just given up and decided to skip a bit and start again. Also sometimes the typist is clearly not a football fan and gets the lingo badly wrong.


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    #30
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,834 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    It's automated voice recognition software rather than a person isn't it.

    edit: yes
    However, live subtitling, as seen mostly on the news, sporting events and other programmes which are going out live, requires an entirely different skillset - a person with good ears, a clear speaking voice and specially 'trained' voice recognition software.
    These live subtitlers sit in a soundproofed room, watching the TV feed and 're-speak' the words from the programme clearly and deliberately into a microphone. The computer, which over time has come to accurately recognise the live subtitler's voice, then translates their spoken words into text on screen.
    Problems usually arise with complex jargon, or unusual names of people and places - Manchester United footballer Adnan Januzaj famously became Janet Jazz Jazz Jam for example.
    The BBC is working on new automated subtitling technology - but for now, re-speaking, while not infallible, is still the best method available.


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    #31
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,061 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    Earthhorse wrote: »
    Can you get subtitles for live events? You'd need to be typing fast.

    But it might be a missed opportunity to help people learn the language if it were possible.
    ArmaniJeanss wrote: »
    BBC try to do it anyway, but it's really tricky. You should switch it on the next time they have an FA Cup tie.
    It understandably tends to get way behind, then you can see that the typist has just given up and decided to skip a bit and start again. Also sometimes the typist is clearly not a football fan and gets the lingo badly wrong.

    I'd have thought a speech to text programme would have been employed, maybe they are not quick enough yet.


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