Is there as many Muntjac as is claimed?

Free-2-Flow

I've read a bit about Muntjac over the years yet I've never seen one, Not being a deer hunter wouldn't help but I've heard there is thousands countrywide?
Where are they hiding? Can they be eaten like all others?

Vizzy

I have a herd of 17 at the moment, but I'm thinking of getting rid of them because between them and the wild boar, they have the place destroyed

Free-2-Flow

Vizzy wrote:

I have a herd of 17 at the moment, but I'm thinking of getting rid of them because between them and the wild boar, they have the place destroyed

Vizzy wrote:

I have a herd of 17 at the moment, but I'm thinking of getting rid of them because between them and the wild boar, they have the place destroyed

Hi Vizzy, do you keep them as pets?

Free-2-Flow

Vizzy wrote:

I have a herd of 17 at the moment, but I'm thinking of getting rid of them because between them and the wild boar, they have the place destroyed

Currently looking for permission to start my Deer hunting journey Vizzy, stepping up from the .22lr, would you know anyone interested in giving me permission?

cookimonster

Free-2-Flow wrote: »

.........but I've heard there is thousands countrywide?
.....Can they be eaten like all others?

Can't get the link up, maps.biodiversityireland.ie, there's only 128 records on them.
If you can find 'em and cook 'em thier ment to taste very nice, one of the better venison sources.

Vizzy

Free-2-Flow wrote: »

Hi Vizzy, do you keep them as pets?

Sorry Free-2-Flow, I was joking.

There are loads of threads on here about supposed sightings of Muntjac and Wild Boar but I've yet to see photos.

Best of luck finding them though.

Free-2-Flow

cookimonster wrote:

Can't get the link up, maps.biodiversityireland.ie, there's only 128 records on them. If you can find 'em and cook 'em thier ment to taste very nice, one of the better venison sources.

Any idea where to start for deer hunting? I have no licence or large caliber as of yet altough i have a deposit on a 6.5x55, approach farmers with land?
Thanks.

Crow Pigeon and Pheasant

Free-2-Flow wrote:

Any idea where to start for deer hunting? I have no licence or large caliber as of yet altough i have a deposit on a 6.5x55, approach farmers with land? Thanks.

Well suppose you'll have to get a deer hunting licence first!

Free-2-Flow

Crow Pigeon and Pheasant wrote:

Well suppose you'll have to get a deer hunting licence first!

You need land to shoot on first

cookimonster

Free-2-Flow wrote: »

Any idea where to start for deer hunting? .......

Honestly.....the best place to start is with someone who's already an experienced deer stalker. I had a childhood background in shooting, pleanty of hunting permissions and a good few connections with the stalking world. I earned my bones for the first dear season with a lot of walk outs and no gun. After 6 or so seasons I still take the opportunity to go out with different lads for a wider experience often without my gun.
The land, license and gun are only the tip of the iceberg, experience particularly the mud, blood and sh1te part is invaluable, then comes the logistics: animal retrieval, hygienic storage, preparation skills and long term meat storage etc.

It's a great pastime and my only regret is I waited so long to get into it, but even with my short experience you'll come across quite a few lads who never prepared themselves for what is involved or shoot one deer and after that never stalk again.
I don't mean to make assumptions about you, but given your other posts I would guess that stalking would be new to you, so plan your steps out so that you are able to pay justice to your first deer. I know experienced stalkers who often curtail or stop stalking if they cannot do things right.
Keep asking the questions, but try to get mud on your boots and blood on your hands before you take the shot.

dodderangler

I have seen the boar. But they're not like the massive lads you see in Poland. Someone on here told me that these are a mix of polish boar and domestic pigs. This was 2 year ago so I would say they're gone by now. If not and if they've bred we should be seeing them all over the place now.

cookimonster

Vizzy wrote: »

Sorry Free-2-Flow, I was joking............Best of luck finding them though.

Damn and I was digging in my repertoire for a muntjac recipe......:rolleyes:;):D

cookimonster

From the The National Biodiversity Data Centre:

Feral pigs are not known to be established in Ireland. There have been 39 verified sightings of feral pig in Ireland since 2009 with a scattered distribution in Ireland and no verified sightings in Northern Ireland. Most sightings are in upland areas and are thought to be escaped or released animals. A group of 7 animals recorded on Foynes Island (Co. Limerick) in 2014 is believed to have been a deliberate release.

Crow Pigeon and Pheasant

cookimonster wrote:

Feral pigs are not known to be established in Ireland. There have been 39 verified sightings of feral pig in Ireland since 2009 with a scattered distribution in Ireland and no verified sightings in Northern Ireland. Most sightings are in upland areas and are thought to be escaped or released animals. A group of 7 animals recorded on Foynes Island (Co. Limerick) in 2014 is believed to have been a deliberate release.

So what if they are released? I'd love just to release some and hope that they would breed and have wild pigs/boar to shoot! I'd say it would be great craic!

cookimonster

Crow Pigeon and Pheasant wrote: »

So what if they are released? I'd love just to release some and hope that they would breed and have wild pigs/boar to shoot! I'd say it would be great craic!

Absolutely illegal, they are listed as an invasive species and considering it's illegal to live trap vermin and release them onto other lands could you imagine what the NPWS would throw at you if they had a will.
I've seen damage that a small group of boar can do to freshly tilled fields and although they are ment to be good in forestry areas I think those conditions are long past in Ireland. Farmers won't be too keen to see their tillage and grazing fields rooted up.

Crow Pigeon and Pheasant

cookimonster wrote:

Absolutely illegal, they are listed as an invasive species and considering it's illegal to live trap vermin and release them onto other lands could you imagine what the NPWS would throw at you if they had a will. I've seen damage that a small group of boar can do to freshly tilled fields and although they are ment to be good in forestry areas I think those conditions are long past in Ireland. Farmers won't be too keen to see their tillage and grazing fields rooted up.

Very true but let them out in forestry of your own if you owned large a enough area! Or let them out in forestry owned by coillte!

Free-2-Flow

cookimonster wrote:

Damn and I was digging in my repertoire for a muntjac recipe......

You are right about my experience, I generally shoot rabbits. Thanks for the advice.

cookimonster

Crow Pigeon and Pheasant wrote: »

Very true but let them out in forestry of your own if you owned large a enough area! Or let them out in forestry owned by coillte!

If it was your own land it would have to be well fenced and 'hog' proofed, considering the amount of deer that have escaped from modern deer farms in recent times.

I doubt, no I know it, Coillte would not be impressed with anyone releasing not only an invasive species but quite a destructive one in amongst their crop.
I shoot on two Coillte woods and the reason myself and the other nominated stalkers hunt there is to control the deer numbers in order to reduce the damage to the trees. It's part of the forestry management plan, so the wilful introduction of boar wouldn't go down well.

cookimonster

Free-2-Flow wrote: »

You are right about my experience, I generally shoot rabbits. Thanks for the advice.

We all have to start somewhere, I know of lads who never shot or hunted before and got into stalking and are very competent stalkers.
Two options:

Get your land permission/s,100 acres of land with deer on it, get your deer license, get your firearms certificate & rifle. Someone here can confirm whether or not the NPWS issue letters of confirmation deer license prior to issuing in August in order to satisfy the Guards.

Get a spot on a Coillte lease (how deep are your pockets), in order to 'qualify' for this you need - HCAP certification, (exams and testing will begin early next year) & suitable insurance.
The Coillte stalking permit will suffice for your permission in order to apply for the deer hunting license then that in turn gives you just reason for your centre fire.
The only problem with this is that Coillte only issue nominated permits in August and in recent years this is causing havoc with deer licensing applications and getting them back before Sept 1st.
Somebody here may have experience the Coillte route better as I use private permissions to get my deer license.

Grizzly 45

Crow Pigeon and Pheasant wrote: »

Very true but let them out in forestry of your own if you owned large a enough area! Or let them out in forestry owned by coillte!

You would promptly find them living in your surburban back garden veggie plot!
Wild boar are incredibly adaptive,and are not going to hang around for long in barren of anything edible sitka spruce forestry plots. Their native habitat are massive oak forests where they forage for mostly acorns, mice,squirrels,berries, mushrooms and carrion.[Numerous murder victims have been disposed like this on the continent].Ask surburban dwelling Berliners and Munchiners about this "Sauen plage" and finding their fine lawns and fruit trees being uprooted by a herd of boar,and being chased back indoors or attacked by the dominant sow in the herd.Or any German farmer and hunter about up rooted crop fields of spuds ,corn or wheat. They are not something to be trifiled with when they lose their natural fear of humans and get used to us and our free food.

The muntjac story in Ireland is about as truthful as the media silly season "Black cats the size of mountain lions stalking our lands" every Summer in our national fake news rags .
There has been two or three,more or less...., confirmed kills of them in the Republic going by previous statistics of NPWS returns. Muntjac breed like rabbits.It's not uncommon for a doe to produce three young a year. So at that rate ,ther should be a Hell of a lot more sightings or shootings of them.

Grizzly 45

cookimonster wrote: »

. It's part of the forestry management plan, so the wilful introduction of boar wouldn't go down well.

And yet they would be the best natural earth grubbers ,garbage removers,fertilisers and pest controllers you could let into a forest plantation.
As WB dont live off trees in any age shape or form.[Apart from using a few around around a mud wallow as scratching posts:)]But they do like briars and black berries,[as do deer.],and will root out wasp nests,rat and mice nests,as well as aerate and dung the forest soil.

cookimonster

Grizzly,
're Muntjac,
Absolutely f@cking exactly.... Non stop breeding, drop one, then pregnant again. So where are they. Based on today's society's passion to photograph every thing alive or inanimate where are all the photos of these mini prehistoric deer. Even if one is produced, with no signs of freezer burn, then where's the other ones?
Up on one of my permissions there are two of the biggest hares I've seen in decades and they seem to love meandering through a thick fir plantations and if you weren't switched on the uninitiated could wonder what these large fury things are. While out lamping we've seen a good few new born Sika calfs, so again the uninitiated my assume these small deer are 'munti's'.

're the boar damage in forestry...
....grubbing and rooting around new plantings and bark damage to younger rubbing posts. But I agree with you the average coillte wood wouldn't hold their interest too long.

Free-2-Flow

cookimonster wrote:

Damn and I was digging in my repertoire for a muntjac recipe......

Would love to go stalking without a rifle, certainly wouldn't feel confident firing without the knowledge, Just need to find a hunter to tag along with (wink wink)

cookimonster

Free-2-Flow wrote: »

Would love to go stalking without a rifle, certainly wouldn't feel confident firing without the knowledge, Just need to find a hunter to tag along with (wink wink)

.....and there lies the crux of the matter, there are some generous souls out there who may take a complete stranger and novice to boot, out hunting onto their permissions with a firearm in tow but the majority would be reluctant or down right negative to the request.

An introduction through a reliable third party is common. If someone I know, a fellow hunter, asked me to get a lad out for a day onto rabbits or pigeons, then by virtue of my mate vouching for them I would think that suffice. Even then I've come across characters, family and family friends, who never ever got a secound day out, myself or my father would always be busy whenever they asked.

Most hunters are a bit protective about land that they have been lucky or worked hard to get, fearing the possibility of accidents, with or without firearms and subsequent 'poaching' not only of game but of the land. I think we all know one or two lads who would take liberties.

Free-2-Flow

cookimonster wrote:

An introduction through a reliable third party is common. If someone I know, a fellow hunter, asked me to get a lad out for a day onto rabbits or pigeons, then by virtue of my mate vouching for them I would think that suffice. Even then I've come across characters, family and family friends, who never ever got a secound day out, myself or my father would always be busy whenever they asked.

cookimonster wrote:

Most hunters are a bit protective about land that they have been lucky or worked hard to get, fearing the possibility of accidents, with or without firearms and subsequent 'poaching' not only of game but of the land. I think we all know one or two lads who would take liberties.

cookimonster wrote:

.....and there lies the crux of the matter, there are some generous souls out there who may take a complete stranger and novice to boot, out hunting onto their permissions with a firearm in tow but the majority would be reluctant or down right negative to the request.

Absolutely agree, I don't think I'd take a complete stranger anywhere with me that involved firearms or being alone with them, who are they? But hey, I had to ask to be able to start somewhere haha, maybe behind the user names we do know each other 😂. I've been a member of Dublin Rifle Club 10 years now.

cookimonster

I'm afraid my experience with rifle ranges are limited to my military service and a handful of civilian courses I've done over various disciplines. I'm rarely even shooting clays in the last few years, preferring to spend time in the fields. As the deer and birds finish up I'll start back with vermin control for fur and feather, then at the end of summer enjoy the bouts of pigeon decoying and then restart the cycle come the 1st Sept. There's always something to do

Grizzly 45

cookimonster wrote: »

Grizzly,

're the boar damage in forestry...
....grubbing and rooting around new plantings and bark damage to younger rubbing posts. But I agree with you the average coillte wood wouldn't hold their interest too long.

Decent fencing and coal tar as well as the old string of noisy tin cans,and electric fences have worked wonders for german hunters for decades.Not to mind setting up your stand in said young plantation and shooting them.:) But then again you have an incentive to do so.As you "own" the game on your let,you are responsible for the damage it causes to standing crops or timber.:)

cookimonster

Grizz,

Different approach alright to management of game species....would it work here, with our moany, bitchy attitudes (myself inclusive)- "what do you mean 'you haven't culled enough!', sure I was out with the man flu, her indoors wanted the kitchen painted, the young lad GAA training......"

As to whether or not Coillte would like to manage it, it's like my mate always says-
'Coillte are more destructive in a wood then Hurricane Katrina'.

Grizzly 45

And that the difference with a lifestyle and a hobby.If your local farmer was knocking on your door looking for five grand damage to 4 acres of spuds because "your" pigs had made pigs of themselves with it.. Think you would be out every minute possible, man flu unpainted kitchens or not.:D

dodderangler

When are going to release unicorns?? I could do the magic blood.

cookimonster

dodderangler wrote: »

When are going to release unicorns?? I could do the magic blood.

I heard their waiting until there's a decent stock of silver bullets.....ohh and most important their having trouble securing virgins.

dodderangler

cookimonster wrote: »

I heard their waiting until there's a decent stock of silver bullets.....ohh and most important their having trouble securing virgins.

Silver bullets are for werewolves. Although they might need to release them because the unicorns may end up being over populated. So we can shoot the wolves.

Grizzly 45

I'd prefer more myself the hideous beasties of the cave of Ky banach, those with big sharp pointy teeth!They can only be dispatched with the holy hand grenades of Antioch!:)

Nekarsulm

Good luck with Coilte and wild boar, they have banned ponies from all their lands near us!

Chiparus

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/round-up-deer-wrecking-our-countryside-and-send-them-back-to-england-mla-35342146.html
http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/farming/invasive-chinese-deer-species-needs-to-be-eradicated-says-mla-1-7758055

grassroot1

Chiparus wrote: »

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/round-up-deer-wrecking-our-countryside-and-send-them-back-to-england-mla-35342146.html
http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/farming/invasive-chinese-deer-species-needs-to-be-eradicated-says-mla-1-7758055

Any headline is better than ash for cash

Grizzly 45

Waterford Whispers have bought out the Belfast telegraph and newsletter then??

Free-2-Flow

cookimonster wrote:

Damn and I was digging in my repertoire for a muntjac recipe......

Grizzly 45 wrote:

Waterford Whispers have bought out the Belfast telegraph and newsletter then??

Are you not convinced?

cookimonster

Free-2-Flow wrote: »

Are you not convinced?

As I alluded to in other posts, when I see a 'munti' been held aloft with no signs of freezer burn etc on the steps of Stormont then I might begin to believe.

Again in today's craze for selfies and photo opportunities do you not think by now in forums like this with either tree huggers or hunters that the little lads wouldn't have appeared in some media format by now.

Free-2-Flow

cookimonster wrote:

As I alluded to in other posts, when I see a 'munti' been held aloft with no signs of freezer burn etc on the steps of Stormont then I might begin to believe.

I have lad from Carlow there with a picture of one he shot

Grizzly 45

If someone wants to prove they shot one in the Republic.
Please post a pic with a national newspaper and a local newspaper in the pic of +/- 3days of the kill to prove it was shot here.Then it can be argued you have the first offical certifiably so shot muntjac in the Republic.

Free-2-Flow

Grizzly 45 wrote:

If someone wants to prove they shot one in the Republic. Please post a pic with a national newspaper and a local newspaper in the pic of +/- 3days of the kill to prove it was shot here.Then it can be argued you have the first offical certifiably so shot muntjac in the Republic.

Are you suggesting the whole Muntjac thing is a conspiracy?

cookimonster

Corpus Delicti.......

Every year the returns for the annual deer cull are in the tens of thousands covering all the counties and the three species. I remember seeing an archive return with one (1) muntjac on it.
Consider that all returns are done by individuals with no proof required other then a form submitted back to the department. So Johnny down the road can say he shot 80 animals when in fact he never got out or Billy could shoot 180 and only report 20.
As is said ' paper won't refuse ink '....