Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123314528#Comment_123314528

Ironic of you to be mocking people pushing conspiracy theories, any new info on the brexit pint glass benefits?

Mr. teddywinkles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123314528#Comment_123314528

Control is not conspiracy..

Its been happening since the dawn of human civilisation.

Control by a group of individuals in which the general public are lead to believe its for their benefit.

In this case its control of the narrative when it comes to alcohol consumption. Some people have their demons with it yes but most just enjoy a drink now and again.

Demonising it like its some sort downhill slope for majority is control of the narrative whens its not the case and these groups seem to be on a power trip to ensure this happens.

AndrewJRenko

I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123315581#Comment_123315581

The health damage arising from alcohol isn't just confined to alcoholics. Alcohol is a major factor in hypertension, stroke, CHD, diabetes, obesity and many many more health issues that cost ALL of us.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123316122#Comment_123316122

Most medical professionals will agree that moderation is key. Most people I know enjoy a drink in moderation.

Crossing the road has it's dangers too, as do stepping outside your house everyday. Eating Ice-cream or a bag of chips has it's dangers too as do all take-aways. Why is alcohol being singled out here? Why aren't we banning the sale of Monster energy with the bright cans aimed at kids?

Yours is a straw man argument. Whilst we choke the life out of any flexibility around alcohol off sales we fill our kids up with junk. AAI and their funding would be better off directed here.

AndrewJRenko

I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337050#Comment_123337050

Restrictions on alcohol or junk?

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337070#Comment_123337070

Restrictions? So Prohibition? Whats next a war on alcohol? That has worked so well throughout history…..

How many times does it need to be pointed out we are already drinking less without implementing draconian policies?

AndrewJRenko

I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337109#Comment_123337109

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337109#Comment_123337109

Prohibition?

Rocket_GD

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337070#Comment_123337070

Let's tax fun and enjoyment too.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337115#Comment_123337115

You are the one who said "restrictions on alcohol". What else does that amount to but prohibition?

Describe it to me.

AndrewJRenko

I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337122#Comment_123337122

The title of the thread and the issues that we've been discussion for >300 pages would be a good hint as to what restrictions would look like.

The issue with rising prices is it doesn't deter the problem drinkers who clog up the health services or the justice system. So it's the wrong way of tackling things.

At the moment it makes more economical sense if you are a problem drinker to buy 2 bottles of wine or a bottle of whiskey than it does to buy 6 cans of beer. It's crazy.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337134#Comment_123337134

Increasing prices is a far stretch from restricting it which is what you posted, in my view price increases are a carrot to encourage people to drink less, restrictions I would consider a stick.

There are already restrictions, you are restricted from buying alcohol if you are under 18, you are restricted from buying it before and after a certain time.

Anyone suggesting more restrictions above those or suggesting increasing the age or limiting the time even further in my view is angling for a form of prohibition.

Price increases are not restrictions so please clarify what you mean by "restrictions".

AndrewJRenko

I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337156#Comment_123337156

Again, it's not just 'problem drinkers' who clog up the health services. It's the huge numbers of people with obesity, diabetes, CHD, hypertension, stroke and more - where alcohol intake, at levels that most people wouldn't consider to be 'problem drinking' is a major factor.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337158#Comment_123337158

You can call it whatever you like, carrot or stick, but if it gets people to drink less, it's a restriction. Your jump to 'prohibition' leads me to conclude that we're not having a serious policy discussion here.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337191#Comment_123337191

You are unwilling to elaborate on what you mean by restriction, I have outlined what restrictions we currently have on alcohol and do not think the definition of "restriction" aligns with price increases despite the intention of the price increase being for people to drink less alcohol.

Your definition of "anything that leads to less alcohol being consumed can be classed as a restriction" means that advertising from drinkaware et al showing the dangers of alcohol should also be classed as a restriction, see how that makes no sense?

In my opinion price increases are an encouragement to drink less much like advertising showing the dangers of alcohol would also be an encouragement for people to drink less and not a restriction.

So i will ask again for you to define what restricting alcohol looks like, if you continue to refuse to try define it i suppose we can consider this discussion coming to an unsatisfying conclusion.

BP_RS3813

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337109#Comment_123337109

The war on drugs did not fail, we did just not try hard enough.

There is an issue with drinking here as there is a link between having a fun night out and drinking. You can have lots of fun without drinking.

I'd also imagine most are over the weekly recommended unit amount of 14? Think thats the limit off the top of my head, works out to be 7 pints I believe.

I'd also be in favour of a complete smoking and vaping so I'm not impartial.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337242#Comment_123337242

LOL "we didnt try hard enough" thats some level copium you are consuming, the war on drugs has by any definition been an absolute and utter failure as well as a complete waste of time, money and law enforcement resources. Billions has been spent across the globe on it for over 5 decades but you claim not enough was done? Pray tell what else could have been done?

Also much like with alcohol we don't need to ban smoking as kids are consuming less tobacco with every generation, banning it or restricting it will have the opposite effect as people and especially children/teenagers will automatically push back against authority ultimately leading to its consumption increasing again and it will be black market stuff so likely even more poisonous than what we currently have.

elperello

Prohibition failed in the US first time around but the idea never died.

The people who believe we need to be saved from drink are back and this time they are smarter.

The approach now is neo prohibitionism.

Not a Trumpian big bang but a steady stream of measures designed to achieve their aims.

This article is a long read but if you have time it's a good introduction.

https://daily.sevenfifty.com/what-do-neo-prohibitionists-really-want/

AndrewJRenko

I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337231#Comment_123337231

The discussion came to an unsatisfying conclusion when you tried to equate prohibition with restriction tbh.

The MUP is a restriction. The restriction on advertising is a restriction, and we need to close off the loophole with the zero% products. We need to restrict bring visiting heads of state to the Guinness Hop Store for a photo op. Putting cancer warnings and photos on bottles and cans as was agreed in 2018 is a restriction. I'm sure there's lots more opportunities to restrict.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337340#Comment_123337340

So do you agree that the ultimate goal of restricting alcohol by any method is zero alcohol consumption by anyone ie prohibition.

AndrewJRenko

I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337355#Comment_123337355

No. I don't agree that the ultimate goal is zero alcohol consumption, i.e. prohibition.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337463#Comment_123337463

No. That will be achieved by extension of the current AAI policies which they are being allowed free reign to impelment as they want.

AAI aren't stupid they know calling for a ban on alcohol would make them look silly. So they plan to price it out of most peoples reach.

Asus X540L

660ml Rockshore €2.10 in SV. So 1.05 per 330ml. Not bad for minimum pricing.

I remember working in an Offie in 1999 and we had a special on Corona 330ml bottles - one pound a bottle. They absolutely felw off the shelves in fact i think there was people queing outside for them. What is £1 in 1999 worth in 2025? Probably €2.

So has the price of drink really gone up?

https://shop.supervalu.ie/sm/delivery/rsid/5550/product/rockshore-irish-lager-bottle-660-ml-id-1933766000

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337630#Comment_123337630

It's gone up significantly since MUP. I was getting a slab of heineken for 15 euro before MUP. Sometimes 20 bottles for 10euro.

That was probably too cheap. MUP should be capped a 1 euro for a can of say heineken or coors. Most people would agree that is a sensible price point.

fonecrusher1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337630#Comment_123337630

Thats a pretty good deal but its also unusual to see it that cheap. They must be trying to flog it off before it hits a certain best before threshold or they just have too much of it sitting around unsold.

AndrewJRenko

I agree because we have drinking problems in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337608#Comment_123337608

"allowed free reign to impelment as they want" (sic)

There's a gaping canyon between AAI policies and current implemented government policies. The most obvious example is the cancer warnings on bottles and cans which was agreed in 2018 and still nothing has been implemented.

Exaggerating like this doesn't really help your case.

dxhound2005

AAI cannot claim all the credit for the reduction in consumption. Social media influencers have entered the Sober space, with their messages about health and lifestyle. But there has always been a Teetotaller movement in the country, with around one third of adults being abstainsers from alcohol.

This has to be taken into account when looking at the consumption figures. We are down to the equivalent of 400 pints per adult, but that includes the non drinkers in the average. On a side note MUP does not matter to bar owners. They could sell a pint at €2.50 and be well within the rules.

https://drinknolo.ie/blogs/the-oasis/living-an-alcohol-free-life-exploring-sober-communities-in-ireland?srsltid=AfmBOopap8bhPRkfrhO7qQA4Uk1pLh_0rqmsIy1VgCwwc4b38m7FC5W_

AI generated:

"The average annual consumption for people aged 15 years and over in 2023 was 9.9 litres of pure alcohol. This equates to 37 bottles of vodka (70cl), 104 bottles of wine or 400 pints of beer." 17 Apr 2024.

thesandeman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337630#Comment_123337630

2L of water is 65c in SV. Tastes better as well.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337992#Comment_123337992

I don't think so.

I'm invited to a barbecue inspired by the lovely weather later on.

I won't be best pleased if they press a two litre bottle of water into my sweaty hand 🙂

Nice cold 🍻 beer of any variety will fit the bill.

Large bottle small glass

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123337070#Comment_123337070

No, education on the harm that excess alcohol AND moderate levels of alcohol caused is the best approach.

Alcohol has zero nutritional benefit and is toxic at a cellular level, while sugar is a nutrient which the liver can readily process so they are not really comparable.

Education for citizens and in particular parents or people about to me parents is key.

Educate people as to what exactly alcohol is and let them make up their own minds.

The absence of education lets this kind of comment any many others go unchallenged.

"Some people have their demons with it yes but most just enjoy a drink now and again"

I can post plenty studies from the UK bio bank and elsewhere that show the negative effects (from effect on brain cells, breast cancer risk etc) of low level drinking; certainly in an Irish context.

Is there any evidence that even low level drinking is beneficial?

Asus X540L

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123338020#Comment_123338020

BYOB.