Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

KrustyUCC

Fianna Fail have already said that they are in favour of the bill particularly the pricing aspects

Fianna Fáil is committed to alcohol Bill, Martin says
Party leader clarifies FF’s position on legislation following lobbying by drinks industry

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/fianna-f%C3%A1il-is-committed-to-alcohol-bill-martin-says-1.2840617

Wanderer78

Wow, contacting our td's regarding alcohol pricing! It's good to see people are staying focused on our most critical problems!

Leroy42

The problem is that many TD's are either publications themselves or are beneficiaries of them. So the potential loss of a vote or votes pails when compared to the loss of money.

And at the end of the day are you really going to base your vote on this single issue? What if FF go with this but oppose increased property taxes?

We have had many on here talk about adults being treated like adults. So, do just that then. If they bring this in do vote against them, and make sure they know why you are not voting for them. But also stop going to the pub. This is clearly a sop to the Vintners. As long as people continue to pay their exorbitant prices they will continue.

Make it known that without hard evidence to back up their proposals then this is nothing more that a power grab from the pub and as such we will avoid the pub altogether unless it is defeated or unless the vintners actually reduce their pricing

dr.fuzzenstein

If sufficient numbers of people threaten to vote AAA (Irish equivalent of the Monster Raving Looney Party), it might help.
Problem is, in Ireland FF get in by default. Once they ****ed up the country beyond recognition, FG get in to clean up the mess. They get kicked out by a disgusted electorate because of their necessary unpopular measures and FF get swept into power again amidst promises of milk and honey flowing.
It was ever thus and shall ever be this way.

KrustyUCC

It is a matter that TDs should listen to the general public on

The bill is not proportional and will hit everybody in the pocket

Lets take a bottle of whiskey in Aldi

Queen Margot

Sells in Germany €9.99

Sells in Ireland €15.29 as it is. That is already 53.05% dearer than Germany

Under this bill the same bottle would now be €22.09. That would be 121.12% dearer than Germany and an 44.47% increase in price overnight

Nobody can justify than increase

Also if a bottle of Queen Margot has to go up 44.47%, does anybody think that Jameson, Powers etc won't increase their prices by the same margin?

Leroy42

Not justifiable based on the numbers you went through but that won't be the way this will be 'sold'.

It will be sold on the health benefits, the saving of rural pubs, culture, saving battered spouses, etc etc.

Is €12.10 really such a big price to pay for all of that? is what they will cry

So what people need to do, as the Journal did, is call people up on the basis for these claims. What health benefits? If there is a drop in consumption what sector of the drinkers does it happen in? Is the drink replaced by something else? Will there be limits placed on the price pubs can charge to ensure they don't profit? Will the extra cost be, at least partially, claimed from the brewers/distributors by way of a health levy/social fund.

Clear targets should be given by those wanting to bring it in. What % drop in consumption is the target and who is responsible for delivering it? Who is going to police the pricing? Can other products be used to lesson the effect? So the bottle of vodka does up in price but you get free munchies or softdrinks etc or even a discount off your grocery bill. Can offy's set up loyalty schemes to effectively give the pricing back by way of refunds to customers?

Zubeneschamali

KrustyUCC wrote: »

The bill is not proportional and will hit everybody in the pocket

Not me, I'm a FG voter, and my craft beer, French wine and Champagne and Single Malt Whiskey won't cost a cent extra!

This change only hurts Aldi-shopping peasants, and serves them right.

weldoninhio

Leroy42 wrote: »

Not justifiable based on the numbers you went through but that won't be the way this will be 'sold'.

It will be sold on the health benefits, the saving of rural pubs, culture, saving battered spouses, etc etc.

Is €12.10 really such a big price to pay for all of that? is what they will cry

So what people need to do, as the Journal did, is call people up on the basis for these claims. What health benefits? If there is a drop in consumption what sector of the drinkers does it happen in? Is the drink replaced by something else? Will there be limits placed on the price pubs can charge to ensure they don't profit? Will the extra cost be, at least partially, claimed from the brewers/distributors by way of a health levy/social fund.

Clear targets should be given by those wanting to bring it in. What % drop in consumption is the target and who is responsible for delivering it? Who is going to police the pricing? Can other products be used to lesson the effect? So the bottle of vodka does up in price but you get free munchies or softdrinks etc or even a discount off your grocery bill. Can offy's set up loyalty schemes to effectively give the pricing back by way of refunds to customers?

I can't remember the figures off the top of my head, I think they were mentioned earlier in the thread. But the percentage drop off in alcohol consumption they are hoping to achieve, is exactly in line with the rate that alcohol consumption is currently dropping. Its a sleveen move to "prove" that this is working.

Ush1

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Not me, I'm a FG voter, and my craft beer, French wine and Champagne and Single Malt Whiskey won't cost a cent extra!

This change only hurts Aldi-shopping peasants, and serves them right.

You can bet your balls to a barn dance the price of all of it will go up.

dr.fuzzenstein

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Not me, I'm a FG voter, and my craft beer, French wine and Champagne and Single Malt Whiskey won't cost a cent extra!

This change only hurts Aldi-shopping peasants, and serves them right.

bananabread12

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

This whole idea of "no healthcare for you!" is idiotic and offensive, sprung from small minds and tight wallets. I bet such people are conveniently off to the loo when it's time for their round.
That is not the way it works. And if you want it to work this way, sorry, life is tough. Deal.

Really? Because in my experience the people you describe are usually the ones that are actually prepared to pay their way in the world.... :rolleyes:

Foxhound38

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

It was ever thus and shall ever be this way.

Depressingly true...

With that said, at least we can take some solace that it will be at least entertaining to watch Mehole Martin nervously try to appease the Shinners enough to remain in Government with them. Tainiste Gerry will be able to laugh at him to his face in press conferences...

Mr. teddywinkles

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Not me, I'm a FG voter, and my craft beer, French wine and Champagne and Single Malt Whiskey won't cost a cent extra!

This change only hurts Aldi-shopping peasants, and serves them right.

Sorry but there's the definition of naivety

Fr Tod Umptious

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Wow, contacting our td's regarding alcohol pricing! It's good to see people are staying focused on our most critical problems!

No major party candidate is going to campaign that alcohol is too expensive.

Mr. teddywinkles

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

No major party candidate is going to campaign that alcohol is too expensive.

https://youtu.be/rQhGaHTBBG8

Politicians are like this

dr.fuzzenstein

Foxhound38 wrote: »

Depressingly true...

With that said, at least we can take some solace that it will be at least entertaining to watch Mehole Martin nervously try to appease the Shinners enough to remain in Government with them. Tainiste Gerry will be able to laugh at him to his face in press conferences...

When Mehole finally becomes Taoiseach (and chances are he will), FF's biggest insult to the voters and in turn their greatest moment of shame and self humiliation will be complete.
Then FF can rule supreme, it will demonstrate that the Irish electorate has absolutely no shame or self respect, because he represents the old gard, right back to Haughey.
If all this sounds a bit Palpatinian, it's because he is the very nearest equivalent to our dear Emporer.

Ipso

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

When Mehole finally becomes Taoiseach (and chances are he will), FF's biggest insult to the voters and in turn their greatest moment of shame and self humiliation will be complete.
Then FF can rule supreme, it will demonstrate that the Irish electorate has absolutely no shame or self respect, because he represents the old gard, right back to Haughey.
If all this sounds a bit Palpatinian, it's because he is the very nearest equivalent to our dear Emporer.

I thought that was bankrupting the country.

Jim Bob Scratcher

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Not me, I'm a FG voter, and my craft beer, French wine and Champagne and Single Malt Whiskey won't cost a cent extra!

This change only hurts Aldi-shopping peasants, and serves them right.

What's the weather like up there ?

McMurphy

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Not me, I'm a FG voter, and my craft beer, French wine and Champagne and Single Malt Whiskey won't cost a cent extra!

This change only hurts Aldi-shopping peasants, and serves them right.

If you don't think the branded big companies will want to try and price their product upwards to keep it in people's mind that it's a "premium product" there's actually no helping you, and I sincerely hope your professional life doesn't involve sales or business marketing in anyway shape or form.

(however, in case the above isn't satirical)

If you're naive enough (with a generous topping of snobbery thrown in) to think that if a cheap bottle of beer in Aldi, Lidl, or any other retailer rises in price to even make a slight encroachment towards the more established (premium is entirely debatable), ( let's say it's then within a euro or so), and the other brand won't raise their prices to ensure that few euro buffer still exists to seperate their product to the Aldi one, then God bless your little cotton socks.

Capt'n Midnight

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

This thing is just another quick VAT grab attempt

This won't raise any extra VAT unless people are dipping into their savings or reducing spending on food , because the extra money spent on minimum price has to come from reduced spending elsewhere so the VAT probably balance out.

Capt'n Midnight

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Fianna Fail have already said that they are in favour of the bill particularly the pricing aspects

Fianna Fáil is committed to alcohol Bill, Martin says
Party leader clarifies FF’s position on legislation following lobbying by drinks industry

IIRC at one stage half of the FF backbenchers were publicans.

dr.fuzzenstein

Ipso wrote: »

I thought that was bankrupting the country.

Well, there's that and then there's sailing back into power under the leadership of one of the old gard who represents the era of brown envelope dealing and fcuking the country over for personal gain. It's the ultimate way of saying "yes bitches, bend over, that's how you like it!".
And should this come to pass, that's exactly what the Irish electorate is doing and in fact has done already. They're validating Bertie and Biffo era FF and getting fcuked in the process.

kittensmittens

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

IIRC at one stage half of the FF backbenchers were publicans.

I'm not sure if you are old enough to remember but years ago, the vast majority of politicians "clinics" were always held in pubs

Cookie_Monster

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

This won't raise any extra VAT unless people are dipping into their savings or reducing spending on food , because the extra money spent on minimum price has to come from reduced spending elsewhere so the VAT probably balance out.

nah, because the biggest impacts will be on those who can't afford it but spend anyway, substituting VAT free food and the like.

And if you think pubs won't continue to hike their prices on the back of it too...

Zubeneschamali

Rick Shaw wrote: »

If you don't think the branded big companies will want to try and price their product upwards to keep it in people's mind that it's a "premium product" there's actually no helping you.

Irish craft brewers would love Guinness and Heineken to jack up their prices for no reason - makes small producers more competitive.

georgewickstaff

Are we going to see a return of the 5000 car convoy up to Newry again?

Does anyone remember the 5 mile tail backs getting into Sainsburys about 10 years ago? "Shop patriotically" was the message from the Dáil. Funnily enough that didnt encourage people to spend down south, it was the likes of Tesco etc losing money hand over fist that caused a rethink from retailers about pricing structures in "Eire".

Leroy42

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Irish craft brewers would love Guinness and Heineken to jack up their prices for no reason - makes small producers more competitive.

Irish Craft Brewers will simply raise their prices as well. If anything Irish Craft brewers are the most Premium brands out there

Zubeneschamali

Leroy42 wrote: »

Irish Craft Brewers will simply raise their prices as well. If anything Irish Craft brewers are the most Premium brands out there

Nope - Irish craft brewers want to increase their market share. They complain non-stop about anti-competitive practices that shut them out of the market. They would much rather increase volume and take a bite out of Heineken/Guiness market share than increase prices.

Breaking News

Denis Naughten rejects claims alcohol bill will put small shops out of business

Communications Minister and unaligned Independent TD Denis Naughten has rejected claims the new alcohol bill could potentially force small shops to close - despite qualifying his own support for the legislation, writes Fiachra Ó Cionnaith.

Speaking at an event in Dublin, the Roscommon TD said while the planned law change "would put a financial burden on them [small shops], I don't think it would put them out of business".

Mr Naughten said he agrees with his cabinet colleague, Health Minister Simon Harris, that "there are very serious public health concerns in relation to alcohol" and that "I'm as conscious on those as anyone else".

However, asked if he is fully supportive of the bill now that Mr Harris has said he will amend the small shops issues and seek to have it passed into law by Halloween, he added:

"Everyone in Leinster House, I think, is supportive of the bill, and all of us acknowledge we have a huge problem with alcohol in this country.

"There are issues with the bill itself. I haven't seen the detail of the amendment Simon is proposing and that may very well resolve those issues, but what is important is that the legislation that is brought in one meets its intentions and two that it's practical and feasible to actually implement it.

"There have been proposals in the past that haven't been practical or feasible. I think the move Simon is making to this is positive and probably addresses this, but I haven't seen the detail of it."

While Mr Harris on Monday insisted the new bill must pass before Halloween when he re-introduces it to the Oireachtas in the coming weeks with an amendment to address concerns raised over the cost it could impose on small shops, it remains unclear whether the legislation will garner enough support.

A number of Fine Gael senators have called for a meeting with Mr Harris to discuss the as yet unpublished amendment, while rural TDs in particular have previously expressed concerns over the proposed law change's implications.

Pity the small shops associations lobby isnt as powerful as the VFI.

suicide_circus

"Sales of Listerine increase by 8000%, officials baffled"