cash and carry kitchens deposit

oconn96048

My dad (who is 82 years old ) wanted to upgrade his kitchen . So I took him to the cash and carry showrooms out in Tramore road. A salesperson did a ten minute design of the kitchen and quoted a price which I thought was a bit high. He then asked us for a 100 euro booking deposit . He also gave a mobile number of a fitter who would call out and take further measurements .
After a week my dad decided not to go ahead with it . A salesperson from c&c rang shortly after this , and I told him we weren't interested anymore and wanted the booking deposit back . He then said we were only entitled to 50 euro back which I though was a bit cheeky , when they say on there website that your entitled to a free design appointment .
So I rang them 2 weeks ago again and asked for the full 100 euro to be returned .
And still they refuse to pay it back .
What action can we take from here ?. I still have the booking deposit receipt

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote:

My dad (who is 82 years old ) wanted to upgrade his kitchen . So I took him to the cash and carry showrooms out in Tramore road. A salesperson did a ten minute design of the kitchen and quoted a price which I thought was a bit high. He then asked us for a 100 euro booking deposit . He also gave a mobile number of a fitter who would call out and take further measurements . After a week my dad decided not to go ahead with it . A salesperson from c&c rang shortly after this , and I told him we weren't interested anymore and wanted the booking deposit back . He then said we were only entitled to 50 euro back which I though was a bit cheeky , when they say on there website that your entitled to a free design appointment . So I rang them 2 weeks ago again and asked for the full 100 euro to be returned . And still they refuse to pay it back . What action can we take from here ?. I still have the booking deposit receipt

What did you think the booking deposit is for? Usually booking deposit is non refundable so you are doing good giving 50 back

shane b

I priced a kitchen last year with cash and carry and got my free design and price. However if I wanted the design printed emailed or any breakdown of the size/number of units or type of door I would have to pay to take that away with me. What I left with was 1 page document with the info I supplied and the price. If you got any design plan this may be what they are holding the money back for.
I went to 3 other kitchen places and they were all similar, one guy even said he doesn't do written quotes any more as its all saved on the pc and he can call up the design using the contact phone number if and when I had made my decision.

oconn96048

Sleeper12 wrote: »

What did you think the booking deposit is for? Usually booking deposit is non refundable so you are doing good giving 50 back

So why do they say free design appointment ???

oconn96048

Sleeper12 wrote: »

What did you think the booking deposit is for? Usually booking deposit is non refundable so you are doing good giving 50 back

So why do they say free design appointment ???

Stheno

oconn96048 wrote: »

So why do they say free design appointment ???

You got a free design appointment the booking deposit was towards the actual kitchen no?

oconn96048

Stheno wrote: »

You got a free design appointment the booking deposit was towards the actual kitchen no?

I didn't go ahead with the kitchen

oconn96048

Stheno wrote: »

You got a free design appointment the booking deposit was towards the actual kitchen no?

I didn't go ahead with the kitchen

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote:

So why do they say free design appointment ???

It wasn't a free design deposit. It was a booking deposit. You booked, paid deposit and then cancelled. I think Cash and carry kitchens were pretty decent for refunding any of deposit.

Stheno

oconn96048 wrote: »

I didn't go ahead with the kitchen

But you agreed to have a fitter come out and a week later changed your mind. You got your free design tbh

oconn96048

Stheno wrote: »

But you agreed to have a fitter come out and a week later changed your mind. You got your free design tbh

Again , I made no contact with the fitter . The fitter was coming out to measure the kitchen so that we could design it . There was no kitchen designed before this .

Stheno

oconn96048 wrote: »

Again , I made no contact with the fitter . The fitter was coming out to measure the kitchen so that we could design it . There was no kitchen designed before this .

Eh in your first post you said the salesman did a design of the kitchen?

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote: »

My dad (who is 82 years old ) wanted to upgrade his kitchen . So I took him to the cash and carry showrooms out in Tramore road. A salesperson did a ten minute design of the kitchen and quoted a price which I thought was a bit high. He then asked us for a 100 euro booking deposit . He also gave a mobile number of a fitter who would call out and take further measurements .
After a week my dad decided not to go ahead with it . A salesperson from c&c rang shortly after this , and I told him we weren't interested anymore and wanted the booking deposit back . He then said we were only entitled to 50 euro back which I though was a bit cheeky , when they say on there website that your entitled to a free design appointment .
So I rang them 2 weeks ago again and asked for the full 100 euro to be returned .
And still they refuse to pay it back .
What action can we take from here ?. I still have the booking deposit receipt

Again , I made no contact with the fitter . The fitter was coming out to measure the kitchen so that we could design it . There was no kitchen designed before this .

???

Edit: As far as I remember Cash & Carry don't fit kitchens. They only supply. The deposit was a booking deposit with them. You canceled the order so not entitled to refund.

Cash & carry give out phone numbers of independent fitters. The deposit didn't go to the fitter. Saying thatt you didn't even call the fitter has nothing to do with the booking deposit paid to cash & carry

oconn96048

Ok Guys, i'm not getting anywhere here. looks like I wont be getting any of the deposit back. Remember this " free design appointment" took less than 10 minutes , so I was effectively charges 10 euro /minute for this persons time . So how do you get a price quote on a kitchen if you don't give them these details . Are we effectively charging people a 100 euro to get a quotation so??

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote:

Ok Guys, i'm not getting anywhere here. looks like I wont be getting any of the deposit back. Remember this " free design appointment" took less than 10 minutes , so I was effectively charges 10 euro /minute for this persons time . So how do you get a price quote on a kitchen if you don't give them these details . Are we effectively charging people a 100 euro to get a quotation so??

I don't think you'll ever get what a deposit is.
You got the free kitchen design. They did NOT charge you for this.
You paid a deposit for the kitchen. You cancelled the kitchen so you are not due a refund.

oconn96048

So Sleeper2 I take it your connected with this company . ( You'll obviously deny this anyway). I know what a deposit is . I was going to buy a buy to let property a few years ago , and I paid a deposit of 5000 euro. At the time it was very hard to get a loan . So after much haggling the bank refused . I rang the auctioneer told him the position can I get the deposit back. Sure no problem he said . And i had used a lot more of his time of this auctioneer than the salesperson in c&c as well. Legally was he obliged to give it back , I honestly don't know. But it shows If that person has a bit of principle, they will do the right thing without quoting terms and conditions.
So should c&c pay back the deposit .I leave that up to other peoples view . But I can tell you one thing for sure . C&C are not 100 euro out of pocket due to expenses or time wasted , and I did not get value for money

Stheno

oconn96048 wrote: »

So Sleeper2 I take it your connected with this company . ( You'll obviously deny this anyway). I know what a deposit is . I was going to buy a buy to let property a few years ago , and I paid a deposit of 5000 euro. At the time it was very hard to get a loan . So after much haggling the bank refused . I rang the auctioneer told him the position can I get the deposit back. Sure no problem he said . And i had used a lot more of his time of this auctioneer than the salesperson in c&c as well. Legally was he obliged to give it back , I honestly don't know. But it shows If that person has a bit of principle, they will do the right thing without quoting terms and conditions.
So should c&c pay back the deposit .I leave that up to other peoples view . But I can tell you one thing for sure . C&C are not 100 euro out of pocket due to expenses or time wasted , and I did not get value for money

You didn't pay for the design you paid a booking deposit to book a kitchen to be fitted then cancelled.

Did you check if the deposit would be refunded if you cancelled?

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote:

So Sleeper2 I take it your connected with this company . ( You'll obviously deny this anyway). I know what a deposit is . I was going to buy a buy to let property a few years ago , and I paid a deposit of 5000 euro. At the time it was very hard to get a loan . So after much haggling the bank refused . I rang the auctioneer told him the position can I get the deposit back. Sure no problem he said . And i had used a lot more of his time of this auctioneer than the salesperson in c&c as well. Legally was he obliged to give it back , I honestly don't know. But it shows If that person has a bit of principle, they will do the right thing without quoting terms and conditions. So should c&c pay back the deposit .I leave that up to other peoples view . But I can tell you one thing for sure . C&C are not 100 euro out of pocket due to expenses or time wasted , and I did not get value for money

When you put a deposit on a house it is ALWAYS dependent on mortgage approval so the deposit HAD to be refunded to you by law.

I'm a plumber & have never worked for cash and carry. I got a kitchen from them 10 years ago. I just find it very wrong that you try to make out that they ripped you off when clearly they haven't. They even refunded half of the deposit when they could have kept it all.
Maybe this will help explain it to you. You didn't pay the deposit before the kitchen design. This is because they did not charge you for this service. You only paid the deposit when you booked the kitchen. You then broke this contract and they kept half the deposit

bee06

Based on my experience of using Cash and Carry, you get your initial design, if you are happy with it you pay your booking deposit to go ahead with the order and they send out the fitter to remeasure to make sure you didn't make a balls of the measurements you gave them. After the initial design, there was nothing stopping you from saying you wanted to go away and think about it for a while before you made a decision. This is what I did bacause I wasn't happy with the design from them (also Tramore road). Ended up going with In-house kitchens in Blackpool in the end.

I would always assume a booking deposit was non-refundable unless stated otherwise. The whole point of the deposit is to weed out the time wasters.

oconn96048

Did I check if the deposit would be refunded if I cancelled . Be honest for the 10 minutes I was inside there I hadn't time to read the terms and conditions. I think guys the point I trying to make is ,a small bit of cop on would tell you,that you shouldn't lose a deposit if you decide to change your mind especially if the person your dealing with is not going to be out of pocket . Ok the salesperson was with us for ten minutes , but it does say on their website that it is free. And yes he did right draw out a rough plan but that's not worth a 100 euro . And Sleeper12 I didn't any money back from this crowd.

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote:

Did I check if the deposit would be refunded if I cancelled . Be honest for the 10 minutes I was inside there I hadn't time to read the terms and conditions. I think guys the point I trying to make is ,a small bit of cop on would tell you,that you shouldn't lose a deposit if you decide to change your mind especially if the person your dealing with is not going to be out of pocket . Ok the salesperson was with us for ten minutes , but it does say on their website that it is free. And yes he did right draw out a rough plan but that's not worth a 100 euro . And Sleeper12 I didn't any money back from this crowd.

I have to ask. What did you think the deposit was for? Why would you think that it was refundable?
Very few deposits are refundable. What would be the use of taking a deposit if you can just cancel & get the deposit back. The deposit would have no meaning. It just doesn't make sense.

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote: »

Did I check if the deposit would be refunded if I cancelled . Be honest for the 10 minutes I was inside there I hadn't time to read the terms and conditions. I think guys the point I trying to make is ,a small bit of cop on would tell you,that you shouldn't lose a deposit if you decide to change your mind especially if the person your dealing with is not going to be out of pocket . Ok the salesperson was with us for ten minutes , but it does say on their website that it is free. And yes he did right draw out a rough plan but that's not worth a 100 euro . And Sleeper12 I didn't any money back from this crowd.

He then said we were only entitled to 50 euro back which I though was a bit cheeky , when they say on there website that your entitled to a free design appointment

Why didn't you take the €50 when it was offered?

oconn96048

deposit as I understand it to be , is to compensate a person who is out pocket in an agreement . And ill say it again there was no money lost by any party in this exchange. It wasn't like as if the kitchen was ordered 6 months ago and then I got a change of heart . I think we're being punished unfairly . And yes they offered to pay it back ,but I've received nothing. In the real world offering and giving are two different things

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote:

deposit as I understand it to be , is to compensate a person who is out pocket in an agreement . And ill say it again there was no money lost by any party in this exchange. It wasn't like as if the kitchen was ordered 6 months ago and then I got a change of heart . I think we're being punished unfairly . And yes they offered to pay it back ,but I've received nothing. In the real world offering and giving are two different things

OK. I can see why you don't get what everyone is trying to tell you. You don't understand what a deposit is or what it is for.
I'm not trying to be mean but you'll take a bit of stress out of your life if you get someone to explain what a booking deposit is.
Lets be clear here. You got the free kitchen design as promised. You then booked a kitchen & put a booking deposit on it. You then cancelled the kitchen & lost the deposit. Cash & carry acted in an honest way & didn't do anything wrong

oconn96048

sleeper12 I think at this stage we'll agree to differ I obviously don't understand the world the same as you . Bee06 made a good point where he said he got an initial design and that's exactly what we got and not pay the booking deposit . But our friendly salesperson was pushing the deposit even though he knew we were undecided . So we got ripped off plain and simple . Some guys might like to dress it up differently and say different things , but speaking for myself if positions were reversed I would pay back the deposit , because its the decent thing to do.

Stheno

oconn96048 wrote: »

sleeper12 I think at this stage we'll agree to differ I obviously don't understand the world the same as you . Bee06 made a good point where he said he got an initial design and that's exactly what we got and not pay the booking deposit . But our friendly salesperson was pushing the deposit even though he knew we were undecided . So we got ripped off plain and simple . Some guys might like to dress it up differently and say different things , but speaking for myself if positions were reversed I would pay back the deposit , because its the decent thing to do.

No bee said they didn't put down a deposit as they were undecided. If you were undecided you shouldn't have agreed to go ahead and pay a booking deposit tbh, all you'd to say was that you'd have a think about it.

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote:

sleeper12 I think at this stage we'll agree to differ I obviously don't understand the world the same as you . Bee06 made a good point where he said he got an initial design and that's exactly what we got and not pay the booking deposit . But our friendly salesperson was pushing the deposit even though he knew we were undecided . So we got ripped off plain and simple . Some guys might like to dress it up differently and say different things , but speaking for myself if positions were reversed I would pay back the deposit , because its the decent thing to do.

I've no problem agreeing to disagree but it is so unfair to say you were ripped off. This is an Irish business with a great reputation.
No one put a gun to your head. If you are not capable of saying no you want to think about then you should bring someone with you while shopping.
I suggest you go to the small claims court. If you win the case come back here and bad mouth cash & carry all you want but in the meantime it's very unfair what you are doing here. Go back & read all the comments. Ignore mine and count everyone saying that you weren't due a refund.
Businesses like cash and carry have had 10 very tough years and the fact that they are still going speaks volumes for the quality of the service they provide.

oconn96048

in fairness stheno I understand fully that I shouldn't have paid the deposit when I was undecided . But should I be penalized a 100 euro for dare I say a rushed decision ?

oconn96048

sleeper12 .One question for you. What costs did C&C incur to take a 100 euro from my dad. The mobile phone cost ?.The point being there was no cost ,plain and simple . The fact that you know that C&C only hire independent fitters has blown your cover as well .

Deagol

Cash and Carry kitchens really dodged a bullet here I think

Sleeper12

oconn96048 wrote:

sleeper12 .One question for you. What costs did C&C incur to take a 100 euro from my dad. The mobile phone cost ?.The point being there was no cost ,plain and simple . The fact that you know that C&C only hire independent fitters has blown your cover as well .

I was walking away but I'll answer the question & leave it there as I'm just repeating myself.
Now please take into account that I have my own business and I take booking deposits so I do know what a booking deposit is.
You entered a legal contract with cash and carry. You ordered a kitchen. They accepted your order secured with a 100 euro. You broke the contract when you cancelled. They kept the deposit as this is what a booking deposit is for. They do not have to be out of pocket to keep this deposit.
I know you have a problem believing me but the citizens advice will tell you the same thing.

duffman13

oconn96048 wrote: »

in fairness stheno I understand fully that I shouldn't have paid the deposit when I was undecided . But should I be penalized a 100 euro for dare I say a rushed decision ?

Yes of course, the initial consultation is free. You then agreed for a fitter to call out. The salesman did additional work (maybe just a phone call or maybe more) by getting the fitter lined up to come out. If I paid a deposit and I changed my mind then I'd never expect a penny back. Your lucky to get half back.

Owryan

oconn96048 wrote: »

in fairness stheno I understand fully that I shouldn't have paid the deposit when I was undecided . But should I be penalized a 100 euro for dare I say a rushed decision ?

But you are not being penalised. You entered into a contract and lost your deposit when you broke it.

Unless they locked you into the store and forced you to pay a deposit c+c have done nothing wrong. If you were half as quick about saying you would think about it as you are about claiming you were ripped off then you wouldn't be in this position.

oconn96048

Right this is the first time ive ever badmouthed an irish company , and I hate doing this so I haven't mentioned any names . Believe me we all have been through a pretty rough last 10 years . So when I see my dad losing this money it really ticks me off . The point of all this is that a small bit of decency on C&C's part could have went a long way . Again I repeat we got none of the deposit back . The phone number of the fitter was given to us to contact the fitter directly , so these costs were not incurred by C&C. These are the facts .

dudara

The fact is that you committed to a kitchen from C&C and they therefore took a booking deposit. A booking deposit serves many purposes, one of which is to ensure that the buyer is serious about their order.

You then broke that contract by cancelling the kitchen, and therefore they kept the deposit. Nothing wrong with that. In order to avoid this, you shouldn't have paid a deposit if you weren't certain about the purchase.

oconn96048

In business theirs a legal agreement and theirs a gentleman's agreement . That day in C&C we entered a gentleman's agreement with that salesperson . If I entered a legal agreement with C&C that day I would have asked to see the terms and conditions and got my solicitor to draw an agreement , but in the real world we cant do this can we ?? I' m telling people how we were treated and I didn't like It . Does decency matter anymore

Colser

oconn96048 wrote:

In business theirs a legal agreement and theirs a gentleman's agreement . That day in C&C we entered a gentleman's agreement with that salesperson . If I entered a legal agreement with C&C that day I would have asked to see the terms and conditions and got my solicitor to draw an agreement , but in the real world we cant do this can we ?? I' m telling people how we were treated and I didn't like It . Does decency matter anymore

It obviously does as they offered you 50e back..very decent imo.

duffman13

oconn96048 wrote: »

In business theirs a legal agreement and theirs a gentleman's agreement . That day in C&C we entered a gentleman's agreement with that salesperson . If I entered a legal agreement with C&C that day I would have asked to see the terms and conditions and got my solicitor to draw an agreement , but in the real world we cant do this can we ?? I' m telling people how we were treated and I didn't like It . Does decency matter anymore

Yes your gentleman's agreement which you broke. You agreed to have work done, then changed your mind. You enter legal agreements all the time and don't use a solicitor. As a previous poster said you should look up the definition for a deposit. Decency matters but you some to be completely unaware that it's you coming across poorly in what you've posted not C&C

gordongekko

oconn96048 wrote: »

Right this is the first time ive ever badmouthed an irish company , and I hate doing this so I haven't mentioned any names . Believe me we all have been through a pretty rough last 10 years . So when I see my dad losing this money it really ticks me off . The point of all this is that a small bit of decency on C&C's part could have went a long way . Again I repeat we got none of the deposit back . The phone number of the fitter was given to us to contact the fitter directly , so these costs were not incurred by C&C. These are the facts .

They were actually very decent to you by offering you back €50

Walter2016

oconn96048 wrote: »

So Sleeper2 I take it your connected with this company . ( You'll obviously deny this anyway). I know what a deposit is . I was going to buy a buy to let property a few years ago , and I paid a deposit of 5000 euro. At the time it was very hard to get a loan . So after much haggling the bank refused . I rang the auctioneer told him the position can I get the deposit back. Sure no problem he said . And i had used a lot more of his time of this auctioneer than the salesperson in c&c as well. Legally was he obliged to give it back , I honestly don't know. But it shows If that person has a bit of principle, they will do the right thing without quoting terms and conditions.
So should c&c pay back the deposit .I leave that up to other peoples view . But I can tell you one thing for sure . C&C are not 100 euro out of pocket due to expenses or time wasted , and I did not get value for money

Whenever someone uses the schoolyard phrase of "you must be connected to them" they lose all credibility.

You seem to have no interest in anyone (everyone so far) who has said c+c were correct.

On the house deposit it is clearly stated as a "refundable BOOKING deposit" - both buyer and seller can walk away until a CONTRACT deposit is paid. - Considering you don't understand this, you were lucky the bank refused you.

As for your "10 minutes" argument - I would reckon it was 20-30 min and just like any professional service, you don't just pay for the small time you were there - part of the cost is the knowledge and experience and technology used in designing the kitchen.


So your little campaign against c+c (account just set up to try and damage them) seems to have backfired.

Time for you to learn the meaning of deposits.

oconn96048

walter 2016, your a pretty nasty individual with your demeaning comments about my house deposit. that's none of your business. Another keyboard warrior

Sleeper12

Op has had another thread going at the same time & all the replies have pointed out that op has broken a legal contract & that C&C are perfectly in the right: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=101623679

IMO OP is deliberately trying to blacken the name of a reputable Irish company when they already know that they are in the wrong & not C&C.
this can do a good business a lot of damage I don't think it is fair or right. I now say with no difficulty at all SHAME ON YOU OP

Sleeper12

Op has had another thread going at the same time & all the replies have pointed out that op has broken a legal contract & that C&C are perfectly in the right: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=101623679

IMO OP is deliberately trying to blacken the name of a reputable Irish company when they already know that they are in the wrong & not C&C.
this can do a good business a lot of damage I don't think it is fair or right. I now say with no difficulty at all SHAME ON YOU OP

Ronin247

Oconn96048. Did they give you a copy of the design?

Most kitchen/ bedroom cupboard companies will not give you a hard copy of the design without a deposit. this prevents people using the design service and then ordering their cabinets from an online retailer.

If this is the case I suspect that is why the deposit was kept.....

Walter2016

oconn96048 wrote: »

walter 2016, your a pretty nasty individual with your demeaning comments about my house deposit. that's none of your business. Another keyboard warrior

Nasty? I just pointed out that you were lucky as it seems you do not understand different forms of deposit. And considering deposits are used in home rentals, you are lucky you didn't become a landlord.

I would also suggest you read up on defamation laws - you have tried to defame c+c kitchens despite everyone telling you that you are wrong.

Maybe time to accept you are wrong.

Owryan

At this stage it appears the op has little idea of the contract he entered into and cannot see that the design and arranging for a fitter to visit are 2 different things

I have no idea what makes him think there was a gentleman's agreement in place nor why he thought one would be entered into over a professional one.

Pretty much everyone has agreed that the company was in the right but the op continues to claim they were ripped off.

Dr Turk Turkelton

Deagol wrote: »

Cash and Carry kitchens really dodged a bullet here I think

This x1000

oconn96048

ronin 247 So The design outline that I was given; was four boxes on one side of the kitchen and three boxes on the other side . So how long did this take ? yup 8 minutes at best . Believe me i'm not making this up. And of course there was no explanation about the risks to my deposit. Love the comments about C&C being decent ones by offering me 50 euro of the deposit and then reneging on it afterwards. A real class act LOL!!
Oh sleeeeeper12 sorry to awaken you from your slumber but seeing that it was the first time I was complaining about a company and using this website I made a mistake and posted in the wrong forum . It does happen you know so no point getting two excited about it. As for walter " never argue with stupid people , they bring you down to there level, and then beat you with experience ". Im just quoting this and Im not directing it at you in case you might think Im defaming you

bee06

If it was such a rubbish design then why in gods name would you pay a booking deposit. Why wouldn't you say, you know what, this design gives me no indication of the kitchen so I'm going to need a much better design before I make any commitment to buy?

Stheno

bee06 wrote: »

If it was such a rubbish design then why in gods name would you pay a booking deposit. Why wouldn't you say, you know what, this design gives me no indication of the kitchen so I'm going to need a much better design before I make any commitment to buy?

Backtracking bee

Colser

You seriously wanted someone to explain the "risks to your deposit"....what did you actually think a deposit was up until now?