Louis Smith: British Gymnastics bans four-time Olympic medallist over video.

A Little Pony

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/gymnastics/37832754

[font=Arial, Helvetica, freesans, sans-serif]The video, filmed by the 27-year-old Smith but leaked to the media in September, showed him laughing while retired gymnast Luke Carson mimicked Islamic prayer practices.[/font]

Didn't know British Athletics had a blasphemy law. Sounds utterly ludicrous to me.

Flint Fredstone

I'd say a gymnastics ban is the least of his worries now...

A Little Pony

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

I'd say a gymnastics ban is the least of his worries now...

Why? Maajid Nawaz who is outspoken on Islamism is speaking out against this disgraceful ban.

Mardy Bum

They better start banning the Life of Brian again for athletes. There must be more to this.

lertsnim

A Little Pony wrote: »

Why? Maajid Nawaz who is outspoken on Islamism is speaking out against this disgraceful ban.

Unfortunately he doesn't represent all of the lunatics.

Flint Fredstone

A Little Pony wrote: »

Why? Maajid Nawaz who is outspoken on Islamism is speaking out against this disgraceful ban.

Ah well that's that sorted. I'm sure he can have a nice quiet word with the extremists. Good to know.

The King of Moo

A Little Pony wrote: »

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/gymnastics/37832754




Didn't know British Athletics had a blasphemy law. Sounds utterly ludicrous to me.

They don't, they're free to make judgement on individual cases.

I think this is a perfectly reasonable decision. It was very stupid of Smith to take part in the video given his profile, though at least he didn't publish it himself.

Given the PR damage this will cause for him and British Gymnastics, and he's been in trouble before for questionable social media, I think a mere two-month ban is entirely appropriate.

It's a pity you didn't mention in your original post that the ban is only for TWO MONTHS.

SnakePlissken

The King of Moo wrote: »

It's a pity you didn't mention in your original post that the ban is only for TWO MONTHS.

Banned for laughing at someone make a religious joke... You believe this is a sensible response in an enlightened secular society?

Perhaps we should round up everyone who's ever laughed whilst watching Father Ted and throw them in a cell... Oh but that's catholicism, that's fair game for satire and outright mockery, Islam, well not so much.

A Little Pony

The King of Moo wrote: »

A Little Pony wrote: »

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/gymnastics/37832754




Didn't know British Athletics had a blasphemy law. Sounds utterly ludicrous to me.

They don't, they're free to make judgement on individual cases.

I think this is a perfectly reasonable decision. It was very stupid of Smith to take part in the video given his profile, though at least he didn't publish it himself.

Given the PR damage this will cause for him and British Gymnastics, and he's been in trouble before for questionable social media, I think a mere two-month ban is entirely appropriate.

It's a pity you didn't mention in your original post that the ban is only for TWO MONTHS.

So you can't mock Islam now? Or any religion for that matter? Some ideas are protected? Are you fine with that?

The King of Moo

SnakePlissken wrote: »

Banned for laughing at someone make a religious joke... You believe this is a sensible response in an enlightened secular society?

Perhaps we should round up everyone who's ever laughed whilst watching Father Ted and throw them in a cell... Oh but that's catholicism, that's fair game for satire and outright mockery, Islam, well not so much.

Banned for two months for again damaging his image and that of British Gymnastics?
A perfectly sensible response.

A Little Pony wrote: »

So you can't mock Islam now? Or any religion for that matter? Some ideas are protected? Are you fine with that?

You can, I'm fine with the mocking of any religion.
But if doing so provides negative publicity for you and the organisation you, as an Olympic gold-medallist, work for, then you can expect them to take action to punish you.
Especially when you've already been in trouble for publicly posting a close up of a 16-year old gymnast's arse with the caption "My sport has its moments."

HellSquirrel

Meh.

Two months isn't the end of the world and hopefully he'll learn some cop on. Mind you, I doubt he'd like his Muslim fellow athletes (assuming he has any) seeing him mock them.

Basically, don't be a dick. Or if you're going to be a dick, don't be caught on camera being a dick while being famous in your field, because your dickishness will get you rapidly recognised and not in a good way. At least he's learning it young, if not as young as most normal people do. I'd say the same if he got a two-month ban for wandering around dressed as a priest with one of those baby dolls on the groin too. One of the downsides of being famous.

Although, looking at it from the other direction, it -is- rather strange how many people get outraged at not being allowed to be dicks to minorities. I mean...is this really affecting your lives? Are you physically hurting from disapproval when you're rude to other people? I don't get it.

suicide_circus

Can't be offending Islam, they're fierce sensitive

HellSquirrel

Lol, just saw the OP. No wonder pertinent info was left out!

Okay, enjoy the thread.

Mortpourvelo

If anything was begging to be mocked, it's Islam.

A Little Pony

HellSquirrel wrote: »

Meh.

Two months isn't the end of the world and hopefully he'll learn some cop on. Mind you, I doubt he'd like his Muslim fellow athletes (assuming he has any) seeing him mock them.

Basically, don't be a dick. Or if you're going to be a dick, don't be caught on camera being a dick while being famous in your field, because your dickishness will get you rapidly recognised and not in a good way. At least he's learning it young, if not as young as most normal people do. I'd say the same if he got a two-month ban for wandering around dressed as a priest with one of those baby dolls on the groin too. One of the downsides of being famous.

Although, looking at it from the other direction, it -is- rather strange how many people get outraged at not being allowed to be dicks to minorities. I mean...is this really affecting your lives? Are you physically hurting from disapproval when you're rude to other people? I don't get it.

You should see how Islamic countries treat minorities. Saudi Arabia being just one. The fact you think it is wrong to mock Islam is rather concerning. It would be like saying mocking Christianity is wrong, it isn't wrong and people should be entitled to do so without facing internal persecution.

Billy86

Surprise surprise, op decided to leave out this part from their very own link...

British Gymnastics said Smith's ban was a "cumulative penalty" because of a previous breach of its rules on conduct.

He was reprimanded in June for posting an image on social media of an American gymnast, who was 16 when the photograph as taken, accompanied by a comment British Gymnastics said was "unbefitting to a participant".

In April, he apologised for questioning the judging at the British Championships, where he was beaten to pommel gold by Max Whitlock.

The Briton missed last month's Olympic and Paralympic celebrations to visit two London mosques "to learn more about the Muslim community".

Smith said he had previously been "ignorant to people's religion" and added on Facebook that it was his responsibility "as someone of sporting influence" to exercise freedom of speech "in good taste".

HellSquirrel

Billy86 wrote: »

Surprise surprise, op decided to leave out this part from their very own link...

Yep. :pac: It's like they don't expect people to notice or something.

pickarooney

Banned for two months while he's on sabbatical.

HellSquirrel

Basically, he sounds like a bit of a dip****, and I really don't care if he's gotten a little smack on his poor diddum wrist.

A Little Pony

Billy86 wrote: »

Surprise surprise, op decided to leave out this part from their very own link...

British Gymnastics said Smith's ban was a "cumulative penalty" because of a previous breach of its rules on conduct.

He was reprimanded in June for posting an image on social media of an American gymnast, who was 16 when the photograph as taken, accompanied by a comment British Gymnastics said was "unbefitting to a participant".

In April, he apologised for questioning the judging at the British Championships, where he was beaten to pommel gold by Max Whitlock.

The Briton missed last month's Olympic and Paralympic celebrations to visit two London mosques "to learn more about the Muslim community".

Smith said he had previously been "ignorant to people's religion" and added on Facebook that it was his responsibility "as someone of sporting influence" to exercise freedom of speech "in good taste".

He didn't do anything wrong, Islam has no special status and is allowed to be criticized or mocked. The fact they suspended him for two months because of this is further legitimate proof as to why secularism is important and no religion should be free from ridicule. We are being forced down a very dark path bordering on authoritarianism.

HellSquirrel

A Little Pony wrote: »

He didn't do anything wrong, Islam has no special status and is allowed to be criticized or mocked. The fact they suspended him for two months because of this is further legitimate proof as to why secularism is important and no religion should be free from ridicule. We are being forced down a very dark path bordering on authoritarianism.

Oh Pony, you've been debunked in the first page. He wasn't banned for two months just for that, he was banned for a series of incidents of being a moron. He was on a warning before that, he showed that he hadn't taken it on board, they smacked him. They've hardly ended his career, just told him to bugger off for two months and think about how not to be a repeated bad example of British Athletics.

Don't be so triggerable. And I say that as a firm secularist with no particular love of Islam (or Catholicism, or any of the rest of them either).

ohnonotgmail

A Little Pony wrote: »

He didn't do anything wrong, Islam has no special status and is allowed to be criticized or mocked. The fact they suspended him for two months because of this is further legitimate proof as to why secularism is important and no religion should be free from ridicule. We are being forced down a very dark path bordering on authoritarianism.

he was banned for being a dick and drawing unwanted attention to his sport. and not for the first time. This was not a court of law. the decision has no bearing on the outside world

A Little Pony

HellSquirrel wrote: »

A Little Pony wrote: »

He didn't do anything wrong, Islam has no special status and is allowed to be criticized or mocked. The fact they suspended him for two months because of this is further legitimate proof as to why secularism is important and no religion should be free from ridicule. We are being forced down a very dark path bordering on authoritarianism.

Oh Pony, you've been debunked in the first page. He wasn't banned for two months just for that, he was banned for a series of incidents of being a moron. He was on a warning before that, he showed that he hadn't taken it on board, they smacked him. They've hardly ended his career, just told him to bugger off for two months and think about how not to be a repeated bad example of British Athletics.

Don't be so triggerable. And I say that as a firm secularist with no particular love of Islam (or Catholicism, or any of the rest of them either).

The other incidents of bad behaviour are irrelevant. This incident should not warrant him needing a 'slap on the hand' as he didn't do anything wrong. Freedom FROM religion is as important as freedom of religion. Like I said, it doesn't have a special status and neither should it ever have.

ohnonotgmail

A Little Pony wrote: »

The other incidents of bad behaviour are irrelevant. This incident should not warrant him needing a 'slap on the hand' as he didn't do anything wrong. Freedom FROM religion is as important as freedom of religion. Like I said, it doesn't have a special status and neither should it ever have.

well they are relevant. this incident on its own would not have warranted a ban

learn_more

Off all traditions I've seen in any and all religions I think Muslim style of Prayer is the NO. 1 thing begging to be mocked. I thought the video was quite funny.

dirtyden

I think most companies who value inclusiveness and respect would have behaved similarly. I know where I work if I was reprimanded for posting public sexist material a further incident showing religious disrepect would warrant more serious action. I would be surprised if that is not the case in most working environments where there are diverse employees or customers.

Billy86

A Little Pony wrote: »

He didn't do anything wrong, Islam has no special status and is allowed to be criticized or mocked. The fact they suspended him for two months because of this is further legitimate proof as to why secularism is important and no religion should be free from ridicule. We are being forced down a very dark path bordering on authoritarianism.

They didn't suspend him for just this though, so stop trying to pretend otherwise. You literally quoted the part of the article you decided to omit for obvious reasons that explicitly states they were completely relevant. This is like complaining about a soccer player being booked for a niggly foul, while ignoring all his other fouls leading up to it. Very straightforward stuff that you're well aware of.

DEFTLEFTHAND

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

he was banned for being a dick and drawing unwanted attention to his sport. and not for the first time. This was not a court of law. the decision has no bearing on the outside world

Say idiot or something.

Dick is sexist.

ohnonotgmail

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Say idiot or something.

Dick is sexist.

certainly not. if a man can be a pussy a woman can be a dick

Ferrari3600

A Tory MP asked a question about this yesterday, seemingly Teresa May gave a waffly non-answer.

Ferrari3600

The King of Moo wrote: »

Especially when you've already been in trouble for publicly posting a close up of a 16-year old gymnast's arse with the caption "My sport has its moments."

So he did something really that a lot of red-blooded young males would be tempted to do in the circumstances, probably the more intelligent ones would rein themselves in. Athletes aren't necessarily candidates for Nobel Prizes in astrophysics. Some of them are, frankly, a bit thick. But it's not a hanging offence to be a bit thick.

This whole idea that athletes are supposed to be models of decorum, "ambassadors for Britain" or whatever, seems highly questionable to me. And I speak as not only a firm secularist but someone that has no great interest in sport.

DEFTLEFTHAND

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

certainly not. if a man can be a pussy a woman can be a dick

Pussy is a sexist term also.

REM76

He's a dead man walking, poor sap. Athletics and intelligence haven't been together since Zola Budd.

ohnonotgmail

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Pussy is a sexist term also.

how so?

Bonaparted

He laughed at an unfunny joke. Big deal. A ban for that is absolutely ridiculous.

ohnonotgmail

Bonaparted wrote: »

He laughed at an unfunny joke. Big deal. A ban for that is absolutely ridiculous.

perhaps try to read the linked article

Bonaparted

He got reprimanded and then banned for laughing at an unfunny joke, did he not?

ohnonotgmail

Bonaparted wrote: »

He got reprimanded and then banned for laughing at an unfunny joke, did he not?

he was reprimanded for a previous incident. he was banned for being a cumulative dick. and banned for 2 months. 2 months he would not be competing anyway.

The King of Moo

Ferrari3600 wrote: »

So he did something really that a lot of red-blooded young males would be tempted to do in the circumstances, probably the more intelligent ones would rein themselves in. Athletes aren't necessarily candidates for Nobel Prizes in astrophysics. Some of them are, frankly, a bit thick. But it's not a hanging offence to be a bit thick.

This whole idea that athletes are supposed to be models of decorum, "ambassadors for Britain" or whatever, seems highly questionable to me. And I speak as not only a firm secularist but someone that has no great interest in sport.

It's not, which is why he's not being hanged. He's getting a two-month ban, which means he's going to miss:

• West Midlands Rhythmic - Duets - Trios - Groups - Rhythmic Gymnastics
  
• London TRA NDP Regional Series 1 (2017) - Trampoline Gymnastics
  
• London DMT NDP Regional Series 1 (2017) - Double Mini Tramp (:-D)
  
• West Midlands Acro Championships 2016

... and a few similar events. A complete loss to the British gymnastics world, and no doubt the end of his career, obviously.

As a man, I also take strong issue with your belief that a lot of "red-blooded" 27-year olds would take a picture of a 16-year old's arse, zoom in on it, and post it online with a creepy caption. Hardly a spur-of-the-moment crime of passion.

I'll tell you what though, it's a good thing hyperbole isn't a hanging offence, or some people in this thread would be done for!

Pherekydes

A Little Pony wrote: »

Didn't know British Athletics had a blasphemy law. Sounds utterly ludicrous to me.

British Gymnastics, not Athletics.

Bonaparted

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

he was reprimanded for a previous incident. he was banned for being a cumulative dick. and banned for 2 months. 2 months he would not be competing anyway.

Grand. So he was reprimanded and banned for laughing at an unfunny joke. Absolutely ridiculous.

Pherekydes

HellSquirrel wrote: »

They've hardly ended his career, just told him to bugger off for two months and think about how not to be a repeated bad example of British Athletics.

This has nothing to do with British Athletics.

ohnonotgmail

Bonaparted wrote: »

Grand. So he was reprimanded and banned for laughing at an unfunny joke. Absolutely ridiculous.

no. you need to read it again. he was reprimanded for a previous incident. he was banned this time because he already had an outstanding reprimand. its not that complicated.

Billy86

Bonaparted wrote: »

He got reprimanded and then banned for laughing at an unfunny joke, did he not?

He got repreminanded and then banned for a series of offences, as the article states.

Corruptedmorals

I'm curious if any of the people defending him have heard of him before. He's been around a long time and never learns. Not only does he pull stunts like this and the picture of Carly Patterson, but he's a total sore loser even with his own teammates and has publicly criticised them and other gymnasts who dared to legitimately beat him. This has been a long time coming and doesn't go far enough.

metaoblivia

Louis Smith has a reputation in gymnastics for being a sore loser and a general disgrace. And a two month ban during a period where there are absolutely no major competitions he would have been expected to take part in? Yeah, I'm not crying any tears for him. I wonder had this happened earlier, if British Gymnastics would have done this at a more inconvenient time, like say, last August.

Louis's ban was 100% the collective sum of his poor decisions. Luke Carson, his partner in crime here and a retired Irish gymnast and coach of Ireland's most promising gymnast, Rhys McClenaghen, only got a reprimand because this was his first incident.

Ferrari3600

The King of Moo wrote: »

As a man, I also take strong issue with your belief that a lot of "red-blooded" 27-year olds would take a picture of a 16-year old's arse, zoom in on it, and post it online with a creepy caption. Hardly a spur-of-the-moment crime of passion.

Except that this isn't what I said.

Having said that for some reason I thought he was younger, 19 or 20. If he is 27 then, certainly, old enough to know better. But really it's no different to what the Daily Mail does every day of the week, inviting its readership to sleaze over photos of scantily clad females, in some cases females under the age of consent, while pretending to be the moral guardians of the nation. Does that excuse his actions, no, but its the prevailing media culture that's out there.

HellSquirrel

A Little Pony wrote: »

You should see how Islamic countries treat minorities. Saudi Arabia being just one. The fact you think it is wrong to mock Islam is rather concerning. It would be like saying mocking Christianity is wrong, it isn't wrong and people should be entitled to do so without facing internal persecution.

No issue with mocking Islam. I do have an issue with mocking Muslims just because. No issue with mocking Catholicism. I try not to mock Catholics though. Extremists of both sets are open for it, but of course, that's down to my subjective view on where the line of extremism is. Or your view for your own way of looking at it.

Oh, and "Well, Saudi Arabia do it" isn't a sane argument for doing it too. As someone's mother in here probably once said "If Saudi Arabia jumped off a cliff, would you do it too?"

Fr_Dougal

I wish people would stop mocking religion. It's not something to joke about.

SnakePlissken

The King of Moo wrote: »

As a man, I also take strong issue with your belief that a lot of "red-blooded" 27-year olds would take a picture of a 16-year old's arse, zoom in on it, and post it online with a creepy caption. Hardly a spur-of-the-moment crime of passion.

I'll tell you what though, it's a good thing hyperbole isn't a hanging offence, or some people in this thread would be done for!

The female gymnast you're referring to is Carly Patterson who is actually one year older than Louis Smith, the photo he tweeted was an old photo of her which he himself did not take as you seem to suggest, he did however come out and state he wasn't aware of when the photo was taken and fully believed it to be a more recent photo, it's hardly the crime of the century now is it, but to you this constitutes an act of absolute dickery.

I also find it amusing that a random poster would, as you describe, take great issue with this photo, when the gymnast herself publicly came out in support of Louis Smith and that she took no offence by his tweet, but you go ahead and continue getting morally outraged on the behalf of others if you wish.

osarusan

SnakePlissken wrote: »

he did however come out and state he wasn't aware of when the photo was taken and fully believed it to be a more recent photo,

Not to get into this debate but it's hard to believe that when the photo in question shows an athlete with the sticker for Athens 2004 Olympics on their back.