Can i return unused electronics, if seal on box is broken?

fret_wimp2

I purchased a tablet from argos on Saturday.
When i got it home and tried it i found it doesnt work on my wifi (it doesnt do 5ghz).

This information wasn't indicated on the packaging so i wasn't aware at the time it wouldn't be suitable for me.

I want to return the item but:
-the box was shrink wrapped with this tape all around the edges that had to be removed to open the box.

-there was a sticky label on the screen of the tablet i had to remove.

As the box was opened and the label on the screen was removed, can i still return the item for a full refund?

snubbleste

When you contacted Argos, what was their response?

CramCycle

Bring it back into Argos and tell them it does not work on your WiFi. They will probably ask if you want a replacement or a refund. As above, going good straight to argos and let them know it does not work.

I have never had issues with returning there once prompt.

mass_debater

Argos have a 14 day no questions money back guarantee. For work I've often sent a customer to buy a temporary router or set of home plugs, told then keep all packaging, then ordered a better set on Amazon with the plan to return them for a refund

L1011

You've limited statutory rights (catalogue shops are distance selling basically, as you can't see the product) that you wouldnt have with other retailers. However, Argos are generally excellent for returns anyway so just being nice when asking to return will probably work and be a lot easier

davo10

L1011 wrote: »

You've limited statutory rights (catalogue shops are distance selling basically, as you can't see the product) that you wouldnt have with other retailers. However, Argos are generally excellent for returns anyway so just being nice when asking to return will probably work and be a lot easier

Wow, didn't know buying in an Argos shop was the same as distance selling, that is very interesting. So consumers actually have a right to bring items back to Argos if they change their mind and Argos have no legal option but to accept the return? Very interesting.

Is the op's case not caveat emptor? He/she didn't check the tablet is compatible with his/her wifi? Unless the item is broken, any acceptance of return is a gesture of goodwill (which Argos would seem to be good for) rather than an entitlement.

RobbingBandit

There are exclusions on the 14 day return with electronics usually being one such item, chance your arm explaining the issue you should hopefully get at least an exchange.

mass_debater

davo10 wrote: »

Wow, didn't know buying in an Argos shop was the same as distance selling, that is very interesting. So consumers actually have a right to bring items back to Argos if they change their mind and Argos have no legal option but to accept the return? Very interesting.

Is the op's case not caveat emptor? He/she didn't check the tablet is compatible with his/her wifi? Unless the item is broken, any acceptance of return is a gesture of goodwill (which Argos would seem to be good for) rather than an entitlement.

Other way round, you have more rights online, you have the option of changing your mind when you buy online, you don't have this when you buy in a store. Argos are good to deal with and usually accept returns.

Spocker

L1011 wrote: »

You've limited statutory rights (catalogue shops are distance selling basically, as you can't see the product) that you wouldnt have with other retailers.

I don't think this is the case, Argos will allow you to examine an item out of the box before purchasing. They are a bricks and mortar shop, just like the rest - they just happen to have better return policies

Pkiernan

mass_debater wrote: »

Argos have a 14 day no questions money back guarantee. For work I've often sent a customer to buy a temporary router or set of home plugs, told then keep all packaging, then ordered a better set on Amazon with the plan to return them for a refund

Classy.
I wonder how you would feel if your customers did the same to you.
Argos isn't a parts library.

davo10

mass_debater wrote: »

Other way round, you have more rights online, you have the option of changing your mind when you buy online, you don't have this when you buy in a store. Argos are good to deal with and usually accept returns.

That's what I thought, I didn't think those extra online/distant selling rights extended to goods physically bought in a shop just because they have catalogues.

coylemj

OP bought the item on the basis that it could do 5Ghz simply because 'This information wasn't indicated on the packaging' i.e. it didn't say on the box that it could not do 5hz therefore he assumed it could.

On which basis he could also bring it back because it doesn't make toast or boil water.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

mass_debater wrote: »

Argos have a 14 day no questions money back guarantee. For work I've often sent a customer to buy a temporary router or set of home plugs, told then keep all packaging, then ordered a better set on Amazon with the plan to return them for a refund

Off topic but... honestly? That is deplorable.

foggy_lad

Spocker wrote: »

I don't think this is the case, Argos will allow you to examine an item out of the box before purchasing. They are a bricks and mortar shop, just like the rest - they just happen to have better return policies

Except for items which are exempt from their 30 day change of mind returns policy, items which are considered personal items like Ear rings and studs, all products containing memory like cameras, usb sticks, hard drives, tablets, laptops etc.

OP most routers will have a 2.4/5Ghz setting to allow for using products which don't have 5Ghz wireless adaptors.

Hollister11

Argos are probably the best out there in terms of returning items. I have never had issues.

Rackstar

mass_debater wrote: »

Argos have a 14 day no questions money back guarantee. For work I've often sent a customer to buy a temporary router or set of home plugs, told then keep all packaging, then ordered a better set on Amazon with the plan to return them for a refund

What a sh1tty thing to do.

GerardKeating

mass_debater wrote: »

Argos have a 14 day no questions money back guarantee. For work I've often sent a customer to buy a temporary router or set of home plugs, told then keep all packaging, then ordered a better set on Amazon with the plan to return them for a refund

It's practices like this that make retailers reduce/eliminate their returns policy.

coylemj

GerardKeating wrote: »

It's practices like this that make retailers reduce/eliminate their returns policy.

Exactly. It costs money to have a no quibble money back guarantee, the shop is going to end up with stock that is either unsaleable or which has to be sold at a discount as 'display stock' because the packaging has been mauled or destroyed.

Abusing this facility will lead to a retailer pulling up the drawbridge and reverting to 'legal rights only'.

Argos has a hardcopy catalogue you can take home, an online catalogue on the web and multiple copies of their catalog available for inspection instore as well as terminals where you can inspect their offerings.

In all cases, Argos gives you the manufacturer model or part no. for every electronics item meaning you can do the research to see what you're buying so there is no excuse for buying an item, bringing it home and 'discovering' that it doesn't have some feature you assumed it would have because the box didn't say it didn't have that feature.

dobsdave

In fairness, I don't think too many people would check the frequency of their WIFI for compatibility when ordering a laptop/tablet.

Del2005

dobsdave wrote: »

In fairness, I don't think too many people would check the frequency of their WIFI for compatibility when ordering a laptop/tablet.

How many routers only do 5GHz though? If you specifically bought a router which does not comply with the WIFI standards, 802.11ac is backwards compatabile, then you would make sure that you buy compatabile devices.

L1011

UPC provide routers that can do one of 2.4 and 5, but not both. It's ridiculous but not uncommon.

coylemj

L1011 wrote: »

UPC provide routers that can do one of 2.4 and 5, but not both. It's ridiculous but not uncommon.

The UPC Horizon box does both. When you install it, it's set to do 2.4Ghz only but you can activate 5 Ghz with a new password and it will happily connect devices on both frequencies concurrently, each one with a different SSID.

L1011

coylemj wrote: »

The UPC Horizon box does both. When you install it, it's set to do 2.4Ghz only but you can activate 5 Ghz with a new password and it will happily connect devices on both frequencies concurrently, each one with a different SSID.

The recent Thomson/Technicolor is what I'm referring to

fret_wimp2

L1011 wrote: »

UPC provide routers that can do one of 2.4 and 5, but not both. It's ridiculous but not uncommon.

This is exactly the issue, the UPC Thompson router will do either 2.4 or 5, but not both at the same time.
All phones, laptops and other tablets in the apartment use 5ghz. the tablet i purchased only works on 2.4ghz.

When the router is set to 5ghz the tablet didnt even see the wireless network in its list. it could only see it when the router was explicitly set to 2.4ghz.

2.4ghz does not work well in our apartment block due to interference.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

coylemj wrote: »

The UPC Horizon box does both. When you install it, it's set to do 2.4Ghz only but you can activate 5 Ghz with a new password and it will happily connect devices on both frequencies concurrently, each one with a different SSID.

I don't see how us ordinary Joe Soaps would know anything about this though.

coylemj

fret_wimp2 wrote: »

2.4ghz does not work well in our apartment block due to interference.

Have you tried different channels on 2.4 Ghz? There are scanner apps which will show you the activity in your neighbourhood on the different channels and you can pick a channel that is not congested.

fret_wimp2

coylemj wrote: »

Have you tried different channels on 2.4 Ghz? There are scanner apps which will show you the activity in your neighbourhood on the different channels and you can pick a channel that is not congested.

yes, tried all 13 channels, 6 was the least congested, but still causes problems occasionally, problems which disappear when switching to 5ghz.
Diagnosis of the issue was made using "Wifi analyzer" for android, which shows networks, channels and congestion.

Problem is resolved, i took a spin to argos and they refunded without any issue. Wonder what happens to the device, will they sell it on in a sale "as is" or send it back to the manufacturer for repackaging.

ssmith6287

fret_wimp2 wrote: »

I purchased a tablet from argos on Saturday.
When i got it home and tried it i found it doesnt work on my wifi (it doesnt do 5ghz).

This information wasn't indicated on the packaging so i wasn't aware at the time it wouldn't be suitable for me.

I want to return the item but:
-the box was shrink wrapped with this tape all around the edges that had to be removed to open the box.

-there was a sticky label on the screen of the tablet i had to remove.

As the box was opened and the label on the screen was removed, can i still return the item for a full refund?

Just wondering what router you are using. generally when a router transmits at 5 ghz it also transmits at 2.4 also

L1011

ssmith6287 wrote: »

Just wondering what router you are using. generally when a router transmits at 5 ghz it also transmits at 2.4 also

As stated, a UPC Thomson which does not allow this. It can operate either, but not both. This is quite a common router.

MaroonAndGreen

mass_debater wrote:

Argos have a 14 day no questions money back guarantee. For work I've often sent a customer to buy a temporary router or set of home plugs, told then keep all packaging, then ordered a better set on Amazon with the plan to return them for a refund

Fair fcuks to you, nobody got hurt

L1011

MaroonAndGreen wrote: »

Fair fcuks to you, nobody got hurt

Except Argos, and anyone who would want to use the returns policy in future should they cease it due to rampant abuse.

This may be a consumer issues forum but deliberately/systemically defrauding retailers is not acceptable conversation.

rubadub

fret_wimp2 wrote: »

yes, tried all 13 channels, 6 was the least congested, but still causes problems occasionally, problems which disappear when switching to 5ghz.
Diagnosis of the issue was made using "Wifi analyzer" for android, which shows networks, channels and congestion.

Problem is resolved, i took a spin to argos and they refunded without any issue.

good to hear. I presume you stuck with explainging the 5GHz issue rather than the other oh so helpful one suggested about not being able to boiling water or make toast.

Argos probably thought you were one of these
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reasonable_person
probably not if you gave the toast excuse though.

fret_wimp2

rubadub wrote: »

good to hear. I presume you stuck with explainging the 5GHz issue rather than the other oh so helpful one suggested about not being able to boiling water or make toast.

Argos probably thought you were one of these
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reasonable_person
probably not if you gave the toast excuse though.

yep, explained the situation, showed them the box where it said it adheres to the IEEE 802.11 N wifi standards, that N usually means 2.4ghz and 5ghz but it didnt indicate that it did not do 5ghz. Even the lenovo webpage doesnt indicate this in the tech specs, it just says "CONNECTIVITY - Broadcom 802.11b/g/n Wi-Fi wireless"

The chap was very understanding, checked the device worked & all cables were presesnt and refunded. took about 3 mins.

coylemj

fret_wimp2 wrote: »

yep, explained the situation, showed them the box where it said it adheres to the IEEE 802.11 N wifi standards, that N usually means 2.4ghz and 5ghz but it didnt indicate that it did not do 5ghz. Even the lenovo webpage doesnt indicate this in the tech specs, it just says "CONNECTIVITY - Broadcom 802.11b/g/n Wi-Fi wireless"

You can't assume that 802.11n includes support for 5 Ghz, there is a TP-Link USB wi-fi adapter which brags about 'N' support - it even includes 'N' in the product name ('300Mbps Mini Wireless N USB Adapter') and it doesn't support 5 Ghz......

http://www.tp-link.com/en/products/details/cat-11_TL-WN823N.html

the spec. you need to look for is 802.11ac

CramCycle

coylemj wrote: »

You can't assume that 802.11n includes support for 5 Ghz, there is a TP-Link USB wi-fi adapter which brags about 'N' support - it even includes 'N' in the product name ('300Mbps Mini Wireless N USB Adapter') and it doesn't support 5 Ghz......

To be fair, for most people, it is a reasonable expectation. Most people would make the quite reasonable assumption that it would work, alot of regular users would just assume that a wifi device bought in Argos would work with the atypical wifi router they have at home. I imagine if I asked people whether their router was at 2.4GHz or 5GHz, they would just ignore me.

fret_wimp2

coylemj wrote: »

You can't assume that 802.11n includes support for 5 Ghz, there is a TP-Link USB wi-fi adapter which brags about 'N' support - it even includes 'N' in the product name ('300Mbps Mini Wireless N USB Adapter') and it doesn't support 5 Ghz......

http://www.tp-link.com/en/products/details/cat-11_TL-WN823N.html

the spec. you need to look for is 802.11ac

If you think about it you'l probably find that i can assume that, and i did assume that.

If my mum/dad bought that tablet they wouldnt even look at that detail. they would see "Wifi" and think "great, it will work with the wifi at home".

You have been quite a negative source on this thread, silly comments about it not mentioning it doesnt toast bread, saying assumptions cant be made.

If you cant be helpful, can you at least put some kind of flag on your posts to indicate you're a troll so people can skip by them?

ssmith6287

Should prob point out that the problem is with your router and not the tablet. Excellent customer service from Argos even though technically they didn't have to refund

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

coylemj wrote: »

You can't assume that 802.11n includes support for 5 Ghz, there is a TP-Link USB wi-fi adapter which brags about 'N' support - it even includes 'N' in the product name ('300Mbps Mini Wireless N USB Adapter') and it doesn't support 5 Ghz......

http://www.tp-link.com/en/products/details/cat-11_TL-WN823N.html

the spec. you need to look for is 802.11ac

Sorry but for the average person WiFi is just WiFi. Do you honestly think an ordinary Argos customer would know what the distinctions you are stating mean?

ohnonotgmail

coylemj wrote: »

You can't assume that 802.11n includes support for 5 Ghz, there is a TP-Link USB wi-fi adapter which brags about 'N' support - it even includes 'N' in the product name ('300Mbps Mini Wireless N USB Adapter') and it doesn't support 5 Ghz......

http://www.tp-link.com/en/products/details/cat-11_TL-WN823N.html

the spec. you need to look for is 802.11ac

a 802.11N device should support 2.5GHz and 5GHz. They are both part of the 802.11N standard.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11n-2009#Comparison

coylemj

Melvin Grumpy Slacker wrote: »

Sorry but for the average person WiFi is just WiFi. Do you honestly think an ordinary Argos customer would know what the distinctions you are stating mean?

We're talking about someone who knows what he wants (support for 5 Ghz wi-fi) and who goes to the bother of checking the technical specs. on the box - hardly your 'ordinary Argos customer'.

coylemj

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

a 802.11N device should support 2.5GHz and 5GHz. They are both part of the 802.11N standard.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11n-2009#Comparison

Maybe it 'should' but TP-Link clearly don't agree. From that article you quoted, a device can comply with the 'n' standard if it supports 2.4 Ghz or 5 Ghz - I see a slash which means OR and not AND. Which means the OP's device (and the TP-Link USB Wi-Fi adapter I quoted above) are compliant with 'n' but with support for 2.4 Ghz only.

My point is that if you want guaranteed 5 Ghz support than you need to read 5 Ghz on the box or 802.11ac

TerrorFirmer

Melvin Grumpy Slacker wrote: »

Sorry but for the average person WiFi is just WiFi. Do you honestly think an ordinary Argos customer would know what the distinctions you are stating mean?

In fairness, if we take the 'ordinary argos customer', then this tablet would suit 99% of such people as it does support WiFi. It's not faulty nor misleading in my opinion.

A minute fraction of a fraction of those customers would have their router operating in 5Ghz mode.

You can't be simultaneously an average joe soap who professes total ignorance of hardware but also have a router you've set to operate in 5ghz mode.

Not giving out to anyone but it would be very unfair to say this is an issue on the manufacturers or argos end.

CramCycle

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

Not giving out to anyone but it would be very unfair to say this is an issue on the manufacturers or argos end.

I don't think anyone is saynig that though, just that thinking it would do 5GHz is a reasonable presumption based on the packaging (it did not say 2.4 or not 5) or the presumption that any wifi device bought from a large retailer will typically work off the bat with any home wifi router, even if they have some different settings as many people would either not know or if they did, presume it would cover both possibly. There would appear to be nothing wrong with the product or Argos, who seem to have done the right thing.

My wifi is going at 5GHz, mainly due to issues awhile back and googling the issue pointed me to changing it. I would not have known it was the wrong piece of equipment but I think it would be fair to say, I would have been reasonable in my assumption it would work.

Thankfully Argos have the good sense to realise being in the right and doing the right thing are sometimes exclusive, it would certainly encourage me to use them more.

WildCardDoW

just that thinking it would do 5GHz is a reasonable presumption

It is, however, and I know this is Wikipedia but:

802.11n is an amendment that improves upon the previous 802.11 standards by adding multiple-input multiple-output antennas (MIMO). 802.11n operates on both the 2.4 GHz and the 5 GHz bands. Support for 5 GHz bands is optional.

OP made an assumption that since the device is 802.11n compliant this meant it would support 5 GHz band. This assumption appears to be incorrect, basing this on Wikipedia so feel free to connect with a more reputable source.

So on this point:

a 802.11N device should support 2.5GHz and 5GHz. They are both part of the 802.11N standard.

If you think about it you'l probably find that i can assume that, and i did assume that.

You can't assume that 5GHz will be supported by default.