Brewing Potsize

VinylJunkie

So, I'm getting back into brewing after a 4 years or so, I have all the equipment from before, picked up some glass bottles and this American Pale Ale kit - http://www.geterbrewed.ie/american-pale-ale-extract-brewing-kit/

My questions are
- The recipe is based on a 23L boil, I have a 10L brewpot. How should I alter the recipe to allow for that? I was reading online and people were suggesting adding the second batch of LME with 15mins to go in the boil?
- Do I just throw the hops into the boil - no need for a muslin bag for the hops?

BeerNut

VinylJunkie wrote: »

I have a 10L brewpot. How should I alter the recipe to allow for that? I was reading online and people were suggesting adding the second batch of LME with 15mins to go in the boil?

Yep, then top up with cold water to full batch size at the end.

VinylJunkie wrote: »

Do I just throw the hops into the boil - no need for a muslin bag for the hops?

Sure. When I brewed this way I used to pour to concentrated newly-boiled wort through a sieve into the fermenter to aerate it, then top up with cold water.

VinylJunkie

Cheers for the reply, so I reckon in a 10L pot the volume at start of boil should be 8L.

So my basic recipe is as follows

1. Steep grains in muslin bag for 30 minutes at 66 oC in 6L of water in brewing pot.
2. Remove muslin bag, let it drip then place into a sieve over the brewing pot.
3. Pour 1L of boiling water through the bag to get the rest of the goodness (I should have give or take 7L in the brewing pot)
4. Take off the heat and Pour in the first 1.5kg of LME - stir until disolved.
5. Put back on the heat and bring to a boil.
6. 60 Min - Add the hops to the boil at indicated times given in recipe (will be pouring these straight into the wort, no muslin bag)
7. 15 Min - Add the second 1.5kg of LME - stir until disolved.
8. 10 Min - Add the Whirlfoc tablet
9. 0 Min - Remove from heat and bring temperature down to 19 oC
10. When temperature down to 19 oC, pour wort into the FV through a sieve.
11. Top the FV upto the 5 gallon mark with water (Will buy Tesco water for this)
12. Sprinkle yeast on top of the FV when at 19 oC
13. Close lid and let ferment

(Not forgetting sanitation BTW)

I bought a muslin bag and hop pellets to dry hop but I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

The recipe says OG of 1.045-1.060 & FG of 1.010-1.015, will this be affected by not doing a full boil?

aaronm13

Was just about to ask a question about pot sizes too. Going to move away from kits myself and want to start the mash kits from the home brew company

http://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/hbc-dunkelweizen-mashkit-23lt-55-alc-p-1264.html

What size pot would I need?

Beer nut , would the stock pots from that place on Talbot St be suitable or are they too smal. Will be in town over the weekend and could pick one up then.

BeerNut

VinylJunkie wrote: »

3. Pour 1L of boiling water through the bag

Let it cool (or dilute it) to about 60 rather than boiling. Water that's too hot will extract tannins, which you don't want.

VinylJunkie wrote: »

bring temperature down to 19 oC

Do you have a plan for doing this? It's easier to bung it into the fermenter hot, top it up and cool it as one process, and then even if it's still too warm it's not as big a job to bring it down the rest of the way. You want it at 27 (but no more than 30) btw. The initial higher temperature gives the yeast a boost.

VinylJunkie wrote: »

Will buy Tesco water for this

Tap water is probably cleaner. As long as your tap water doesn't actually taste of chlorine it'll be fine.

VinylJunkie wrote: »

will this be affected by not doing a full boil?

No, but if it's your first brew I wouldn't worry about the numbers anyway. When your readings are nothing like you expected, don't worry.

aaronm13 wrote: »

What size pot would I need?

The answer to this question is almost always "the biggest one you can get".

aaronm13 wrote: »

Beer nut , would the stock pots from that place on Talbot St be suitable or are they too smal. Will be in town over the weekend and could pick one up then.

I bought my 17L one there. It's grand. As I say: go big.

VinylJunkie

BeerNut wrote: »

Let it cool (or dilute it) to about 60 rather than boiling. Water that's too hot will extract tannins, which you don't want.

Makes sense so just run warm water through the bag / sieve.

BeerNut wrote: »

Do you have a plan for doing this? It's easier to bung it into the fermenter hot, top it up and cool it as one process, and then even if it's still too warm it's not as big a job to bring it down the rest of the way.

Makes complete sense and makes things easier for me, cheers

BeerNut wrote: »

You want it at 27 (but no more than 30) btw. The initial higher temperature gives the yeast a boost.

So when I fill up the fermenter I should pitch the yeast when it's at 27 oC ish?I'm guessing the boiled wort + cool water will be near enough or above this temp? BTW The recipe says to add the yeast at 19 oC

BeerNut wrote: »

Tap water is probably cleaner. As long as your tap water doesn't actually taste of chlorine it'll be fine.

I have a filter tap that I may use, just takes ages to pour from the filter.

Brilliant stuff, thanks very much!

BeerNut

VinylJunkie wrote: »

So when I fill up the fermenter I should pitch the yeast when it's at 27 oC ish?

No: fill it up, then pitch the yeast unless the temperature is still 30 or over, in which case let it cool to below 30, then pitch. Matching the ratio of wort to top-up water so that you finish with 23L at 27C is a real trial and error job. I'd just about got the hang of it by my sixth brew, which was my last using this method.

Lovely Bloke

If you mash the grain in 6 litres of water, you won't have 6 litres +1 litre sparge water at the end of that process.

The grain soaks up water and doesn't let it all out, when I'm doing all grain, full brews I usually calculate losses of about 1 litre per kilo of grain (so if I mash 5 kilo of grain in 18 litres of water, I'd expect to get 13 litres (give or take) of wort), then sparge with another 10 litres of 73 degree water to give me 23 litre boil.

VinylJunkie

BeerNut wrote: »

No: fill it up, then pitch the yeast unless the temperature is still 30 or over, in which case let it cool to below 30, then pitch. Matching the ratio of wort to top-up water so that you finish with 23L at 27C is a real trial and error job. I'd just about got the hang of it by my sixth brew, which was my last using this method.

Would you advise having a full kettle of boiling water at hand to pour in if the temp is below 25L as it reaches 23L?

BeerNut

Don't try and raise the temperature. 27 is ideal. 30 is too high, but if it's below 27 just pitch, it'll be fine: trying to raise it is more likely to cause something to go wrong.

RasTa

You'll need a 30L pot if you're doing all grain mash kits from HBC

aaronm13

Thanks beernut, might just have to get one online so. The homebrewcompany's ones are expensive but I'm sure they're good. I'll take a look at Amazon too.

aaronm13

RasTa wrote: »

You'll need a 30L pot if you're doing all grain mash kits from HBC

Really? Was hoping I wouldn't have to get one that big ad storages space is going to bea problem, €64 too online.

BeardySi

aaronm13 wrote: »

Really? Was hoping I wouldn't have to get one that big ad storages space is going to bea problem, €64 too online.

Defninitely. Also think about how you're planning on heating it - an electric cooker won't be great - certainly ours wouldn't have gotten it close to a rolling boil. Haven't a clue about domestic gas.

Lovely Bloke

induction

RasTa

aaronm13 wrote: »

Really? Was hoping I wouldn't have to get one that big ad storages space is going to bea problem, €64 too online.

You'll also need a chiller.

http://www.adverts.ie/other-home-garden/copper-immersion-cooler-for-brewing/11544564

http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.ie/forum/index.php/topic,16220.0.html

You could get a electric boiler or you could get the 17L pot and do 11L brews instead of 23L but you'll have to do your own recipes.

mordeith

Lovely Bloke wrote: »

induction

You'd have to be sure the base of the pot is of the right grade steel to work with induction mind.

BeerNut

I've never heard of anyone doing full-batch all grain brewing on a stovetop. If you're putting the effort in to doing all-grain, get a boiler. Or cut your batch size.

VinylJunkie

Sorry BeerNut, another couple of questions,

If I add the second can of LME with 15mins to go in the boil, should I take the pot off the heat so I don't burn the LME on the bottom of the pot or just stir like mad?

7. 15 Min - Add the second 1.5kg of LME - stir until disolved.

When the 60min boil is up, do you leave the pot off the heat for a length of time, or pour straight into the FV?

aaronm13

RasTa wrote: »

You'll also need a chiller.

http://www.adverts.ie/other-home-garden/copper-immersion-cooler-for-brewing/11544564

http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.ie/forum/index.php/topic,16220.0.html

You could get a electric boiler or you could get the 17L pot and do 11L brews instead of 23L but you'll have to do your own recipes.

Cheers for tha. Think I might have to go back to the drawing board and see what I'll do. I'm only in an apartment so space is very limited. Thought I was good to go when I got a stock pot and my brother in laws mash tun. Any links to a suitable electric boiler. I have a gas hob to work off.

BeerNut

VinylJunkie wrote: »

should I take the pot off the heat

You should maintain a continuous rolling boil for the full hour. If you're concerned about burning, add the second can after you've poured the hot wort into the fermenter, then stir like mad before topping up.

VinylJunkie wrote: »

When the 60min boil is up, do you leave the pot off the heat for a length of time, or pour straight into the FV?

The only reason to leave it sitting would be if you've done a big 0 minute hop addition. Otherwise, once the boil is over your immediate priority is getting the temperature down as quickly as possible.

RasTa

aaronm13 wrote: »

Cheers for tha. Think I might have to go back to the drawing board and see what I'll do. I'm only in an apartment so space is very limited. Thought I was good to go when I got a stock pot and my brother in laws mash tun. Any links to a suitable electric boiler. I have a gas hob to work off.

You got a balcony? Most people do it there.

http://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/peco-beermakers-professional-boiler-32lt-includes-hop-strainer-p-2211.html


You could do brew in a bag if doing beers 1065 and under. Good video here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6WVul6IEKk

aaronm13

RasTa wrote: »

You got a balcony? Most people do it there.

http://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/peco-beermakers-professional-boiler-32lt-includes-hop-strainer-p-2211.html


You could do brew in a bag if doing beers 1065 and under. Good video here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6WVul6IEKk

Thanks for the link and video. That boiler might actually be a better option and is the same cost as a pot. My gas bill would go through the roof boiling 20+ litres of water. So with this bolder and the mash tun I'm getting am I good to go or would I need the cooler too?

BeerNut

aaronm13 wrote: »

would I need the cooler too?

Unless you already have a way of getting 20L of boiling water quickly down to 30C you'll need a chiller.

To be quite honest I think you'd be better off doing 10L batches on the stovetop and just brew more often if output volume is the issue.

aaronm13

BeerNut wrote: »

Unless you already have a way of getting 20L of boiling water quickly down to 30C you'll need a chiller.

To be quite honest I think you'd be better off doing 10L batches on the stovetop and just brew more often if output volume is the issue.

Yeah, I might just go down that road. I'll have to have a think about it. My brother in law must have a cooler so I'll check with him. Even if I did get those 23 litre kits I could just do 2 batches of 11.5 liters.

BeardySi

aaronm13 wrote: »

Even if I did get those 23 litre kits I could just do 2 batches of 11.5 liters.

Not sure about that. There's no guarantee that you'll get the right proportion of grains in each half.

Surprised they don't have a 10L option.

aaronm13

Just reading through a few forums about cooling and came across something and would like some opinions as I'm a bit unsure. Say we take these 23 litre kits for example. If I was to boil maybe 13 litres of water for doing the whole process then top up with 10 litres of cold water in the FV at the end to cool. And also put the FV into a bath of cold water to help cooling. Would the addition of the cold water compromise the taste of the beer. I also saw freezing a 2 litre bottle of water and place in the pot or boiler to help cooling. I know I'm probably just going to have to do smaller batches but just wondering people's opinions.

testaccount123

You know you'll need a 33L fermenter to ferment a 23L batch right? How is it you have the space to store a 33L fermenting bucket but not a 33L boiling bucket? One fits inside the other

aaronm13

testaccount123 wrote: »

You know you'll need a 33L fermenter to ferment a 23L batch right? How is it you have the space to store a 33L fermenting bucket but not a 33L boiling bucket? One fits inside the other

I have two 33L and one 15L bucket that all fit into each other. If I get the boiling bucket this will fit into them too, no space issue there. My issue is unfortunately with the cooling as I don't have the space in an apartment to be setting up a hose. My kitchen tap will also not take a hose connection

VinylJunkie

Thanks for everyones help, I brewed it this evening, just waiting on the temperature to fall to pitch the yeast. The OG is 1.045 which is in the range for the recipe, tastes and looks very nice. Plan is to dry hop it next week.

VinylJunkie

Is there anywhere to buy a 30L induction brewpot in Ireland?

Carawaystick

VinylJunkie wrote: »

Is there anywhere to buy a 30L induction brewpot in Ireland?

http://www.hughjordan.com/en/336-litre-pujadas-stainless-steel-stockpot

You can get almost anything once you have the readies for it

VinylJunkie

That's steep alright, will look in the UK so.

VinylJunkie

My brew has been fermenting now for 2 days, do you think it's too cold? I have it wrapped in a blanket.

loyatemu

no - 18 is perfect.

VinylJunkie

So I plan on dry hopping this, I've a couple of questions.

When fermentation finishes, should the krausen/foam fall into the beer so I can see liquid at the top of the fermentor?

I bought a nylon hop bag, I was planning on putting the dry hop pellets into this and just throwing on top of the beer. Do I need to weigh down the bag? (Seeing plenty of opinions on this online)

BeerNut

VinylJunkie wrote: »

should the krausen/foam fall into the beer so I can see liquid at the top of the fermentor?

It will.

VinylJunkie wrote: »

I was planning on putting the dry hop pellets into this and just throwing on top of the beer.

I don't see the point of putting pellets in a bag. The pellets will just break apart anyway.

VinylJunkie

So I'll just chuck the pellets on top when fermentation finishes, planning on dry hopping for 5 days all in the primary FV.

Next stage question - I'm going to syphon the beer into a bottling FV, but before I do I'm going to dilute the appropriate amount of corn sugar with water and pour into the bottling FV to carbonate the beer. Give it a gentle stir so as not to airate the beer, leave sit for 10mins then start bottling.
Does this sound correct?

irish_goat

VinylJunkie wrote: »

So I'll just chuck the pellets on top when fermentation finishes, planning on dry hopping for 5 days all in the primary FV.

Next stage question - I'm going to syphon the beer into a bottling FV, but before I do I'm going to dilute the appropriate amount of corn sugar with water and pour into the bottling FV to carbonate the beer. Give it a gentle stir so as not to airate the beer, leave sit for 10mins then start bottling.
Does this sound correct?

I never bother stirring it, if you syphon on top of the sugar solution it'll mix up grand. Otherwise, sounds good.

RasTa

Use a bag with pellet hops, they are a pain in the arse when siphoning into your bottle bucket

VinylJunkie

RasTa wrote: »

Use a bag with pellet hops, they are a pain in the arse when siphoning into your bottle bucket

So it's easier to take the bag off the top of the beer before syphoning?

I bought an auto syphon, I assume I put that half way into the FV so I don't disturb the sediment at the bottom.

BeerNut

RasTa wrote: »

Use a bag with pellet hops, they are a pain in the arse when siphoning into your bottle bucket

I'll defer to your experience on this one

VinylJunkie wrote: »

I bought an auto syphon, I assume I put that half way into the FV so I don't disturb the sediment at the bottom.

Put it right down to the base. It's designed so it doesn't suck up what's on the bottom.

Lovely Bloke

boil the sugar/water solution, or it could introduce infection

VinylJunkie

RasTa wrote: »

Use a bag with pellet hops, they are a pain in the arse when siphoning into your bottle bucket

Do you put a sanitized spoon or something in the bag to weigh it down or not?

RasTa

VinylJunkie wrote: »

Do you put a sanitized spoon or something in the bag to weigh it down or not?

I use a few snooker balls

BeardySi

RasTa wrote: »

I use a few snooker balls

Surely OTT? I've found a single spoon in the bag is enough to weigh it down.

VinylJunkie

So my OG was about 1.04, just tested it there and its 1.008 so about 4.2% which I'm happy with.

Thing is the beer is quite cloudy in the tester, anything I can do to help clear it? I don't have a spare fridge to cold crash.

Lovely Bloke

bottle it then put the bottles in the fridge is the only thing that you can do really now.

RasTa

Treadhead wrote: »

Surely OTT? I've found a single spoon in the bag is enough to weigh it down.

The bag I use is pretty big so just floats if I add a spoon.

VinylJunkie

Update on this, Fermentation has finished, I threw the bag of hops in earlier with a sanitised spoon (need something heavier next time)

Does it look ok?