DIY Plumbing Fit On Log Cabin

Rgdajd

Hi All,

Thanks in advance for any advice hints or tips given on this issue.

I am considering buying a log cabin and placing it on a site, I am doing the electrical myself but plumbing is something I never really done anything with.

I have a small understanding of the fundamentals of a central heating system. I have drawn a diagram of the system I want to put in.

Could anyone:

Tell me if i have went very wrong on any part?

Tell me if i really need that overhead tank on the top left?

Do i need another buffer tank going into the feed for the pressure pump?

I am trying to avoid the overhead tanks as there is no attic and it means building a cupboard to house the tanks and cylinder

Rgdajd

Also I am Aware the inputs and outputs to the cylinder may not be the right way, but that can be figured out on the actual cylinder

Dtp1979

Hi,
Sorry your drawing is mostly completely wrong. If you're doing it as solid fuel heat source then you've created a bomb. If it's an oil/gas boiler then it just won't work. The plumbing is all wrong too. If you're installing a new boiler then maybe you should consider a combi boiler and get a decent plumber to install it.

Rgdajd

Hi dtp,

Thanks for saving me from being exploded haha,

I did realise after that I would need an expansion tank on the central heating loop , I forgot to add it into the diagram, and bare in mind that where i am positioning the coloured lines at the copper cylinder is not a reference to where they physically get connected , can you tell me where I am going wrong?

At the moment it will be an oil burner as the source , i have yet to research other methods but i am presuming the will be similiar principle?

Also another question , is there a circulation pump built into a oil burner or do i need to put a standalone one in?

cruiser202006

+1 on the combi. Plumbed one recently. Just make sure they don't put down floor Until you run in pipes for radiators. Grant combi as they seem to come in cheaper than firebird.

Rgdajd

I have done some research and made these changes

Pete67

Honestly you are out of your depth here, please get a professional to design and install the heating system. It is not a trivial exercise. It may appear straightforward but remember the professionals have years of training and experience behind them. The consequences of getting it wrong can at best be a system that just does not work, and at worst a very dangerous system that could prove fatal, particularly with a solid fuel heat source.

Rgdajd

hi pete, i appreciate the concern and advice, but its not why i made this post, i would appreciate if someone could advise me on how to do this right and not guys telling me that im doing it wrong, i know im doing it wrong, thats why i looked for help

thanks anyway pete

Dtp1979

Rgdajd wrote: »

hi pete, i appreciate the concern and advice, but its not why i made this post, i would appreciate if someone could advise me on how to do this right and not guys telling me that im doing it wrong, i know im doing it wrong, thats why i looked for help

thanks anyway pete

No offence but you really don't know what you're doing. It's not a diy job. Pete, and myself and probably others are showing our concern because we're the ones who are called in when things don't work or go wrong.

Rgdajd

Yes true, I don't know, that's why I am asking here, avoiding hiring a plumber is my aim.

Sleeper12

Rgdajd wrote:

Yes true, I don't know, that's why I am asking here, avoiding hiring a plumber is my aim.

Not a good idea.

Galway_guy_33

fair play to u op .... I plumbed my own house myself and saved 1000's from what I quoted by a plumber.... never had one leak ... infact when my solar panel was being installed the guy that installed it didnt believe I did it all myself.


to be honest ur last pic is getting close.... when I did mine I used my friends house as a reference taking photos etc... also found my local plumbing supply store really helpful too.


ill have a proper look at ur drawings tomorrow.

I think u will find plumbers and electricians fint like sharing this info.... I had an electrician once try to charge me 400 euro labour only to install 14 recessed lights wasnt long about telling him whereto go with his toolbox.. jokers some of them

Rgdajd

thanks galway guy, your thinking more on my lines....................no disrespect to the other guys as the were looking out for safety etc, but how hard could it be? not saying its going to be easy but its not rocket science

Dtp1979

Galway_guy_33 wrote: »

fair play to u op .... I plumbed my own house myself and saved 1000's from what I quoted by a plumber.... never had one leak ... infact when my solar panel was being installed the guy that installed it didnt believe I did it all myself.


to be honest ur last pic is getting close.... when I did mine I used my friends house as a reference taking photos etc... also found my local plumbing supply store really helpful too.


ill have a proper look at ur drawings tomorrow.

I think u will find plumbers and electricians fint like sharing this info.... I had an electrician once try to charge me 400 euro labour only to install 14 recessed lights wasnt long about telling him whereto go with his toolbox.. jokers some of them

Why didn't u chance doing your solar panel yourself?

Sleeper12

Galway_guy_33 wrote:

fair play to u op .... I plumbed my own house myself and saved 1000's from what I quoted by a plumber.... never had one leak ... infact when my solar panel was being installed the guy that installed it didnt believe I did it all myself.

Galway_guy_33 wrote:

to be honest ur last pic is getting close.... when I did mine I used my friends house as a reference taking photos etc... also found my local plumbing supply store really helpful too.

Galway_guy_33 wrote:

ill have a proper look at ur drawings tomorrow.

Galway_guy_33 wrote:

I think u will find plumbers and electricians fint like sharing this info.... I had an electrician once try to charge me 400 euro labour only to install 14 recessed lights wasnt long about telling him whereto go with his toolbox.. jokers some of them

I think you'll find several plumbers give plenty of free advice here on this forum. In this case the op got some very sensible advice from some great plumbers. Advice was that it is not a diy project and he should get a professional in. It's up to op to decide if he'll take that advice or not.
There are times in this & the electricical forum when the Job is too dangerous the best advice is get a professional

antoinolachtnai

Between the discounts the professional plumber will get on supplies and the lower VAT rate it might only cost you hundreds of euros to get the benefit of the plumber's experience. You might also be able to benefit from a tax break or a grant.

You will also save yourself weeks of messing.

The professionals here are not trying to be sarcastic. They are giving you really good advice.

I am not a plumber and I have no axe to grind. But your plan is not good. Your design won't work and it is very dangerous. I am not talking about a risk of an explosion. That is about the best thing that could happen. There is a real risk of someone getting scalded by steam or even killed.

I can understand the professionals being reluctant to give advice as a result.

corkgsxr

Galway_guy_33 wrote: »

fair play to u op .... I plumbed my own house myself and saved 1000's from what I quoted by a plumber.... never had one leak ... infact when my solar panel was being installed the guy that installed it didnt believe I did it all myself.


to be honest ur last pic is getting close.... when I did mine I used my friends house as a reference taking photos etc... also found my local plumbing supply store really helpful too.


ill have a proper look at ur drawings tomorrow.

I think u will find plumbers and electricians fint like sharing this info.... I had an electrician once try to charge me 400 euro labour only to install 14 recessed lights wasnt long about telling him whereto go with his toolbox.. jokers some of them

Yep getting better but still majorly wrong.

Flowing through cylinder coil before it goes near rads? You'd be a hour waiting for heat.

No fill for the heating.

Cylinder filled from the heating tank.

Sorry but he has no understanding on how plumbing works.


OP I apologise but there has to be a point where you say na it's too much.

Rgdajd

Rgdajd wrote: »

thanks galway guy, your thinking more on my lines....................no disrespect to the other guys as the were looking out for safety etc, but how hard could it be? not saying its going to be easy but its not rocket science

You'd be surprised.


It is not rocket science but yet I go out to warranty jobs where diyers have fitted simplistic undersink water heaters with one pipe in one pipe out but they've got it wrong so the heater has leaked or worse has burst causing at times utter devastation to the family home, all because of a simple mistake.

RJF

By the by, there is an awful lot of plumbing involved in rocket science.

At the least, you need a plumber to design the system for you. You can still do the install yourself if you feel the need but at least the proper safety requirements will be in place ( assuming you follow the design).

It is so obvious from your initial drawing that your concept of how a heating system MIGHT work leads posters here concerned that you are not capable of safely following any advice they might give. While this may or may not be true, this is the worry.

Sometimes advice or descriptions given here by PLUMBERS CAN BE misunderstood or misinterpreted BY OTHER PLUMBERS. Hence the worry.

Please don't try to do it all on your own. Get some help on the ground and learn from it.
You will be far happier with the final result.

Alun

He has another (closed) thread here suggesting he's not overly concerned about getting planning permission for this "log cabin" either, so I'd imagine he's not one for any kind of rules or regulations when it comes to things like this ...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057572322

Rgdajd

Thanks for that rjf , your last paragraph there kind of sums up my reason for posting ,

I am looking for a plumber or someone who knows what they are at to post there own system to use , give advice and not just health and safety lectures and criticism

This is a temporary housing solution (5yrs) to be done as cheaply as possible , big labour bills for plumbers are not cheap, thats why any positive advice given here would be greatly appreciated

RJF

Rgdajd wrote: »

Thanks for that rjf , your last paragraph there kind of sums up my reason for posting ,

I am looking for a plumber or someone who knows what they are at to post there own system to use , give advice and not just health and safety lectures and criticism

This is a temporary housing solution (5yrs) to be done as cheaply as possible , big labour bills for plumbers are not cheap, thats why any positive advice given here would be greatly appreciated

Sorry, Rgdajd, you misunderstand my point - which in fact proves my point. I will try to be as clear and succinct as possible.

You need to HIRE and pay a professional/competent person to

(1) Design your heating system

(2)Instruct you on its installation

(3) Check that your final installation is both correct and safe, and if not, instruct you how to rectify it until it is.

This should be a minimum requirement and should be obvious to any reasonable and responsible person.

As I said earlier you need a person "on the ground". Just to be clear this means pay someone competent to advise you who will also physically inspect the work.

If you choose to ignore this advice you will be endangering both yourself and others and temporary accommodation may be the least of your worries.

Also hiring a competent person in this manner will give you savings in your build and material costs. If you try to do it alone you WILL DEFINITELY make mistakes which will cost you far more than paying for the expert. I see no reason you could not find someone to do this for a reasonable amount. Looking at it purely financially, this is a no brainer.

PLEASE DO NOT ATTEMPT TO DO THIS ON YOUR OWN!!!!!!!!!

dathi

Rgdajd wrote: »

Hi All,



I am considering buying a log cabin and placing it on a site, I am doing the electrical myself
r

and if you are doing the electrical yourself and not registered have a look here;)
http://www.safeelectric.ie/

Rgdajd

Your problem?

Galway_guy_33

So many negative posts the guy is looking for some help here.... like i said i plumbed mine myself for me i replicated exactly what i saw in a friends house.... "his was done by a local plumber".

I traced every pipe... drawing up a sketch and taking photos... bought a good quality pipe bender in heat merchants and practiced a few copper bends with the help of you tube..... got the loan of an 1 inch bender to do the soild fuel boiler connections.

I used qualpex pipe in a pipe underground every where so it can easily be replaced later by slipping a pipe back up the duct later should there be any leaks.... took photo's of every pipe before laying the finish floor. I used copper above ground always nothing as bad as seeing qualpex pipe above ground level.

It is far from rocket science.

Oh and i was asked why i didnt install my own solar .... i was applying for the grant at the time and had to use a registered plumber to do the install.... only for that i wouldnt have used him seeing as the idiot managed to bend my gutter with his ladder

Dtp1979

Galway_guy_33 wrote: »

So many negative posts the guy is looking for some help here.... like i said i plumbed mine myself for me i replicated exactly what i saw in a friends house.... "his was done by a local plumber".

I traced every pipe... drawing up a sketch and taking photos... bought a good quality pipe bender in heat merchants and practiced a few copper bends with the help of you tube..... got the loan of an 1 inch bender to do the soild fuel boiler connections.

I used qualpex pipe in a pipe underground every where so it can easily be replaced later by slipping a pipe back up the duct later should there be any leaks.... took photo's of every pipe before laying the finish floor. I used copper above ground always nothing as bad as seeing qualpex pipe above ground level.

It is far from rocket science.

Oh and i was asked why i didnt install my own solar .... i was applying for the grant at the time and had to use a registered plumber to do the install.... only for that i wouldnt have used him seeing as the idiot managed to bend my gutter with his ladder

Well fair play to you so. Not every diyer is as capable as you though.
And just because you copied another plumbers work certainly dosent mean it's done correctly. Especially when it comes to solid fuel pipework.

Edit.
And seeing as you have grasped heating systems so well, why don't you draw a sketch of your dual system and put it up here. It'd benefit the op greatly.

Galway_guy_33

Dtp1979 wrote: »

Well fair play to you so. Not every diyer is as capable as you though.
And just because you copied another plumbers work certainly dosent mean it's done correctly. Especially when it comes to solid fuel pipework.

Edit.
And seeing as you have grasped heating systems so well, why don't you draw a sketch of your dual system and put it up here. It'd benefit the op greatly.

Here we go again..... well its working for 10 years and more.... i have plenty of hot water and my rads are always warm...... you still see a problem???


Seriously do you guys work in the public sector..... time to bring the union in maybe??

OP i feel sorry for you dont let all this put you off.... go for it plan your system and let me see it.....


ha this reminds me of wiring my kitchen in a new build...... was begging my electrician to come back and wire my kitchen so we could move in.... so I went got the materials wired it myself..... then a few weeks later i get a call from my electrician who was very annoyed the work was done..... he only wanted to know who i got in to do it...... i kept laughing at him and told him rip it out and do it again if its wrong... but he only wanted the name of person that did it.... when i finally told him i did it.... he said oh no its all 100% i thought you got someone else in



As for putting up my system its was a triple boiler system using systemlink...... now the OP's system is much simpler no point in confusing him as there appears to be enough of that going on here as it is.

All the info Dtp1979 is here http://www.systemlink.ie if you want to know....

Dtp1979

Ok grand. Post a diagram for the op

Galway_guy_33

you have quite the "chip" on your shoulder dont you... wheres your diagram seeing as you know it all... are you a qualified plumber?

Dtp1979

Galway_guy_33 wrote: »

you have quite the "chip" on your shoulder dont you... wheres your diagram seeing as you know it all... are you a qualified plumber?

Yes qualified 17 years. But I'm interested in your drawing. I'd genuinely like to see your system. I won't be nit picking out mistakes if I see them. I'll give my honest opinion

Galway_guy_33

This thread is not about my system... how about you help the OP..... thats all im here to do.... i dont need a review of my system i 100% happy with it... and as i've said its well documented on the system link website should you want to know more about it

Galway_guy_33

Galway_guy_33 wrote: »

Here we go again..... well its working for 10 years and more.... i have plenty of hot water and my rads are always warm...... you still see a problem???


Seriously do you guys work in the public sector..... time to bring the union in maybe??

OP i feel sorry for you dont let all this put you off.... go for it plan your system and let me see it.....


ha this reminds me of wiring my kitchen in a new build...... was begging my electrician to come back and wire my kitchen so we could move in.... so I went got the materials wired it myself..... then a few weeks later i get a call from my electrician who was very annoyed the work was done..... he only wanted to know who i got in to do it...... i kept laughing at him and told him rip it out and do it again if its wrong... but he only wanted the name of person that did it.... when i finally told him i did it.... he said oh no its all 100% i thought you got someone else in



As for putting up my system its was a triple boiler system using systemlink...... now the OP's system is much simpler no point in confusing him as there appears to be enough of that going on here as it is.

All the info Dtp1979 is here http://www.systemlink.ie if you want to know....

Obviously you're a man with great skill but do you think that's reflected elsewhere, I find it isn't and I'm only talking about under sink water heaters also it's very lazy thinking to assum professionals reluctancey to help the unskilled is financialy based rather than safety.


(MOD: THREAD CLOSED AT REQUEST OF OP)

Sleeper12

Rgdajd wrote:

Your problem?

It's illegal for starters even if you don't believe it's dangerous.

Back to the plumbing. If I had a 4th year apprentice plumber working for me I still couldn't fully trust his work. I'd have to check it over myself to be sure it's safe. This guy would have spent 4 years in college and on sites. He'd have more knowledge than you after only a few months (no offence intended) let alone 4 years but I'd still have to keep an eye on him.
It's obvious that you won't take the advice from all the plumbers above but none of us are going to help you kill yourself or someone else