Tinkov destroys Contador

godtabh

http://cycling-today.com/tinkov-destroys-contador-i-dont-like-him-even-in-the-team-most-of-the-riders-dont-like-him/

I think this is worth a read.

Some of it is a bit rich from Tinkov but given his age is it time Contdor to call it a day (clearly he isnt with his Trek contract).

thekooman

he will be missed... Oleg that is

neris

thekooman wrote: »

he will be missed... Oleg that is

oleg was a bit of craic in a stodgy peleton led by sky. some of the stuff he said about the race organisations and money was probably true

Cee-Jay-Cee

I like Contador as a cyclist but have often read before he's a bit of a dry shīte away from the game and hard to get on with. I don't think Tinkoffs remarks will do him any harm, he already has his contract so I'm sure he won't be too worried by it, it might even spur him into being a bit more personable.

MPFGLB

I think Contador is probably very dry and overly focused even probably obsessed with what he does ... Many top sports giants are like this ...

Surely its not a major problem for an owner ?

I guess Contador's major sin is he didn't win the Tour. If he had won the Tour Tinkov would hvae been over the top in his praise

As for people not being comfortable around Contador ..I always got that feeling with Roche diaries ...I guess the riders are in awe of Contador and also feel maybe judged in what they are doing plus his personality maybe very awkward in social interactions so they donlt know what to do around him ...but on the otherhand he engenders strong loyalty with some riders not just Spanish ones like Rogers, Tossatto

MPFGLB

Also I donlt think Contador is too old yet

He can still win a GT in my book ....no one knows how Froome or Quintana will turn up next year or what mishaps there are a long the way

I think Contador still has a chance but everyone is so quick to write him off

average_runner

Why the love for a drug cheat?

mloc123

average_runner wrote: »

Why the love for a drug cheat?

Wiggins? Froome?... oh no, Contador.

timmy_mallet

I think I speak for everyone when I say Oleg is a complete eejit. Tremendous leadership skills being demonstrated by him. In the end, it doesn't matter, they're both away from each other. Would enjoy Alberto winning a Grand Tour next year, and giving Oleg the finger as he crosses the last line.

pelevin

I'd say Contador getting slagged off by Tinkov cos of having no interest in being his bosom buddy is a big positive. What a crass classless man Tinkov signs off as.

The public doesn't need to know everything about how you feel, though the modern know-all, no-depth culture might imagine this the greatest of heresies. Contador by contrast has been pleasant & complimentary in his comments on Tinkov. A whole lot more class imo.

And I remember Tinkov saying how the Giro was his favourite race. Now in terms of Grand Tours all he mentions is Contador crashing in the Tour, no mention of how great it was Contador winning the Giro pretty much without a team, literally not a single teammate generally once the roads went up - bucketloads of character to do that, alone in the mountains every time against an army of Astana. Or Contador beating Froome in the Vuelta after the Tour they both crashed out in the Tour. No, doesn't warrant a mention. Contador not drinking though stands out for Tinkov as something important - Contador now bowing to the will of Tinkoff's fragile & huge ego, so the resentment is buried, festers & of course finally gets let loose now.
As far as noone likes Contador, I'd say given who this is coming from, at a guess this could well amount to Tinkov slagging off Contador & noone Tinkov is paying contradicting him.

timmy_mallet

pelevin wrote: »

I'd say Contador getting slagged off by Tinkov cos of having no interest in being his bosom buddy is a big positive. What a crass classless man Tinkov signs off as.

The public doesn't need to know everything about how you feel, though the modern know-all, no-depth culture might imagine this the greatest of heresies. Contador by contrast has been pleasant & complimentary in his comments on Tinkov. A whole lot more class imo.

And I remember Tinkov saying how the Giro was his favourite race. Now in terms of Grand Tours all he mentions is Contador crashing in the Tour, no mention of how great it was Contador winning the Giro pretty much without a team, literally not a single teammate generally once the roads went up - bucketloads of character to do that, alone in the mountains every time against an army of Astana. Or Contador beating Froome in the Vuelta after the Tour they both crashed out in the Tour. No, doesn't warrant a mention. Contador not drinking though stands out for Tinkov as something important. As far as noone likes Contador. I'd say given who this is coming from, at a guess this could well amount to Tinkov slagging off Contador & noone Tinkov is paying contradicting him.

Agree with all that. Alberto not playing Tinkov's game, so Oleg has a petty, childish moan.

harringtonp

Just read it, no doubt in my mind who the tool is

Darkglasses

Tinkov's an awful piece of work. He's had some shocking racist, homophobic and anti-semitic outbursts over the years in public, can only imagine what he's like in private.

average_runner

mloc123 wrote: »

Wiggins? Froome?... oh no, Contador.

Whatever you think of Wiggins or Froome, so far they haven't got caught.

Contador is a drug cheat and should never be held in high regard.

pelevin

average_runner wrote: »

Whatever you think of Wiggins or Froome, so far they haven't got caught.

Contador is a drug cheat and should never be held in high regard.

"Whatever you think of Wiggins or Froome, so far they haven't got caught." I thought he was caught lying very strongly about No Needles - and taking powerful corticosteroids, & Dave Brailsford caught being a blatant hypocrite, & then talking garbage that he had no idea this substance had a history of ped abuse. No idea why it was banned I suppose & just couldn't be arsed finding out. I'm sure all that was in the news lately. Your high moral stance seems to waver very quickly.

average_runner

pelevin wrote: »

"Whatever you think of Wiggins or Froome, so far they haven't got caught." I thought he was caught lying very strongly about No Needles - and taking powerful corticosteroids, & Dave Brailsford caught being a blatant hypocrite, & then talking garbage that he had no idea it was taken essentially as a ped. I'm sure that was in the news lately. Your high moral stance seems to waver very quickly.

I don't like Wiggins so dont get me wrong. But if you can give me proof that he failed a drug test then fair enough.

Yes i know he was caught out over the TUE and it did improve his performance no doubt, but it was within the stupid rules.

pelevin

average_runner wrote: »

I don't like Wiggins so dont get me wrong. But if you can give me proof that he failed a drug test then fair enough.

Yes i know he was caught out over the TUE and it did improve his performance no doubt, but it was within the stupid rules.

As J Vaughters has pointed out, if the TUE was obtained dishonestly then, no, that's not in the rules. It's cheating even in a legal sense rather than just an ethical one. The chances of it being punished as a legal infraction are presumably remote but the reality of what happened seems the same either way.

koutoubia

Ah jaysus lads give it a rest. This thread is about Oleg and Bertie. No need to be bringing Sky into it .

average_runner

pelevin wrote: »

As J Vaughters has pointed out, if the TUE was obtained dishonestly then, no, that's not in the rules. It's cheating even in a legal sense rather than just an ethical one. The chances of it being punished as a legal infraction are presumably remote but the reality of what happened seems the same either way.

Look lets keep it simple.

Did he fail a drug test or do anything illegal that WADA punished him for?

Its a simple YES or NO.

Chuchote

Asking here because the right people will be reading, sorry to dethread for a moment -
Still laughing my head off at Tim Krabbé's The Rider. Does anyone know if it's based on a specific race?

Macy0161

timmy_mallet wrote: »

Agree with all that. Alberto not playing Tinkov's game, so Oleg has a petty, childish moan.

Except he did, by trying the Giro - Tour double. Who know's how he might have gone in 2015 focussed on the Tour? That didn't work out, and now the odious man is trying to blame Bert.

average_runner wrote:

Why the love for a drug cheat?

I refer you to stage 15 of this years Vuelta. That's why.

pelevin

average_runner wrote: »

Look lets keep it simple.

Did he fail a drug test or do anything illegal that WADA punished him for?

Its a simple YES or NO.

Lets keep it simple cos our brains are very small.

average_runner

pelevin wrote: »

Lets keep it simple cos our brains are very small.

No because its against the forum charter

Macy0161

If we're getting into technicalities, WADA did accept that Contador had ingested the drug through contamination; hence he didn't get the full ban.

pelevin

Macy0161 wrote: »

If we're getting into technicalities, WADA did accept that Contador had ingested the drug through contamination; hence he didn't get the full ban.

So it's a score draw!

average_runner

Macy0161 wrote: »

If we're getting into technicalities, WADA did accept that Contador had ingested the drug through contamination; hence he didn't get the full ban.

So he got his tour win back and is now not down as a drug cheat with wada and didnt serve a ban?

Macy0161

average_runner wrote:

So he got his tour win back and is now not down as a drug cheat with wada and didnt serve a ban?

Strict liability so doesn't get results back. However, as I said, WADA accepted the contamination, so they haven't him down as a "drug cheat".

average_runner

Macy0161 wrote: »

Strict liability so doesn't get results back. However, as I said, WADA accepted the contamination, so they haven't him down as a "drug cheat".

I can see anywhere where it says Contador didnt serve a ban and is a clean athlete.
WADA said he was a drug cheat and on their list

thebouldwhacker

He's a proven cheater. A thief of others success, drug cheats only add further insult and damage to the sport we love.
Zero media attention and public accolade is what him and his kind deserve.

Dopes.

pelevin

This is the environment Contador & practically every successful cyclist of that era entered. Unless one gets some pleasure in damning them all from the height of one's own righteousness, I think it bizarre to have a supposed interest in pro-cycling without accepting this reality was the way things were, and hoping they are cycling clean now. Otherwise as said unless one enjoys feeling self-righteously angry, why have an interest in pro-cycling? It would lead to virtually an unbroken thread of those emotions. Personally I stopped watching cycling for years when I was convinced twas filthy, & have gotten into it again in the last 3 or 4 years. What I care about is whether they're cycling clean now. If I again become convinced the top guys are dirty I'll give up on watching it. I think it's unfair to shove this "proven cheat" stuff about that dirty era down people's throats insisting they derive no pleasure but be angry & bitter instead, & hold on tight to this bitterness. Well I don't really enjoy anger & condemnation. I'd much rather just give up on having an interest in it if that's how I'm supposed to feel. Plenty other things to do with one's time.

Macy0161

average_runner wrote:

I can see anywhere where it says Contador didnt serve a ban and is a clean athlete. WADA said he was a drug cheat and on their list

Who said he wasn't sanctioned? He was done on strict liability based on he couldn't prove meat as a source - CAS actually suggested contaminated supplement (rather than blood bags) was most likely.

I'm not saying he his or isn't a drug cheat. I wouldn't stand over anyone in pro cycling, but I certainly wouldn't be sticking the boot into contador while excusing the tramadoled up TUE skybots!

thebouldwhacker

pelevin wrote: »

This is the environment Contador & practically every successful cyclist of that era entered. Unless one gets some pleasure in damning them all from the height of one's own righteousness, I think it bizarre to have a supposed interest in pro-cycling without accepting this reality was the way things were, and hoping they are cycling clean now. Otherwise as said unless one enjoys feeling self-righteously angry, why have an interest in pro-cycling? It would lead to virtually an unbroken thread of those emotions. Personally I stopped watching cycling for years when I was convinced twas filthy, & have gotten into it again in the last 3 or 4 years. What I care about is whether they're cycling clean now. If I again become convinced the top guys are dirty I'll give up on watching it. I think it's unfair to shove this "proven cheat" stuff about that dirty era down people's throats insisting they derive no pleasure but be angry & bitter instead, & hold on tight to this bitterness. Well I don't really enjoy anger & condemnation. I'd much rather just give up on having an interest in it if that's how I'm supposed to feel. Plenty other things to do with one's time.

They are cheats. Plenty of riders are clean, this 'environment' argument is propagated by cheats to defend themselves, it's a mute argument. If dirty riders chose day one to fight cheating with the same gusto as they did in cheating we would have a very different sport.
Cheats are cheats, lying, thieving cheats, where is irrelevant. Cheating in a bike race, cheating in a poker game, cheating is cheating and each cheat had one day in their lives to chose to be either clean, have dignity and pride, or, cheat, become a fraud and steal glory from others. It's not self-righteous, it's called having a personal moral code, ethics and respect for fellow man.

pelevin

thebouldwhacker wrote: »

They are cheats. Plenty of riders are clean, this 'environment' argument is propagated by cheats to defend themselves, it's a mute argument. If dirty riders chose day one to fight cheating with the same gusto as they did in cheating we would have a very different sport.
Cheats are cheats, lying, thieving cheats, where is irrelevant. Cheating in a bike race, cheating in a poker game, cheating is cheating and each cheat had one day in their lives to chose to be either clean, have dignity and pride, or, cheat, become a fraud and steal glory from others. It's not self-righteous, it's called having a personal moral code, ethics and respect for fellow man.

I think you need to use the word 'cheat' a few more times to drive your point home.

average_runner

Macy0161 wrote: »

Who said he wasn't sanctioned? He was done on strict liability based on he couldn't prove meat as a source - CAS actually suggested contaminated supplement (rather than blood bags) was most likely.

I'm not saying he his or isn't a drug cheat. I wouldn't stand over anyone in pro cycling, but I certainly wouldn't be sticking the boot into contador while excusing the tramadoled up TUE skybots!

I never excuse the sky team. All I said was, that contador was a convicted drug cheat, like lance, Gatlin and others

pelevin

thebouldwhacker wrote: »

They are cheats. Plenty of riders are clean, this 'environment' argument is propagated by cheats to defend themselves, it's a mute argument. If dirty riders chose day one to fight cheating with the same gusto as they did in cheating we would have a very different sport.
Cheats are cheats, lying, thieving cheats, where is irrelevant. Cheating in a bike race, cheating in a poker game, cheating is cheating and each cheat had one day in their lives to chose to be either clean, have dignity and pride, or, cheat, become a fraud and steal glory from others. It's not self-righteous, it's called having a personal moral code, ethics and respect for fellow man.

To give a bit of a deeper response, I already said, "I think it's unfair to shove this "proven cheat" stuff about that dirty era down people's throats insisting they derive no pleasure but be angry & bitter instead, & hold on tight to this bitterness."
Well this is a thread about pro-cycling. There are obviously many threads here about pro-cycling. SHould you or someone else come onto every single one going on about cheats & basically how it's a joke anyone deriving any pleasure from pro-cycling? Perhaps you'd respond you're only talking about the cheats, not the clean cyclists. Like Dan Martin presumably. Dan rode for a team, several of whom were to use your key word, cheats. It was managed by a cheat. Quite a few of his key wins, particularly his brilliant Liege win, had Ryder Hesjedal playing a big role. For you presumably this completely spoilt the victory - that a cheat played a key role.

To go to grand tour contenders, you've obviously no time for Contador. I'd say Sky's credibility has gone down the tubes to a big extent. So that's them tainted & stupid to take pleasure in cheats. Quintana has had Valverde as a big team member. So that's him gone as not being essentially of the cheat camp. Nibali for many becuase of being in Astana is gone. Struggling to think of other recent GT winners. Chris Horner! There's one for you. Hesjedal in the Giro. Though we've covered him already.

So I think that's largely sorted the idea of anyone getting pleasure from pro-cycling. Maybe every pro-cycling thread here should have a sub-heading that this is a degrading way to spend one's time.

velo.2010

average_runner wrote: »

I never excuse the sky team. All I said was, that contador was a convicted drug cheat, like lance, Gatlin and others

Actually, Contador was found to have 'accidentally ingested' Clenbuterol according to CAS and was banned because the substance was prohibited. Whatever we may believe privately, the above is on record.

As for Oleg, apparently he's into a bit of wife swapping according to Nico Roche. Heard this from the man himself on a sportive at Fairyhouse in late 2014 just as he was leaving Tinkoff/Saxo for Sky. Roche said Oleg asked him and other riders at a party once could he swap with their partners. Oleg may have been pulling his leg but Roche seemed to think he was fairly serious. Obviously Roche declined the offer!

average_runner

velo.2010 wrote: »

Actually, Contador was found to have 'accidentally ingested' Clenbuterol according to CAS and was banned because the substance was prohibited. Whatever we may believe privately, the above is on record.

As for Oleg, apparently he's into a bit of wife swapping according to Nico Roche. Heard this from the man himself on a sportive at Fairyhouse in late 2014 just as he was leaving Tinkoff/Saxo for Sky. Roche said Oleg asked him and other riders at a party once could he swap with their partners. Oleg may have been pulling his leg but Roche seemed to think he was fairly serious. Obviously Roche declined the offer!

No matter what twist you put on it, he served a drug ban and was stripped of a tour because he was caught cheating. So a drug cheat.

D9Male

He was caught with a banned substance in his system, not cheating. Read the ruling. You're the one putting a spin on it.

velo.2010

average_runner wrote: »

No matter what twist you put on it, he served a drug ban and was stripped of a tour because he was caught cheating. So a drug cheat.

Nope. Read the CAS ruling. They believe (even if you or I don't) that he ingested something from a tainted supplement or other. Strict liability on the substance being in the body meant he got a ban.

MPFGLB

As for Oleg, apparently he's into a bit of wife swapping according to Nico Roche. Heard this from the man himself on a sportive at Fairyhouse in late 2014 just as he was leaving Tinkoff/Saxo for Sky. Roche said Oleg asked him and other riders at a party once could he swap with their partners. Oleg may have been pulling his leg but Roche seemed to think he was fairly serious. Obviously Roche declined the offer!

What? what century are we living in?? As if the women are owned by the men for swapping purposes

I am surprised he didn't offer Nico 10 camels !!! NO wonder he ran awy to SKY

Gotta be a joke ...have you seen Oleg's wife ....she'd eat Nico alive

Lusk_Doyle

"Tinkov destroys Contador"

What an exaggeration. He said that people don't like him. Hardly destructive material thereat all.

velo.2010

Tinkoff being the biggest prick on twitter again. Seriously, the man needs to check in somewhere.

Lumen

People are not just one thing.

Contador is a supremely talented bike rider who's also been sanctioned for a doping offence.

One does not negate the other.

Oleg is a loathsome prick. He's also quite entertaining.

One does not negate the other.

godtabh

What he says probably has some merit but how he says it is vulgar

wirelessdude01

Don't follow the idiot on twitter so can anyone share what guff he is spouting now?

letape

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Don't follow the idiot on twitter so can anyone share what guff he is spouting now?

Effectively that he is overpaid and hasn't delivered in the last year as not hungry enough:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/oleg-tinkov-contador-a-rip-off/

godtabh

letape wrote: »

Effectively that he is overpaid and hasn't delivered in the last year as not hungry enough:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/oleg-tinkov-contador-a-rip-off/

He said a bit more than that!

letape

godtabh wrote: »

He said a bit more than that!

Not that much more!

"Contador hasn't won any protour race in the last 11 months.He has received 4million euro since then as a salary.What a rip off for investors"

retalivity

That's what was said in English...heaps more in Russian but no translation...
The man is deranged.

godtabh

letape wrote: »

Not that much more!

"Contador hasn't won any protour race in the last 11 months.He has received 4million euro since then as a salary.What a rip off for investors"

See below. he said a lot more and a lot of it was how he said it

Darkglasses

Fair play to Bertie for saying that to Oleg's face. Takes guts, unlike raving on twitter.