John Connors: The Travellers

laugh

Anybody watching this?

Doesn't seem to be much balance in this analysis of the travelling community.

tomwaterford

I'm. Watching it......kinda of really hard to follow....seems to be running from one point to another



Guess it's all from a travellers viewpoint

Hope there's more craic in next episode....depressing AF

Duff

Come with me if you want to live.

gifted

John connors???...is he the chap from the Terminator with your man arnold

tomwaterford

gifted wrote: »

John connors???...is he the chap from the Terminator with your man arnold

No....he shot king nidge

gifted

tomwaterford wrote: »

No....he shot king nidge

Arnold from the terminator shot king nudge?

mucksavage1985

Notice the way young male travellers are no where to be seen in any footage! They don't want to be seen just in case someone recognises them!

Guy:Incognito

laugh wrote: »

Anybody watching this?

Doesn't seem to be much balance in this analysis of the travelling community.

Have they got to th epart where they show their p60's , bank accounts, proof of income sources yet?

Have they explained how the site has numerous very fresh registered cars and vans all owned by people with no official income?

I always find it interesting Pavee point never come out and debunk the negative thinking within the rest of society with proof. It's almost like they never address it at all.......

Willfarman

My parents and grandparents often talked athome here of the travellers years ago here in north Wexford. I suppose from the early part of the century to the 70's.. There were also tramps aplenty roaming north Wexford those days doing casual labour anywhere they could get it. They were hard times for a lot of people. One such story my dad tells is of being a small boy and hearing a setting hen kicking up s racket in the hen house. He looked in to see a much older tinker child stealing the eggs from under the said hen. He went to report to my grandmother who was giving milk and bread to a tinker woman at the door. Who then chastised the child but had obviously sent her to do it. "the devil is in that child mam"

Kermit.de.frog

IN.BEFORE.DE.LOCK

Mongfinder General

Travelers are probably the least travelled part of the population today when you consider that most of the population has been to far flung places like Australia, the U.S, Asia etc

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

John Connors: Time Traveller

bajer101

Watching this on RTE+1 now. Interesting section on traveller children being taken by the state and put in industrial schools.

foggy_lad

Mongfinder General wrote: »

Travelers are probably the least travelled part of the population today when you consider that most of the population has been to far flung places like Australia, the U.S, Asia etc

So have many of the travellers.

MonkieSocks

gifted wrote: »

Arnold from the terminator shot king nudge?

NO......he shot Skelator

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Who is your daddy and what does he do.

andekwarhola

Passionate advocate that fights valiant if somewhat deluded battle to deny that traveller community has entrenched issues with criminality and antisocial culture.

Best known for giving guilty middle-class liberals the horn with dramatic portrayal of pipe bomb-making traveller engaged in violent feud with Dublin criminals.

toptom

Disgrace tv license spent on this propaganda

dd972

Were there any LGBT Travellers in it?, then another thread can be saved...:pac:

Arsemageddon

toptom wrote: »

Disgrace tv license spent on this propaganda

RTE making a programme about Irish people!?


You're right Tom - it is indeed a disgrace.

toptom

Arsemageddon wrote: »

RTE making a programme about Irish people!?


You're right Tom - it is indeed a disgrace.

But it is. its glorifying them. We all had it hard in the past, Why single out them to try bring pity on

suicide_circus

#settledprivilage

Arsemageddon

toptom wrote: »

But it is. its glorifying them. We all had it hard in the past, Why single out them to try bring pity on

Yes indeed Tom, how dare any one ever mention that it was state policy to forcibly remove traveller children frm their families and put them in reformatories and industrial schools for no good reason.

What RTE need to do is make more nice programmes about nice people doing nice things - but only after getting your approval first.

darkpagandeath

Did it explain why 90 odd percent are on SW ? And yet still have them cars ?

Arsemageddon

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Did it explain why 90 odd percent are on SW ? And yet still have them cars ?

No one on the scratch is allowed have a car now?!

Jaysus lads, ye're all in great form tonight - I'll leave ye to it

darkpagandeath

Arsemageddon wrote: »

No one on the scratch is allowed have a car now?!

Jaysus lads, ye're all in great form tonight - I'll leave ye to it

Where did I say that ?

toptom

Arsemageddon wrote: »

Yes indeed Tom, how dare any one ever mention that it was state policy to forcibly remove traveller children frm their families and put them in reformatories and industrial schools for no good reason.

What RTE need to do is make more nice programmes about nice people doing nice things - but only after getting your approval first.

Plenty of settled people ended up in the homes too

foggy_lad

Arsemageddon wrote: »

No one on the scratch is allowed have a car now?!

Jaysus lads, ye're all in great form tonight - I'll leave ye to it

+1

Considering they rarely drink and most don't smoke and their lifestyle would work out cheaper than many settled families they could well afford to save up for a car and insurance etc while on the dole or working wherever they can get some work.

darkpagandeath

foggy_lad wrote: »

+1

Considering they rarely drink and most don't smoke and their lifestyle would work out cheaper than many settled families they could well afford to save up for a car and insurance etc while on the dole or working wherever they can get some work.

You have seen the weddings yes ? lol insurance, and working while on JSA cuts the amount and not really worth the hassle. No Problem with someone that lost there job having a car. Find it very strange you can afford buy one on €188 pw. Are the insurance companies not gouging everyone ?

Arsemageddon

toptom wrote: »

Plenty of settled people ended up in the homes too

Yes, but they weren't sent to homes solely because they were settled people, nor were they sent there in anything like the numbers that travellers were.

One point made in the programme was that many travellers sent to state run homes were never properly recorded so they were not allowed get compensation from the state redress scheme for being sexually abused - but sure, isn't that just more auld propaganda Tom?

toptom

Arsemageddon wrote: »

Yes, but they weren't sent to homes solely because they were settled people, nor were they sent there in anything like the numbers that travellers were.

One point made in the programme was that many travellers sent to state run homes were never properly recorded so they were not allowed get compensation from the state redress scheme for being sexually abused - but sure, isn't that just more auld propaganda Tom?

I didn't get any compensation when the chainsaw, lawnmower, saws and tools vanished from the shed.

Junkyard Tom

Travellers are kinda like Ireland's version of Native Americans. Modern western life just isn't compatible with nomadism.

Arsemageddon

toptom wrote: »

I didn't get any compensation when the chainsaw, lawnmower, saws and tools vanished from the shed.

So because some stuff was robbed from your shed there shouldn't be any programmes about travellers on RTE?

I think most people would agree there is a bit of a difference between petty theft and the systematic sexual exploitation of a child in a state run institution.

feargale

toptom wrote: »

But it is. its glorifying them. We all had it hard in the past, Why single out them to try bring pity on

I don't know how hard you had it, but let me tell you some things I witnessed as a kid in the fifties:
1. A traveller woman going into labour in a field at the side of the road.
2. A traveller kid aged six or seven playing with other traveller kids in a dump, without a trousers, his genitals exposed to the world.
3. Two travellers came to my rural parish to do a few weeks' work for a farmer. They caused no trouble during the time of the work. The day the work was done they did some drinking and walked up the street shouting angrily, I would think because they were shortchanged in their pay. Two guards arrested them and while they were being walked to the garda station one of them queried the arrest on two or three occasions, and on each such occasion was beaten severely with a baton. Later that evening I heard very distressed crying coming from the garda station. I was about a quarter of a mile away from the station at the time.

I have no wish to condone criminality by travellers. But boards.ie typically sets out the case in black and white. If you look at the Australian aborigines you will see a very similar pattern, a people virtually destroyed by abuses such as families broken up, children forcefully taken from their families etc. resulting today in communities plagued by alcoholism and criminality. You see a bit of that in Ireland's settled community too. I bet that every drug dealer in Dublin had a grandfather coming out of a factory on Friday with a pay packet. Machines and neoliberal economics rendered them no longer useful. And those who invented the machines weren't quite as inventive socially. I've heard a big employer say - leave them redundant, more trouble than they're worth, and give them some money to keep them out of trouble. Nothing about self esteem there.

BlaasForRafa

Arsemageddon wrote: »

Yes indeed Tom, how dare any one ever mention that it was state policy to forcibly remove traveller children frm their families and put them in reformatories and industrial schools for no good reason..

No good reason? Perhaps they were taken for reasons of poor health or neglect or doesn't that fit with your world view.

I assume you'll probably blame settled people for the high child mortality rate among traveller children and the higher rates of still births among traveller women http://www.irishhealth.com/article.html?id=19721

ChunkyLover54

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Travellers are kinda like Ireland's version of Native Americans.

No, that's not really an accurate comparison.

Arsemageddon

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

No good reason? Perhaps they were taken for reasons of poor health or neglect or doesn't that fit with your world view.

Actually, they were taken into care because the 1963 Commission on Itinerancy recommended that the best way to deal with travellers was to force them to assimilate. Part of that policy was to take traveller children from their families and place them into state run homes.

I assume you'll probably blame settled people for the high child mortality rate among traveller children and the higher rates of still births among traveller women http://www.irishhealth.com/article.html?id=19721

Why would you assume that?

darkpagandeath

ChunkyLover54 wrote: »

No, that's not really an accurate comparison.

Aye the whole pox blankest and all that.

darkpagandeath

Arsemageddon wrote: »

Actually, they were taken into care because the 1963 Commission on Itinerancy recommended that the best way to deal with travellers was to force them to assimilate. Part of that policy was to take traveller children from their families and place them into state run homes.



Why would you assume that?

Fair point, But why do the act the same in every country ?

Junkyard Tom

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

No good reason? Perhaps they were taken for reasons of poor health or neglect or doesn't that fit with your world view.

It was 'worldview' that probably contributed to them being incarcerated. The savages needed civilising and nothing like kidnapping, beating, and abuse, of the less civilised proves the superior values of the civilised.

Arsemageddon

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Fair point, But why do the act the same in every country ?

I dunno, I'm not the official spokesman.

This thread was about a pretty straight forward topic - whether any boardsies had watched a programme on RTE about travellers. Turns out next to no one here has, but yet they felt the need to post in the thread anyway.

I found the actual programme a bit disjointed, the first part was about their oral tradition, folklore, language, etc. The second part about the Commission on Itinerancy and institutional abuse was just skimmed over. I think this should have been dealt with in more detail (it probably warranted a programme on its own)

mickdw

Jesus that Connor chap is an obnoxious clown.
His character on love hate was a pipe bomb maker and murderer but it says alot that the character was far more likeable that the man himself who from all of his media outings appears to be completely blind to any wrong doing on the side of travellers and seems to believe that the state owes them all a living.

darkpagandeath

Arsemageddon wrote: »

I dunno, I'm not the official spokesman.

This thread was about a pretty straight forward topic - whether any boardsies had watched a programme on RTE about travellers. Turns out next to no one here has, but yet they felt the need to post in the thread anyway.

You blamed them being taken into care here, They act the same in the UK, The EU and Aus. it cant be just the taken into care in Ireland. The abuse is shocking I agree. Every country they claim welfare and live beyond those means basic stuff needs to be answered why. If they are born in the UK they are a separate race afforded what everyone else is yet act the same as they do in Ireland.

Donald Trump

The Honey Monster wrote: »

John Connors: Time Traveller

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TakfNbFuNA

Donald Trump

Did the programme cover some of their major contributions to culture and heritage, especially music?

I mean, who among us has not enjoyed:
"The hoor among the nettles roaring"
"The mangled badger"
"The cow that ate me mother's shawl"
"Mammy's horse is after dying"

toptom

toptom wrote: »

I didn't get any compensation when the chainsaw, lawnmower, saws and tools vanished from the shed.

Not sure I get the point you make.

Are you against the concept of redress for victims of institutional abuse because of the wrong done to you?

Or again the idea that travellers should be entitled to it as you blame them for the theft from you?

Or do you think the State should compensate victims of all crimes, including theft of gardening tools?

nullzero

feargale wrote: »

I don't know how hard you had it, but let me tell you some things I witnessed as a kid in the fifties:
1. A traveller woman going into labour in a field at the side of the road.
2. A traveller kid aged six or seven playing with other traveller kids in a dump, without a trousers, his genitals exposed to the world.
3. Two travellers came to my rural parish to work for a farmer. They caused no trouble during the time of the work. The day the work was done they did some drinking and walked up the street shouting angrily, I would think because they were shortchanged in their pay. Two guards arrested them and while they were being walked to the garda station one of them queried the arrest on two or three occasions, and on each such occasion was beaten severely with a baton. Later that evening I heard very distressed crying coming from the garda station.

I have no wish to condone criminality by travellers. But boards.ie typically sets out the case in black and white. If you look at the Australian aborigines you will see a very similar pattern, a people virtually destroyed by abuses such as families broken up, children forcefully taken from their families etc. resulting today in communities plagued by alcoholism and criminality. You see a bit of that in Ireland's settled community too. I bet that every drug dealer in Dublin had a grandfather coming out of a factory on Friday with a pay packet. Machines and neoliberal economics rendered them no longer useful. And those who invented the machines weren't quite as inventive socially. I've heard a big employer say - leave them redundant, more trouble than they're worth, and give them some money to keep them out of trouble. Nothing about self esteem there.

The relevance of anecdotes from the 1950's in relation to the behaviour of modern travellers is questionable.
As a society at that point in out history we brutalised vast swathes of our people be they travellers or not, usually due to being instructed to do so by the church.

As for the travellers being stuck in a vicious circle of discrimination leading to criminality there is some validity to that argument but it also has to be understood that a lot of travellers do not view assimilation into society as desirable. Living outside the law has become extremely profitable and where travellers were once dishevelled and impoverished they are now well dressed carrying large amounts of cash and driving brand new expensive cars. How they afford their lifestyle is a whole other discussion or at least post that I'm not going to get into now.

nullzero

nullzero wrote: »

As for the travellers being stuck in a vicious circle of discrimination leading to criminality there is some validity to that argument but it also has to be understood that a lot of travellers do not view assimilation into society as desirable...

And that's perfectly understandable.

It's almost 100 years since the USA dropped the policy of assimilating Native Americans.

largepants

The footage of the County Council Official really opened my eyes when he spoke of educating the traveller children to get rid of itinerants for good. I'm paraphrasing there but it's along those lines.

What a despicable thing to say.

GerryDerpy

Meh, having worked in retail for numerous years I have no real grá for travellers. The majority of shoplifters were members of their community, says a lot.

The_Captain

Everyone in Ireland just has a very specific type of racism where we accept Africans, Eastern Europeans, Chinese, Muslims, people from all backgrounds, nations and cultures, but we're racist against the white Irish travelling community who never do anything wrong ever.