elastic post codes and post code snobbery

What the general opinion on post code snobbery, for me it would always be value over addresses.

SarahMollie

It depends.... I do believe the location is of utmost importance but if I was getting a bargain by being slightly outside a certain postcode yet the street where the house is shared all the positive characteristics of the desirable post code, than thats a good deal.

Buying a house almost always involves compromise however, unless you've a literally unlimited budget. I think for most people its a balance between a location they can feel good about and a property that they can be happy in.

witchgirl26

For me location does mean a lot but it's not about the postcode it has but more about what the location itself has. I want to live somewhere I can walk to a local shop from, has a supermarket within an easy drive, relatively easy to get to my mam's house, not too much of a commute and, ideally, a nice coffee shop or something nearby.

Are there some areas I wouldn't live in? Course, we all have our preferences but I'm not going to rule out say all of Dublin 5 because I don't like one particular place within it. That's being a bit unrealistic I think.

Effects

mariaalice wrote: »

What the general opinion on post code snobbery, for me it would always be value over addresses.

Address is also an indicator of value though. I'd rather live in a 2 bed in Clontarf that a 5 bed in bad Cabra.

SarahMollie

Yeah exactly - when myself and my OH first moved in together, we went for a rented apt not that far from where he was from. The apartment was lovely - warm, modern, good sized rooms, but the location was killing me. We had only 1 bus into town, took a solid 10 minutes each way to find a Londis for some milk or whatever and we didnt have a nice local or any nice resturants we could go to for a casual dinner. Nearest was about 25-30mins walk away. It was just non stop housing estates everywhere. He liked it as it was pretty much what he'd grown up with but I'd always lived in places with more amenities.

So when I bought, I'm technically no closer to the city really, but the area has so much more. I'm 10 (if even) minutes walk each way to the local village with a small shopping center, cinema and a few pubs restaurants to choose from. 10 minutes the other direction and I'm on the Luas into town. I've a convenience shop 5 minutes away. I'm so much happier with the new area. While is still very suburban, its got a much better balance in terms of infrastructure. That to me is worth money.

riclad

You,ll get a 1 bed house in clontarf ,for the price of a 3bed house in coolock .Think of your budget ,i can borrow 200k,
i want at least 2 bedrooms, and a garden .
go to daft.ie ,look at houses under 200k , see what is on the market.
Looking to live near shops, a supermarket, restaurants is more convenience than snobbery.Theres alot of snobbery in dublin ,
a house on the southside can be 200k more than a similar house on the northside.

Sleeper12

Effects wrote:

Address is also an indicator of value though. I'd rather live in a 2 bed in Clontarf that a 5 bed in bad Cabra.

Just as an example :Rathfarnham is a sought after area & yet parts of Rathfarnham are riddled with junkies. If you are not well informed about an area the post code can miss lead you.
Most parts of Dublin have good & bad. It's up to you (the buyer) to make sure you are looking in the right area.

Sleepy

I wouldn't pay a cent for a postcode, but I'd pay tens of thousands for location. They're very, very different things to anyone who isn't obsessed with branding or labels.

the_syco

mariaalice wrote: »

for me it would always be value over addresses.

Add kids to the mix, and your postcode may matter more?

Elliott S

For me, unless the area is a complete warzone, the property is more important than the postcode. If I love the house and it has everything I want and need, I don't care where it is. Proximity to the city centre is important to me, but there are non-fashionable postcodes that fall into this category too. I can't fathom buying a house that doesn't meet my requirements simply because it's in a fashionable neighbourhood. And, to be honest, I consider anyone who does this to be a bit snobbish.

Elliott S

SarahMollie wrote: »

Yeah exactly - when myself and my OH first moved in together, we went for a rented apt not that far from where he was from. The apartment was lovely - warm, modern, good sized rooms, but the location was killing me. We had only 1 bus into town, took a solid 10 minutes each way to find a Londis for some milk or whatever and we didnt have a nice local or any nice resturants we could go to for a casual dinner. Nearest was about 25-30mins walk away. It was just non stop housing estates everywhere. He liked it as it was pretty much what he'd grown up with but I'd always lived in places with more amenities.

So when I bought, I'm technically no closer to the city really, but the area has so much more. I'm 10 (if even) minutes walk each way to the local village with a small shopping center, cinema and a few pubs restaurants to choose from. 10 minutes the other direction and I'm on the Luas into town. I've a convenience shop 5 minutes away. I'm so much happier with the new area. While is still very suburban, its got a much better balance in terms of infrastructure. That to me is worth money.

Yes, I'm a bit isolated where I am at the moment. One bus into town, a bus trip to get to the nearest supermarket and nice restaurants. I was used to living in the inner suburbs before but got pushed out of town by crazy rents. I've been here two years now and I'm still not used to it. I don't think I ever will be.

Estrellita

Postcodes mean absolutely nothing to me. But as parent I want to bring up my children in an area that isn't riddled with anti-social problems, or is dangerous for them to be outside during the day or night. The schools must have a good reputation to ensure the children get a good education. I don't think those preferences are unreasonable.

I've lived in a couple of different areas in Dublin. Trying to find an (affordable) area that can provide those things, combined with having relatively peaceful neighbours has proven to be quite a challenge. So, we have 'postcoded' ourselves out of Dublin, for a much better quality of life.

Estrellita

Estrellita wrote: »

Postcodes mean absolutely nothing to me. But as parent I want to bring up my children in an area that isn't riddled with anti-social problems, or is dangerous for them to be outside during the day or night. The schools must have a good reputation to ensure the children get a good education. I don't think those preferences are unreasonable.

I've lived in a couple of different areas in Dublin. Trying to find an (affordable) area that can provide those things, combined with having relatively peaceful neighbours has proven to be quite a challenge. So, we have 'postcoded' ourselves out of Dublin, for a much better quality of life.

I don't see that: There are areas of Dublin with good schools and environment for a family that for some reason do not attract attention, it is usually because they share a border with somewhere a bit less desirable.

You would think Ireland was beset by the sort of riots and destruction you can see in the UK and US. It seems to be a sort of fear that is not based on reality.

Carawaystick

Wait till people in Meath now living in D15 or D13 find out...
Or wickla people now living in D24...

ThisRegard

Carawaystick wrote: »

Wait till people in Meath now living in D15 or D13 find out...
Or wickla people now living in D24...

Whatever about people in Meath having Dublin 15 postcodes, it's pretty impressive for spill over from Meath into Dublin 13!

Estrellita

mariaalice wrote: »

I don't see that: There are areas of Dublin with good schools and environment for a family that for some reason do not attract attention, it is usually because they share a border with somewhere a bit less desirable.

You would think Ireland was beset by the sort of riots and destruction you can see in the UK and US. It seems to be a sort of fear that is not based on reality.

I haven't lived in warzone type areas, but I've yet to live beside anyone that didn't cause problems in some way shape or form.

As I've said, I've lived in several different areas and base my opinions on experience.

hardCopy

Where I used to live, people couldn't get places in an established school hundreds of metres away because they were already full of kids from older estates which were actually much further away. I can understand why some people may be willing to pay extra to cross an imaginary line if it's used as a determining criteria for a good local school.

The ability to walk to shops, transport links, schools and green space were the most important things to us when we moved, these all emerged over the course of six months of viewings. Initially all we cared about was a big garden, then it was energy efficiency, everyone has their own priorities for different reasons.

Rew

hardCopy wrote: »

Where I used to live, people couldn't get places in an established school hundreds of metres away because they were already full of kids from older estates which were actually much further away. I can understand why some people may be willing to pay extra to cross an imaginary line if it's used as a determining criteria for a good local school.

School catchment is a primary driver of our house search ATM. I could buy a detached house with big garden but crap school catchment or I can buy a semi d with an OK garden in a good school area. Proximity to the amenities is much the same.

Good independent (not private) school (in the crap catchment mentioned above) 500m from the house we rent ATM is a waiting list from birth and depending on the time of year your child is born that list can already be full. Given we moved into the area when our oldest was 3 we were told to forget that school.

REFLINE1

Rew wrote: »

hardCopy wrote: »

Where I used to live, people couldn't get places in an established school hundreds of metres away because they were already full of kids from older estates which were actually much further away. I can understand why some people may be willing to pay extra to cross an imaginary line if it's used as a determining criteria for a good local school.

School catchment is a primary driver of our house search ATM. I could buy a detached house with big garden but crap school catchment or I can buy a semi d with an OK garden in a good school area. Proximity to the amenities is much the same.

Good independent (not private) school (in the crap catchment mentioned above) 500m from the house we rent ATM is a waiting list from birth and depending on the time of year your child is born that list can already be full. Given we moved into the area when our oldest was 3 we were told to forget that school.

Not to derail this thread but isnt that practice going to stop soon as per link below?

http://www.education.ie/en/Press-Events/Press-Releases/2016-Press-Releases/PR2016-07-06.html

ongarboy

Carawaystick wrote: »

Wait till people in Meath now living in D15 or D13 find out...
Or wickla people now living in D24...

That's a bug bear of mine alright. The amount of people who live near me inside Dublin 15 and put Clonee in their address. Clonee is a village in County Meath!!:eek:

ThisRegard

Are they in Littlepace? I know people who lived there but they used their address as Clonee. Maybe it's the official address, I dunno, but as you say, the Meath border is just before that closed pub on the right on the way into the village.

Rew

ThisRegard wrote: »

Are they in Littlepace? I know people who lived there but they used their address as Clonee. Maybe it's the official address, I dunno, but as you say, the Meath border is just before that closed pub on the right on the way into the village.

I lived there for a few months and car insurance insisted on my address being Hartstown (and upped my premium).

Rew

REFLINE1 wrote: »

Not to derail this thread but isnt that practice going to stop soon as per link below?

http://www.education.ie/en/Press-Events/Press-Releases/2016-Press-Releases/PR2016-07-06.html

I haven't read the legislation or seen a meaningful review of it so couldn't comment. I wont be holding my breath.

I checked and that school hasn't updated its enrolment policy in ~4 years so they may be waiting for it to be enacted to do anything. Some others I have seen have mention of new policies form 2020! We will have to hedge our bets as we don't want to move schools after any of the kids have started.

Rew

Rew wrote: »

I haven't read the legislation or seen a meaningful review of it so couldn't comment. I wont be holding my breath.

I checked and that school hasn't updated its enrolment policy in ~4 years so they may be waiting for it to be enacted to do anything. Some others I have seen have mention of new policies form 2020! We will have to hedge our bets as we don't want to move schools after any of the kids have started.

Considering you are talking about educating a 4/5 year old how exactly do you define a crap school or a good school.

Secondary school is different.

Estrellita

mariaalice wrote: »

Considering you are talking about educating a 4/5 year old how exactly do you define a crap school or a good school.

Secondary school is different.

I'll have to cordially disagree with you there. Education matters from the roots. From ages 4/5 - 12 or 13 years old matters a lot, both academically and socially.

Rew

Education matters from the moment they are born, I see that every day in my kids.

witchgirl26

It was my understanding that schools cannot operate waiting lists anymore and that sign up for a school is only in the year prior to when the child is due to start. Some of my friends and siblings who have children who have just started school in the past couple of years have mentioned this and about how they were trying to make sure they got the applications in as soon as they could once the school was accepting submissions for the following year.

I agree understanding the schools in an area is key to a lot of people but just something to note. My father was the principal in a primary school in a designated "underprivileged" area whereas I went to a primary near our home in what would have been considered a fairly good area. My dad's school always had better technology and facilities than my school ever had because of the funding it received.

http://www.savills.co.uk/blog/article/187279/residential-property/interactive-map-how-secondary-schools-affect-local-house-prices.aspx

That is a UK report which showed proximity to a good school pushes up prices. That might be a factor in Ireland.

Mine are grown up and gone and the local schools are excellent so never really an issue to consider. I know it is something that people very exercised about.

hardCopy

REFLINE1 wrote: »

Not to derail this thread but isnt that practice going to stop soon as per link below?

http://www.education.ie/en/Press-Events/Press-Releases/2016-Press-Releases/PR2016-07-06.html

Rew wrote: »

I haven't read the legislation or seen a meaningful review of it so couldn't comment. I wont be holding my breath.

I checked and that school hasn't updated its enrolment policy in ~4 years so they may be waiting for it to be enacted to do anything. Some others I have seen have mention of new policies form 2020! We will have to hedge our bets as we don't want to move schools after any of the kids have started.

As per the link, schools can still operate whatever criteria they want if they are oversubscribed. Plenty of schools with good reputations will always be oversubscribed, especially in cities. I can't see it making any material difference.

Removing waiting lists will just mean you can shop for a postcode when your child is three years old rather than moving house as soon as you conceive.

Minister Bruton said: “The basic aim of this Government is to use our economic success to build a fair and compassionate society. Few areas are more important to this vision than education.This legislation is a significant public service reform designed to make it easier for parents to more easily access local schools and to enrol their children in a school that meets their needs.”
“This legislation will increase the transparency and fairness of school admissions. It makes clear that every school must be welcoming of every young person –regardless of their colour, their abilities or disabilities. It will help to end the soft barriers that some of our schools erect in the way of children with special needs.”
- See more at: http://www.education.ie/en/Press-Events/Press-Releases/2016-Press-Releases/PR2016-07-06.html#sthash.sDTVSP9O.dpuf

The Minister's quote actually seems to leave only geography and religion as valid selection criteria for oversubscribed schools to use.

Rew

hardCopy wrote: »

Removing waiting lists will just mean you can shop for a postcode when your child is three years old rather than moving house as soon as you conceive.

The Minister's quote actually seems to leave only geography and religion as valid selection criteria for oversubscribed schools to use.

That would be our experience with most schools other then that one that is still operating the list but if your outside the catchment chances are slim. Finding out what the catchment for schools is is also pretty tricky...

athtrasna

This is accommodation and property. Please take the school talk to the education fora.

Mod

beauf

Sorry just saw the mod comment. Perhaps we could split the schools related stuff to a new thread in property. Out of the postcode.

When buying and committing to a house purchase near by schools is a big consideration. Even the logistics of getting the kids to school is as important as your own commute to work

helimachoptor

I'm in south county dublin.

The house I bought is classed as Blackrock, despite it being nowhere near it (across the road is classed as Foxrock and at the end of the road is classed as Cabinteely)

I grew up literally around the corner and i would never have classed where i live now as blackrock.. but we've gotten the postmen putting stickers on the letters where the address doesnt mention blackrock saying "you're in blackrock"

Mental ted

SarahMollie

helimachoptor wrote: »

I'm in south county dublin.

The house I bought is classed as Blackrock, despite it being nowhere near it (across the road is classed as Foxrock and at the end of the road is classed as Cabinteely)

I grew up literally around the corner and i would never have classed where i live now as blackrock.. but we've gotten the postmen putting stickers on the letters where the address doesnt mention blackrock saying "you're in blackrock"

Mental ted

I also apparently live in Blackrock according to Eircode (I definitely don't). I think its something to do with Blackrock being a postal district. Anyone with A94 at the start of their eircode is classed as Blackrock apparently - even when it isnt.

hardCopy

helimachoptor wrote: »

I'm in south county dublin.

The house I bought is classed as Blackrock, despite it being nowhere near it (across the road is classed as Foxrock and at the end of the road is classed as Cabinteely)

I grew up literally around the corner and i would never have classed where i live now as blackrock.. but we've gotten the postmen putting stickers on the letters where the address doesnt mention blackrock saying "you're in blackrock"

Mental ted

AFAIK, An Post can call an area whatever suits their operations. Addresses are often imposed on people featuring neighbouring towns or counties. It just depends on where it makes sense for them to sort and distribute from. I know of one place that was told to use "Castlerea, Co. Galway" even though the business is in Glenamaddy, Co. Galway and Castlerea is in Roscommon.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/high-court-rules-post-can-be-delivered-only-to-postal-address-28817426.html

Dardania

I drives me mad when the property websites can't get it correct. With myhome, I have an alert set up for Dublin 14, and I'm a wee bit disappointed when I open up the email to see something on the other side of the M50...

Sleeper12

ongarboy wrote:

That's a bug bear of mine alright. The amount of people who live near me inside Dublin 15 and put Clonee in their address. Clonee is a village in County Meath!!

Yes clonee Village is in Co meath but clonee has always been a lot more than a village. Clonee always stretched into Dublin. It is only now that these massive fields have been developed into housing estates that you can see they have always been in Dublin. The deeds of these homes show the correct country as Dublin. This information can't be altered on the land registry. Check out the eircode if in doubt.

ThisRegard

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Check out the eircode if in doubt.

The eircode is not necessarily a good reference as they can be organised to suit An Post rather than by town lands and counties etc.

Sleeper12

ThisRegard wrote:

The eircode is not necessarily a good reference as they can be organised to suit An Post rather than by town lands and counties etc.

Check Google maps, Tom Tom etc. They can't all be wrong.

ThisRegard

I'n not saying they are, just saying that the eircode is not a 100% foolproof method of working out where an area is within, the eircode thread in infrastructure has plenty of examples, and there's a Q&A there somewhere with the reasons as to why.