is Mourinho a busted flush?

GavRedKing

MD1990 wrote: »

If he loses his next 3 games this thread will get locked.

The discussion has been civil, that helps.

If it's Klopp Liverpool match threads will stay open no matter what.

Usually match threads are closed a day or two later, most just drop off the first page and are forgotten about.

MD1990

[QUOTE=Giggsy11;101109333]And Klopp blamed Moreno when Liverpool lost against Villarreal but no one says Klopp throws players under the bus.

Even then what Jose said about Shaw wasn't wrong at all, it was more about highlighting mentality of the team when it comes to closing down and he even said it's on him to improve them.[/QUOTE]
Considering Klopp has taken the blame numerous times for mistakes with Liverpool.
I think when he said he wasn't sure where Moreno was for that goal escapes him for being accused of throwing players under the bus lol.

MD1990

GavRedKing wrote: »

The discussion has been civil, that helps.



Usually match threads are closed a day or two later, most just drop off the first page and are forgotten about.

Sounds like
Jokes about Man Utd/Chelsea after a loss = uncivil

Jokes about Liverpool after a loss = civil

MD1990

MD1990 wrote: »

If he loses his next 3 games this thread will get locked.



If it's Klopp Liverpool match threads will stay open no matter what.

What have match threads got to do with a thread about Jose or other managers?
You are veering towards something else entirely for whatever reason.
Maybe you should question the content that is posted in Match threads after a win or a loss if you have such an issue with it.

54and56

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Peps handling of the Toure piece is public when it shouldn't be

It was Toure's agent who made the issue public. Pep had no control over that but once it went public and he was asked questions about it in a news conference he had little choice but to publicly respond and assert his authority. He could have deflected and said he'll deal with it internally but given the players agent chose to make it public why not put him back in his box publicly?

If you are equating that to Jose just coming out and publicly saying his players are weak mentally then best of luck to you.

MD1990

MD1990 wrote: »

Sounds like
Jokes about Man Utd/Chelsea after a loss = uncivil

Jokes about Liverpool after a loss = civil

What have jokes got to do with this thread also?
This is a discussion about Jose being a busted flush or not.

Andersonisgod

I predicted this before a ball was kicked this season.

Pro. F

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I predicted this before a ball was kicked this season.

You admitted to trolling this forum on your Twitter account too.

GavRedKing

MD1990 wrote: »

Sounds like
Jokes about Man Utd/Chelsea after a loss = uncivil

Jokes about Liverpool after a loss = civil

You've hit the nail on the head there.

:rolleyes:

GavRedKing

GavRedKing wrote: »

If Conte lost last night, considering we've Arsenal away Saturday, he could have easily lost 3 in a row and had no win in 4 if you throw in the draw at Swansea, you could start a thread on Conte potentially facing the sack on the back of that if ya wanted, it would be wrong but thats the footballing landscape at this moment.

Jose winning, losing or drawing or farting at Utd creates column inches, I'm sure any Utd fan isnt going to jumo the shark and write Utd or Jose off after a blip, even if the last 12 months havent been rosey, you dont write off Utd or Jose easily.

I'd argue that it would be so premature and completely not required.
Conte needs time to stamp his authority on the Chelsea team and is completely understandable from any knowledgeable football fan.

GavRedKing

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'd argue that it would be so premature and completely not required.
Conte Jose needs time to stamp his authority on the Chelsea Utd team and is completely understandable from any knowledgeable football fan.

I wonder does the above apply here also?

Je_suis_Jean

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

It was Toure's agent who made the issue public. Pep had no control over that but once it went public and he was asked questions about it in a news conference he had little choice but to publicly respond and assert his authority. He could have deflected and said he'll deal with it internally but given the players agent chose to make it public why not put him back in his box publicly?

If you are equating that to Jose just coming out and publicly saying his players are weak mentally then best of luck to you.

What relevance has this to what Pep should say about a player? Yes he had a choice. Nobody can force him to say or not say anything to the press.

You are making up your own equations I'm afraid.

Also source for this where he said all the players are weak mentally out of interest?

GavRedKing

GavRedKing wrote: »

I wonder does the above apply here also?

Obviously not

MD1990

M!Ck^ wrote: »

What have match threads got to do with a thread about Jose or other managers?
You are veering towards something else entirely for whatever reason.
Maybe you should question the content that is posted in Match threads after a win or a loss if you have such an issue with it.

M!Ck^ wrote: »

What have jokes got to do with this thread also?
This is a discussion about Jose being a busted flush or not.

54and56

M!Ck^ wrote: »

What relevance has this to what Pep should say about a player?

If you understand anything about being an "agent" http://www.duhaime.org/LegalDictionary/A/Agent.aspx you'd know that an agent acts on behalf of their employer so when a players agent publicly critisices a manager he's doing it on behalf of the player who doesn't have the ball$ to do it himself. Does that clarify it for you?

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Nobody can force him to say or not say anything to the press.

Thanks for stating the obvious there. No one claimed he was forced. Pep chose to respond to public questions about public statements made on behalf of a player by his agent. Simples.

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Also source for this where he said all the players are weak mentally out of interest?

Fixed that selective mis quote for ya there and here's some of the sources - https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/sep/18/jose-mourinho-some-manchester-united-players-not-coping-with-pressure-watford and http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3796248/Jose-Mourinho-questions-Manchester-United-players-coolness-pressure.html

Flint Fredstone

MD1990 wrote: »

If he loses his next 3 games this thread will get locked.



If it's Klopp Liverpool match threads will stay open no matter what.

Flint Fredstone

MD1990 wrote: »

Considering Klopp has taken the blame numerous times for mistakes with Liverpool.
I think when he said he wasn't sure where Moreno was for that goal escapes him for being accused of throwing players under the bus lol.

Convenient. If he does it again it will probably "escape him" again too.

Flint Fredstone

Klopp had no problem airing the dirty laundry in public when it came to Sakho either.

Je_suis_Jean

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

If you understand anything about being an "agent" http://www.duhaime.org/LegalDictionary/A/Agent.aspx you'd know that an agent acts on behalf of their employer so when a players agent publicly critisices a manager he's doing it on behalf of the player who doesn't have the ball$ to do it himself. Does that clarify it for you?

Thanks for stating the obvious there. No one claimed he was forced. Pep chose to respond to public questions about public statements made on behalf of a player by his agent. Simples.

Fixed that selective mis quote for ya there and here's some of the sources - https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/sep/18/jose-mourinho-some-manchester-united-players-not-coping-with-pressure-watford and http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3796248/Jose-Mourinho-questions-Manchester-United-players-coolness-pressure.html

Correct and he shouldn't have but he did.
Public, non-public...starting to make sense here?

So to your original point.
I know you like equations so this is what you equate to Jose throwing players under the bus?

"Anyone trying to compare that to Jose throwing his own players under the bus for being weak mentally and being the cause of their poor performances is just making excuses for Jose's behaviour."

Here's what Jose said.

“I was completely aware that we were not the perfect team, that we had lots of players who are not end products and can make their own mistakes,” Mourinho said. “My only doubt was the way they can cope with the negative moments that come sooner or later. I feel that some individuals probably feel too much pressure and that responsibility.

“But from a collective point of view I only have good things to say about them. If you analyse our three defeats in the last week, we were always the best team in the second half. We didn’t start well today but then in the second half the players showed quality, intensity, desire, commitment and ambition. And we lost again in our best moment."

“I can split this into three factors: one is the referee’s crucial mistakes – that’s not in my control. Against Man City you know what happened in minute 55 [when Claudio Bravo made the challenge on Wayne Rooney], today you know what happened for the first goal, against Feyenoord you know that the goal was in an offside position, so we were punished by these mistakes and I can’t do anything.

“The third thing is what is in my hands, which is the improvement of the team,the improvement of individuals, trying to stop with the defensive mistakes. I knew that I had a task because, for example, the first Man City goal and this second goal today, you can find an incredible similarity.This is tactical but it is also a mental attitude. It’s something that you don’t go there and in a couple of weeks everything becomes perfect. So we have to improve, no doubt, individually and collectively. And that’s my job because lady luck you don’t control and referees mistakes you don’t control.”

I read Jose is taking on the responsibility as manager to get his team in order.
Absolutely nothing in the slightest wrong with that.
In-fact there is a lot of positives to read from that in regards to how he addressed the team.

54and56

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Klopp had no problem airing the dirty laundry in public when it came to Sakho either.

You're right, Klopps public discussion of Sakho's situation just like Jose's antics LOL - https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/sep/08/jurken-klopp-tells-mamadou-sakho-no-easy-route-back-liverpool

Je_suis_Jean

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

You're right, Klopps public discussion of Sakho's situation just like Jose's antics LOL - https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/sep/08/jurken-klopp-tells-mamadou-sakho-no-easy-route-back-liverpool

What antics? For Utd?

Flint Fredstone

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

You're right, Klopps public discussion of Sakho's situation just like Jose's antics LOL - https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/sep/08/jurken-klopp-tells-mamadou-sakho-no-easy-route-back-liverpool

Jose hasn't done any worse at United yet.

54and56

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Correct and he shouldn't have but he did.
Public, non-public...starting to make sense here?

So to your original point.
I know you like equations so this is what you equate to Jose throwing players under the bus?

"Anyone trying to compare that to Jose throwing his own players under the bus for being weak mentally and being the cause of their poor performances is just making excuses for Jose's behaviour."

Here's what Jose said.

“I was completely aware that we were not the perfect team, that we had lots of players who are not end products and can make their own mistakes,” Mourinho said. “My only doubt was the way they can cope with the negative moments that come sooner or later. I feel that some individuals probably feel too much pressure and that responsibility.

“But from a collective point of view I only have good things to say about them. If you analyse our three defeats in the last week, we were always the best team in the second half. We didn’t start well today but then in the second half the players showed quality, intensity, desire, commitment and ambition. And we lost again in our best moment."

“I can split this into three factors: one is the referee’s crucial mistakes – that’s not in my control. Against Man City you know what happened in minute 55 [when Claudio Bravo made the challenge on Wayne Rooney], today you know what happened for the first goal, against Feyenoord you know that the goal was in an offside position, so we were punished by these mistakes and I can’t do anything.

“The third thing is what is in my hands, which is the improvement of the team,the improvement of individuals, trying to stop with the defensive mistakes. I knew that I had a task because, for example, the first Man City goal and this second goal today, you can find an incredible similarity.This is tactical but it is also a mental attitude. It’s something that you don’t go there and in a couple of weeks everything becomes perfect. So we have to improve, no doubt, individually and collectively. And that’s my job because lady luck you don’t control and referees mistakes you don’t control.”

I read Jose is taking on the responsibility as manager to get his team in order.
Absolutely nothing in the slightest wrong with that.
In-fact there is a lot of positives to read from that in regards to how he addressed the team.

I admire your ability to ignore reality in order to defend the manager of your team, fair play to you.

You can put all the lipstick you like on an pig of a situation but at the end of the day it's still a pig of a situation

Now that your senior player is already briefing the media against Jose (much to G Neville's embarrassment) it seems there is plenty of legs left in this little debate

Carry on.

Andersonisgod

Pro. F wrote: »

You admitted to trolling this forum on your Twitter account too.

Sometimes I drop some real knowledge on here. This was one of those times.

Flint Fredstone

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Sometimes I drop some real knowledge on here. This was one of those times.

So you're admitting to trolling here now too?

Je_suis_Jean

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

I admire your ability to ignore reality in order to defend the manager of your team, fair play to you.

You can put all the lipstick you like on an pig of a situation but at the end of the day it's still a pig of a situation

Now that your senior player is already briefing the media against Jose (much to G Neville's embarrassment) it seems there is plenty of legs left in this little debate

Carry on.

What reality has been ignored?

To note you decided to commence said debate by quoting my original point. I will continue to carry on thanks very much.

Source for a the senior player leaking to the press?

Giggsy11

Je_suis_Jean wrote: »

You're right, Klopps public discussion of Sakho's situation just like Jose's antics LOL - https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/sep/08/jurken-klopp-tells-mamadou-sakho-no-easy-route-back-liverpool

Lol

The Frenchman was banished on Tuesday after "three cases of indiscipline during Liverpool's tour... and is now facing an uncertain future", reports the Daily Telegraph.

The pair are now set for "crunch talks" over the defender's future next week, when Liverpool return from the US.

"He nearly missed the departure [of Liverpool's plane to San Francisco], he missed a treatment session and was late for a team meal," explained Klopp.

"I have to build a group here and we've got to start new here. I thought it maybe made sense for him to fly home to Liverpool. We have some rules and we have to respect them – if somebody gives me the feeling they are not respecting it I have to react."

Andersonisgod

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

So you're admitting to trolling here now too?

Uh oh, don't remember saying that but I'm not gonna respond to that I just wanted to note that I was right.

Giggsy11

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Lol

Case and point
He nailed Sahko

GLaDOS

This is the worst thread I've ever read.