How do you think Joe Healy is doing now ?

Bullocks

Well as the title says , what do ye think ?
I heard him on the radio there and he seems to be working away

whelan2

The first thing he should have done was to scrap all levies. Increase the membership fee a bit. The whole levy thing will bury them imo. How can you fight against processors etc if you are relying on them to collect your levy

_Brian

whelan2 wrote: »

The first thing he should have done was to scrap all levies. Increase the membership fee a bit. The whole levy thing will bury them imo. How can you fight against processors etc if you are relying on them to collect your levy

Spot on there Whelan.
That would make the organisation more dependant on serving members to keep them on board rather than knowing the money was rolling in no matter what the members did.

Jonny303

Totally agree with increased membership. I joined IFA this year, why? It cost me €75 and I get €70 off my insurance. Its a no brainer with higher fees too!

freedominacup

Jonny303 wrote: »

Totally agree with increased membership. I joined IFA this year, why? It cost me €75 and I get €70 off my insurance. Its a no brainer with higher fees too!

The membership thing has been done to death. The question was about Joe Healys performance so far.

whelan2

I didnt hear Damien o Reilly this morning, my dad said there had been a survey done and most people were happy with how the IFA are getting on. Wonder who's opinion was asked i the survey.

poor farmer

I thought it was a good interview .Damien o reilly asked lots of hard questions .
Joe Healy is working hard and has a mild polite manner, but bearing in mind the mandate he got I dont see him making any hard decisions ie: the levy,staff salaries, etc etc.
This crack with FBD not accepting his nominee (Eddie Downey) on to the board looks bad also.

rangler1

poor farmer wrote: »

I thought it was a good interview .Damien o reilly asked lots of hard questions .
Joe Healy is working hard and has a mild polite manner, but bearing in mind the mandate he got I dont see him making any hard decisions ie: the levy,staff salaries, etc etc.
This crack with FBD not accepting his nominee (Eddie Downey) on to the board looks bad also.

He's a reasonable speaker and communicator, that's all he really has to be, so he'll do alright.

Water John

He has had some bedding in time and that's fine.
Now time to move on and effect change, otherwise he'll end up having change trust upon him. LG and FBD Ins are two good examples of that in recent times.

rangler1

Water John wrote: »

He has had some bedding in time and that's fine.
Now time to move on and effect change, otherwise he'll end up having change trust upon him. LG and FBD Ins are two good examples of that in recent times.

what did FBD thrust upon him.
He's only one person, all he can do is steer a calm path through what is now choppy waters. He's likely delighted with Larrys move, after Nationlal exec voting to leave the levy as it was. His county'd be very anti Levy

Water John

He has only one task, lead.

rangler1

Water John wrote: »

He has only one task, lead.

yea, maybe lead neutral policies, but anything more radical than that will meet the same fate as the levy.

What did FBD do to him or thrust on him

Keepgrowing

Is he not just like the last guy and the one before, head down getting on with it?

Water John

Danger of that Growing. Loathe to get involved and just having an ould ding dong with some posters going nowhere.

rangler1

Water John wrote: »

Danger of that Growing. Loathe to get involved and just having an ould ding dong with some posters going nowhere.

Was thinking the same myself. .

mf240

rangler1 wrote: »

Was thinking the same myself. .

At least you would have the sense not to wade in and escalate things.

For what it's worth I've great hopes for healy

rangler1

mf240 wrote: »

At least you would have the sense not to wade in and escalate things.

For what it's worth I've great hopes for healy

Yea he's a good speaker, i think he's professional and the west needed someone, but there's not enough change at the top....half the exec board is back in again.
Good move to decline the place on the board of FBD

Bullocks

rangler1 wrote: »

Yea he's a good speaker, i think he's professional and the west needed someone, but there's not enough change at the top....half the exec board is back in again.
Good move to decline the place on the board of FBD

I think that shows he's fairly genuine about his job . Maybe could've done without proposing Eddie to take it though !

whelan2

Spoke with one of the grain farmers after the recent protest in Drogheda, he said Healy wasnt great, now I know grain wouldnt be his thing but this lad thought he was poor enough

Bullocks

whelan2 wrote: »

Spoke with one of the grain farmers after the recent protest in Drogheda, he said Healy wasnt great, now I know grain wouldnt be his thing but this lad thought he was poor enough

Had he poor knowledge of the industry or just poor speaking ? You would think that if he was going to a protest as a leader he would've come off well

whelan2

Bullocks wrote: »

Had he poor knowledge of the industry or just poor speaking ? You would think that if he was going to a protest as a leader he would've come off well

Dont know , thats just what the lad said . I would assume he would be good at speaking at this stage

freedominacup

whelan2 wrote: »

Dont know , thats just what the lad said . I would assume he would be good at speaking at this stage

After hectacres assumptions like that prove the saying.

kerry cow

Grain ot beef or milk are all the same .We grow them at a cost and sell them at a loss . Is it not too difficult for anyone who's paid to do a leaders job to educate in the fields of supply and demand .It all is quite simply really with a bit of effort .
There's no excuse for healy not to know his brief up and down , anything other is a failure .Full stop .
Farmers need a leader , we need strength .how silly to propose Downey .he might be a nice guy but it is time to move on , cut clean .
Healy needs to make his own decisions .They will be hard calls but the farmers will back him .
Look at the french or Welsh farmers , they get on with it ,United strong .
Healy can get it done once he is strong enough to be boss and captain of his ship .
We wish him well .

whelan2

the lad said that you would imagine the grain committee chairman would have had him well versed at this stage

rangler1

whelan2 wrote: »

the lad said that you would imagine the grain committee chairman would have had him well versed at this stage

Very different when some one sticks a mic in your gob. temporary amnesia clicks in very quick.
Was that protest a good move though, what happens when english farmers start throwing our beef into the Irish sea.
Fair ould price difference there now.

freedominacup

[/Quote] Is it not too difficult for anyone who's paid to do a leaders job to educate in the fields of supply and demand .It all is quite simply really with a bit of effort .
There's no excuse for healy not to know his brief up and down , anything other is a failure .Full stop .
Farmers need a leader ,

Healy needs to make his own decisions .They will be hard calls but the farmers will back him .

Healy can get it done once he is strong enough to be boss and captain of his ship .
[/quote]

And the consensus view on this forum is that all of these skills and the time required to get yourself briefed can all be got for the price of a relief milker and a few quid mileage.

Bullocks

freedominacup wrote: »

Is it not too difficult for anyone who's paid to do a leaders job to educate in the fields of supply and demand .It all is quite simply really with a bit of effort .
There's no excuse for healy not to know his brief up and down , anything other is a failure .Full stop .
Farmers need a leader ,

Healy needs to make his own decisions .They will be hard calls but the farmers will back him .

Healy can get it done once he is strong enough to be boss and captain of his ship .
[/quote]

And the consensus view on this forum is that all of these skills and the time required to get yourself briefed can all be got for the price of a relief milker and a few quid mileage.[/quote]

They were getting a bit more than mileage and relief .
I think he deserves a decent wage and let him pay his own relief milking out of that if he wants to do the job . I don't think they deserve a decent wage and to get their previous job paid aswell while they're at it

freedominacup

Bullocks wrote: »

I think he deserves a decent wage and let him pay his own relief milking out of that if he wants to do the job . I don't think they deserve a decent wage and to get their previous job paid aswell while they're at it

What's a decent wage bullocks? You work in an industry where fellas with very limited education and narrow skillsets were not so long ago and soon will again expecting €70-80,000 gross for climbing up on a scaffolding and having everything they required to do their job spoon fed to them. What's the leader of the ifa worth based on that metric? I certainly wouldn't do it for a penny less than what Eddie Downey was earning and I'd want a driver thrown in at that.

tanko

Since when did how much anyone is paid, have anything to do with how good they are at their job.
Integrity doesn't cost anything.

rangler1

Probably would need someone 60hrs/wk on joes farm.....anyone any idea what that'd cost and how much gross joe would have to get to cover it.
Not a very tax efficient way of doing it really

Bullocks

freedominacup wrote: »

What's a decent wage bullocks? You work in an industry where fellas with very limited education and narrow skillsets were not so long ago and soon will again expecting €70-80,000 gross for climbing up on a scaffolding and having everything they required to do their job spoon fed to them. What's the leader of the ifa worth based on that metric? I certainly wouldn't do it for a penny less than what Eddie Downey was earning and I'd want a driver thrown in at that.

We won't see them days again unfortunately, and most of the boys getting that kinda money then weren't worth it .
I dont mind a fair wage but like I said let them get that but i don't like this craic of a big wage plus getting another wage for the farm labourer. Like if i won the presidency would you like to see me getting a plasterers wage on top of the presidents wage ?

Bullocks

rangler1 wrote: »

Probably would need someone 60hrs/wk on joes farm.....anyone any idea what that'd cost and how much gross joe would have to get to cover it.
Not a very tax efficient way of doing it really

He could rent it out ?

Keepgrowing

freedominacup wrote: »

Is it not too difficult for anyone who's paid to do a leaders job to educate in the fields of supply and demand .It all is quite simply really with a bit of effort .
There's no excuse for healy not to know his brief up and down , anything other is a failure .Full stop .
Farmers need a leader ,

Healy needs to make his own decisions .They will be hard calls but the farmers will back him .

Healy can get it done once he is strong enough to be boss and captain of his ship .
[/quote]

And the consensus view on this forum is that all of these skills and the time required to get yourself briefed can all be got for the price of a relief milker and a few quid mileage.[/quote]

Sorry can only thank once

rangler1

Bullocks wrote: »

He could rent it out ?

if it was a permanant job he was going into.

Water John

How many are employed in IFA HQ? I am staying away from the wage issue.
The briefing notes in any precise area should be boiled to Albert Reynolds one page.
That is what should be available to JH on any aspect. If not, he should demand it and not brook any less.
It's what CS provide to any elected public rep.

freedominacup

Water John wrote: »

It's what CS provide to any elected public rep.

And look how well that has served us over the past 95 years or so.

freedominacup

Bullocks wrote: »

I dont mind a fair wage but like I said let them get that but i don't like this craic of a big wage plus getting another wage for the farm labourer. Like if i won the presidency would you like to see me getting a plasterers wage on top of the presidents wage ?

I couldn't see why not. You are getting paid to do a job and your business still has to be run. Your labour has to be replaced in your business and then you'll have to hope you can minimize the hit to your business on the management side. I would be afraid that if you weren't properly compensated you wouldn't be giving the job I was looking for you to do the proper attention.

The ifa presidents compensation was massively increased because more than one past presidents business ended up close to collapse because of the competing demands of his farm and his position as president.

How much of an uptick in lifestyle would Mrs bullocks expect if you were going to be away from home two or three nights a week. How much would you want to compensate you for all the things you would miss with your lads in this situation. I don't want someone who doesn't value his own time negotiating with processors or ministers about things that effect how much I will be paid for my time.

Bullocks

freedominacup wrote: »

I couldn't see why not. You are getting paid to do a job and your business still has to be run. Your labour has to be replaced in your business and then you'll have to hope you can minimize the hit to your business on the management side. I would be afraid that if you weren't properly compensated you wouldn't be giving the job I was looking for you to do the proper attention.

The ifa presidents compensation was massively increased because more than one past presidents business ended up close to collapse because of the competing demands of his farm and his position as president.

How much of an uptick in lifestyle would Mrs bullocks expect if you were going to be away from home two or three nights a week. How much would you want to compensate you for all the things you would miss with your lads in this situation. I don't want someone who doesn't value his own time negotiating with processors or ministers about things that effect how much I will be paid for my time.

The way I look at it is farming and president are two very seperate jobs and hopefully they both will pay well but I don't see why one should subsidise the other .

Mrs Bullocks and the lads might be glad to be rid of a cranky lad like me for a few nights haha !

rangler1

Bullocks wrote: »

The way I look at it is farming and president are two very seperate jobs and hopefully they both will pay well but I don't see why one should subsidise the other .

Mrs Bullocks and the lads might be glad to be rid of a cranky lad like me for a few nights haha !

You take someone away from their farm for four years, it's only fair you pay for a replacement. , there's plenty of dairy farms now where the wife has no interest in the farm so maybe joe is the same, It's a manager that is required not a student. Is there many dairy farms getting by with working only 40hrs/wk.... forty hours by tuesday evening some weeks morelike i'd say,so that's an extra cost. Joe has always only asked for the cost of a replacement.

kerry cow

The salary should be laid out before post is filled and if you don't like the terms , then why apply ? What goes on at home is not anyone's problem .
Any how maybe the whole job should be represented by a non farmer paid to do a top class job like all union bosses

rangler1

kerry cow wrote: »

The salary should be laid out before post is filled and if you don't like the terms , then why apply ? What goes on at home is not anyone's problem .
Any how maybe the whole job should be represented by a non farmer paid to do a top class job like all union bosses

maybe....Tom Parlon reputed to have got €250000/pa from the CIF.

Terms are for replacement labour, most farmers will go with that.
Problem with some farmers is the economy they live in, everything's too dear, the mechanic, the vet,creamery employees, name any profession you like..... but they didn't train to work for our rates, we all had the same opportunties to study and get out so it's wrong to begrudge

Grueller

kerry cow wrote: »

Any how maybe the whole job should be represented by a non farmer paid to do a top class job like all union bosses

Agree with this sentiment 100%. However an awful lot of union leaders are poorly thought of by their members. Liam Doran for example with the nurses.
Salary package ahould be a set multiple of average family farm income. Therefore if they contribute to raising this their salary rises in line with it. Performance related pay of a sort.

Bullocks

rangler1 wrote: »

You take someone away from their farm for four years, it's only fair you pay for a replacement. , there's plenty of dairy farms now where the wife has no interest in the farm so maybe joe is the same, It's a manager that is required not a student. Is there many dairy farms getting by with working only 40hrs/wk.... forty hours by tuesday evening some weeks morelike i'd say,so that's an extra cost. Joe has always only asked for the cost of a replacement.

I wouldn't agree with you there ,the farm is totally seperate to his other job .
Are there many self employed people getting by on 40 hrs ? This craic about farmers working every hour god sends would wear a bit thin in comparison to some peoples workload and commute .

alps

Bullocks wrote: »

He could rent it out ?

Absolute. ........rubbish

rangler1

alps wrote: »

Absolute. ........rubbish

Very true, the guys that got destocked by whatever will tell you that it's not straightforward to get rid of a lifetimes breeding and restock with smeone elses culls

rangler1

Bullocks wrote: »

I wouldn't agree with you there ,the farm is totally seperate to his other job .
Are there many self employed people getting by on 40 hrs ? This craic about farmers working every hour god sends would wear a bit thin in comparison to some peoples workload and commute .

I don't know, during the quota years, dairy farmers were well stocked with labour alright., it's a lot tighter now though.
Any way it's as good as any way to set the pay, what's liam doran on, that'd be a good comparison, doubt if liam is putting in the hours tha joe will put in

Bullocks

alps wrote: »

Absolute. ........rubbish

Why so ?

Bullocks

rangler1 wrote: »

Very true, the guys that got destocked by whatever will tell you that it's not straightforward to get rid of a lifetimes breeding and restock with smeone elses culls

Got destocked by BSE . Would've been easier if my job paid better when we had empty fields

Bass Reeves

freedominacup wrote: »

What's a decent wage bullocks? You work in an industry where fellas with very limited education and narrow skillsets were not so long ago and soon will again expecting €70-80,000 gross for climbing up on a scaffolding and having everything they required to do their job spoon fed to them. What's the leader of the ifa worth based on that metric? I certainly wouldn't do it for a penny less than what Eddie Downey was earning and I'd want a driver thrown in at that.

TBH not all were on 70-80K. Most lads making the big money were on piece rates paid by out by the block, by the roof or by the sq meter of plaster. TBH a good few had little issue with ED pay however he was not under paid. The IFA lost the argument when they tried to make out he was paying the replacment after tax.

rangler1 wrote: »

Probably would need someone 60hrs/wk on joes farm.....anyone any idea what that'd cost and how much gross joe would have to get to cover it.
Not a very tax efficient way of doing it really

Even give it 80 hours labour/week and seasonal help at calving 100K should cover it. IN ED cases he would more than likly have in had labour there anyway as he was involved with the IFA for a while. Joe Healy would be an exceptional case what was he getting as a part time journalist 20K? and then running the farm. There is no tax efficiency, you write the labour costs off against the farm and the income from working.

Water John wrote: »

How many are employed in IFA HQ? I am staying away from the wage issue.
The briefing notes in any precise area should be boiled to Albert Reynolds one page.
That is what should be available to JH on any aspect. If not, he should demand it and not brook any less.
It's what CS provide to any elected public rep.

My understanding is that at present the IFA have 63-65 fulltime staff. There are some quite high salary's it seems. JH intends to publish some of the details in the following format. CEO and top 5 managment in one group( I think the CEO pay will be made public as well). Pay to elected officiers President, VP, treasurer. Expenses of elected members of the Executive etc. Pay of staff will be baned and how many in each band.

freedominacup wrote: »

The ifa presidents compensation was massively increased because more than one past presidents business ended up close to collapse because of the competing demands of his farm and his position as president.

Not really sure if this is true. There is one past President taht has/had issue but it seems that this was mainly due to huge expansion and Larry is running his place now if it is to be believed.

rangler1 wrote: »

maybe....Tom Parlon reputed to have got €250000/pa from the CIF.

Tom Parlon was the exception rather than the norm for previous five presidents. None of them have even shaddowedthe way his career developed.

Bullocks wrote: »

I wouldn't agree with you there ,the farm is totally seperate to his other job .
Are there many self employed people getting by on 40 hrs ? This craic about farmers working every hour god sends would wear a bit thin in comparison to some peoples workload and commute .

This is the nub of the matter are you paying to replace his labour or or you paying him a wage and paying his labour expenses as well. In a lot of cases lads that get involved have support from at home often in the form of a family member that is running the operation.

hurling_lad

Has there been any comment from the IFA about how they are getting on recruiting a new CEO?

Surely that job is the most important one for Joe Healy to attend to.

Water John

Thanks Bass. Yes I thought HQ staff was just under 70. Allowing for the field officers, that is still over 50 in HQ.
That is a massive staff to deliver research and operational to each sector.
Its that research I feel is missing. One cannot match processors, importers, Govn't etc unless you have a knowledge base as good as them of each segment of the industry.
I presume JH is putting his stamp on matters. The Gen Sec that's picked will then mirror this. Its a chicken and egg situation.
We have had 2 Gen Secs that seem to have been under little control.

The notion that the President should let his farm is a non runner.