Drive though McDonalds Celbridge

scheister

Was just looking at the kildare county council planning list. McDonalds are after putting in permission for a drive though only restaurant in a part of the current Tesco carpark on the maynooth road.

Planning number 16919

Buffman

scheister wrote: »

Planning number 16886

Are you sure about that number? From what I can see that relates to the fuel station on the Clane Road, I don't see anything recent for the Tesco site on the online map.

16/886
Sofa Properties Ltd
18/08/2016

1) the change of use of 32.8sq.m from the permitted
storage area under Reg. Ref. 08/835 to commercial
use incorporating 30.76sq.m for café/deli, 0.64sq.m
retail area and 1.4sq.m general circulation space. 2)
an increase to the net retail floor area of 51.25sq.m
so that the overall total is now 143sq.m and 3)
modifications to the storage area resulting in a
storage area of 55.6sq.m and associated ancillary
revisions. Permission is also sought for a single
storey extension of 73sq.m to accommodate
additional seating for the café/deli area and
additional works and all consequent elevational
alterations and works
Topaz Service Station & Spar Shop
Clane Road
Celbridge
Co. Kildare

Stealthirl

This was on facebook the other day

scheister

Buffman wrote: »

Are you sure about that number? From what I can see that relates to the fuel station on the Clane Road, I don't see anything recent for the Tesco site on the online map.

Was looking at both yesterday will check number when I get into work

scheister

have corrected the planning number in the original post

dobsdave

I'm thinking this will go into the space where the bottle banks are?
Also, it seems to indicate drive through only, with outdoor seating, surely a walkin section would have to there aswell.

Movie Maestro

Oh Christ this would be a BAD idea. Although I do like MacDonald's food I do think it will be a blight on the area generating a lot of rubbish. Hopefully if it gets the go ahead I'll be wrong:( Would locals welcome this I wonder?

L1011

Movie Maestro wrote: »

Oh Christ this would be a BAD idea. Although I do like MacDonald's food I do think it will be a blight on the area generating a lot of rubbish. Hopefully if it gets the go ahead I'll be wrong:( Would locals welcome this I wonder?

McDonalds staff go out cleaning up - that'll likely even be made as an offer in the planning app. Go take a look at the Maynooth drivethrough if you want to see the impact (minimal) it has.

Movie Maestro

L1011 wrote: »

McDonalds staff go out cleaning up - that'll likely even be made as an offer in the planning app. Go take a look at the Maynooth drivethrough if you want to see the impact (minimal) it has.

To be fair thats true. Fingers crossed

ongarboy

Drive thru only? I've never seen a standalone McDs without an internal seating area apart from the express counter type ones you see in train stations or airports abroad. That's unusual.

Edit: just reading the planning app online now and it just seems to be a standard drive thru restaurant application so I expect there to be internal seating. 410 square meters would otherwise be a lot of space for just kitchen facilities without seating.

http://webgis.kildarecoco.ie/PlanningEnquiryLIte/Default.aspx?FullFileNumber=06a-16919&FromList=true

Are there schools nearby? They influenced the rejection of a KFC in Navan and McDonalds in Greystones recently as they said they'd be too much of a temptation for the school kids and would encourage obesity.

radharc

Nothing in the application says 'D/T only'.

Buffman

My main concern with this location is the extra traffic it's going to attract to the two already busy signalled junctions at Tesco.

If they'd used roundabouts like Maynooth, this wouldn't be an issue. As it is now, between the two poorly designed signalled junctions and the dangerous non-signalled concealed exit from Lidl/Primary Care Centre, the whole area is mess for traffic at peak times.

ongarboy wrote: »

Drive thru only? I've never seen a standalone McDs without an internal seating area apart from the express counter type ones you see in train stations or airports abroad. That's unusual.

Edit: just reading the planning app online now and it just seems to be a standard drive thru restaurant application so I expect there to be internal seating. 410 square meters would otherwise be a lot of space for just kitchen facilities without seating.

Ye, I was thinking the same, 'drive-thru' only wouldn't make any sense for an area as busy as that with potential 'walk in' customers.

ongarboy wrote: »

Are there schools nearby? They influenced the rejection of a KFC in Navan and McDonalds in Greystones recently as they said they'd be too much of a temptation for the school kids and would encourage obesity.

Given the scattered nature of the schools all over the town, it's probably one of the few sites in Celbridge where they won't be very close to a school. Maybe that's why they chose it given the recent issues in the other towns?

mloc123

Is there demand for it? Depending on which side of the bridge you live on there is a McDonalds 10 minutes away.. in Lucan or Maynooth.

This is the planned location afaik:

corm500

mloc123 wrote: »

Is there demand for it? Depending on which side of the bridge you live on there is a McDonalds 10 minutes away.. in Lucan or Maynooth.

Celbridge has a population of over 20,000, much bigger than Maynooth's, so I would say yes there is a demand for it. A town the size of Celbridge needs to be self contained and shouldnt be looking at traveling to other towns for this sort of thing.
And i'm saying this as someone who is not a fan of McDonalds. But, live and let live.
Not everything has to be a fine dining experience.

Buffman

mloc123 wrote: »

This is the planned location afaik:

It's actually the other top bit of the car park where the bottle banks are.

EDIT:My link to the view of the site from KCC planing system seems to keep disappearing, but if you go to the website and enter planning number 16919, you'll see the location.

L1011

The dot on the KCC planning website is not to be taken as meaning anything. You need the actual drawings to see where.

Buffman

L1011 wrote: »

The dot on the KCC planning website is not to be taken as meaning anything. You need the actual drawings to see where.

Ye, I know the dots can be hit and miss sometimes, but the way they've outlined the site area in blue where no seperate site currently exists leads me to believe it's accurate.

L1011

Buffman wrote: »

Ye, I know the dots can be hit and miss sometimes, but the way they've outlined the site area in blue where no seperate site currently exists leads me to believe it's accurate.

The outlines are the land folio outlines. That's the entire centre there basically. It must cover more that one folio, but that outline is vastly bigger than the planning area.

Buffman

L1011 wrote: »

The outlines are the land folio outlines. That's the entire centre there basically. It must cover more that one folio, but that outline is vastly bigger than the planning area.

No, I probably should have zoomed out a bit more. It's a small area of the car park and entrance that's highlighted. As far as I know it was never a seperate site before now.

The Tesco store is over to the left of the highlighted section of the car park/entrance.

Buffman

Buffman wrote: »

It's actually the other top bit of the car park where the bottle banks are.

My link to the view of the site from KCC planing system seems to keep disappearing, but if you go to the website and enter planning number 16919, you'll see the location.

brian_t

Buffman wrote: »

My link to the view of the site from KCC planing system seems to keep disappearing, but if you go to the website and enter planning number 16919, you'll see the location.

All the maps and plans have now been added.

Buffman

brian_t wrote: »

All the maps and plans have now been added.

Ye, good detail there.

Looks like the Tesco entrance will become an even greater 'pinch' point for traffic, with the mainly used second turn into the Tesco side now sharing space with a pedestrian crossing and the entrance to the 'drive-thru'.

There's one drawing there which shows how a truck is supposed to deliver to Mc D's. It involves pulling in towards Tesco, stopping on the junction and crossing, reversing back diagonally across the pedestrian crossing and into the 'drive-thru'.

Rather him than me, but suppose I shouldn't be surprised given the maneuvers that trucks have to do to get into the Tesco delivery yard.

brian_t

One objection to date from Chestnut Grove Residents.

mloc123

Not sure how it impacts Chestnut Grove directly.. apart from adding to the traffic on the Maynooth road

Edit: Just read the objection now, some of it is laughable... the rest is mostly "Not in my town"

NinetyForNone

LOL.. Who knew Big Macs where a gateway drug :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

Buffman

mloc123 wrote: »

Edit: Just read the objection now, some of it is laughable... the rest is mostly "Not in my town"

Agreed, the only part of that submission I semi agree with is the increased traffic element, but the rest comes across as NIMBYism and hysterics.

I'm surprised Da Mario's and Halo haven't lodged anything.

dobsdave

That objection is actually cringeworthy.

the_syco

ongarboy wrote: »

Are there schools nearby?

Yeah. One being built next to Lidl.

=-=

The objection isn't much of a surprise. It would create some local employment, and it'd be accessible from anyone on the east and south east of the village.

dobsdave

the_syco wrote: »

Yeah. One being built next to Lidl.

=-=

The objection isn't much of a surprise. It would create some local employment, and it'd be accessible from anyone on the east and south east of the village.

What school is going in there? first I heard of it.

mloc123

dobsdave wrote: »

What school is going in there? first I heard of it.

The medical centre? Have not heard of any new school apart from the temporary one opposite Salesians.

I don't know if teenagers will walk down... Past Apple green, past macaris etc.. just for McDonalds.

The most annoying aspect of the objection to me is that they didn't even get the name correct... "MacDonalds"

Coopaloop

It's definitely a hse Centre going in beside lidil, the one opposite tesco is where it's currently at.

Really hate all these objections to things like this, it really is just from people who think it will cause teenagers hanging around, but they already do that at tesco and around the village anyway. I personally think it will be good for the town, new jobs etc... If they have proper security who move along the hangers on (unlike outside tesco, I've seen the security guard play football with them rather than move them along out of people's way trying to get a trolley or in the door)

Seriously hope it goes ahead anyway. Onwards and upwards (or outwards for our waistlines).

the_syco

mloc123 wrote: »

The medical centre? Have not heard of any new school apart from the temporary one opposite Salesians.

Seems you're correct. It's called "​Celbridge Primary Care Centre", so I'm assuming that whomever told me assumed that the Primary referred to was a school.

Surprised Da Mario didn't lodge a moan, as this may impact their parking?

scheister

the_syco wrote: »

Seems you're correct. It's called "​Celbridge Primary Care Centre", so I'm assuming that whomever told me assumed that the Primary referred to was a school.

Surprised Da Mario didn't lodge a moan, as this may impact their parking?

you spoke to soon 4 objections now. Da Mario's using the owners name and Cllr Young have both objected along with someone from St Rapheals Manor. generally the increased traffic is the main issue

mloc123

the_syco wrote: »

Surprised Da Mario didn't lodge a moan, as this may impact their parking?

Guy in Nigel's barbers said that it would impact their parking, I would expect a joint objection maybe from that entire retail unit.

Edit: Three more objections in now, one from Macaris(who own DeMario also?)

dobsdave

mloc123 wrote: »

the_syco wrote: »

Surprised Da Mario didn't lodge a moan, as this may impact their parking?

Guy in Nigel's barbers said that it would impact their parking, I would expect a joint objection maybe from that entire retail unit.

Edit: Three more objections in now, one from Macaris(who own DeMario also?)

LOL, "Please don't let Tesco build on their own land because our customers want to park on Tescos parking spaces"
You couldn't make it up.

corm500

mloc123 wrote: »

Guy in Nigel's barbers said that it would impact their parking, I would expect a joint objection maybe from that entire retail unit.

Edit: Three more objections in now, one from Macaris(who own DeMario also?)

These objections are gas. There are never any cars in that part of the car park anyway its just a gigantic waste of space. I think they are clutching at straws here.

Coopaloop

Yeah I've never seen da marios over run with customers, and let's be honest there is still plenty of space in Tesco to park if they do get a rush of customers, that family and the chip shop are all linked anyway so I'm not surprised they are objecting. Typical.
And how many people would be all using that particular barber at the same time that they would run out of car parking. Laughable. Every business in the village manages to run a business without the abundance of parking those two establishments have.

dobsdave

corm500 wrote: »

mloc123 wrote: »

Guy in Nigel's barbers said that it would impact their parking, I would expect a joint objection maybe from that entire retail unit.

Edit: Three more objections in now, one from Macaris(who own DeMario also?)

These objections are gas. There are never any cars in that part of the car park anyway its just a gigantic waste of space. I think they are clutching at straws here.

"undermining of hot-foot outlets" :-)
28 food outlets, of which almost half are made up of shops and pubs.

L1011

dobsdave wrote: »

"undermining of hot-foot outlets" :-)
28 food outlets, of which almost half are made up of shops and pubs.

Same adding up of random outlets (and double/triple counting venues with more than one counter) was done in Maynooth to oppose a restaurant. I can only assume people still think its acceptable to go "waah, waah, I don't want competition" in a planning application because sometimes its actually accepted.

Buffman

Thanks to Cllr Young for the comprehensive list of eateries in the town, it'll come in handy next time I want to try somewhere new.:D

I have to say Mario Macari's submission is well written and does have some good points. His town planner really picks apart their Traffic and Transport Assesment Report and explains well what a mess those junctions currently are.

He also points out something I hadn't noticed and just assumed there was, that there is no provision in the plans to relocate the bottle banks, just remove them, so potentially there won't be any recycling on the North side of the town at all.

Now, I would broadly welcome maccy Ds, but I would like them to sort out those junctions while their doing it. Some roundabouts like the ones at Tesco Maynooth would alleviate the problems and work well IMO.

(Link to all the docs)

mloc123

Buffman wrote: »

Thanks to Cllr Young for the comprehensive list of eateries in the town, it'll come in handy next time I want to try somewhere new.:D

I have to say Mario Macari's submission is well written and does have some good points. His town planner really picks apart their Traffic and Transport Assesment Report and explains well what a mess those junctions currently are.

He also points out something I hadn't noticed and just assumed there was, that there is no provision in the plans to relocate the bottle banks, just remove them, so potentially there won't be any recycling on the North side of the town at all.

Now, I would broadly welcome maccy Ds, but I would like them to sort out those junctions while their doing it. Some roundabouts like the ones at Tesco Maynooth would alleviate the problems and work well IMO.

(Link to all the docs)

Agree, DeMario obviously spent a bit of money on a solicitor that has some experience here.

Are opening hours confirmed at 7-23 now?

Joe Public

Re. Da Mario's input:-

"He also points out something I hadn't noticed and just assumed there was, that there is no provision in the plans to relocate the bottle banks, just remove them, so potentially there won't be any recycling on the North side of the town at all."

mloc123 wrote: »

Agree, DeMario obviously spent a bit of money on a solicitor that has some experience here.

Are opening hours confirmed at 7-23 now?

The proposed McDonalds is not planned for the parking area where the bottle banks are.

brian_t

Joe Public wrote: »

The proposed McDonalds is not planned for the parking area where the bottle banks are.

But that's exactly where it's going.

Buffman

Joe Public wrote: »

The proposed McDonalds is not planned for the parking area where the bottle banks are.

Have you looked at the drawings? According to them, where the bottle banks are now beside Mr Macari's house is going to become a landscaped area with trees on it beside the 'drive-thru' lane pick up windows.

That was actually another aspect of Mr Macari's objection which I can understand where he's coming from. (That his house was going to be overlooked by the drive-thru windows and would be subjected to increased noise and light (car headlights) pollution)

Joe Public

Buffman wrote: »

Have you looked at the drawings? According to them, where the bottle banks are now beside Mr Macari's house is going to become a landscaped area with trees on it beside the 'drive-thru' lane pick up windows.

That was actually another aspect of Mr Macari's objection which I can understand where he's coming from. (That his house was going to be overlooked by the drive-thru windows and would be subjected to increased noise and light (car headlights) pollution)

I was confused by a post here on the 1st Sept that showed a different part of the car park as being the proposed site but now on checking the KCC planning site I see it is where the bottle banks are.

Mr Macari's rented house has been an eyesore for many years often with loads of dumped stuff piled in heaps for all to see and the house could do with a facelift. Despite that moan I suppose he is entitled to make his objections.

One of those big "M" signs would not go down well at this location especially with the workhouse graveyard directly across the road, Lidl had to keep their signs at ground level for the same reason.

The Mulk

Joe Public wrote: »

I was confused by a post here on the 1st Sept that showed a different part of the car park as being the proposed site but now on checking the KCC planning site I see it is where the bottle banks are.

Mr Macari's rented house has been an eyesore for many years often with loads of dumped stuff piled in heaps for all to see and the house could do with a facelift. Despite that moan I suppose he is entitled to make his objections.

One of those big "M" signs would not go down well at this location especially with the workhouse graveyard directly across the road, Lidl had to keep their signs at ground level for the same reason.

Yeah a McDonalds facing a famine memorial, progress!

Anyone hear of an Eddie Rockets for over at SuperValu or is this the rumour mill ramping up again

Buffman

Joe Public wrote: »

I was confused by a post here on the 1st Sept that showed a different part of the car park as being the proposed site but now on checking the KCC planning site I see it is where the bottle banks are.

No worries, I can see where you're coming from. They probably wouldn't try for that location as it's pretty close to a number of houses in Dara Court.

Joe Public wrote: »

One of those big "M" signs would not go down well at this location especially with the workhouse graveyard directly across the road, Lidl had to keep their signs at ground level for the same reason.

There's a 12m high illuminated sign in their plans to be located in the corner opposite the graveyard.

Buffman

Planning permission for this refused according to the online system.

scheister

Buffman wrote: »

Planning permission for this refused according to the online system.

Wonder will they release the reason why it was refused

L1011

They have to. Docs usually take a day or two.

dobsdave

Could this be dead in the water, or is it one of things that they have to change something and re-apply I wonder.

Edit: I see that there are a few new files on the system from different departments looking for further info.