American football flyover?

J.pilkington

The last American football match in croke park 2 years ago featured a flyover from two 2 F16s. Anyone know if this will be repeated on Sat week?

It was very hush hush last time and not pre announced, I suppose to keep the gimpy protestors away so was indoors and missed it.

BonkeyDonker

The Aer Corps have been down around there as well the past few days as well.

Fattes

J.pilkington wrote: »

The last American football match in croke park 2 years ago featured a flyover from two 2 F16s. Anyone know if this will be repeated on Sat week?

It was very hush hush last time and not pre announced, I suppose to keep the gimpy protestors away so was indoors and missed it.

BC and Georgia tech dont have strong traditions of military fly over for their games, UCF who competed in the last game do.

Lots of factors at play, its not hush hush because of protesters, more scheduling. The F16 for the last game came from Germany with drop tanks, and a stop over in the UK.

Fingers crossed. Sadly I am out of country for it

Dardania

Fattes wrote: »

J.pilkington wrote: »

The last American football match in croke park 2 years ago featured a flyover from two 2 F16s. Anyone know if this will be repeated on Sat week?

It was very hush hush last time and not pre announced, I suppose to keep the gimpy protestors away so was indoors and missed it.

BC and Georgia tech dont have strong traditions of military fly over for their games, UCF who competed in the last game do.

Lots of factors at play, its not hush hush because of protesters, more scheduling. The F16 for the last game came from Germany with drop tanks, and a stop over in the UK.

Fingers crossed. Sadly I am out of country for it

That's some commitment to make - I know it's a great gesture, but who picks up the tab?

Fattes

Dardania wrote: »

That's some commitment to make - I know it's a great gesture, but who picks up the tab?

Nomrally the US Air force /Navy /Marines or whatever branch performs the fly over. US College football games and universities are seen as rich recruitment areas for the US Deference forces and it is all part of a marketing exercise for them

helimachoptor

there are F15s based @ RAF Lekenheath so they could make an appearance, not sure why they would come from Germany, long trip for a couple of seconds over a stadium

Fattes

helimachoptor wrote: »

there are F15s based @ RAF Lekenheath so they could make an appearance, not sure why they would come from Germany, long trip for a couple of seconds over a stadium

For the last game to F-16 came from Germany, Would be great to see Eagels over Dublin, especially with link to BC mascot. But we will have to see what Sat brings.

emo72

Last time I was in West Dublin and seen them streak south, and as they turned East to go home their engines faced me, sure enough a couple of seconds later the roar reached me. Amazing. Bring them back.

Gaoth Laidir

I hope they are not allowed into the country. Too much glorification of what are lethal weapons, albeit amazing feats of engineering. It's one thing if they were our own but it's totally another if they're from another country, here for a sporting event from another country (if you can call the American football circus a sporting event) and causing possible disruption to our airspace (I bet there'll be no GA city flyovers or Lambay transitions permitted during this time). Would we allow Russian fighter planes in, I wonder. I think not.

J.pilkington

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

bla bla off topic bla bla

Would we allow Russian fighter planes in, I wonder. I think not.

When is the Russian football match on?

Pat Dunne

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

I hope they are not allowed into the country. Too much glorification of what are lethal weapons, albeit amazing feats of engineering. It's one thing if they were our own but it's totally another if they're from another country, here for a sporting event from another country (if you can call the American football circus a sporting event) and causing possible disruption to our airspace (I bet there'll be no GA city flyovers or Lambay transitions permitted during this time). Would we allow Russian fighter planes in, I wonder. I think not.

BAH HUMBUG!

Fattes

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

I hope they are not allowed into the country. Too much glorification of what are lethal weapons, albeit amazing feats of engineering. It's one thing if they were our own but it's totally another if they're from another country, here for a sporting event from another country (if you can call the American football circus a sporting event) and causing possible disruption to our airspace (I bet there'll be no GA city flyovers or Lambay transitions permitted during this time). Would we allow Russian fighter planes in, I wonder. I think not.

Dear Helen Lovejoy, the fly over for the last game caused exactly Zero disturbance to Irish Airspace or regular flights, In fact the No fly zone around the Mach Loop in wales would cover most of their transit in and for the AVIVA, there would be no impact on Dublin Airport.

Fattes

Fattes wrote: »

Dear Helen Lovejoy, the fly over for the last game caused exactly Zero disturbance to Irish Airspace or regular flights, In fact the No fly zone around the Mach Loop in wales would cover most of their transit in and for the AVIVA, there would be no impact on Dublin Airport.

You might want to do a little bit of research into the flypast from two years ago,specifically the topic that discussed the flypast. You'll note they held north of Dublin airport and then flew south to the game. How exactly could that be done with no impact to Dublin ops ? I'm not saying there was much but zero and No impact is a stretch.

martinsvi

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

I hope they are not allowed into the country. Too much glorification of what are lethal weapons, albeit amazing feats of engineering. It's one thing if they were our own but it's totally another if they're from another country, here for a sporting event from another country (if you can call the American football circus a sporting event) and causing possible disruption to our airspace (I bet there'll be no GA city flyovers or Lambay transitions permitted during this time). Would we allow Russian fighter planes in, I wonder. I think not.

quite a bit of negativity there me thinks, but I'm sure there are a few New Yorkers who would rather see that "foreign" st Patricks day going with it's lethal drinking and abusive leprechaun impostors

I rather like when other cultures come visit me and I have no problem leaving my GA transit to another day. As for Russians - call me back when they regain culture worth seeing

martinsvi

the real question is, have USAF suspended their austerity measures? Two years ago any sort of displays were suspended due to budget cut-backs and the mentioned 2 F16 where just "transiting"

Fattes

Deleted User wrote: »

You might want to do a little bit of research into the flypast from two years ago,specifically the topic that discussed the flypast. You'll note they held north of Dublin airport and then flew south to the game. How exactly could that be done with no impact to Dublin ops ? I'm not saying there was much but zero and No impact is a stretch.

What abnormal impact do you think the flyover caused? Most of the West coast of England and Wales is restricted air space, their was a brief holding pattern for commercial flights holding Dublin on their approach. Nothing that you would not see on a normal day in Dublin for a host of reasons.

Tenger

The pair of F-16's that conducted the flyover had to get diplomatic approval prior to the game. This happened through a series a communications between the USAF and the Dept Foreign Affairs, then the IAA had to be involved.
The aircraft themselves flew from Germany and staged out of Lakenheath.
They flew across the Irish Sea and held off the coast,just north of DUB. This resulted in a short hold which on the day caused a couple of disgruntled queries from aircraft in the hold. DUB tower could not give any info over the frequency at the time.
Post flyover there was also quite a stir on social media and in the Irish online media the following day.So while the actual holding may have been similar to 'normal' there was actual a good deal of buildup to it. They didn't just decide to do it for the lols a week before hand.

Fattes wrote: »

Dear Helen Lovejoy, the fly over for the last game caused exactly Zero disturbance to Irish Airspace or regular flights, In fact the No fly zone around the Mach Loop in wales would cover most of their transit in and for the AVIVA, there would be no impact on Dublin Airport.

Deleted User wrote: »

You might want to do a little bit of research into the flypast from two years ago,specifically the topic that discussed the flypast. You'll note they held north of Dublin airport and then flew south to the game. How exactly could that be done with no impact to Dublin ops ? I'm not saying there was much but zero and No impact is a stretch.

GVHOT never stated "abnormal impact", merely contradicted the "exactly Zero disturbance" claim.

Fattes

Tenger wrote: »

The pair of F-16's that conducted the flyover had to get diplomatic approval prior to the game. This happened through a series a communications between the USAF and the Dept Foreign Affairs, then the IAA had to be involved.
The aircraft themselves flew from Germany and staged out of Lakenheath.
They flew across the Irish Sea and held off the coast,just north of DUB. This resulted in a short hold which on the day caused a couple of disgruntled queries from aircraft in the hold. DUB tower could not give any info over the frequency at the time.
Post flyover there was also quite a stir on social media and in the Irish online media the following day.So while the actual holding may have been similar to 'normal' there was actual a good deal of buildup to it. They didn't just decide to do it for the lols a week before hand.


GVHOT never stated "abnormal impact", merely contradicted the "exactly Zero disturbance" claim.

Let me know how many flights were 10min or more delayed that day, due to the fly past.

Unbelievable pedantic nonsense trying to claim they disrupt or impact operations at Dublin.

Tenger

Fattes wrote: »

Let me know how many flights were 10min or more delayed that day, due to the fly past.

Unbelievable pedantic nonsense trying to claim they disrupt or impact operations at Dublin.

No one here has claimed 10 mins or more delayed.
Please quote the post that stated that.

GVHOT merely pointed out that there was not "zero disturbance", I support this point.
Dont make up stuff just to argue against it.



But on the day there was a pause to arrivals of 4-5 minutes (Im trying to remember here, as I was listening to the ATC feed from home at the time) During this hold at least 2 aircraft were querying the reason as it was a clear day with no departures at the time. Thus aircraft trying to land were puzzled as to the reason for the hold.
1 UK accented flight crew member was getting a little unhappy over the air with DUB ATC. (cant remember which airline it was so cant be badmouthing anyone)
As I said it was no more than a 4-5 minute hold north of Dublin before arrivals were flowing again. Any aircraft further out wouldn't have noticed anything. I dont have any information on grounds ops.

Fattes

Fattes wrote: »

Let me know how many flights were 10min or more delayed that day, due to the fly past.

Unbelievable pedantic nonsense trying to claim they disrupt or impact operations at Dublin.

Apologies you're right, cancelling non jets north and south, stopping approaches prior to the run in and during it, having no VFR in the zone, not being able to have IFR arrivals to either baldonnel or Weston during this period, stopping departures. Sorry you're right whatever was I thinking about when I thought it had an impact on operations at Dublin and causing some delays.

Fattes

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

and causing possible disruption to our airspace .

This farcical claim of disruption.

The reality is normal every day events in Irish or any airspace cause more disruption. A fly over has zero impact,as every day there are events that cause hold patterns or delays.

Zero impact on normal every day air traffic. Zero net effect compared to the day before or the day after. Just normal ATC operations be it an emergency flight being given priority, a vip transport or military flight transiting airspace, Go arounds, emergency landings or a rescue craft. These things in any combination happen every average day.

So fly past cause absolutely no disruption, compared to standard everyday occurrences

Dardania

The root issue with the poster seems to be more the supply of military might, in my opinion - disruption is a secondary I hazard.

Gaoth Laidir

Dear Pilko and Fattes

Do you think the Aer Corps (such as it is) would be allowed fly over say Gaelic Park in New York for a GAA match? No, I didn't think so. I have an opinion different to yours, respect it and cut out the attitude please.

Gaoth Laidir

Fattes wrote: »

This farcical claim of disruption.

The reality is normal every day events in Irish or any airspace cause more disruption. A fly over has zero impact,as every day there are events that cause hold patterns or delays.

Zero impact on normal every day air traffic. Zero net effect compared to the day before or the day after. Just normal ATC operations be it an emergency flight being given priority, a vip transport or military flight transiting airspace, Go arounds, emergency landings or a rescue craft. These things in any combination happen every average day.

So fly past cause absolutely no disruption, compared to standard everyday occurrences

These are unforseen incidents/emergencies so delays are unfortunate but necessary for safety. Allowing the USAF cause a similar disruption just because there's a ball game on and they want to show their muscle to recruit is a totally different and unnecessary disruption.

Triboro

Is it a sell out?
Was at the last one in croker and had a great day out.The flyover is very impressive in fairness so fingers crossed for another one.

Pat Dunne

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Dear Pilko and Fattes

Do you think the Aer Corps (such as it is) would be allowed fly over say Gaelic Park in New York for a GAA match? No, I didn't think so. I have an opinion different to yours, respect it and cut out the attitude please.

I actually fail see the point to your arguement. Can I ask if you are Anti-American or just simply against small disruptions to ATC?

As a recently as this month the airforces of both Britain and Italy displayed at the Bray Airshow, without a murmur of dissent.

In fairness the Irish Navy visit overseas ports on a regular basis promoting Ireland and I have yet to encounter complaints against them for doing so.

I also recall the Silver Swallows (Air Corp Fouga Display Team) partaking in Airshows in the UK in the early 90's also receiving an award for their display routines. The Irish Air Corp displayed at a number of events in Northern Ireland this year alone and have been regular visitors aborad over the years.

Also the Army School of Equitation partake in many international Showjumping events, heightening awarness of both Ireland and the Irish Equine Industry.

The Irish Defence Forces do partake in visits abroad to display their wares and promoting Ireland. Do you have a difficulty with this as well?

Gaoth Laidir

Pat Dunne wrote: »

I actually fail see the point to your arguement. Can I ask if you are Anti-American or just simply against small disruptions to ATC?

As a recently as this month the airforces of both Britain and Italy displayed at the Bray Airshow, without a murmur of dissent.

In fairness the Irish Navy visit overseas ports on a regular basis promoting Ireland and I have yet to encounter hear complaints against them doing so.

I also recall the Silver Swallows (Air Corp Fouga Display Team) partaking in Airshows in the UK in the early 90's also receiving an award for their display routines. The Irish Air Corp displayed at a number of events in Northern Ireland this year alone and have been regular visitors aborad over the years.

Also the Army School of Equitation partake in many international Showjumping events, heightening awarness of both Ireland and the Irish Equine Industry.

So it is a little unfair to say that the Irish Defence Forces do no partake in visits abroad to display their wares and promoting Ireland.

Am I anti-American? What sort of question is that?

As it happens I'm against all displays of military weaponry for the purpose of public entertainment. That includes at airshows. Your attempt at a comparison of the Aer Corps overseas promoting Ireland is different to the USAF in Ireland promoting itself in order to recruit. Not the same at all, but I still disagree with both.

Fattes

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

These are unforseen incidents/emergencies so delays are unfortunate but necessary for safety. Allowing the USAF cause a similar disruption just because there's a ball game on and they want to show their muscle to recruit is a totally different and unnecessary disruption.

Our Naval cadets performed a guard of Honour at JFK's funeral, so it would not be unheard of.

This is the aviation, not politics forum.

But over 70 nations military aircraft enter Irish airspace every year causing flight chganges or changes, many events in Ireland have no fly zones creating airspace management issues. It's an everyday realty

Gaoth Laidir

Fattes wrote: »

Our Naval cadets performed a guard of Honour at JFK's funeral, so it would not be unheard of.

This is the aviation, not politics forum.

But over 70 nations military aircraft enter Irish airspace every year causing flight chganges or changes, many events in Ireland have no fly zones creating airspace management issues. It's an everyday realty

I never mentioned politics so I don't know where you got that from. I think you're trivialising what is a disruption over a capital city in favour of bigging up other TRAs (e.g. Electric Picnic, Slane, etc.?) in less congested airspace.

Pat Dunne

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Am I anti-American? What sort of question is that?

As it happens I'm against all displays of military weaponry for the purpose of public entertainment. That includes at airshows. Your attempt at a comparison of the Aer Corps overseas promoting Ireland is different to the USAF in Ireland promoting itself in order to recruit. Not the same at all, but I still disagree with both.

It was a direct question to assertain what your real position is?

I would also remind you that this is a Aviation & Aircraft forum and not a political or current affairs forum.

Also please take a leaf from your own book and respect the views and opinions of the other poster's on this topic.

Pat Dunne

Fattes wrote: »

Our Naval cadets performed a guard of Honour at JFK's funeral, so it would not be unheard of.

Could I just clarify that it was members of the 37th Cadet Class from the Military College in the Curragh, who formed the Guard of Honour at JFK's grave side.

BoJack Horseman

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

I'm against all displays of military weaponry for the purpose of public entertainment

Good for you oh noble one, luckily though you don't get to decide such things!

Fattes

You have given multiple opinions on militarisation, political influence and a number of derogatory comments re US.military policy & complained about military displays.

You keep mentioning disruption, it normal every day traffic. All of Irish airspace is pretty much restricted. and the airspace over Dublin is nothing anyone would call congested or overcrowded.

As explained repeatedly any US military aircraft flying over Dublin will be in Irish airspace for a tiny window and only cross regular commercial flight paths for less than a minute or two.
The visit of Francois Hollande a few weeks back probably caused more disruption than an F16 flyover do you object to the French Military enter our airspace with 5 aircraft for the visit of one person? Or their Airbus 300 that was at Shannon & Dublin this week

Fattes

Pat Dunne wrote: »

Could I just clarify that it was members of the 37th Cadet Class from the Military College in the Curragh, who formed the Guard of Honour at JFK's grave side.

Apologies Pat, my error. Thanks for the correction, don't know why I thought it was a naval Cadet class

Gaoth Laidir

Pat and Fattes, I completely disagree with your last comments but I will not become engaged in an argument with you. It seems only one opinion is allowed on here so I'll leave it at that.

Gaoth Laidir

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Good for you oh noble one, luckily though you don't get to decide such things!

My opinion is as valid as yours. The thread is about a military flyover. I commented on military flyovers. Since then it snowballed personal against me. Whatever, no skin off my nose, flyover or not. I just think it'd be funny if it's OVC003 on the day... ;-)

Pat Dunne

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

My opinion is as valid as yours. The thread is about a military flyover. I commented on military flyovers. Since then it snowballed personal against me. Whatever, no skin off my nose, flyover or not. I just think it'd be funny if it's OVC003 on the day... ;-)

Genuinely what did expect when you come on to an aviation & aircraft forum objecting to the potential of some very unusual aircraft over flying our city. For us "Airhead's" to lie down and say nothing.

Gaoth Laidir

Pat Dunne wrote: »

Genuinely what did expect when you come on to an aviation & aircraft forum objecting to the potential of some very unusual aircraft over flying our city. For us "Airhead's" to lie down and say nothing.

Of course not, but I didn't expect a hissy fit either. As I said, these are amazing technological masterpieces, and I admire that, but I just voiced my opinion that I'd rather they didn't display. I didn't see anything in the charter stating that differences in opinion are not allowed. I won't be there with a Father Ted placard objecting if it does go ahead or anything.

prinzeugen

Not going to happen. It was planned for the Navy game a few years back and was included in the timings for the day but there was some issues with a holding pattern or something.

I have the timings for the game on the 3rd and there is no mention of a fly past.

tricky D

Cmod note: some problem posters here and on other threads need to dial it right down or face curtailment of their posting privileges.

Do not respond on thread to this message. Back on topic and play nice.

Pat Dunne

prinzeugen wrote: »

Not going to happen. It was planned for the Navy game a few years back and was included in the timings for the day but there was some issues with a holding pattern or something.

I have the timings for the game on the 3rd and there is no mention of a fly past.

Following on from the Air Corp activity over South Dublin City Centre earlier this week my money is on a 4 PC-9 formation fly by.

Blut2

Pat Dunne wrote: »

Following on from the Air Corp activity over South Dublin City Centre earlier this week my money is on a 4 PC-9 formation fly by.

That would make a lot of sense. I was wondering what they were up to.

Not quite as impressive as F16s, though.

prinzeugen

Pat Dunne wrote: »

Following on from the Air Corp activity over South Dublin City Centre earlier this week my money is on a 4 PC-9 formation fly by.

Most likely if there was to be a fly over. Won't be USAF anyway. Should get updated stuff around Wed so will keep you all posted.

billie1b

Tenger wrote: »

No one here has claimed 10 mins or more delayed.
Please quote the post that stated that.

GVHOT merely pointed out that there was not "zero disturbance", I support this point.
Dont make up stuff just to argue against it.



But on the day there was a pause to arrivals of 4-5 minutes (Im trying to remember here, as I was listening to the ATC feed from home at the time) During this hold at least 2 aircraft were querying the reason as it was a clear day with no departures at the time. Thus aircraft trying to land were puzzled as to the reason for the hold.
1 UK accented flight crew member was getting a little unhappy over the air with DUB ATC. (cant remember which airline it was so cant be badmouthing anyone)
As I said it was no more than a 4-5 minute hold north of Dublin before arrivals were flowing again. Any aircraft further out wouldn't have noticed anything. I dont have any information on grounds ops.

The one giving out was a British Airways pilot, he was querying why he had to hold as he had not seen anything on the NOTAM's and didn't have extra fuel on board. I remember the controller telling him there was a fly past for an event happening in the city and it would be no more than a couple of minutes but he was still have a go about it.

TheFitz13

They're parachuting the ball into the stadium... I'm predicting it's gonna land in the DART stadium ðŸ˜႒

Pat Dunne

TheFitz13 wrote: »

They're parachuting the ball into the stadium... I'm predicting it's gonna land in the DART stadium ðŸ˜႒

The Irish Defence Focres parachute team, the Black Knighs are a multi award winning team at both national and international level. They rank amongst the elite military parachute teams globally.

Tenger

TheFitz13 wrote: »

They're parachuting the ball into the stadium... I'm predicting it's gonna land in the DART stadium

If I remember correctly, that was a very windy day and the jumper was unfamiliar with the area. Poor guy.

Edit, sorry, forgot to mention the guy who nailed his landing. I felt sorry for the other guy who sort of got forgotten about by the media...the avgeeks didnt though.

Triboro

Tenger wrote: »

If I remember correctly, that was a very windy day and the jumper was unfamiliar with the area. Poor guy.

There was two jumpers that day and the other guy nailed his landing,so dont know what happened the dartman!

MoyVilla9

So, no fly-overs?

TheCockpitGuy

MoyVilla9 wrote: »

So, no fly-overs?

So, no fly-overs!

Tenger

I suspect we may see the Air Corps pass over Croker at half time