All Ireland SFC SF: Dublin v Kerry, 28th August 2016 - Mod Note Post #1

BonnieSituation

So with just under a week to go it's probably high time we got this motoring!

Eh, also, No discussions about turnstiles in here. That's for the information thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057637686

Mod Note: No player abuse, manager abuse or personal abuse of other posters. Generally using words like thug, s**mbag etc. is a sure fire way to get carded/banned.
Please report any trolling/abusive posts.

passremarkable

Are rumours true?
Lyne to man mark Fenton? Moran centre forward?
Sheehan in goals for second half

BonnieSituation

passremarkable wrote: »

Are rumours true?
Lyne to man mark Fenton? Moran centre forward?
Sheehan in goals for second half

That latter one has to be bollox.

jive

Fancy Kerry by 3 myself. The bookies say Dublin by 3 and given what we've seen so far rightfully so. I always live by the mantra 'you don't get rich backing against Kilkenny and Kerry'.

I think Dublin will miss the McCaffrey and O'Carroll, probably the first time the Dubs will have to defend this year! Crowley did a number on Connelly last time they met and no reason he can't repeat that. If Kerry can keep Brogan quiet then they will be there or thereabouts.

Hoping for a cracker regardless of who wins. From what we've seen of Mayo you'd have to fancy whoever wins this to take it all the way.

Stoner

He was extremely lucky to stay on the pitch after the number he did on Small, the frees he gave away on Kilkenny and then the Barney with McCarthy.
He's s big player for Kerry, my thinking is he'll play it very close to the line and he'll be stretched/ spread around a lot again.

Connelly had a brilliant second half against Kerry in the final last year, there's plenty of reasons why Crowley can't mark Connelly, just like McMahon might not outscore Gooch this time.
Kerry will again have to contain Andrews and McManamon, two guys they struggle with regularly. Then there's Kilkenny going well too. Like Dublin kerry have more than two opposing forwards to be concerned about imo.
Kerry also have to worry about the attacks from the Small, McMahon and J Cooper, usually worth a few points

Mr. Incognito

The Sheehan rumour is bollox and already dismissed by Fitzmaurice

http://www.hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=259735

I don't buy that Dublin are weaker. They have a panel that is just as good as the lads that are gone.

Kerry have a chance in this, they have solid forwards. There is no point comparing this game to 2011 or 2013 because the Kerry team is drastically changed.

Dublin are going to do what Dublin always do, run the ball. Turn it over, attack on masse with runners on the shoulder. Kerry are going to play the ball into space and rely on their forwards to get there first.

This game is going to come down to tactics. Fitzmaurice is a great manager but has been too loyal to the likes of Gooch and Donaghy and Marc O Se and O Mahony when they go missing in the last quarter. O Mahony was dead on his feet in the League final and was sent off for pulling his man down out of exhaustion I suspect.

Kerry have lethal forwards. They will get scores. Dublin have good forwards and usually enjoy good supply of ball.

Midfield is irrelevant because Cluxton kicks short or to the free man.

Kerry will obviously target Cluxtons kick outs and the Kerry half back line will be pushing up to man mark on the kick outs. This leaves them vulnerable and out of position of the ball is transitioned quickly inside.

To my mind Griffin at full back is Key for Kerry- he simply has to have a good game. He's been in training wheels long enough- he can get caught out of position but he was immense for the first half in the league final and we leaked the goals when he went off.

The other thing that is vital to Kerry winning is to stop the quick transition to allow the defenders to get back. I hate to say it but the only way to do this is to tactically foul out the field. We saw Kerry do this against Tipp and it worked for them.

For Dublin, it's a sweeper if Donaghy plays inside, which he wont. It'll be Geaney and JOD as a two man full forward line, Gooch roaming, O Brien and Walsh doing all the running and hard graft and probably Darren O Sullivan to carry the ball through the first cover.

Dublin will do what they always do, it's not rocket science, run with ball in hand and leave it off to the man on the run or in space.

I'm actually putting money on the draw.

Tombo2001

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

The Sheehan rumour is bollox and already dismissed by Fitzmaurice

....

I'm actually putting money on the draw.

Great analysis, cheers.

Stoner

Mr. Incognito wrote:

I don't buy that Dublin are weaker. They have a panel that is just as good as the lads that are gone.

Rory O' Carroll at 21 had Donaghy addressed. He's recognised as the best if not the best full back in the country. Some might argue that McGee is better.

McCaffery is also a fantastic footballer, footballer of the year last year, both those guys are all-stars and would walk back onto the Dublin team and any team in the country.

Johnny Cooper and John Small are doing ok so far, but ROC is a proven number 3.

Of coarse Dublin miss these players to suggest a team would not miss the current footballer of the year is not realistic imo.

Kerry could well beat Dublin by exposing ROCs departure.

Also how that Kerry half-forward line being lethal and relegates Kilkenny, Connelly and Flying down a notch to just good is a surprise to me.

As for Brogan he was the top scorer from play last year. I don't think any of Kerry's forwards made the top ten. I'm open to correction.
There are some fine kerry forwards, both teams have had players that have performed against each other. I doubt many kerry supporters consider McManamon much less than lethal , the players were on red alert against him recently anyway.

Gooch has a lot to prove , it worries me, however in 2013 he was left in Brennan for too long. Cian O'Sullivan and McMahon have done very good jobs on him since.

I worry about JOD alright he can most certainly be lethal.

But all joking aside, it's now about 5 years of listening to how good and superior Kerry's forwards are to Dublins, maybe the suggestion is that Kerry have inferior defenders.

I'll take good old Brogan, Andrews, Connelly , Kilkenny, Mannion, McManamon and Flynn, hopefully they'll be good enough again

Dublin have come up against these lads before. The game last year was very tactical, the matchups went our way, I doubt it will be like that the next day, but Dublin have a different way to play Donegal, Mayo and Kerry it just so happens that both teams like to give it a go.
The reason it might look like the same style again is that it works, the little twist last year was McMahon on Gooch, but it was a twist. Kerry might have to abandon that policy against Dublin now, if they don't and win it will be a great achievement. I'm looking forward to this one. I think kerry owe us one alright but hopefully not just yet.

Mr. Incognito

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/darragh-%C3%B3-s%C3%A9-time-for-desperate-kerry-to-cast-off-dublin-yoke-1.2766041

Cracking read today.

quad_red

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/darragh-%C3%B3-s%C3%A9-time-for-desperate-kerry-to-cast-off-dublin-yoke-1.2766041

Cracking read today.

Rumours get around like lightning, especially in Kerry. There’s a man who runs Larkin’s pub in Milltown called Mike McCarthy – rumours go into that pub as boys and come out as men.

jive

Stoner wrote: »

Rory O' Carroll at 21 had Donaghy addressed. He's recognised as the best if not the best full back in the country. Some might argue that McGee is better.

McCaffery is also a fantastic footballer, footballer of the year last year, both those guys are all-stars and would walk back onto the Dublin team and any team in the country.

Johnny Cooper and John Small are doing ok so far, but ROC is a proven number 3.

Of coarse Dublin miss these players to suggest a team would not miss the current footballer of the year is not realistic imo.

Yeah them 2 players will definitely be missed when push comes to shove IMO. Not to say Dublin's backline isn't excellent because it is, arguably still the best in the country, but you can't lose 2 of the best backs in the game and not miss them even if you do have a great panel. I think because Dublin have blown away every team so far at a canter that the 'weakness' (if you could really call it that) hasn't been exposed yet.

BonnieSituation

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/darragh-%C3%B3-s%C3%A9-time-for-desperate-kerry-to-cast-off-dublin-yoke-1.2766041

Cracking read today.

Good jesus:
All that said and done, I think Kerry will win. I know I always go for Kerry in these matches and maybe that’s just me being a fine, thick Kerryman. I accept that as an argument.

---

Same column as every week.

Fr Tod Umptious

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Good jesus:
All that said and done, I think Kerry will win. I know I always go for Kerry in these matches and maybe that’s just me being a fine, thick Kerryman. I accept that as an argument.

---

Same column as every week.

Is there a story about traveling somewhere in the car with Paudi in it ?, there is every week.

BonnieSituation

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Is there a story about traveling somewhere in the car with Paudi in it ?, there is every week.

Bingo.

He actually rehashed a story from a few months back that he used re Cork being okay with losing were he wanted to bust Paidi open.

quad_red

However close some of the recent scores have been, you always got the feeling that if it had gone on for another 5 mins Dublin would have put another 10 points on.

A tight game up to 55 mins then Dublin to remorselessly pull away. Kerry then go down a man in frustration and finish out the game on the ropes.

Again.

BonnieSituation

quad_red wrote: »

However close some of the recent scores have been, you always got the feeling that if it had gone on for another 5 mins Dublin would have put another 10 points on.

A tight game up to 55 mins then Dublin to remorselessly pull away. Kerry then go down a man in frustration and finish out the game on the ropes.

Again.

Cmere. We won by 7 in 2013 and apparently it flattered us and because the scores were taken in the dying moments they didn't count.

corny

Stoner wrote: »

Johnny Cooper and John Small are doing ok so far, but ROC is a proven number 3.

Come on Stoner. Ok? Small and Byrne have excellent so far. Who's to say they won't cement their own reputations in the games ahead.

Anyway, you can only say X and Y are missed if the performance level in the backs drops. So far it hasn't.

BonnieSituation

corny wrote: »

Come on Stoner. Ok? Small and Byrne have excellent so far. Who's to say they won't cement their own reputations in the games ahead.

Anyway, you can only say X and Y are missed if the performance level in the backs drops. So far it hasn't.

Stoner has been spending so much time in the long grass that it's hard for him to be biased for us.

DoctaDee

I'll go out on a limb here and say that John Small has offered every bit as much in his general play as Jack Mc - he just needs to capitalise more on his scoring threat ... the pace of McCaffrey is what sets him apart.

Jimmy Two Times

DoctaDee wrote: »

I'll go out on a limb here and say that John Small has offered every bit as much in his general play as Jack Mc - he just needs to capitalise more on his scoring threat ... the pace of McCaffrey is what sets him apart.

Agree, and is probably a better defender. Just needs to get the head up when he goes forward. Getts bottled up too easily but as good a replacement as we could have hoped for.

corny

DoctaDee wrote: »

I'll go out on a limb here and say that John Small has offered every bit as much in his general play as Jack Mc - he just needs to capitalise more on his scoring threat ... the pace of McCaffrey is what sets him apart.

Yeah i agree with that. I also think its only a matter of time before he adds the scoring to his game. For me, its always been about confidence with Small. He was unsure of himself at the start of the year and gradually you can see that changing.

Byrne too has own strengths. He's the best marker on the panel imo. I'd put him on O' Donoghue if i was Gavin.

Tombo2001

A deciding factor, if Dublin are to lose, could be whether they can keep 15 men on the pitch.

The two games where Dublin have been really pushed in the past two years - last year against Mayo, this year against Donegal - they have had at least one player sent off.

Mr. Incognito

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Cmere. We won by 7 in 2013 and apparently it flattered us and because the scores were taken in the dying moments they didn't count.

2013 was the best game of football I've ever been at bar none and I've been going to Croke Park for twenty years for all the Kerry games.

The standard of football from both sides- the scoring- the goals, the tackles were ferioucious.

Even though we lost I was privileged to have been to such a game.

I felt 2011 we left behind us. 2013 we were beaten by the better team. T O Se burst a lung making a break when Kerry were up shooting narrowly wide. Cluxton picked out his man and Kevin McManamon finished with a sumptous shot. That put Dublin two points up with five minutes left and they kicked on from there.

Kerry were the better team in the first half. Dublin pulled away at the end.

Anyone thinking that was a run-away Dublin win either wasnt there or knows nothing about football. Sadly, as with all counties there are a lot of supporters that suddenly come out of the woodwork and become experts in September but for pure football this game is up there for me.

BonnieSituation

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

2013 was the best game of football I've ever been at bar none and I've been going to Croke Park for twenty years for all the Kerry games.

The standard of football from both sides- the scoring- the goals, the tackles were ferioucious.

Even though we lost I was privileged to have been to such a game.

I felt 2011 we left behind us. 2013 we were beaten by the better team. T O Se burst a lung making a break when Kerry were up shooting narrowly wide. Cluxton picked out his man and Kevin McManamon finished with a sumptous shot. That put Dublin two points up with five minutes left and they kicked on from there.

Kerry were the better team in the first half. Dublin pulled away at the end.

Anyone thinking that was a run-away Dublin win either wasnt there or knows nothing about football. Sadly, as with all counties there are a lot of supporters that suddenly come out of the woodwork and become experts in September but for pure football this game is up there for me.

Yup that's me. I never ever talk about GAA at any other part of the year. :rolleyes:

---

Listen, you can calculate the lead anyway you wish and the significance of it when KMac scored, but leaving Croke Park that day I was disgusted at the concession of 3 goals in the manner in which they were given and as a result I don't view this as the classic it's played out in some circles. Still nothing comes near 2006 SF for me. Or possibly the 2011 final for the tension of it all.

We were worth the 7 points. End of. Ye didn't score an ounce for 1/7th of the match from when Darran score in the 62/63 min.

I think that every victory we have over ye of any significance since 2009 (2011, 2013, 2015, 2016 League Final) has an excuse or a sob story or a justification for how ye lost.

danganabu

BonnieSituation wrote: »

I think that every victory we have over ye of any significance since 2009 (2011, 2013, 2015, 2016 League Final) has an excuse or a sob story or a justification for how ye lost.

Tis a pity they can't all be as impartial and objective as your good self Bonnie

BonnieSituation

danganabu wrote: »

Tis a pity they can't all be as impartial and objective as your good self Bonnie

Cmere, I'm a martyr to the cause.

Kerry bleating winds me up so easily. AS I'm sure you've noticed.

skywanderer

Connolly will be sent to the stands within ten minutes and Kerry will cruise to victory by 4-5 points.

danganabu

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Cmere, I'm a martyr to the cause.

Kerry bleating winds me up so easily. AS I'm sure you've noticed.

The notion did cross my mind!

Past30Now

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Still nothing comes near 2006 SF for me.

While being unable to forget the finish to that match, I can remember very little of the detail. Other than the warm up and Ciaran McDonald, all I really recall is the sickening feeling in the pit of my stomach when we lost that match, and how that festered over the following three/four weeks hearing about how it was Mayo's big chance, and then got even worse when they'd blown the final within 15 minutes.

A complete sickener.

2011 I recall with joy. 2013 I loved every minute of it, but only when I watched the replay:D.

Mr. Incognito

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Yup that's me. I never ever talk about GAA at any other part of the year. :rolleyes:

---

Listen, you can calculate the lead anyway you wish and the significance of it when KMac scored, but leaving Croke Park that day I was disgusted at the concession of 3 goals in the manner in which they were given and as a result I don't view this as the classic it's played out in some circles. Still nothing comes near 2006 SF for me. Or possibly the 2011 final for the tension of it all.

We were worth the 7 points. End of. Ye didn't score an ounce for 1/7th of the match from when Darran score in the 62/63 min.

I think that every victory we have over ye of any significance since 2009 (2011, 2013, 2015, 2016 League Final) has an excuse or a sob story or a justification for how ye lost.

The League final? Lord above.

BonnieSituation

danganabu wrote: »

The notion did cross my mind!

Sharp as a tack for a Premier man (with a Faithful name )

BonnieSituation

Past30Now wrote: »

While being unable to forget the finish to that match, I can remember very little of the detail. Other than the warm up and Ciaran McDonald, all I really recall is the sickening feeling in the pit of my stomach when we lost that match, and how that festered over the following three/four weeks hearing about how it was Mayo's big chance, and then got even worse when they'd blown the final within 15 minutes.

A complete sickener.

2011 I recall with joy. 2013 I loved every minute of it, but only when I watched the replay:D.

That last 10 min of 2011 were the best and worst of my life. I hope I never have to live through that again. (McGregor getting wrapped up in the 3rd round on Sunday morning came close to the sick feeling)

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

The League final? Lord above.

Ye draw from the 2009 well enough, but I can't bring up the very relevant and most recent meeting between the two sides? Lord above is right.

Why doesn't the League final count as a crushing defeat?

The selectivity of some of the Kerry boardsies on here is off the wall.

danganabu

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Sharp as a tack for a Premier man (with a Faithful name )

Different Dangan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kildangan_GAA_(Tipperary)

DoctaDee

Jimmy Two Times wrote: »

Agree, and is probably a better defender. Just needs to get the head up when he goes forward. Getts bottled up too easily but as good a replacement as we could have hoped for.

This is true - Jack Mcs pace bails him out of defensive errors - Small is a better defender

corny wrote: »

Yeah i agree with that. I also think its only a matter of time before he adds the scoring to his game. For me, its always been about confidence with Small. He was unsure of himself at the start of the year and gradually you can see that changing.

Byrne too has own strengths. He's the best marker on the panel imo. I'd put him on O' Donoghue if i was Gavin.

Yeah it's been a rapid rise up the ranks for Small - particularly given he found it hard to break into Paul Currans BK team a few years ago. He by all accounts has readjusted his focus and that little bit of confidence has seen him to the fore this year.

Byrne found it quite difficult to settle in the senior set up when he was first brought into the training panel, but I suppose it just shows that all underage talent don't have the same learning curve in the senior game - mistakes in the back line tend to be amplified and it is very much a confidence thing being a strong defender - he's taken to the role very well.

It's remarkable at times how insulated the senior squad are to the goings on in the bigger world of planet GAA. I was chatting last year with one of the players and he was asking if the minors were still in the championship, also it was really strange that none of them had Fenton mapped as a talent prior to his introduction last year - "where da fack did this guy come from" were his exact words.

Past30Now wrote: »

While being unable to forget the finish to that match, I can remember very little of the detail. Other than the warm up and Ciaran McDonald, all I really recall is the sickening feeling in the pit of my stomach when we lost that match, and how that festered over the following three/four weeks hearing about how it was Mayo's big chance, and then got even worse when they'd blown the final within 15 minutes.

A complete sickener.

2011 I recall with joy. 2013 I loved every minute of it, but only when I watched the replay:D.

2006 was the worst result that I can remember a good deal ahead of the '92 final in 2nd place - we've had some terrible defeats to Kerry & Tyrone but they pale to insignificance

Stoner

corny wrote:

Come on Stoner. Ok? Small and Byrne have excellent so far. Who's to say they won't cement their own reputations in the games ahead.

Lol I'm not in the long grass. I've been fighting this fight about having better footballers for some time .

J Cooper has been very good. But he was here last year too. It's been his best season so far

Small was very good last year too.

My point was that imo we'd be better with ROC at Fullback. I don't think any of the lads have his skills WRT watching the square.

Alan Brogan is gone

However the pluses as you guys have pointed out in the main

Cooper playing at his best level yet
Mannion is back and looking very good. His confidence is up too
O'Gara is fit
Small better than last year
McCarthy better than last year
Byrne has been a saviour
Costello had looked good too and Kerry are a good match for him.

posturingpat

Stoner wrote: »

Lol I'm not in the long grass. I've been fighting this fight about having better footballers for some time .

J Cooper has been very good. But he was here last year too. It's been his best season so far

Small was very good last year too.

My point was that imo we'd be better with ROC at Fullback. I don't think any of the lads have his skills WRT watching the square.

Alan Brogan is gone

However the pluses as you guys have pointed out in the main

Cooper playing at his best level yet
Mannion is back and looking very good. His confidence is up too
O'Gara is fit
Small better than last year
McCarthy better than last year
Byrne has been a saviour
Costello had looked good too and Kerry are a good match for him.

Mc Carthy better than last year? Id disagree with that, been very good again but last year he was phenomenal, I would've had him close to player of the year last season.

Stoner

posturingpat wrote:

Mc Carthy better than last year? Id disagree with that, been very good again but last year he was phenomenal, I would've had him close to player of the year last season.

Ahh he is as flying this year imo. we've been saying it all year.

seligehgit

McCarthy has been absolutely flying this year pre injury.Dublin's stand out player in the league this year IMO.

BonnieSituation

seligehgit wrote: »

McCarthy has been absolutely flying this year pre injury.Dublin's stand out player in the league this year IMO.

But sure, the league doesn't count,

50HX

v v close one to call

form obviously says dublin

v unusual that things are so quiet in kerry... i would be wary of that

2 things to add

cooper to be found out at full back by Geaney...he is a great defender but not a full back

all the tactics and formations allegedly being tried by kerry can't replicate games

unless there is something completley off the wall brought by kerry you would have to say it's the dubs to win, paddypower is a bit jittery on it though

either way we will all be experts by 5pm sunday

BonnieSituation

50HX wrote: »

v v close one to call

form obviously says dublin

v unusual that things are so quiet in kerry... i would be wary of that

When is it never not quiet in Kerry?

Grass is at its longest in August in the south west.

GAAman

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DmYLrxR0Y8

BonnieSituation

Jaysus, is Mickey Ned on a WUM here?

Absolute incoherent gibberish with absolutely no basis in reality:

Mickey Ned wrote:

“The hype about Dublin has been enormous. It’s almost impossible for management to prevent this from seeping through,” he said.



“Kerry on the other hand are benefitting from coming under the radar.”

http://m.rte.ie/sport/gaa/football/2016/0825/811969-osullivan-strong-finish-can-see-kerry-home/

corny

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Jaysus, is Mickey Ned on a WUM here?

Absolute incoherent gibberish with absolutely no basis in reality:




http://m.rte.ie/sport/gaa/football/2016/0825/811969-osullivan-strong-finish-can-see-kerry-home/

Its been nauseating listening to past Kerry players this week. Liston, D O' Shea, O' Sullivan, they're all at it.

Liston was the worst. Apparently no one does 'hunger' like Kerry.

PaddyWilliams

corny wrote: »

Its been nauseating listening to past Kerry players this week. Liston, D O' Shea, O' Sullivan, they're all at it.

Liston was the worst. Apparently no one does 'hunger' like Kerry.

Well, if you were to go on All Ireland's won, Kerry would seem to have had more hunger than other teams.

DoctaDee

corny wrote: »

Its been nauseating listening to past Kerry players this week. Liston, D O' Shea, O' Sullivan, they're all at it.

Apparently no one does 'hunger' like Kerry.

A right toe curler for anyone interested

MaxPower89

corny wrote: »

Its been nauseating listening to past Kerry players this week. Liston, D O' Shea, O' Sullivan, they're all at it.

Liston was the worst. Apparently no one does 'hunger' like Kerry.

What did O'Sullivan say that was so nauseating?

I can't understand why ye are harping on about it so much. Its non stop complaining about so and so said this and that.

PaddyWilliams

The Dubs are taking what us Kerry men are saying very much to heart. Why bother sure? It's only words on paper.

Sure back in 2009 against Cork, it was worse. According to some, had we lost that final, none of the previous 30+ would have mattered.

They're casting their line out and catching some serious fish!

BonnieSituation

DoctaDee wrote: »

A right toe curler for anyone interested

Good Jesus that was gash.

Did the 11 point skinning in the League final not happen or something?

The more of this shoite I read the more joyous a win will be.

corny

MaxPower89 wrote: »

What did O'Sullivan say that was so nauseating?

I can't understand why ye are harping on about it so much. Its non stop complaining about so and so said this and that.

First time I've mentioned it and I was responding to the poster above.

What did he say? You'd get more coherent analysis from a lad in the pub with 8 pints on him. Won't take up much of my day thinking about it now but just thought I'd call bull****.

Floppybits

All this pre-match talk is a load of bull. It is just the media looking to fill up either air space or paper space. Liston, D O'Shea, O'Sullivan have no more an idea of what is going to happen on Sunday than the man on moon. Anyone who takes it seriously needs to have their head examined.