All Ireland SFC Semi-Final - Mayo v Tipperary, 21 August 15:30 - Mod note post #1

Fr Tod Umptious

Well with the hurling semi-finals over I think it’s time for a football semi-final thread, specifically Mayo v Tipperary

As a Mayo fan I always expected Mayo to be at this point this year, but as result of winning Connacht and the A side QF rather than the long B side route and beating Tyrone at the end.

I fully expect Mayo to win this, and without too much fuss either.

Perhaps Tipp may be a point or two up at half time but that’s the best they can expect.

Mayo are a far better team and have a far better squad depth, Tipp will not be able to match what Mayo can bring off the bench.

Tipp have done well, fair enough, but the only day they meet anyone of a quality similar to Mayo, Kerry in the Munster final, they were swept aside.

Mayo by a comfortable margin.

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Mushy

Tell us, how did mayo do v Galway and how did Tipp do v Galway?

Either way, the winner of the AI is coming from the other side of the draw anyway, it won't matter too much who wins this Sunday. Be some achievement if Tipp were to get there though.

Fr Tod Umptious

Yea good one, Mayo lost to Galway a full 9 weeks ago, that's extremely relevant, not a single thing has changed since.

And I don't care if you think that the AI winner is coming from the other side, it has nothing to do with this discussion.

Menoetius

Yeah the Galway game jumped straight into my head reading that too, but I've a feeling if Mayo were playing Galway now, with the stakes so high, we would see a different outcome.

I wouldn't write the winners of this one off either way. Let's not forget how many people were tipping Tyrone this year and Mayo took them out.

Would love to see Tipp do it, but can't see see anything but a Mayo win.
Will be delighted to eat my words next week

ultrapercy

Mayo's physicality and squad depth should be key. I don't see the 2 teams respective performances against Galway as a good indicator as Mayo are much fitter now and Galway seemed to set up very nievely against Tipp. The one thing I'm worried about is complacency, it's a cancer. Confidence is important and Mayo should be confident with their experience but they must be under no illusion about the job of work required. Tipp have some classy forwards and if they get a foothold in the match can cause serious problems. All things equally Mayo should win closing out in the last quater comfortably but it won't be a cake walk.

Mushy

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Yea good one, Mayo lost to Galway a full 9 weeks ago, that's extremely relevant, not a single thing has changed since.

And I don't care if you think that the AI winner is coming from the other side, it has nothing to do with this discussion.

I just don't see how a fan from Mayo should be so over confident going in to a semi final. Especially against a team who have put in some quality performances lately. Yeah Mayo should win, but I wouldn't be shouting about how easy it's going to be.

Fr Tod Umptious

Mushy wrote: »

I just don't see how a fan from Mayo should be so over confident going in to a semi final. Especially against a team who have put in some quality performances lately. Yeah Mayo should win, but I wouldn't be shouting about how easy it's going to be.

You see Mayo people are not allowed be confident.
They are accused of hype and arrogance if they are.

Tipp came 6th in Div 3 of the league.

A Mayo win should be straight forward end of.

Another poster mentioned complacency, I'd be very disappointed if complacency was part of this Mayo team at this stage in their careers.

Stoner

Menoetius wrote:

Yeah the Galway game jumped straight into my head reading that too, but I've a feeling if Mayo were playing Galway now, with the stakes so high, we would see a different outcome.

Yeah, Mayo had a safety net when they played Galway, Mayo for me have been well ahead of the teams around them for the past 4 years, even down to how lean some of the Mayo Lads are compared to say the Roscommon guys, I'm sure Roscommon will continue to improve etc. I'm talking now and the past few years .

I can't see anything but a Mayo win tbh. They are set up for it. Unless they don't take it seriously enough, imo it'll have to be a case one one side playing very well (again) and Mayo having am off day. I think it's one of those stats Iike if they played 10 times Mayo would win 8.

Mantis Toboggan

Mayo seem to be peaking at the right time. They've been flying in recent games. Tipp are in bonus territory having not got to this stage in 81 years. We've had a great year but let's call a spade a spade, Mayo are in a different league and they've some outstanding forwards.

Mushy

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Mushy wrote: »

I just don't see how a fan from Mayo should be so over confident going in to a semi final. Especially against a team who have put in some quality performances lately. Yeah Mayo should win, but I wouldn't be shouting about how easy it's going to be.

You see Mayo people are not allowed be confident.
They are accused of hype and arrogance if they are.

Tipp came 6th in Div 3 of the league.

A Mayo win should be straight forward end of.

Another poster mentioned complacency, I'd be very disappointed if complacency was part of this Mayo team at this stage in their careers.

I just wouldn't be arrogant in the face of a SF against a team in good form.

So game v Galway ain't relevant but league position is?

There's such a thing as cautious optimism, I'd at least understand that.

A boss of mine, a Galway man, explained how Galway players were at the races in the week up to the Tipp match. They were obviously confident too.

Expect a win, just don't come out and say it in a way that comes across as belittling to a team who have done very well this season.

flasher0030

Mushy wrote: »

I just wouldn't be arrogant in the face of a SF against a team in good form.

So game v Galway ain't relevant but league position is?

There's such a thing as cautious optimism, I'd at least understand that.

A boss of mine, a Galway man, explained how Galway players were at the races in the week up to the Tipp match. They were obviously confident too.

Expect a win, just don't come out and say it in a way that comes across as belittling to a team who have done very well this season.

What are they expected to do. Sit in their rooms meditating about winning mentalities. What's wrong with going to the races? Padraig Harrington was playing golf at the Olympics. Yet he was spotted attending a badminton match during his off time (I think it was badminton). Should he be reprimanded for that?

Mushy

flasher0030 wrote: »

Mushy wrote: »

I just wouldn't be arrogant in the face of a SF against a team in good form.

So game v Galway ain't relevant but league position is?

There's such a thing as cautious optimism, I'd at least understand that.

A boss of mine, a Galway man, explained how Galway players were at the races in the week up to the Tipp match. They were obviously confident too.

Expect a win, just don't come out and say it in a way that comes across as belittling to a team who have done very well this season.

What are they expected to do. Sit in their rooms meditating about winning mentalities. What's wrong with going to the races? Padraig Harrington was playing golf at the Olympics. Yet he was spotted attending a badminton match during his off time (I think it was badminton). Should he be reprimanded for that?

Big difference attending a different sport at an event you're participating in and heading out socialising for the craic (which is acceptable of course, but at least time it a bit better).

Only use tgat example cos I would've said Galway be somewhat favourites for it.

Fr Tod Umptious

Mushy wrote: »

I just wouldn't be arrogant in the face of a SF against a team in good form.

So game v Galway ain't relevant but league position is?

There's such a thing as cautious optimism, I'd at least understand that.

A boss of mine, a Galway man, explained how Galway players were at the races in the week up to the Tipp match. They were obviously confident too.

Expect a win, just don't come out and say it in a way that comes across as belittling to a team who have done very well this season.

Yes league form is more important than the Galway game.

Mayo have been a Div 1 team for years and I have no idea when Tipp may have been in 2 let alone 1.

Mayo have been a top 4 team for 6 years, 6th SF in a row, Tipp have not been at this level since the 30s.

Tipp are only in this position because they had the good fortune to meet Galway in the QF.

I'm not disrespecting them either, they have done well this yrar , but Mayo will be a very different animal.

As for Galway being at the races being an excuse, well that's complacency if I ever heard it.

Mushy

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Mushy wrote: »

I just wouldn't be arrogant in the face of a SF against a team in good form.

So game v Galway ain't relevant but league position is?

There's such a thing as cautious optimism, I'd at least understand that.

A boss of mine, a Galway man, explained how Galway players were at the races in the week up to the Tipp match. They were obviously confident too.

Expect a win, just don't come out and say it in a way that comes across as belittling to a team who have done very well this season.

Yes league form is more important than the Galway game.

Mayo have been a Div 1 team for years and I have no idea when Tipp may have been in 2 let alone 1.

Mayo have been a top 4 team for 6 years, 6th SF in a row, Tipp have not been at this level since the 30s.

Tipp are only in this position because they had the good fortune to meet Galway in the QF.

I'm not disrespecting them either, they have done well this yrar , but Mayo will be a very different animal.

As for Galway being at the races being an excuse, well that's complacency if I ever heard it.

I dunno, the first post came across as somewhat arrogant ("perhaps tipp may be up by 1 or 2 at HT"), that's all I've issue with. You can say a team will win easy without saying stuff like "Tipp are only in this position cos they had the good fortune to come up against Galway in the QF", totally ignoring a very good win v Cork and another hard fought win v Derry.

Uncle Ben

Sorry for butting into this thread, but has anyone any ideas why the Dublin v Kerry game have not got any tickets released to the general public via tickets.ie etc? Thanks.

Menoetius

Uncle Ben wrote: »

Sorry for butting into this thread, but has anyone any ideas why the Dublin v Kerry game have not got any tickets released to the general public via tickets.ie etc? Thanks.

I'd say they are looking after clubs and season ticket holders first, then release the rest to the public, as is right.

I'm sorted inanyways

Fr Tod Umptious

Mushy wrote: »

I dunno, the first post came across as somewhat arrogant ("perhaps tipp may be up by 1 or 2 at HT"), that's all I've issue with. You can say a team will win easy without saying stuff like "Tipp are only in this position cos they had the good fortune to come up against Galway in the QF", totally ignoring a very good win v Cork and another hard fought win v Derry.

Had they meet Tyrone, Dublin or Kerry in a QF that would be the end of their season.

Mushy

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Mushy wrote: »

I dunno, the first post came across as somewhat arrogant ("perhaps tipp may be up by 1 or 2 at HT"), that's all I've issue with. You can say a team will win easy without saying stuff like "Tipp are only in this position cos they had the good fortune to come up against Galway in the QF", totally ignoring a very good win v Cork and another hard fought win v Derry.

Had they meet Tyrone, Dublin or Kerry in a QF that would be the end of their season.

Would you find it disingenuous if people said mayo only got to the final cos they had the good fortune to meet Tipp?

Mushy

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Mushy wrote: »

I dunno, the first post came across as somewhat arrogant ("perhaps tipp may be up by 1 or 2 at HT"), that's all I've issue with. You can say a team will win easy without saying stuff like "Tipp are only in this position cos they had the good fortune to come up against Galway in the QF", totally ignoring a very good win v Cork and another hard fought win v Derry.

Had they meet Tyrone, Dublin or Kerry in a QF that would be the end of their season.

Would you find it disingenuous if people said mayo only got to the final cos they had the good fortune to meet Tipp?

Fr Tod Umptious

Mushy wrote: »

Would you find it disingenuous if people said mayo only got to the final cos they had the good fortune to meet Tipp?

No cos its true.

I'd be somewhat less confident of Mayo getting to the final if it was someone else we were meeting now.

Mushy

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Mushy wrote: »

Would you find it disingenuous if people said mayo only got to the final cos they had the good fortune to meet Tipp?

No cos its true.

I'd be somewhat less confident of Mayo getting to the final if it was someone else we were meeting now.

Fair enough then. I don't put too much heed in who a team had in a round as the reason for getting through, it basis itself in a hypothetical situation that didn't occur.

As I said, Mayo should win, by a few too. But tipp will certainly give them a game.

Fr Tod Umptious

Mushy wrote: »

Fair enough then. I don't put too much heed in who a team had in a round as the reason for getting through, it basis itself in a hypothetical situation that didn't occur.

As I said, Mayo should win, by a few too. But tipp will certainly give them a game.

So in your eyes beating Dublin in the previous round is the same as beating Waterford ?

Mushy

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Mushy wrote: »

Fair enough then. I don't put too much heed in who a team had in a round as the reason for getting through, it basis itself in a hypothetical situation that didn't occur.

As I said, Mayo should win, by a few too. But tipp will certainly give them a game.

So in your eyes beating Dublin in the previous round is the same as beating Waterford ?

No, cos it doesn't matter cos it didn't happen.

PressRun

I mentioned in the Mayo thread that I think we probably have the better bench, which should stand to us in this match. I think Tipp have defensive weaknesses that could be exploited too. That said, if there's any shred of complacency then forget it. Tipp will play with a sense of adventure and fearlessness and they will run at us. They have two very big men up front who have the potential to cause havoc if things fall their way. Our midfield is going to have to be on point. With Liam Kearns at the helm, I think Tipp will be well prepared for this.

dirtyden

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Had they meet Tyrone, Dublin or Kerry in a QF that would be the end of their season.

Yeah I mean Galway are rubbish, who did they ever beat this year ?

Fr Tod Umptious

dirtyden wrote: »

Yeah I mean Galway are rubbish, who did they ever beat this year ?

Yea you can keep throwing the Galway thing out there but the fact that Mayo lost to them on 18th June and Tipp beat them on 30th July means far less than people want it to mean.

Dyr

Uncle Ben wrote: »

Sorry for butting into this thread, but has anyone any ideas why the Dublin v Kerry game have not got any tickets released to the general public via tickets.ie etc? Thanks.

They had some up last week, presume all were sold

Dirty Dingus McGee

Mayo are vulnerable in the full back line I expect Tipp to go long and look for goals in this game.

I'd expect Mayo to win by 5 or 6 points but I think Tipp will scare them and I wouldn't be shocked if they won.

The game will be quite high scoring I feel and anything can happen in high scoring games.

Hopefully Tipp win because I can't bear to look at Mayo losing another all ireland finals which is what will almost certainly happen if Dublin win the other semi final.

Audioslaven

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

I expect Tipp to go long and look for goals in this game.

I would agree with you. I think Tipp will plant some long balls in. it would appear that Galway caught Mayo on the hop because Mayo were complacent and I think some players were just off their game for many reasons. Mayo are still not firing on all injectors (properly) but they are starting to fire and the Tyrone win was the first decent team performance in a while.

I don't think the guys will take Tipp as a certainty as the prize is huge for them. Galway never applied any kind of pressure on Tipp at all and Tipp had the run of the pitch. I expect Mayo to not let this happen and it will be interesting to see how they cope.

Mayo have to win this.

padd b1975

I expect something similar to the Westmeath match. Mayo to hit a purple patch and build up a healthy lead before Tipperary hit back leaving Mayo needing and getting a few late scores to make things comfortable.

I thought the Tipperary celebrations after the Galway match were very interesting, I honestly thought they were going to go on a lap of honour at one stage!
Their body language screamed bonus territory.

Mayo by seven without setting the world on fire.

threeball

Tipp are strong where Mayo are weak so if they can compete at midfield or come out on top there I expect them to cause mayo a lot of problems. I could see Mayo shipping a few goals but I could see tipp doing the same. I think if one team can get a foot on the neck early the other will struggle to reel it in. If it's a shootout I'd back tipp.
The tipp club controversy could be interesting it could galvanise them closer together or if they've been getting stick off locals it might be a huge distraction.

TCDStudent1

The Galway match is extremely relevant as it means that the Mayo players will 100% not be complacent on Sunday. If the draw had worked out differently with mayo winning Connacht, and beating a big team in the QF, then complacency could be an issue on Sunday. There is an argument that complacency caught Mayo against Galway (by both players and management). That defeat to Galway could turn out to be a blessing for Mayo as they won't go into this underestimating Tipp.

Padkir

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

The Galway match is extremely relevant as it means that the Mayo players will 100% not be complacent on Sunday. If the draw had worked out differently with mayo winning Connacht, and beating a big team in the QF, then complacency could be an issue on Sunday. There is an argument that complacency caught Mayo against Galway (by both players and management). That defeat to Galway could turn out to be a blessing for Mayo as they won't go into this underestimating Tipp.

I think the Galway game was very flattering on Tipp, notwithstanding they played good football, but Galway were very poor on the day; no balls for the fight at all when things got tough and very poor tactically.

I do expect Mayo to win but it won't be easy and I'd suspect there will be a few hairy moments in it. As someone else said, a solid win without setting the world on fire would be great.

Any team that goes up North and beats Derry in the manner they did has earned respect. The Cork game was another they dug deep to get the win. They have nothing to lose and will be heroes regardless given their achievements this year; that's a dangerous opponent to have.

Mayo by between 3 and 6 points with 5 plus goals (both full back lines aren't the strongest) in the game is my prediction.

Fr Tod Umptious

threeball wrote: »

Tipp are strong where Mayo are weak so if they can compete at midfield or come out on top there I expect them to cause mayo a lot of problems. I could see Mayo shipping a few goals but I could see tipp doing the same. I think if one team can get a foot on the neck early the other will struggle to reel it in. If it's a shootout I'd back tipp.
The tipp club controversy could be interesting it could galvanise them closer together or if they've been getting stick off locals it might be a huge distraction.

The thing is that this year Mayo have not been as exposed at the back as they have been previously

So far they have given up 3 goals, one of which was due to a bad kick out, another which looked like it may have been a free out.

I have argued previously on the Mayo thread that the McLoughlin at sweeper move is actually a success, not a complete success but as I said they are not leaving the wide open spaces at the back that they were in previous years.

Tipp have some good forwards but I think Mayo will be so much better in other parts of the filed totally negate them.
They wouldn't get the supply.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

The thing is that this year Mayo have not been as exposed at the back as they have been previously

So far they have given up 3 goals, one of which was due to a bad kick out, another which looked like it may have been a free out.

I have argued previously on the Mayo thread that the McLoughlin at sweeper move is actually a success, not a complete success but as I said they are not leaving the wide open spaces at the back that they were in previous years.

Tipp have some good forwards but I think Mayo will be so much better in other parts of the filed totally negate them.
They wouldn't get the supply.

Tipps forwards may not necessarily need good ball though.

Mayo are the better team overall but if Tipp go long they bypass a large part of the field and bypass the areas that Mayo would be strong in.

I think if Tipp deliberately go looking for goals and not just accept points they may get some joy.

seligehgit

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Mayo are vulnerable in the full back line I expect Tipp to go long and look for goals in this game.

I'd expect Mayo to win by 5 or 6 points but I think Tipp will scare them and I wouldn't be shocked if they won.

The game will be quite high scoring I feel and anything can happen in high scoring games.

Hopefully Tipp win because I can't bear to look at Mayo losing another all ireland finals which is what will almost certainly happen if Dublin win the other semi final.[/QUOTE]

I most certainly can't stomach the thought of another final defeat if we do manage to overcome Tipp.I am pessimistic we can overcome Dublin if they come through on the other side.They were the most impressive team on display that quarter final Saturday.

In spite of all the talk about how much Donegal were in the game I thought Dublin were incredibly comfortable,a rare and uncharacteristic unforced error whilst they were playing keep ball to draw Donegal out,thereby allowing Donegal a way back in to the game.Dublin obviously are not invincible and Donegal did expose some frailities.Yet Donegal reverted to type with the vast majority of their players behind the ball even when Dublin went down to 13 men.Amazingly Dublin looked more likely to score.

Having said that I'll keep the faith,hope to look forward to yet another final day...keep knocking on the door.Some final day Mayo forwards god willing are going to shoot the lights out and hopefully we'll get over the line.There's no doubt about it but I firmly believe there is a more potent look about our oft malaligned forward line.

Apologies for going a tad off topic.

Fr Tod Umptious

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Tipps forwards may not necessarily need good ball though.

Mayo are the better team overall but if Tipp go long they bypass a large part of the field and bypass the areas that Mayo would be strong in.

I think if Tipp deliberately go looking for goals and not just accept points they may get some joy.

But how exactly do they bypass where Mayo are strong, because in reality Mayo are stronger than them in ever position.

If they go long with kickouts Mayo can win in the middle, if they go short then the Mayo tackling will be much more intense than anything they got from Galway.

And as I said before McLaughlin is not doing a bad job at sweeping.

That being said as we saw when Westmeath opened up in the second half they caused a lot of problems, but Mayo were playing with a 12 point cushion.

I just don't see Tipp causing enough problems for Mayo for long enough to be able to win it.

seligehgit

Tyson Fury wrote: »

Mayo seem to be peaking at the right time. They've been flying in recent games. Tipp are in bonus territory having not got to this stage in 81 years. We've had a great year but let's call a spade a spade, Mayo are in a different league and they've some outstanding forwards.

I can't agree with this,they have been patchy.Periods of brilliance interpersed with long spells of mediocrity.Where I do agree with you there is a definite improvement in performance levels match on match.:)

If this step up in performance levels continues as Father Tod has stated there is no reason why we can't be quietly confident of putting Tipp to the sword.He is dead right,as a Mayo supporter one can't win.If we do a Kerry/Dublin and have a certain confidence of beating a team that on form we should have a reasonable expectation of defeating,we are perceived as been arrogant.If we have the polar opposite mentality we are accused of possessing of a defeatist attitude/losers mentality.

I have'nt seen a lot of Tipp but would respect any team that defeated an off colour Cork team,Derry and Galway whom we are oft reminded defeated us earlier in the summer.

TBH I believe Mayo only played at around 60% of their capability that fateful evening,following them long enough to know what performance levels they are capable in spite of their many years on the road.

Tipp were impressive against Derry,I only saw the highlights of the Galway game but I can't help but think Galway did'nt really turn up to a certain degree.Mere speculation/wishful thinking...it may still not have been good enough to overcome Tipp.

I suppose all will be revealed come Sunday at 5.00 or so.

Menoetius

If Mayo make it through, and Dublin do too, everyone in the country will write Mayo off.

I've a sneaky feeling that's exactly the sort of situation in which Mayo will finally shock everyone and lift Sam.

Hope I'm wrong

danganabu

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Tipp came 6th in Div 3 of the league.

A Mayo win should be straight forward end of.

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Yea good one, Mayo lost to Galway a full 9 weeks ago, that's extremely relevant, not a single thing has changed since.

Surely even you can see the contradiction and lack of logic in this?

Fr Tod Umptious

danganabu wrote: »

Surely even you can see the contradiction and lack of logic in this?

I was being sarcastic when I said that nothing has changed in the last 9 weeks.

As another poster said the Galway game is relevant here because it should have knocked any complacency out of Mayo.

The fact that Mayo lost to Galway and Tipp beat Galway is far less relevant than people want to make it out to be.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

But how exactly do they bypass where Mayo are strong, because in reality Mayo are stronger than them in ever position.

If they go long with kickouts Mayo can win in the middle, if they go short then the Mayo tackling will be much more intense than anything they got from Galway.

And as I said before McLaughlin is not doing a bad job at sweeping.

That being said as we saw when Westmeath opened up in the second half they caused a lot of problems, but Mayo were playing with a 12 point cushion.

I just don't see Tipp causing enough problems for Mayo for long enough to be able to win it.

Tipps kickouts were top class the last day, no reason they can't break even from the kickouts.Go direct from midfield and committ to it properly and half the field is bypassed and they don't have to work the ball through Mayo.It's what more teams should do in general in the game.

I wouldn't say Mayo are stonger than them in every positions, I'd argue Tipps full forward line are better than Mayo's full back line.

elefant

I'll be absolutely gobsmacked if Tipp beat Mayo.

In saying that, I was very surprised they beat Galway. I don't see them pulling out a shock twice in a row.

danganabu

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

The fact that Mayo lost to Galway and Tipp beat Galway is far less relevant than people want to make it out to be.

Oh I fully agree, it was the reference to the league position that I found bizzare.

DoctaDee

I subscribe to the opinion that Tipp are a lot better than some people are giving them credit for - you can either keep beating the likes of Cork, Derry & Galway and call them shocks or else recognise there maybe something special on the horizon.

If Tipp get a reasonable start and settle quickly, and Comerfords kickouts are as effective as they have been up to now - I've little doubt they'll get a period of dominance but I'd expect the big game experience of Mayo to win the day. I'd like to think the game should stand Tipp on solid ground for the future

Dyr

Wonder how Tipp will deal O'Shea at full forward? I don't rate him against a good full back line at all but he makes hay when he's up against an inexperienced defence

DoctaDee

Bambi wrote: »

Wonder how Tipp will deal O'Shea at full forward? I don't rate him against a good full back line at all but he makes hay when he's up against an inexperienced defence

I'd be more worried about Andy Moran than AOS if I was in the Tipp set up. the influence of O'Shea can be curbed by pressing the supply ball around the middle 3rd - the street smarts of Moran are a different proposition altogether for an inexperienced back line - he's rediscovered the knack of making the ball stick to him in tight areas.

PARlance

Bambi wrote: »

Wonder how Tipp will deal O'Shea at full forward? I don't rate him against a good full back line at all but he makes hay when he's up against an inexperienced defence

He did fairly well up there against Tryone. He'll win ball against anyone if he gets decent ball. The problem is that against better teams, the supply can be a problem.

I think Dillon is key to getting him (& Andy) that decent ball. It'll be interesting to see how Dillon will be used but when he's on, I would expect to see Aidan in the FF line for a large part of it.

Stoner

Fr Tod Umptious wrote:

I have argued previously on the Mayo thread that the McLoughlin at sweeper move is actually a success, not a complete success but as I said they are not leaving the wide open spaces at the back that they were in previous years.

IMO he's more in the roll that James McCarthy defensively played for Dublin in the AI last year running back into space cutting off runs that might let a lad in for a goal. He's not imo pushing up on guys going for points , so he's effective at reducing the options at goal, but he's linking up well with the forwards, he's more of a roving attacking extra centre back rather than an out and out defensive sweeper.

Fr Tod Umptious

Stoner wrote: »

IMO he's more in the roll that James McCarthy defensively played for Dublin in the AI last year running back into space cutting off runs that might let a lad in for a goal. He's not imo pushing up on guys going for points , so he's effective at reducing the options at goal, but he's linking up well with the forwards, he's more of a roving attacking extra centre back rather than an out and out defensive sweeper.

And that's why I think its working, those goal scoring chances are not presenting themselves in the same way they were in previous years.

Stoner

Fr Tod Umptious wrote:

And that's why I think its working, those goal scoring chances are not presenting themselves in the same way they were in previous years.

To a degree, but if you wanted to target a sweeper to pull them out of position like the way lads talk about trying to get Tyrones or Dublins sweeper out of position to create space, then you have an issue imo. While McCarthy drops back to cut out diagonal ball into the square or blocks a path to goal if a corner back gets skinned, he has Cian O'Sullivan fixed in a defensive roll, if the wants to take a spin up to the forwards, Mayo don't have that cover when he joins the attack, imo a better team might exploit that.