Batman '89

smurf492

When we see how bad the new run of DC movies are, thought id throw back to the film that really got the superhero ball rolling... A very adult based batman film that had its flaws for the comic enthusiasts but was great in its depictions of batman, joker, Gotham etc... What do you think???

ziggyman17

watched it a couple of weeks ago and I thought that it has aged very badly, hated the bat suit, it just looked too restrictive and I thought the sets looked like something off Crossroads....... Love the soundtrack........

IncognitoMan

I absolutely love the 89 batmobile. They havent managed to come close to that car in any film since imo.

As for the film, I haven't seen it in a good 10 years so it might be time to go back and watch again sometime soon.

brianregan09

The Batmobile in BVS and Suicide Squad is pretty cool I think

Gatling

Still love the first Burton batman and the 2nd the series went drastically wrong and downhill after that ,

faceman

I have a love hate relationship with the '89 flick. It has aged badly but Keaton as Batman remains awesome. Imo he's the best Batman.

I never really took to Nicholson as the Joker. It felt to much like the 60's to show and even at that age it felt like Nicholson never really bought in to it.

The Batmobile was an instance classic. Although

the shell was just placed over another car for the movie.

It was rated 15 on VHS at the time and I remember having to ask my Dad to get it.

Sad Professor

The film was a big part of my childhood. I must have worn out the VHS. And it probably had a big influence on how I judge comic book movies. But the last time I watched it, which was probably the first post-TDK, the Prince dance sequences really bothered me. I'd forgotten how '80s the movie was and just how completely off the reservation Nicholson is.

I prefer Returns. It's a better movie if not necessarily a better Batman movie.

razorblunt

Loved the first one, hated the second I don't think I've rewatched it in full.

Ben Gadot

Sad Professor wrote: »

The film was a big part of my childhood. I must have worn out the VHS. And it probably had a big influence on how I judge comic book movies. But the last time I watched it, which was probably the first post-TDK, the Prince dance sequences really bothered me. I'd forgotten how '80s the movie was and just how completely off the reservation Nicholson is.

I prefer Returns. It's a better movie if not necessarily a better Batman movie.

I actually love that quirky aspect. It worked for me and was a film of its time. Why can't a film be great and be of its own time? Why does have to age well?

Links234

faceman wrote: »

I never really took to Nicholson as the Joker. It felt to much like the 60's to show and even at that age it felt like Nicholson never really bought in to it.

This is an always contentious issue, but I'm not a huge fan of Nicholson as the Joker either, he just plays himself. He wasn't bad mind you, it was an absolutely terrific Jack Nicholson.

faceman

Links234 wrote: »

This is an always contentious issue, but I'm not a huge fan of Nicholson as the Joker either, he just plays himself. He wasn't bad mind you, it was an absolutely terrific Jack Nicholson.

It's a very fair point but at the time I was too young to have seen anything else by Nicholson.

Ben Gadot

I always thought the playing himself argument was a bit unfair. When I grew older I always saw Jack's Joker as a more sinister version of Caesar Romero's Joker.

It was actually Jack Palance who supposedly threw his weight around on set and made a young Burton's life difficult. Never heard such stories in regards to Nicholson.

The Golden Miller

smurf492 wrote: »

When we see how bad the new run of DC movies are, thought id throw back to the film that really got the superhero ball rolling... A very adult based batman film that had its flaws for the comic enthusiasts but was great in its depictions of batman, joker, Gotham etc... What do you think???

Blade came first, Xmen then really got the modern day super hero ball rolling, then Spiderman propelled them to another level. That batman series belongs to a different era

tigger123

Watched the 89 Batman and Batman Returns about 18 months ago and really, really enjoyed them.

I didn't think they have aged badly at all, but I do think Returns is pretty adult in places, tonally at least.

I'm currently playing the latest Batman game on PS 4 and its giving me a hankering to go back and watch the Burton version.

Both quality movies.

Clareman

I really don't like the 89 Batman, having the Joker shoehorned into being the killer of the Wayne's to Batman indiscriminately killing people to the stupid parade to baddies just appearing on the roof to Batman killing the Joker, all no to me.

shootermacg

The way he couldn't turn his head, so always turned his whole body, lol. I did love it at the time, but, BvS is a thousand times better in every way.

Duggy747

Batman is a bit of a lunatic killing machine in Burton's ones but I love both of them, from the music down to the Batmobile. Pfeiffer and DeVito also were great as Catwoman and Penguin.

Always loved this shot of Wayne in his house contemplating in the dark where he then stands up to the Bat Logo. Not sure why it's shining so brilliantly in his room like that but have always liked it :pac:


I didn't really like Batman Begins or The Dark Knight Rises but I did really enjoy both of Burton's ones.

smash

I loved Burton's batman when I was young but Nolan's batman blew it out of the park. The tumbler was war machine, batman was vulnerable and unhinged and the villains were more human and less comic book.

tigger123

Duggy747 wrote: »

Batman is a bit of a lunatic killing machine in Burton's ones but I love both of them, from the music down to the Batmobile. Pfeiffer and DeVito also were great as Catwoman and Penguin.

Always loved this shot of Wayne in his house contemplating in the dark where he then stands up to the Bat Logo. Not sure why it's shining so brilliantly in his room like that but have always liked it :pac:


I didn't really like Batman Begins or The Dark Knight Rises but I did really enjoy both of Burton's ones.

At the risk of derailing the thread completely; what didn't you like about Batman Begins or The Dark Knight Rises?

Duggy747

tigger123 wrote: »

At the risk of derailing the thread completely; what didn't you like about Batman Begins or The Dark Knight Rises?

I didn't care much for the style of Batman Begins, Gotham was a mess of a city design-wise, Nolan's editing was at it's worst with insane pacing and jump-cuts, the going for realism while then putting in very corny cartoonish jokes and moments.

I really liked The Dark Knight because it felt like they honed in better on what kind of Batman they were going for and Gotham was much more in line of a city that suited the story, theme and tone. Editing was still a bit wonky but not as bad as BB and I found it ultimately to be a really enjoyable film.

TDKR I just did not like at all, walked out of the cinema disappointed. I thought it had terrible dialogue and exposition, the story was very silly and made far too many leaps in logic and the fight scenes are pretty naff to look back on especially the climatic fight with all the extras.

Plus, I still can't believe this was the best cut they got of a death scene :pac: (Spoiler)

squonk

Burton's Batman was probably the first real blockbuster I saw back in 89 in the cinema. I thought it was great. I've always been a Burton fan but I do think he's gone off the boil of late.

Prior to Burton's movie my only frame of reference for Batman was the 60's show which RTE used to show on Saturday mornings so, of course, the darker, more violent Batman was a huge improvement at the time. I think Burton's movie did an excellent job in taking that slapstick 60's world and updating it. I can see why comic fans have their problems with it for sure but I think it's a great movie.

Number two wasn't very good at all I thought but it's a masterpiece compared to what came after in 3 and 4. I don't think I've ever watched 4 at all. I remember number 3 turned into such a cinematic hype juggernaut at the time with that U2 song playing ad nauseum on the radio. The film wasn't great and Kilmer was no Batman. It put me right off.

The later Nolan films are great as well. they're quite different but I miss the fantasy aspect that Burton's batman brought to the genre. Stylistically too there was something there with Burton's films that was missing in the Nolan films which were more realistic and gritty.

Batman V Superman was an absolute waste of time. Awful, awful film.

Mickeroo

squonk wrote: »

Burton's Batman was probably the first real blockbuster I saw back in 89 in the cinema. I thought it was great. I've always been a Burton fan but I do think he's gone off the boil of late.

Prior to Burton's movie my only frame of reference for Batman was the 60's show which RTE used to show on Saturday mornings so, of course, the darker, more violent Batman was a huge improvement at the time. I think Burton's movie did an excellent job in taking that slapstick 60's world and updating it. I can see why comic fans have their problems with it for sure but I think it's a great movie.

Number two wasn't very good at all I thought but it's a masterpiece compared to what came after in 3 and 4. I don't think I've ever watched 4 at all. I remember number 3 turned into such a cinematic hype juggernaut at the time with that U2 song playing ad nauseum on the radio. The film wasn't great and Kilmer was no Batman. It put me right off.

The later Nolan films are great as well. they're quite different but I miss the fantasy aspect that Burton's batman brought to the genre. Stylistically too there was something there with Burton's films that was missing in the Nolan films which were more realistic and gritty.

Batman V Superman was an absolute waste of time. Awful, awful film.

Love both of Burton's films but I don't think he can take credit for updating Batman from the 60's incarnation, he was very much just following the lead of the comics in the 80's in that regard.

I'm pretty sure I had seen the animated series before either of Burton's films so that was probably my intro to the more serious incarnation of Batman.

Wedwood

1989 was one of my favourite summers at the cinema, get this for a lineup -

Batman, Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, Licence to Kill, Die Hard 2, Ghostbusters 2, Star Trek V The Final Frontier. (Ok ST V was a dud, but it had great hype that year)

Batman was the standout movie from those. Although it has dated a bit, at the time it was seen as a darker more adult Batman compared to the 60's TV show. It was also much darker than Christopher Reeve's Superman movies which were at that time the standard for superhero movies.( incidentally Superman IV the quest for peace also came out in 1989).

I think Batman should be considered the movie that commenced the 'darker' comic book movies. While some of the campiness is still there, it's noticeably less in your face and most of today's comic book movies have worked from the template established by Batman.

Also, both Burton's Batman movies were considered to be done in his trademark Gothic style, so you get the 'carnival' stuff as well as the darkness, whereas Nolan's movies are gritty rather than Gothic.

IncognitoMan

Wedwood wrote: »

1989 was one of my favourite summers at the cinema, get this for a lineup -

Batman, Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, Licence to Kill, Die Hard 2, Ghostbusters 2, Star Trek V The Final Frontier. (Ok ST V was a dud, but it had great hype that year)

Haha 2016 : Batman movie (BvS), Jason Bourne movie (American Bond), Ghostbusters movie, Star Trek movie.

Not too much change

Sonics2k

Links234 wrote: »

This is an always contentious issue, but I'm not a huge fan of Nicholson as the Joker either, he just plays himself. He wasn't bad mind you, it was an absolutely terrific Jack Nicholson.

Nicholson wasn't bad as the Joker, but you're right in saying he was essentially playing himself.

To be completely honest, the best ever Joker so far is Mark Hamill in the Arkham games. He absolutely captures the essence of the Joker. You can hear the madness in his voice and it puts Leto to bloody shame.

brevity

Remember the stickers/collectors cards with that teeth shattering chewing gum?

Great soundtrack too..

buried

Love Batman '89. Its the best for me. Seen it in my old local cinema where the decor of the place was like the set design of the movie. A real dark, oldschool even Gothic cinema. That scene where the Batwing spirals up to the sky and stops in front of the moon before it attacks Nicholson as he delivers the line "Come on, you gruesome son of a bitch! Come to me. Ha ha ha ha ha ha! Come on!" That's one one of my earliest and favourite memories of the cinema.

smurf492

I find Batman Returns to be the film i watch most...while i love the first and see it as kickstarting the superhero movie, i fibd returns to be dark, crazy and brilliant...

learn_more

I love to watch older movies remasted to hi-def on my big tv screen. I was so disappointed watching 89 recently cause the special effects were so bad the whole thing just didn't work.
I felt it was comical how poor they were. The batmobile looks like the clunkiest thing I ever saw - the idea that it could actually move at any great speed !
I still liked the final scenes though leading to The Jokers demise.

Returns on the other hand, way better visually and the best of the 2 in my opinion.

IamMetaldave

Batman 89: what a movie. I throw it on regularly. Watching the Bluray the amount of animation really shows through. Keaton and Jack have been my favourite Batman and Joker until Batman vs. Superman and Suicide Squad. And this coming from someone who got a cinema visit count of 60ish for the Nolan films.. It would have been interesting to see Tim Burton s third instalment but apparently it was too dark..

Ben Gadot

IamMetaldave wrote: »

Batman 89: what a movie. I throw it on regularly. Watching the Bluray the amount of animation really shows through. Keaton and Jack have been my favourite Batman and Joker until Batman vs. Superman and Suicide Squad. And this coming from someone who got a cinema visit count of 60ish for the Nolan films.. It would have been interesting to see Tim Burton s third instalment but apparently it was too dark..

The studio reacted negatively to the controversy Batman Returns caused, and they wanted to sell toys and the like, so they strong armed Burton out of the director's chair in an amicable manner. I say amicable because I don't think Burton put up too much of a fight and was happy to step aside.

Keaton priced himself out of returning as well.

IamMetaldave

Yeah, I had read something about that a few years back.

Links234

Sonics2k wrote: »

To be completely honest, the best ever Joker so far is Mark Hamill in the Arkham games. He absolutely captures the essence of the Joker. You can hear the madness in his voice and it puts Leto to bloody shame.

He'll always be the Joker for me, if I'm reading the comics, it's Mark's voice I imagine. And you're damn right about the Arkham games, what a downright terrific performance. This line right here...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFXxoD9hlpM

IncognitoMan

IamMetaldave wrote: »

And this coming from someone who got a cinema visit count of 60ish for the Nolan films.. It would have been interesting to see Tim Burton s third instalment but apparently it was too dark..

:eek: I presume you have an unlimited card or else an unlimited amount of money. Either way that's a lot of trips to the cinema to see the same film. I admire your commitment

IamMetaldave

IncognitoMan wrote: »

IamMetaldave wrote: »

And this coming from someone who got a cinema visit count of 60ish for the Nolan films.. It would have been interesting to see Tim Burton s third instalment but apparently it was too dark..

:eek: I presume you have an unlimited card or else an unlimited amount of money. Either way that's a lot of trips to the cinema to see the same film. I admire your commitment

Actually, no. It was just a crazy amount of money spent, including a trip to London to see TDKR is IMAX. I enjoyed it all. However I have ruined them and rarely wat h them anymore

IncognitoMan

Jesus I think I've seen Begins about 3 times, TDK about 3/4 and seen TDKR 3 times and at that I don't feel a need to go back and watch them anytime soon.

IamMetaldave

IncognitoMan wrote: »

Jesus I think I've seen Begins about 3 times, TDK about 3/4 and seen TDKR 3 times and at that I don't feel a need to go back and watch them anytime soon.

Yeah I know. I like seeing Bats on the big screen

Duggy747

The two of ye with your avatar and post counts were making me think one of you were talking to yourselves :P

IamMetaldave

Duggy747 wrote: »

The two of ye with your avatar and post counts were making me think one of you were talking to yourselves :P

Hahaha I wouldn't put it past myself

TheDoc

Real childhood relationship with this film. It was shown to me in the 90's by my Dad, after I had literally fallen in love with the animated series as a child.

I still watch it atleast twice a year. Just love it, soundtrack, the suit, Keaton, everything.

After hearing the latest game Arkham Knight was fixed for PC started it up a few weeks ago and saw I had all the DLC, playing through it using the 89 suit...absolutely in heaven

Ben Gadot

Unrelated to 89 but still relating to that franchise (they're released within the same anthology so no beefs :pac:) but I was reading about the turmoil behind the scenes of the Schumacher films.

I knew about most of them such as Kilmer being difficult and TLJ and Jim Carrey having a ridiculous rivalry that ended up spilling onto the screen, but I never knew about the grief Alicia Silverstone had gotten from the media for putting on a couple of pounds during filming.

Imagine that happening to a 21 year old today? It wouldn't, because they have more subtle ways now of tearing people down.

Sad Professor

Ben Gadot wrote: »

Unrelated to 89 but still relating to that franchise (they're released within the same anthology so no beefs :pac:) but I was reading about the turmoil behind the scenes of the Schumacher films.

I knew about most of them such as Kilmer being difficult and TLJ and Jim Carrey having a ridiculous rivalry that ended up spilling onto the screen, but I never knew about the grief Alicia Silverstone had gotten from the media for putting on a couple of pounds during filming.

Imagine that happening to a 21 year old today? It wouldn't, because they have more subtle ways now of tearing people down.

I don't think this has changed at all. Early media coverage of Jennifer Lawrence alternated between criticising her for being too fat for The Hunger Games and praising her being an icon for "curvy" women. Both of which were absurd.

IamMetaldave

Once again chaps, just shows it's handier to a lad. We can be roundy or not and no one cares! Haha

Although, I guess Christian Bale got some flack for how he went up and down between roles from Batman Begins to the Machinist to The Dark Knight.. but that was just craziness on his part.

Nervous Wreck

IamMetaldave wrote: »

Once again chaps, just shows it's handier to a lad. We can be roundy or not and no one cares! Haha

Although, I guess Christian Bale got some flack for how he went up and down between roles from Batman Begins to the Machinist to The Dark Knight.. but that was just craziness on his part.

That was people criticising him sacrificing his health though.

Tychoo

I still have a Batman T-shirt from that time

Ben Gadot

Sad Professor wrote: »

I don't think this has changed at all. Early media coverage of Jennifer Lawrence alternated between criticising her for being too fat for The Hunger Games and praising her being an icon for "curvy" women. Both of which were absurd.

Christ, really? I don't recall any of that. Surprising given how Lawrence was the toast of the town at the time.

I always held out hope that Burton would come back to his story much like Ridley Scott has with Alien, his vision for Gotham was gorgeous, can only imagine what he could do now.

faceman

Ben Gadot wrote: »

Imagine that happening to a 21 year old today? It wouldn't, because they have more subtle ways now of tearing people down.

Unfortunately it's just as rife today.

Just look at females in superhero movies. Their outfits are never pratical for a start.

Nervous Wreck

faceman wrote: »

Unfortunately it's just as rife today.

Just look at females in superhero movies. Their outfits are never pratical for a start.

Dunno if I fully agree there. Nothing wrong with costumes for Black Widow, Scarlet Witch. Wonder Woman's, while needlessly strapless, isn't exactly oppositional to her purpose. I think gone positive steps have been made in recent ears on this front.

Ben Gadot

faceman wrote: »

Unfortunately it's just as rife today.

Just look at females in superhero movies. Their outfits are never pratical for a start.

Oh I'm aware apparently Michelle Pfeiffer had to be vacuumed into her costume....I don't even know what that is but it sounds painful.

Both actors and actresses within the genre seem to be under pressure to fit the mould of their comic book counterpart. I mean I actually thought Ben Affleck looked a bit ridiculous at times in BvS.

But the difference is that was probably Affleck's choice. I wouldn't be surprised if what happened with Silverstone happened now that actresses would be threatened with a breach of contract.

Mickeroo

Gadot came under a lot of unfair criticism on her physique when she was first cast for the role from what I recall.

Sad Professor

Maybe if Michael Bay was directing…

It's happened a few times with male actors actually. Peter Jackson dumped Ryan Gosling from The Lonely Bones because he gained weight. Also Bale turned up overweight for Batman Begins and was worried Nolan was going to fire him. You can see his weight fluctuate throughout the film as he tried to rapidly lose it.