PC Build Advice

Billy86

**CAN'T EDIT THE TITLE, BUT FOR ANYONE NEW TO THE THREAD -- THIS HAS CHANGED FROM A GAMING LAPTOP THREAD TO A MIRX BUILD**

Quick intro: I haven't been that much into games outside of Football Manager or Civilization that work fine on my normal laptop for a good few years, so haven't owned any form of console in a good 5-6 years. A room mate of mine bought a PS4 and Fallout over Christmas while I was between jobs and... well the addiction took hold.

Now I'm probably not going ahead with it until a little later in the year, but just wanted some advise. Basically I won't be running a million games on it, but the ones I would be would be pretty demanding fare I would imagine - Fallout 4, GTAV, The Witcher, that kind of thing. I've "outgrown" (terrible term) most forms of games but really love the open world, sandbox types which I am guessing can be most demanding.

I also don't mind overclocking or lowering the settings to get the games working perfect as I don't have the greatest eye for detail and so don't really notice the minor advances in graphics we've seen in recent years. Far more interested in the gameplay and everything running stable at 60FPS, or as close to it as possible (let's say 50fps as an absolute minimum).

By the looks of it, the demand these games put on would likely classify as 'hardcore' from what I have seen, but my own actual use of them would probably fall more under 'casual'. I'm really looking at a PC over consoles as it seems if anything advantageous these days in terms of available titles, plus the mods and such give much more lifespan to games that is often limited on Playstations and XBox's.

So what I want to check in on are specs... are there any specifics I should not look to go below, and anything I can afford to possibly skimp on? Since I am looking at a laptop I really would rather get this right the first time since some parts can't be switched.

--HIGH IMPORTANCE
CPU: This and GPU seem like the two biggest choices to make and most important parts. I have read to just bite the bullet and go Intel i7 new gen (5th or 6th). Would an i5 and an overclock make up the difference, or would it be too big a risk with those kinds of titles? Also, just to be safe, I have heard that for the processor itself Intel's stuff is far better to AMD's - just checking this is the case?

GPU: It seems like nVidia 970M or 980M are absolute must-haves for the frame rates I want on the games I plan on playing, and that this is basically a non-negotiable area that has to be right for the laptop to perform as wanted. As with CPU, this appears to be one where you have to bite the bullet and go top-end. Just checking it's the case here too?

--MEDIUM/HIGH IMPORTANCE?
RAM: Correct me if I am wrong, but can't you typically add RAM onto a laptop quite easily? If so, not a high priority. I reckon 8GB + whatever else is on the graphics card should do the trick, but again please let me know if I am mistaken!

Storage: OK so this one has me a little lost. I understand SSD is supposed to be quicker, but the actual amount of memory on them also appears tiny. And is SSD automatically faster than HD or is there the potential to trip up over myself here (e.g. like how on CPU, you could buying i7 2nd series rather than an i5 6th series if you didn't know the differences). I am guessing this is going to be of reasonably high importance to me as I want the games to run stable and smoothly so would really appreciate some advise! Keeping again in mind I am looking to run games like Fallout 4, GTAV, etc.

**Also, do games on external HDs work OK or does it mess with how well they work? I have a 2TB external HD that is half empty, so am thinking if I used that for storage (could even drag the game over before using it as I rarely play more than 1-2 games at a go; e.g. I like to complete one and then move onto the next) then the SSD would be the best option, and I could go on a cheaper model. Help here would be much appreciated though since this area has me quite stumped!!

-LOW IMPORTANCE
Resolution: Not too picky, the advise seems to be to go with at least 1920x1080, so anything above that should do fine... does this make sense?

Audio: Couldn't give much of a toss since I'll likely be doing the vast majority of playing either with headphones in, or with the laptop hooked up to a TV, and would put even less emphasis on crisp sound than I would on crisp graphics. Just want to make sure there is no base level minimum so I don't screw myself over?

Matte/gloss graphics... customisable design...etc etc... all that stuff is of zero interest to me and I would just be looking to get the absolute cheapest on offer, or leaving it off altogether if possible. But do let me know if I am overlooking something crucial! Same for gaming mice/keyboards/etc, I've got an old knockoff PS2 controller with USB that I am more than happy with!

Also, can anybody a) point me to the cheapest self-building websites please? I remember seeing one from Germany that seemed to have great prices but can't find it, and some charge double than others for the exact same thing so I am guessing there is quite a lot of potential savings off being vigilante about getting the right site.

And finally, would people advise for or against physically building it myself? Of course in doing so there is the risk of me damaging a part and having to re-order it, etc, but self-building desktops appears to be pretty common and almost turning into a bit of a hipster trend lately - not so sure on laptops though, because it appears to be a more delicate process.

Digital Solitude

Pretty sure laptops are stupid hard and not at all worth trying self builds.

An i5 would probably be okay for you.

Because youre not hung up on graphics and want smooth gameplay instead, a 720p screen might be a good idea for keeping it reasonable.

The 970/980M are way way way behind their desktop counterparts, definitely don't go higher than 1080p imo.

What's your maximum budget?

And finally, I'm sorry to have to ask, but why not just a desktop?

Billy86

My ideal budget would be about $750 Canadian, maybe 500 Euro, but I'm in no rush so can afford to build up a few extra hundred if needs be too. I'd rather spend extra on something that would last quite well than less on something that might be out of date in 12-18 months, if you catch my drift. That said I'd really rather keep below $1200 or so, which is probably about 850-900 Euro.

Cheers for the heads up on 720p and on self builds, had just thought it could be useful in terms of picking bits up along the way if I saw them at a good price! Though knowing an i5 should work will likely offset that quite a bit.

A desktop has come into my mind, but I do a good bit of traveling so it might not be ideal. I'd like something I can essentially plug'n' play in an airport, hotel room or wherever else I may be - lugging a monitor or TV around wouldn't really work unfortunately. Living in Canada now, probably going to be back in Ireland by the end of the year, but then could well be back in Canada longer term by next summer.

Digital Solitude

Not sure on prices in the states, but European wise you'll have to double your budget at least to play the likes of The Witcher 3 or GTAV.

Billy86

That's where I appear to be coming unstuck - if the budget difference is that big I might well have to accommodate and go for a more 'portable sized' desktop. Though at the same time I am seeing some laptops that appear to be giving me what I am looking for, but I am not great at reading computer specs so I am sure I am missing one or two major flaws in them - see the two below!

http://www.ibuypower.com/Store/ASUS-ROG-GL551VW-Laptop-Refurb (but I am especially weary of refurb'ed laptops for gaming!)
http://www.ibuypower.com/Store/ASUS-ROG-GL502VT-DS71-Laptop

Digital Solitude

Both would play the games on Med settings fine, obviously one is almost twice what you want to spend, I personally wouldn't buy a refurb

K.O.Kiki

The problem with cheap gaming laptops is that, since so much budget is going on a decent CPU & GPU, the manufacturer skimps out on the screen.
So beyond looking at "1080p screen!!", know that those screens are the bottom-of-the-barrel, junky TN things that will make you hate using it.

Billy86

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

The problem with cheap gaming laptops is that, since so much budget is going on a decent CPU & GPU, the manufacturer skimps out on the screen.
So beyond looking at "1080p screen!!", know that those screens are the bottom-of-the-barrel, junky TN things that will make you hate using it.

Would there be a particular reason why it would make me hate it though? Keeping in mind I would be using a TV for a lot of the time to play it on, and I'm a bit of a philistine when it comes to the finer end of graphics/screen quality/etc.

yimrsg

http://www.logicalincrements.com/might be worth having a look at. You can choose your country and see what you might get for your money. 750 Canadian would put you in or around the 960 or 380 but you could do better if you buy second hand.

A second hand 290x/390 from kijiji would blow the socks off a 970m and mean that you could probably max out most games at 1080 and get decent frame rates.

Digital Solitude

A laptop with a 290X is actually a nice idea, it could double as a frying pan when you go camping

Riesen_Meal

Billy86

Holy crap, jokes aside you might have hit on a gem there, especially with the size! Not sure and I'll need to look into it more, but like some people do with smart phones I might look to jump on their older model (or a competitors) to see the price drop. Sadly their EN970 on Amazon doesn't have a GTX980 available right now, but can someone let me know what they think of the other specs?

https://www.amazon.com/ZOTAC-Barebones-dual-core-Bluetooth-ZBOX-EN970-U/dp/B016QO86DG - very, very much within my price range too. Would really appreciate some feedback on how a 120GB SSD might perform, keeping in mind I have 1TB from on an external HD and would only be playing 1-2 games as a time so wouldn't have much fear of hitting capacity.

Digital Solitude, you mentioned that the desktop cards are far superior, would this offset the difference? It looks like it on here, but while I'm quite interested in computers I'm really awful at reading hardware specs. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gpu-hierarchy,4388.html

This is showing a lower frame rate, but for reference - this quality would be easily satisfactory...

Billy86

Or alternatively, I spotted this guy for a little more (but still within my upper budget) - https://www.maingear.com/boutique/pc/configurePrd.asp?idproduct=2466

USD $1,179 (€1,055)
- Intel® Core™ i5 6600k 3.5GHz/3.9GHz Turbo QUAD Core CPU 6MB L3 Cache
- AMD Radeon R7 370 2GB with FreeSync
- [HDD] 1TB Seagate Desktop HDD 7200rpm 64MB Cache
- [SSD] 250GB Samsung® 850 EVO [520MB/s Sequential Reads] [FREE OS DRIVE UPGRADE ONLY!]
- 8GB HyperX® FURY™ DDR4- 2666 (2x4GB) [Dual Channel]
- 500W EVGA® 80 Plus Certified PSU
- Windows 10.
- All else as standard.

Billy86

Well it seems the thread might have taken a turn, since a 'console PC' appears to be more in line with what I am looking for - suggestions are more than welcome but the Zotac EN970 seems right up the alley of what I'm looking at having checked some reviews!

http://www.computershopper.com/desktops/reviews/zotac-zbox-magnus-en970/(page)/3#review-body

Digital Solitude

I'm not sure what you're asking me on the last page.

You can build mITX PCs that would be about the same size as what you're looking at now, basically the same thing but customizable and cheaper

MarkAnthony

Watch it on laptop specs for CPUs. i5s can be dual cores with hyperthreading, while 4 physical cores is enough 2 + HT is pushing it.

Aside from anything else, laptop parts have a habit of thermally throttling which can impact performance hugely. There is very little (usually no) OC headroom on laptops.

Billy86

Sorry, I had the wrong link to Amazon - https://www.amazon.com/ZOTAC-Barebones-dual-core-Bluetooth-ZBOX-EN970-U/dp/B016QO86DG

Was just thinking if the 960 (desktop) would suffice, since they are apparently a good deal stronger. Thanks for the patience by the way lads, this thread must be like someone going into the soccer forum and asking "what's a Messi?".

Very much appreciated though, between console PCs and these mITX guys I've got a weekend of digging ahead of me, should be fun!

Billy86

MarkAnthony wrote: »

Watch it on laptop specs for CPUs. i5s can be dual cores with hyperthreading, while 4 physical cores is enough 2 + HT is pushing it.

Aside from anything else, laptop parts have a habit of thermally throttling which can impact performance hugely. There is very little (usually no) OC headroom on laptops.

Grand, so just to be sure I read that right, you're saying to stick exclusively to quad core processors?

MarkAnthony

Billy86 wrote: »

Grand, so just to be sure I read that right, you're saying to stick exclusively to quad core processors?

For gaming I would - personally I probably would go with an i7 4+HT these days but it's not strictly necessary and very difficult to get on a laptop (at a reasonable price).

Digital Solitude

Oh yeah, even a desktop 950 will play the games you want no problem.

mITX is just the PCs form factor, it's probably about the same as the console PCs in the right case.

Don't worry about the questions, it's not uncommon for people to get 4-5 pages of advice and full build lists given when they've done no prior research and totally disregard all the hardware advice given.

Digital Solitude

Depends on the budget, i3s aren't optimal but will be relevant for quite some time imo. If the build calls for it, an i3 with a top card is better than an i7 with a weak one. I don't think i7s are necessary for gaming just yet either, but again, when on a budget the price difference between an i5 and i7 can normally be better spent elsewhere.

TerrorFirmer

A desktop skylake i3 is fine now for a budget conscious build, pretty much as DS said above an i3 + a strong card is way better than an i5 + mediocre card. Plus, it can always easily be upgraded in time. The Witcher 3 and GTA V will run virtually identical on a modern i3 versus an i5, the GPU tends to be the bottleneck. Fallout 4 is more demanding and will show a benefit on an i5 versus the i3 - not the different between bad and good but definitely a noticable difference, Fallout 4 doesn't feel great sub 50-60fps compared to other titles. An i3-6100 and a GTX960 will serve you very well for all 3 games at 1080p high settings.

Be careful with most of those console boxes, they're just laptops in a different format - performance will be much lower than the desktop equivalent and cost the same, or even more in some cases. You can build very small machines using desktop parts these days with the huge range of mitx cases available. That Zotac console box looks reasonable, CPU is a little on the weak side but the GPU is pretty solid. Not the worse choice but when you purchase one of these machines, that's it - no upgrade potential. Whereas if you build your own mItx machine, it will be a little bigger, but will last twice as long if not more.

thierry14

Digital Solitude wrote: »

I'm not sure what you're asking me on the last page.

You can build mITX PCs that would be about the same size as what you're looking at now, basically the same thing but customizable and cheaper

That's what I would be doing

I5/8gb/480

Use it like console hooked up to tv even, decent controller/wireless mouse etc.

That's what I do.

Have a micro atx i3/8gb/750ti with Xbox controller and 50 inch tv

Those gaming laptops have to be plugged in most of the time anyway.

Don't see the point.

Skerries

this will give you an idea of a small gaming pc build

Billy86

Right, so this MITX stuff is unquestionably the way I'll be going; the upgrades aspect is just too much to turn up, and I absolutely love the fact it has an potentially unlimited (irony: "to a point") lifespan in terms of upgradability to keep up with consoles. I say 'unlimited, to a point' because obviously it's going to go obsolete at some point. But I absolutely love that I can have the full thing and even if I want, stick a few Euro a week away to add on RAM, upgrade the CPU or CPU, etc as I see fit. That's phenomenal and seems a whole lot of fun - basically I'm looking at it the same as 'leveling up' in Fallout or slowly building a supercity in Civilization!

Anyway, I came across a Canadian website that seems to have wonderful prices but I am still completely new to this an pretty sure there will be errors in compatibility or whatnot, or just putting the money in slightly wrong places etc... but I'm excited to get the ball rolling!

$50CAD / €34 Case: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163231&cm_re=mini_tower-_-11-163-231-_-Product
$40, seems to have good 'breathing room' and is made out of steel in case I have a mishap carrying it. Only two USB 3.0 ports but that would do short term and I plan on getting a discreet 4-6 port USB splitter if possible, to attach to the front. USB 3.0 splitter would be great but if not standard USB will do for controllers/audio/USB-to-HDMI/phone charging/etc. If I need the extra power I can just plug out the splitter and use direct, or use the second USB 3.0 input.

**Side note: Ugh. I was so, so excited about this guy - http://www.mini-box.com/M350-universal-mini-itx-enclosure - and a PicoPSU to replace the power supply (it wouldn't fit) before realising there is no room for a graphics card. Was in dreamland before I noticed no mentions of graphics cards, looked into it and found out.

$160 / €110 Motherboard: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130903&cm_re=MSI_B150I_GAMING_PRO_AC_Mini_ITX_LGA1151_Motherboard-_-13-130-903-_-Product
I'm finding motherboards a lot harder to research into since they are more removed from 'what you see' (if that makes sense - e.g. it is easy to youtube CPU/GPU performances differences, find benchmark tests, etc) so assistance here would be highly appreciated. I've seen models up to $100 cheaper, but would I get away with them?

Also some seem to have no issue with MSI while others seem to hate it, is there something I am missing here?

$265 / €182 CPU: Intel i5 6500 QUAD, 3.2GHz http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117563
This might be overkill not too sure, but it seems like a CPU that would last me a long time compared and with other savings it might be a worthwhile item to 'bite the bullet' on. That said, I can get this one - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=2MN-0004-00002&cm_re=intel_i3_skylake-_-2MN-0004-00002-_-Product - for $150 (€103); i3 6100 DUAL, 3.8GHz. Keeping in mind I will not be running more than maybe a browser and the game simultaneously, would the cheaper option be more worthwhile? This ties in with the GPU below...

$175 / €120 GPU: GIGABYTE GTX 950, 2GB. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125856
I've seen a few GIGABYTE products and the reviews seem solid, but curious just how important branding is - should I pay the extra and go with the official nVidia one. On this GPU hierarchy chart - http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gpu-hierarchy,4388.html - the 950 looks quite solid and reliable, but of course not top of the range... it's a price point purchase as things stand though, this seems to my uneducated eyes to be the best bang-for-buck I could get right now. Keep in mind I am happy to have something that does a decent job (around med settings) on GTAV/Fallout 4/Witcher 3 type titles and plan to put a little aside a week over a good period of time to possibly do a huge upgrade down the line. Please let me know if this should do the trick!

$70 / €48 240GB SSD: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16820313707
Storage shouldn't be an issue since I don't like juggling a bunch of games at the same time, and have a 1TB external HD to hold additional stuff (and I assume could always do an add-on down the line here if that gets irritating?), correct me if I'm missing something but with that in mind a low capacity SSD seems to be the best option to start off with.

$38 / €26 RAM: 1x8GB Crucial Ballistics DDR4 2666. http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820156057&cm_re=8gb_ddr4-_-20-156-057-_-Product
I have no idea what most of that means but DDR4 and 1x8GB seem to be the best way to go. From what I know RAM can have a pretty big impact and is pretty cheap so it might make most sense to get something pretty solid along these lines rather than going 1x4GB or whatnot just to save a tenner. I didn't put too much research into this area just yet though because of that; it doesn't look like it'll have much difference on the final price.

**Note: The motherboard is 2133 while this is 2666, would that cause problems? If not, the link above is 54% off hence why I put it in (might well be of benefit if I upgrade the motherboard etc down the line), otherwise a 2133 model would obviously do me fine were a sale like this not available.

$50 / €34 Cooler: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608029&cm_re=Noctua_NH-L9i_57.5_CFM_CPU_Cooler-_-35-608-029-_-Product
Has good reviews, a good price point, and a reputation for being quiet which should help given my case is mesh/open rather than one of those fancy transparent glass/plastic ones.

$90 / €62 Power Supply. 700 watt, modulated http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16817182333
I could get this down to $70 without the modulation and at 500w, but figure for the tiny price increases it's worth getting extra power and modulation - especially in the smaller MITX space within the box (re. wires/air circulation).

$20 'Sound card': http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829128004&cm_re=usb_sound_card-_-29-128-004-_-Product
OK so it's not really a card at all, but like I said in the OP, outside of having basic sound it is not a priority to me. The separate headphone/speaker inputs are nice, I suppose.

FREE OS: Gonna chance my arm on a Linux type setup. If I fail I guess I'll need to bite the bullet and get Windows, but given I'll be pretty much using this exclusively for games, media (movies, etc) and only the tiniest bit of browsing, steam, etc to download games/media... correct me if I'm wrong, but the $130 difference seems like madness, right?

TOTAL COST, HIGHER END (i5 Skylake, GTX 950, motherboard linked) - $898 CAD / €616.
TOTAL COST, LOWER END (i3 Skylake, GTX 950, $80 hypothetical mobo) - $703 / €483.

I've found a bog basic mouse & keyboard for $15 on the same website, plus this could be handy for about another $17 - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAASC4061364&cm_re=keyboard_mouse_pad-_-9SIAASC4061364-_-Product especially if I find a program/app that allows me to access all my games / old emulators / movies / music / etc together, like a knock off of the PS4 or Xbox One interfaces. Of course that kind of stuff I can tinker with after, so not much point looking into it too much until I've got the build down!

Shipping for all of the above is only around $50 total I think (most are free 'by land' delivery) and there's about $20 to be saved back in rebates & discounts, so in terms of Euro it looks like €500 - €650.








So... what are peoples thoughts and how badly have I messed up so far? I'm just elated at the possible price points so much that it's got to be too good to be true!

And if anyone has seen any cool looking or particularly portable MITX cases, please do let me know!

Billy86

Also if the motherboard has any issues because I get the impression it's the area I am most clueless with, how would this do as a similarly priced alternative? http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128847

Digital Solitude

You need an SFX PSU for the case above, one of these http://www.newegg.ca/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&IsNodeId=1&N=100007656%20600014000

500w is loads. The i5 will give you computing power for a few years, and the 950 will play what you want at 1080p no problem, should do for a while before needing an upgrade.

For the most part, motherboards are motherboards, the only difference between an expensive flashy one and a cheapo plain one is the optional additions, e.g. Wifi, M.2 slots, PCIe lanes and extra RAM slots, stuff like that. Take that B150 vs a €300 Z170, with your setup, there will literally be no difference in any performance, bar a small bit on the RAM

The GPU is official nVidia, nVidia basically allow third party companies to make their own versions of their cards, which are almost always better for cooling and performance. However, afaik the Nvidia Reference carda re better for mITX builds.

CPU is fine,
board is fine
case is fine
GPU is fine
never heard of the SSD brand, I'd go Samsung or Crucial,
RAM is fine, 8gb now is a good idea, the motherboard will automatically slow the RAM down to 2133 so it doesnt matter if its still cheaper than 2133 RAM
Drop the soundcard altogether, motherboard has a built in one that should be fine.
Get Windows, Linux isn't a fully fledged gaming OS just yet.

The Fractal Node 202 is tiny and has good reviews case wise. You need to check case specs on the max GPU size it'll allow, and the PSU sizing, and then compare those again individual GPUs and PSUs.

As a first attempt at a build list, it's fairly solid

Billy86

Man, boards should be paying you at this point! Didn't spot the built in sound card either, so that's a few extra pennies knocked off to set against the SFX PSU's (which seem a small bit more expensive) and needing to get Windows (sons'a'b*tches, thought I stumbled on a great saving there!).

Just a few quick questions
- Is the need for an SFX PSU related to the dimensions or something else? Just so I know what I'm looking for while I'm searching around.
- What exactly is an m.2 connection on the motherboard? I've no idea, but I have come across a few reviews slating mobo's that look great otherwise, because of no m.2 connection.
- If a motherboard doesn't have WIFI, does that automatically mean no online gaming or do I need to get something else to enable it? I'm guessing my build wouldn't work out for those huge scale, 40+ people type of online games, but would still like to run some things like GTA Online (which I am assuming is a little less demanding due to less hyper-intense action and closed-in spaces with tonnes of different people crammed together).


A few alternative SSDs:
- https://www.amazon.ca/Samsung-750-SATA-Internal-MZ-750250BW/dp/B01AAKZRP2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1469905765&sr=8-1&keywords=240gb+samsung+ssd ... Samsung, $103 for 250gb or $190 for 500gb so would really just be a matter of where my budget lay at the time. Tempted to go for the 500gb and use the external HD for 'dormant' games I haven't played in a while.

- http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16820156066 ... Crucial, 240gb for $85. Could be handy since it's on the same site as everything else (e.g. to try to get them to waive shipping, or at least throw the 'free land shipping' stuff in with the air shipping; also for refunds etc in case of damaged parts)... or I could just go bananas and splurge $329 on the 960gb SSD version.



Will also keep an eye out for nVidia official GPUs on sale etc and post here for feedback when I find them!

Digital Solitude

Nah read the spec sheet and it should say if it takes an SFX, if it doesn't it's probably ATX

No WiFi means adding a WIFi PCI card or else using Wired Connections

This PC will be as powerful as any other, more powerful than a lot, if anyone else can play a game you probably can, only a few exceptions to it.

M.2 is a SSD technology. They're super fast SSDs, which says a lot. Optional extra tbh, they're not as big a jump as HDD to SSD was.

The GPU you want is a Reference Model, as above, all GPUs you see on newegg or that will be official Nvidia or AMD, it's the coolers that matter.

Billy86

Grand so, looking at that then m.2 connections don't seem to matter to me. I do hate having wires everywhere though and would be worried getting a separate Wifi card would be a) another complication (trying to keep this as simplified as possible at this point), and b) could add clutter (MIRX cases are quite small, I want this to be run as smooth and quiet as possible, and with holes throughout the cube design I think more space = more air circulation = less intense fans/coolers/etc is likely the smartest way to go).

Digital Solitude

The WiFi card won't be adding anymore wires to the inside, though I haven't a bulls notion about anything to do with them other than what they look like so I can't point you the way of one even if you did want to split the WiFi and motherboard.

Homeplugs are what we normally recommend for PCs, it basically extends your wired connection from the router to a plug socket but that probably isn't suitable for your needs.

Billy86

Yeah, on second glance I was looking up the wrong item, they don't seem too clunky at all - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833166117&cm_re=wifi_pci_card-_-33-166-117-_-Product . But would probably just play it safe and put the extra $20-30 or whatever into a motherboard with the Wifi already in.

Pretty damn excited most of the pieces seem in place already though! Very tempted to buy 1-2 cheaper parts this weekend just to get myself 'pot committed' to getting the rest of the pieces ASAP, because I'm an awful cretin for putting things like this on the long finger. Once I've a toe dipped in though I'm all in.

Also highly excited for getting something like MediaPortal up and running on this when it's done (not so much looking forward to all the chunks of hair I will lose trying to configure it though ) .

K.O.Kiki

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-6500 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor ($204.99 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-L9i 57.5 CFM CPU Cooler ($39.88 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: ASRock H110M-ITX/ac Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard ($69.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: G.Skill Aegis 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR4-2133 Memory ($30.98 @ Newegg)
Storage: A-Data Premier SP550 120GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($36.99 @ NCIX US)
Storage: Seagate Momentus 640GB 2.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($39.69 @ Amazon)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 950 2GB Video Card ($117.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Silverstone Sugo SG13B Mini ITX Tower Case ($45.98 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: Silverstone Strider Gold 450W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular SFX Power Supply ($90.98 @ Newegg)
Total: $677.46
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-07-30 16:03 EDT-0400

K.O.Kiki

Alternatively,

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i3-6300 3.8GHz Dual-Core Processor ($157.49 @ Amazon)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-L9i 57.5 CFM CPU Cooler ($39.88 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: ASRock H110M-ITX/ac Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard ($69.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: G.Skill Aegis 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR4-2133 Memory ($30.98 @ Newegg)
Storage: A-Data Premier SP550 120GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($36.99 @ NCIX US)
Storage: Seagate Momentus 640GB 2.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($39.69 @ Amazon)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 970 4GB Video Card ($229.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Silverstone Sugo SG13B Mini ITX Tower Case ($45.98 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: Silverstone Strider Gold 450W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular SFX Power Supply ($90.98 @ Newegg)
Total: $741.96
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2016-07-30 16:05 EDT-0400

The CPU is weaker, but the GTX 970 is a much, much better graphics card.

This system would blow the prior suggestion out the water in most games.

Billy86

Nice suggestion Koki! It seems your one is in $USD however while mine is in $CAD, so your first one and mine come out the same price wise while your seconnd is approx $950 Canadian (exchange rate right now is approx $1 CAD = $0.75c USD = €0.70c). Curious how the two might stack up though, because having HDD & SSD both off the bat while by no means a necessity would be nice.

The cheaper motherboard also appears to have wifi (albeit with tricky installation but not bothered by that) which is good and coupled with no need for the $20 USB sound card is doing a great job taking a bit dent out of fact I'll need to spend $130CAD or so on Windows 10.

I would probably still stick with the case I have though; trying to get it as small (and thus portable) as possible is a very high priority for me.

K.O.Kiki

Billy86 wrote: »

Nice suggestion Koki! It seems your one is in $USD however while mine is in $CAD, so your first one and mine come out the same price wise while your seconnd is approx $950 Canadian (exchange rate right now is approx $1 CAD = $0.75c USD = €0.70c). Curious how the two might stack up though, because having HDD & SSD both off the bat while by no means a necessity would be nice.

The cheaper motherboard also appears to have wifi (albeit with tricky installation but not bothered by that) which is good and coupled with no need for the $20 USB sound card is doing a great job taking a bit dent out of fact I'll need to spend $130CAD or so on Windows 10.

I would probably still stick with the case I have though; trying to get it as small (and thus portable) as possible is a very high priority for me.

I would suggest Sugo 13 over Sugo 05.

The Sugo 13 is barely larger in volume (11.5l vs 10.8l) but has extra mounting points for 2.5" HDDs/SSDs, a front fan/radiator mount, and fits ATX power supplies (to 150mm). Its front USB ports are also 2x USB3.0

Billy86

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

I would suggest Sugo 13 over Sugo 05.

The Sugo 13 is barely larger in volume (11.5l vs 10.8l) but has extra mounting points for 2.5" HDDs/SSDs, a front fan/radiator mount, and fits ATX power supplies (to 150mm). Its front USB ports are also 2x USB3.0

You might have a point; I checked the measurements of the Sugo 05 and it's almost exactly the size of a piece of A4 paper (with 6 inches in height); smaller than I thought. I think the case and power supply will be the last things I buy though, to give myself some extra time to mull on it.

Billy86

OK, first purchase today... a little help please!

Just want to make sure this is worth the extra few dollars, but it seems it for the overclocking -
Intel i5 6600K, Quad Core, 3.5 GHz, 6M... $290 / 198 Euro (includes shipping)
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117561&cm_re=intel_i5_6600k-_-19-117-561-_-Product

It seems a really good deal at basically $100 off, just wanted to be sure before jumping in! I'm back to Ireland in late September/early October so won't be buying the case or some of the cheaper parts until then, but will be keeping an eye out for deals which is a nice advantage of not being in a rush. Think I'll try to do the same if I see a GTX 950 or better for around the $150 mark (100 Euro) too, should have a small bit of spare luggage space for them.

Digital Solitude

I personally don't consider K chips worth the extra money, putting that money into a GPU will get you better gains.

If there's a sale then go for it though

Billy86

Yeah I was figuring the same, though on a few benchmark test comparisons kind of pushed me over the edge. The i5 6500 standard is only about $20 less (because of the sale) and so I'm reckoning the overclocking could come in handy in terms of lifespan of the processor (e.g. while it seems pretty close to top of the line right now, it will get caught up on so with overclocking it should last a bit longer in that sense while also giving me a better gauge on when it needs replacing). Wasn't considering getting a 6600k at all, but the fact I won't have the whole thing up and running for about 2 months and that it's so little in the price difference is too hard to turn down.

Xenoronin

I say go for it. You may never use the overclocking but it's there as an option You could get a cheap Z170 board to pair with it if you find something on sale over there.

Billy86

Xenoronin wrote: »

I say go for it. You may never use the overclocking but it's there as an option You could get a cheap Z170 board to pair with it if you find something on sale over there.

Will give it a look! I think I've done an OK job getting my head around CPUs, GPUs, etc but motherboards for the most part are still confusing me so I've been following Digital Solitude's (if I recall) advise of not getting too caught up in the extras, etc with them. Can I ask what the advantage of a Z170 would be over a more basic/standard motherboard?

EDIT: Actually I think I remember reading that only some motherboards support overclocking, would that be it?

K.O.Kiki

You can only overclock Intel Core i*-****k chips on their Z*** chipset motherboards.

Chipset differences:

https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Z170-H170-H110-B170-Q150-Q170---What-is-the-Difference-635/

Without overclocking you won't see tangible difference between Core i5 at 3.3GHz vs 3.5GHz

Xenoronin

I know what you meant, but using '*' makes it look like swearing :L

I went looking at the price of the Z170 chipset. It's still ridiculous.

Billy86

How does these two look? They're a little more than I would have liked but again, due to moving and having 2 months or so to fund this, it's not a major issue.

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128847&cm_re=z170_motherboard-_-13-128-847-_-Product - $180 / 123 Euro
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16813157681 - $200 / 136 Euro.

Thought I stumbled on a great little bargain here, but it was for ATX and not MITX - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157681&cm_re=z170_motherboard-_-13-157-681-_-Product $85 / 58 Euro.

Billy86

Well... balls. I misread one of the discounts which added on about $20... then saw the sneaky f***ers never mentioned the sales tax until the end, that added on another 40-50. That's that out the window for the moment. Think I'll just scour around during the week and see if I find any bits on sale.

I've also seen GTX 980 cards on kijiji (Canada's DoneDeal.ie) for $350-400 CAD and slightly lower. I am a little iffy about making a big purchase like that online but would make sure the seller is in Toronto so I can go and pick it up from their gaf which should lower the risk of dodgy business on their end (I'll bring a barb wire baseball bat to be sure ) and a good few of them are still in warranty. €240-275 and cheaper for a GTX 980 considering they seem to cost about double that (way beyond my price range) before postage & packaging.

I've read that if you are going to buy second hand, GPUs are one of the better things to do so with (as opposed to CPUs or HDDs/SSDs), just curious on some feedback if that's the case. I'm on the edge, it's a lot of money to take a risk with, but then again... a GTX 980 for €240-275!!

Billy86

First of the two major components down. Last night just before going to bed I took a quick look on kijiji.ca, and came across this. Now I know some would warn against getting components second hand, but the guy offered to do a test run, and in the end we wound up doing about 20 mins each of GTA Online, The Witcher, Just Cause 3 and Fallout 4 - all worked perfectly. He looked early 20s and told me he had bought it a few months back but hadn't got around to playing much because of studying. His setup was quite a beast which may have helped, and he had upgraded to a 1080 which is why he was selling this at a low cost (he wanted a quick sale and to avoid hagglers, I sold some furniture on kijiji a few months back and some people on it are ridiculous).

Anyway... $270 CAD / €185 for a GTX 970, 4GB DDR5 RAM, OC, and 3.0 PCEI (whatever the **** that means! ).

Billy86

Two more additions (finally!) made, after a move back from Canada delayed things a little. Secured a job back in Ireland today so I should looking to get all the bits bought by Halloween as planned! I'll obviously price check a few places before buying each, but this Brexit really is doing wonders to the Amazon.co.uk prices and (at least on the order I just made) they're giving free shipping!

Added so far:
GPU - €185 - MSI GTX 970
SSD - €125 - Crucial MX300 525GB - https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01IAGSD68/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
RAM - €28 - Crucial 1x8GB - https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01BIWLFGQ/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Still go get:
CPU - i5 6600k - €240

Motherboard - ASUS Z170I Pro - €155 - https://www.amazon.co.uk/ASUS-Z170I-Pro-Gaming-Motherboard/dp/B015FY4HLS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1470554103&sr=8-1&keywords=ASUS+Z170I
*Worth the little bit extra I reckon as I would need one with overclocking anyway, and all the inputs etc over more basic units should come in handy.

Case - Silverstone Sugo SG13B - €60 - http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16811163274
Fits 500W PSU units as instructed by someone earlier in the thread. Still a good size, almost identical width & length to an A4 sheet of paper and just an inch taller and a Samsung Note smartphone.

PSU and Cooler I have not settled on just quite yet, good thing with the Sugo case is it fits standard PSU units and the GTX970 (with about 5mm to spare apparently!). PSU will be modular, cooler I might wait until I have everything else put together to see what I can fit into the case.

So in total it's looking like it's going to come in around €900 rather than my €660 hopes after factoring in the PSU and cooler assuming I can get some bits on discount, but I'm pretty confident that this is going to last me a good, long while so well worth it!

Billy86

Some more bits arrived in the mail today, only the CPU, RAM and cooler left (all are due to arrive tomorrow or Wednesday). Spent some of the weekend getting my head around Mediaportal and I have to say I'm getting proper excited now! Almost there and thanks a mill for all the help!

For anyone curious about the Sugo SG13B size, it perfectly fits an MSi GTX 970 with all of about 0.75cm to spare - there's also a nifty little spot for an SSD located on the bottom, which makes installing a 3.5" HDD later on far, far easier. And as for overall size, it is 99.5% perfectly the same size as an A4 sheet of paper and about 7" tall. Would definitely recommend, for the look of it so far.

MRedd

hi guys im looking to buy a new pc, so that i pick each component. Irish firms seem to expensive, scans.co.uk don;t make the components into a pc. Any advice?

Billy86

MRedd wrote: »

hi guys im looking to buy a new pc, so that i pick each component. Irish firms seem to expensive, scans.co.uk don;t make the components into a pc. Any advice?

I went Amazon all the way (apart from the GPU) - with the £ sterling at the moment, it's excellent value and they didn't charge me a penny for any postage if I took the longer option (only 2-3 days more).

Also, I've got this fella built! Will put up pictures in a small bit, the Sugo SG13B case gives decent space, it has not been running hot with only a standard air cooler for the CPU, and oh my god it's fecking time!!

So much thanks to everyone for their help in this, I genuinely do mean it when I say I couldn't have got this built without you (or without spending double the amount after ordering loads of incompatible parts!)